Dramatic Cut In Visa Extensions

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Hey Livin', I have personal experience speaking with BKK immi about this investment visa (not scheme). You do exactly what I said and deposit 3 mil into Krung thai or other gvt bank and that's it. Go to immi yourself and get the scoop. It's a cakewalk. And hey, if the baht is down 30% against your euro currency then perhaps it is a good time to diversify a small percent to the baht and maybe it will go up 5-15%. I'm an investor and contrarion thinker.

hey Bobby ... does this mean that you have ( at long last ) solved your visa problems once and for all ? If it does, C O N G R A T U L A T I O N S. At the very least, your are on the pathway to success. Good upon you

[unbiasbob]

Hey Livin', I have personal experience speaking with BKK immi about this investment visa (not scheme). You do exactly what I said and deposit 3 mil into Krung thai or other gvt bank and that's it. Go to immi yourself and get the scoop. It's a cakewalk. And hey, if the baht is down 30% against your euro currency then perhaps it is a good time to diversify a small percent to the baht and maybe it will go up 5-15%. I'm an investor and contrarion thinker.

hey Bobby ... does this mean that you have ( at long last ) solved your visa problems once and for all ? If it does, C O N G R A T U L A T I O N S. At the very least, your are on the pathway to success. Good upon you

Thank you good Dr. I, at the very least, have the knowledge of how to take care of it.

[johnsjourney]

A couple of people have mentioned or implied that tourist (60 day) visas might be refused if the person has had several already in recent times. Does anyone have any more precise facts about this or is it only a guess or rumour?

I wonder if this is all a misguided attempt at restarting the Elite card scheme?! Perhaps after a while when that doesn't happen, they will be more welcoming to the longer stayers that can show they have a certain amount of money. I have plenty of money but paid most into a pension already, so I have no chance on these money methods until I'm 50! All I can do is spend 80k+ a month, more than I usually earn from occasional trips home to UK, and hope it runs out at about the time I'm 50...

For me, I'm assuming the worst, so that any surprise will be a positive one, and planning on seeing my Thai girlfriend much more in Malaysia, Australia and UK, we've been together a year and a half almost without a break so it might just work!

[dr_Pat_Pong]

A couple of people have mentioned or implied that tourist (60 day) visas might be refused if the person has had several already in recent times. Does anyone have any more precise facts about this or is it only a guess or rumour?

I wonder if this is all a misguided attempt at restarting the Elite card scheme?! Perhaps after a while when that doesn't happen, they will be more welcoming to the longer stayers that can show they have a certain amount of money. I have plenty of money but paid most into a pension already, so I have no chance on these money methods until I'm 50! All I can do is spend 80k+ a month, more than I usually earn from occasional trips home to UK, and hope it runs out at about the time I'm 50...

For me, I'm assuming the worst, so that any surprise will be a positive one, and planning on seeing my Thai girlfriend much more in Malaysia, Australia and UK, we've been together a year and a half almost without a break so it might just work!

Marry her John. At least it'll solve the visa problems.

[jimbim]

A couple of people have mentioned or implied that tourist (60 day) visas might be refused if the person has had several already in recent times. Does anyone have any more precise facts about this or is it only a guess or rumour?

I'm also concerned about this, John. It doesn't affect me, but I have a friend coming over to Thailand and I worry that she won't be able to stay with me for long if we don't get married so I can cover her with my work permit.

This topic didn't seem to be decisively concluded, nor was the supposed new limit on tourist visa extensions.

Maybe it's just me, not knowing whose opinion to trust.

[sua yai]

Just got back to this thread after the normal Sunday afernoon drinks with friends.

I'm amazed that the more senior members of this forum choose to miss the point.

Are you members of an exclusive club? Are you any better than me? The visa regulations in this country don't suit me, however I comply and so have been here for 6.5 years.

I'll continue to teach English on a voluntary basis in town. And the Thais respect me for this.

I'm certainly not breaking any immigration laws, but give the likes of us a chance.

Sorry I'm an illigitmate peron. Makes me feel like I'm a b-----d.

[Limbo]

I agree with all the current rules with one glaring exception. Under 50's that can prove they are not draining the Thai economy should have a legal avenue open to them short of marrying someone to get a paper.

It happens many times that people agree with all the regulations except the one which isn't in their personal favour.

Don't cry, buy yourself the elite-card and you are done for at least the coming five years.

Personally I feel sorry for the older people, who, married or not cannot live up to the financial requirements.

They have been living here, built houses, made wells, planted trees, got friends, children. They rooted here.

So if anybody should have a legal avenue I opt for these people.

[sriracha john]

Don't cry, buy yourself the elite-card and you are done for at least the coming five years.

One only needs to read the news or follow the various threads here to realize that the Elite Card is on life-support and will likely die soon. In my opinion, it's not a viable alternative as it's wrought with so many problems that to invest in one at this juncture is as foolish as trying to buy a real Rolex at Chatuchak.

[Sunny Valentine]

Limbo, it happens many times that people agree with all regulations as long as they are in their own personal favor.

About the Elite Card: I do hope you are not an Agent of them, as suggesting this scam (especially in the situation reported about it within the last few weeks) could well be considered a serious offence then.

About your pity to the older ones: Point taken, but: How could they ever stay here in the past? The law has not changed. Ok, there surely is the odd one who worked for years legally at Thai rates, and has no money or social security benefits for his legal stay.

But it is an easy guess that most of those you refer here have been staying here long time by "bending the rules", so why pity them?

Sunny

[boris]

Its just a little harsh to call people such as myself 'abusers' dont you think...

I live monogously with a TGF, I love Thailand, I support Thai people financially (both in relation to direct support to GF and indirect to the ecomony), I am learning Thai language and culture, I am trying to integrate to this place as best I am able.

I love the food, the climate, the people, the Islands and environment, in general I think I could happily pursue a lifestyle here that benefits Thailand and costs them nothing.

Is that so abusive ??

It's not harsh at all because that's exactly what you are.Try this sort of nonsense (I love the place and support the people) with immigration authorities in other countries and see how far you get.Thailand's rules are relatively liberal so regularise your position.Sorry for the intemperate tone but the absurd sel-deception is hard to take.

[hudriwudri]

Sawasdee kap,

it seems, that all romours regarding _not_ giving an extension of 30 days on tourist visa anymore are HOT AIR and nothing but HOT AIR.

in another forum I've learned, that Patong Immigration extended a Tourist Visa "with a smile" without any problems!

by(e)

Hurdriwudri

[LivinLOS]

Its just a little harsh to call people such as myself 'abusers' dont you think...

I live monogously with a TGF, I love Thailand, I support Thai people financially (both in relation to direct support to GF and indirect to the ecomony), I am learning Thai language and culture, I am trying to integrate to this place as best I am able.

I love the food, the climate, the people, the Islands and environment, in general I think I could happily pursue a lifestyle here that benefits Thailand and costs them nothing.

Is that so abusive ??

It's not harsh at all because that's exactly what you are.Try this sort of nonsense (I love the place and support the people) with immigration authorities in other countries and see how far you get.Thailand's rules are relatively liberal so regularise your position.Sorry for the intemperate tone but the absurd sel-deception is hard to take.

I have tried exactly this with many many countries... As I listed before I have been offered long terms stays with open arms in every country I have wished to travel to. America, Australia, New Zealand, Europe, etc (all first world place I may add that actually run the risk that I might use social services), these all welcome me with open arms and virtually no restrictions (I own properties and land in some of these places !!). When it comes to 3rd world countries Malaysia, PI, all of Africa (that I have visited and lived, Arab N Africa, and Sub Saharan to S Africa, staying would have been trivial as long as proof of assets was done.

So basically I HAVE tried this with other countries and they ALL welcomed me. I dont know who is suffering from 'ubsurd self deception' but I know of no other country that does not welcome high net worth individuals with open arms.

As to your 'regularise' comment if you follow my posts you will see I really do want to legally sort this and not through a loophole but there are no simple visa's available to someone who is wealthy and retired at a young age. The 3 mil scheme would have lost me 25k USD or so in currency depreciation and loss of investment return but it looks like thats the one avenue I may have to do.

[lopburi3]

About your pity to the older ones: Point taken, but: How could they ever stay here in the past? The law has not changed. Ok, there surely is the odd one who worked for years legally at Thai rates, and has no money or social security benefits for his legal stay.

But it is an easy guess that most of those you refer here have been staying here long time by "bending the rules", so why pity them?

Sunny

The law has changed. Double the amount of money is now required for a support extension of stay. There are many who will not be able to meet these new requirements. And it is not a 'life style' choice for them.

[huski]

Don't cry, buy yourself the elite-card and you are done for at least the coming five years.

buy the card, and then cry

[LivinLOS]

Sawasdee kap,

it seems, that all romours regarding _not_ giving an extension of 30 days on tourist visa anymore are HOT AIR and nothing but HOT AIR.

in another forum I've learned, that Patong Immigration extended a Tourist Visa "with a smile" without any problems!

by(e)

Hurdriwudri

Well the initial source was thaiImmigration.com...

What do you expect... Thier strike record is not exactly high

[phormio]

...As to your 'regularise' comment if you follow my posts you will see I really do want to legally sort this and not through a loophole but there are no simple visa's available to someone who is wealthy and retired at a young age.  The 3 mil scheme would have lost me 25k USD or so in currency depreciation and loss of investment return but it looks like thats the one avenue I may have to do.

Other option I don't see mentioned is to start a business; if you've got that kind of dough you might have some business ideas that would make you money AND give you a visa. Don't forget, investing $75,000 (USD) in a condo may make you money in the long haul as its value increases over time(also forex might go in your favor in the long term - hard to predict).

One other option I've seen mentioned is to invest $1million USD (40Million baht) in real estate (<= 1 Rai)for 5 years and you can keep it. Apparently you can get a PR via investing 10 million baht in a condo also.

These are all things i've seen mentioned in various thaivisa/forums in the last 2 months - and have no personal experience of - so you'd have to look for professional advice if any might apply to you.

[sriracha john]

One other option I've seen mentioned is to invest $1million USD (40Million baht) in real estate (<= 1 Rai)for 5 years and you can keep it.

Never heard of this one before?? but is that 40 million baht for less than a rai? didn't know they had land values commonly for that much? it would have to be a pretty nice hunk of land for that much.

"you can keep it"= you own it?

can site advertisers comment on this please?

[surin]

Ok today I applied for my 60 day visa in NEW ZEALAND to go back to the LOS 4th Nov. The last time I was there was this year for 3 months I left 30th June. Nothing was said to me today when I said I would go to the BKK immigration, just before the 60 days are up for another 30 days stay. I also re enquired the cost of it, the 30 days extention. I was told 1900 baht. You would think they would tell you some thing after asking to see the day you will return on your air ticket? I would be a bit pissed off to pay 1900 baht for just 7 days, then have to phone around to get back on a airplain early for NZ. After paying for another one months rent in the appartment block.

Yeah Warrior....I'd be pessed off having to catch an airplain and forced to go back to Noo Zeland also

[unbiasbob]

Its just a little harsh to call people such as myself 'abusers' dont you think...

I live monogously with a TGF, I love Thailand, I support Thai people financially (both in relation to direct support to GF and indirect to the ecomony), I am learning Thai language and culture, I am trying to integrate to this place as best I am able.

I love the food, the climate, the people, the Islands and environment, in general I think I could happily pursue a lifestyle here that benefits Thailand and costs them nothing.

Is that so abusive ??

It's not harsh at all because that's exactly what you are.Try this sort of nonsense (I love the place and support the people) with immigration authorities in other countries and see how far you get.Thailand's rules are relatively liberal so regularise your position.Sorry for the intemperate tone but the absurd sel-deception is hard to take.

I have tried exactly this with many many countries... As I listed before I have been offered long terms stays with open arms in every country I have wished to travel to. America, Australia, New Zealand, Europe, etc (all first world place I may add that actually run the risk that I might use social services), these all welcome me with open arms and virtually no restrictions (I own properties and land in some of these places !!). When it comes to 3rd world countries Malaysia, PI, all of Africa (that I have visited and lived, Arab N Africa, and Sub Saharan to S Africa, staying would have been trivial as long as proof of assets was done.

So basically I HAVE tried this with other countries and they ALL welcomed me. I dont know who is suffering from 'ubsurd self deception' but I know of no other country that does not welcome high net worth individuals with open arms.

As to your 'regularise' comment if you follow my posts you will see I really do want to legally sort this and not through a loophole but there are no simple visa's available to someone who is wealthy and retired at a young age. The 3 mil scheme would have lost me 25k USD or so in currency depreciation and loss of investment return but it looks like thats the one avenue I may have to do.

Hearing you whine is getting old, dude. If you have as much cash as you say you do, you're crying over pennies. Gimme and all a good goddamn break. Go get your investor visa and stop your balling. I don't think anyone here sympathizes with your situation in any way

[johnsjourney]

Well it seems perfectly alright in Chiang Mai, I have today a new 30 day extension. I have more 60-90 day tourist visas than I can remember already for this year, though I have visited UK briefly twice.

They have a number of new colour signs saying "10 day, 30 day extensions", since last time I went a few months ago. So reinforcing the status quo it would seem. I tried to do it right, dressed well, had a couple of new reasons for an extension. So I guess as other people seem to be confirming it even the title of this thread is no longer correct?

Yes, marrying my girlfriend is very much an option, but I'd prefer to have a long term relationship Seriously though I think that should wait a little.

[LivinLOS]

Other option I don't see mentioned is to start a business; if you've got that kind of dough you might have some business ideas that would make you money AND give you a visa. Don't forget, investing $75,000 (USD) in a condo may make you money in the long haul as its value increases over time(also forex might go in your favor in the long term - hard to predict).

I worked my ass off for many years and traded youth for money.. The plan was not to do it again. Also one of my main areas of expertise is property development but recent issues with land titles on Phuket have made me very nervous. Watching Asia Island Homes lose 200 mil approx on Samsara cause the land title office was forging thier own paperwork is a bit off putting.

As to forex rates my firm belief is the dollar is going to crash thanks to the deficits and the stock market burnout and soon to be real estate crash (only my prediction) once the American consumer stops spending money on debt he has borrowed out of his house equity at tiny interest rates (set to rise) I can see recession if not genuine depression ahead.. So the dollar goes to the dogs and the baht is unofficially pegged to it.. Holding my assets in Euros has done well for me in the last 2 - 3 years.. Tip for the next 3 gold.. I expect 1000 - 1500 per ounce by 2008 or 2009. Anyway WAAY off topic.

One other option I've seen mentioned is to invest $1million USD (40Million baht) in real estate (<= 1 Rai)for 5 years and you can keep it. Apparently you can get a PR via investing 10 million baht in a condo also.

PR for 10 mil in ??? Thats interesting.. I would consider that strongly.. Like real PR lifetime visa and right of residency ?? Anyone know more ??

The 1 mil USD inward is a bit too rich for my blood.. I live by the 'dont bring any more into Thailand than you can afford to lose' theory.. Dropping a mil would probably put me back to work.

Hearing you whine is getting old, dude. If you have as much cash as you say you do, you're crying over pennies.

25k may be a bearable sum to lose but I like to be frugal, thats nearly a years worth of living expenses for me currently.

My responses keep coming as I find it highly frustrating to hear people (married / over 50) repeatedly say "Just get a legal visa its trivial" or how open Thailands visa situation is v other countries. Both of which comments I dissagree with.

[phormio]

...

Watching Asia Island Homes lose 200 mil approx on Samsara cause the land title office was forging thier own paperwork is a bit off putting.

This same sort of sh.t happened to my mother in law, though a bit less money. Ouch! Don't people get killed for pulling this kind of crap?

...

As to forex rates my firm belief is the dollar is going to crash thanks to the deficits and the stock market burnout  and soon to be real estate crash (only my prediction) ...

So the dollar goes to the dogs and the baht is unofficially pegged to it...

Totally agree with likely course of US economy - hard to predict - but it seems like the boys upstairs are driving the sucker off the cliff. Excellent point about the Thai peg - hadn't considered that - perhaps the unofficial peg will fail if the USD tanks...

One other option I've seen mentioned is to invest $1million USD (40Million baht) in real estate (<= 1 Rai)for 5 years and you can keep it. Apparently you can get a PR via investing 10 million baht in a condo also

PR for 10 mil in ??? Thats interesting.. I would consider that strongly.. Like real PR lifetime visa and right of residency ?? Anyone know more ??

...

Last discussion I had on this was this thread

Forum thread on land ownership in LOS early september

I'm looking for the other references but its going to take me some time, Dr Pat Pong knows how wrong(or right I am) - since he didn't mention the options that I have mentioned, I would not have confidence in the information that I have provided. Lets see if the GOOD Doctor lets me have it; he's much more familiar with this material than am I - and there have been recent changes in the regulations.

[johnsjourney]

When does travelling frequently to and from a holiday home become no longer a tourist? how long is a piece of string? From today's happy experience (see above) the tourist visas seem just the same to me as they ever were, and work for me with a less money than is being mentioned here, I stay in a wonderful rented house, I keep my money out of Thailand as much as I can and do fairly well by that, I enjoy the frequent aeroplane trips, I don't think there's a problem guys.

John

[dr_Pat_Pong]

When does travelling frequently to and from a holiday home become no longer a tourist? how long is a piece of string? From today's happy experience (see above) the tourist visas seem just the same to me as they ever were, and work for me with a less money than is being mentioned here, I stay in a wonderful rented house, I keep my money out of Thailand as much as I can and do fairly well by that, I enjoy the frequent aeroplane trips, I don't think there's a problem guys.

John

You live here as a resident, not a tourist. Grow up. Your pitiful argument doesn't hold water.

[Ijustwannateach]

Sunny, responding to you a few pages ago, one should pity the older types who got into a lifestyle here that was "functionally" legal- based on a system where the letter of the law didn't matter as long as the personalities involved were satisfied. In some aspects, Thailand seems to be moving away from this system (inconsistently) towards one where the letter of the rule of law applies (sometimes, partly, depending) in the area of Immigration. I think the old hands can be forgiven for assuming that the status quo would be maintained (it usually is, after all) or that they would be "grandfathered" in otherwise. That said, it's of course any country's perogative to decide who stays or not, citizens aside- but I *do* pity the ones whose lives are getting destroyed for no good reason except bureaucratic neatness.

"Steven"

[faranggerman]

i think most of the guys here are staying to long in Thailand already,or why u say it is ok what the immigration is doing?the reason why Schengenstates check people from poorer countrys is very easy,most of those people like to overstay their visa,or work in europe,or dont go back at all to their home countrys.Most of the Schengen europeans come here and live here with the money the brought from europe,pension savings,or whatever,and almost nobody wants to work here,and almost everybody is respecting the laws here in Thailand,so it is absolutly stupid to compare visa regulation from europe with the regulations from Thailand.IT is ok to check some foreigners who are staying here with 30day visa since x years,but it is not ok to give that treatment to all foreigner.also european embassys are working with clear defined law and orders,not like Thailand where their leave always something open,

Im staying 4 years,i know not very long but enough to understand why thais doing things or how they doing things,I have family here,but i think now it is enough,im bored with treatment from immigration or other government offices,im not drugdealer,thief,or other bandit,im in penson with 55000baht,sorry not enough to buy a VIP card,ok sorry if somebody feels disturbed with my letter,but thats just my thoughts,oh by the way i wonder what would happen if only 50% of the expats are going away for a year,home or to another country,maimeepanha !

[LivinLOS]

I do tend to agree that it is weird to try and compare first world immigration rules with 3rd world immigration rules when one country is placed at risk of having to provide social services (the ambulance still arrives, the library is still open, etc) and the fact that the motivation of most Thais to get to those countries is to improve thier earning potential v a country where we are paying for each and every service we use.

I would also say that if looking at purchase power or net assets if you have a Thai person who earns 8 to 10 times an average European wage I think they would have very little difficulty in visiting and staying in Europe or other 1st world countries. Take a Farang with 8 to 10 times a Thai wage coming here and the problems are still there.

[Felt 35]

How could they ever stay here in the past? The law has not changed. Ok, there surely is the odd one who worked for years legally at Thai rates, and has no money or social security benefits for his legal stay.

But it is an easy guess that most of those you refer here have been staying here long time by "bending the rules", so why pity them?

Sunny

I know an old foreigner who come here from Europe, about 10 years ago, with a small pension (25-30K).

Renting a small apartment, living standard as a Thai, but are happy with his life because it’s not cold here, it’s not expensive here, and he get in touch with people. Because even if he is old and not rich, he is always polite, not fat, not drink like a idiot, and don’t disturb other peoples life.

His option about visa is tourist visa or pass the border every 30 day because his pension is to low to a retirement visa.

He chooses the trip every month, he have the time and it’s inexpensive.

Who welcome him first time? Who have made the law who let him continue to pass the border every month for 10 years? What rules do he bend?

BTW, He is still here.

[Sunny Valentine]

Felt, I fully agree with you. The law has not changed. What seemingly (though not officially confirmed) has changed is the Way Thai Authorities are enforcing the rules. This creates problems for the man in your example (although I belive he could have got a retirement some years ago showing a total of 400000 of Pension and Bank Money, which would mean your friend only would have needed to show around 1000 or 2000 € in the Bank) as well as Millionaires.

If only these rules were pointed out, and also if they would make sense to anyone apart from Burocrats.

I guess that a lot of people who give advise in the way of "follow the visa rules or leave" do bend some other rules in order to live here. Company ownership of a house? Limited Company for Work permit? Quite likely that you bend rules, in a way that is widely accepted even by Thai authorities. Or do the Authorities here really believe that all thoses companies with 49% foreign ownership really have a Thai Majority who has any saying? But it is still against the rules, as is (and was 10 Years ago) the 30 Day border hopping. Some people here in this board just condemn one and ignore (or profit from) the other.

Sunny

[unbiasbob]

As to forex rates my firm belief is the dollar is going to crash thanks to the deficits and the stock market burnout and soon to be real estate crash (only my prediction) once the American consumer stops spending money on debt he has borrowed out of his house equity at tiny interest rates (set to rise) I can see recession if not genuine depression ahead.. So the dollar goes to the dogs and the baht is unofficially pegged to it.. Holding my assets in Euros has done well for me in the last 2 - 3 years.. Tip for the next 3 gold.. I expect 1000 - 1500 per ounce by 2008 or 2009. Anyway WAAY off topic.

Hearing you whine is getting old, dude. If you have as much cash as you say you do, you're crying over pennies.

25k may be a bearable sum to lose but I like to be frugal, thats nearly a years worth of living expenses for me currently.

My responses keep coming as I find it highly frustrating to hear people (married / over 50) repeatedly say "Just get a legal visa its trivial" or how open Thailands visa situation is v other countries. Both of which comments I dissagree with.

You continue to cry over pennies. You say that you will "lose" 25k US by investing 75k in a baht bank account so you can get your investor visa. You say this as if it were a given. That is lidicrous. It is just as likely that the baht would go up as much against the socialist Euro currency, which is bound to retrace. But no matter, anyone who claims to have over a few million Euro and complains about investing less than 5% of net liquid worth for fear of losing 1% of said worth, needs to get his priorities in order. If in fact you have such wealth, then just make your deposit and get your visa. Stop waiting for the next great American depression to come. And if it did come, mark my words that your net worth would get slammed just the same, smart guy