Warning against disrupting Olympic torch relay in Bangkok

[Supaporn]

Lets see...What if a Thai with an illegal water shooting device aims and hits the flame. Happy Thai New Year!! Soory

then the fine would be limited to using a large pvc high pressure water gun on something other than a cute girls arse or a passing motorbike...........

[sbk]

Well, I have just had to go through this entire thread and edit out all the racist and bigoted comments.

So as a FINAL public warning, be aware that any further such racist comments will result in immediate suspension of the poster per forum rules:

1) You will not use thaivisa.com to post any material which is knowingly or can be reasonably construed as .... abusive, vulgar, hateful, ....or otherwise in violation of any law.

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Do not post inflammatory messages on the forum, or any attempt to disrupt discussions to upset its participants. The word, or its derivative, "trolling", is used to describe such messages or the act of posting them.

3) ....racial slurs..... will not be tolerated.

[Seneque]

Foreigners, of course ... the trouble makers are foreigners ... is this clear now !

The olympic games (for amateur only? ... that was it was made for) should be banished for ever ... it is anyway a fantastic ground to test new drugs.

[ThNiner]

Well, I have just had to go through this entire thread and edit out all the racist and bigoted comments.

So as a FINAL public warning, be aware that any further such racist comments will result in immediate suspension of the poster per forum rules:

Please do. Thank you in advance.

[animatic]

So many topics here... DRAT!

Ok yes it seems protesting is OK within limits,

standing quietly with a sign for instance.

But disrupting the run, i.e. getting in the way throwing paint etc

will be prosecuted, at least for a few show cases.

Edit: deleted off-topic comments - Maestro

Edited April 18, 2008 by Maestro

[Bkkthebest]

What time is the torch run starting?

[chuck_s]

This is going to be getting crazy. Where did Thailand get this ultraright wing nutts. Saying Thais who live aboard and come to Thailand to visit their families and end up going to the protests out of international interest and getting perm. denied from coming back to their homelands. Not even the king of any country would do such a thing to his own people.

It is like saying to the Thai. I am more thai then you are, you live aboard and you are a lessor Thai, so get out.

I would say, bring it on.

[fauxie]

I won't be going to protest because I can't afford to be deported, being married to a Thai. How disappointing, but utterly predictable, that the Thai govt. would take this stance. Still, I can't help thinking (and hoping) that the games will be disrupted daily at most events and that it will be impossible for there not to be a lot of news coverage about it.

Bit worried about just wearing my 'Free Tibet - Free The Panchen Lama' t-shirt though. Surely I wouldn't get arrested for wearing that in public would I?

My wife's family are all very much Thai Chinese on her father's side and none of them have any sympathy for China and its position on Tibet and almost completely share my views.

[MustaphaMond]

According to the body of the text, the headline is incorrect.

"Any foreigner who takes part in protests during the run will be kicked out for good, police warn"

In the body, it says that foreigners disrupting the torch relay will be kicked out. Not the same thing.

Feel free to protest (if you feel that strongly) but be careful not to disrupt the torch relay.

This is so insightful, I felt it must be reiterated .

Well read R.F.

So much of the discourse on this forum is based on translated text and inferred headlines..

[chrislarsson]

A very insightful article about this topic written by Fareed Zakaria:

http://www.newsweek.com/id/131751

[gunnyd]

The torch is coming? Who cares.... I have my own problems to worry about. Enjoy arguing over something meaningless. I don't give a toss about the Chinese or the Olympics. But I am a selfish bastard who only thinks about himself and his family.

BTW in most countries freedom of speech is not extended to visitors.

GunnyD

[MustaphaMond]

i really feel that we farang should do what the pakistanis do in UK

get out on the streets and demonstrate for our rights it is about time that we had the right to "fight for our rights" here, same as foreigners in our respective countries do..they stand up for their rights, but we just all sit in beer bars and twiddle our thumbs.

we should get together and form a foundation/society for this purpose...

Perhaps if such a group were to get arrested/deported for merely protesting, a case could be brought in front of the UN.

[dkstoney]

There's definitely a lot of people here ready to embrace their chattel status. In addition to the blatant racism that leaks out of many here like water going through a sieve, there is a sense that many of you think that the Tibetans exist in a vacuum and perceive them to be some sort of spiritual master race. Tibetans are not the Dalai Lama and vice versa. There are reasons why he holds Americans in such high esteem and it has a lot to do with his Mercedes Benz (as another poster commented), a reflection of their generous financial AND covert military support. Follow the link below to read a brief article on the real Tibet.

Friendly Feudalism: The Tibet Myth

[Naam]

The Olympics is about sports, not politics

...and human rights huggers should first look what's going on in their home countries (or what human rights the politicians their home countries "introduce" on other countries).

[Thai at Heart]

I don't think there will be too much squashing going on in front of video phones or live CNN broadcast. No matter how much they try to close the media down, the world is not as it was 20 years ago.

I spend a lot of time in China, and there is a feeling I get from work colleagues that they know there are real problems that need to be solved in China, but that the central government is unable to solve them. A lot of people want things to change, but they feel powerless to do anything. I have been in towns at the time when the farmers have rioted because of corrupt land appropriation and there is a growing chasm between the rich and poor which with all the will in the world will be unsolvable by the communist party.

People with problems have no voice in China, and I honestly believe that many will use the Olympics proper to show their frustration. Falung Gong alone is a big enough problem for the central govt.

//Edit: deleted quoted text from deleted post - Maestro

Edited April 18, 2008 by Maestro

[sonnyJ]

There's a little bit of excitement around 2am .. Manager sent news sms to their subscribers (including me) at 02.01am to let people know that the "torch" arrived in Thailand already! I would be really p*ssed off if I was asleep. Anyways, a bit more in the news sms was that authority would put tight security and would make sure there's no disruption of the relay.

This one is from me: Thailand has long developed "good" relationship with China and it wants to keep it that way. And I won't make any further comments on that since I still wanna keep my head on my shoulders

Surely a cleverer way of protesting would be to make a Fake Olympic Torch and take it round the world, where you could organise protests without the Chinogov forces interfering!

If you can't protest the real torch in Bangkok - MAKE A FAKE ONE! and protest that uninterrupted! Get some celebs involved to get the cameras in, and Bob's your uncle!

That's exactly what they did in India. Was fun to watch the police attacking the (fake) torch. Gives it somehow a serious twist one might say.

Edited April 18, 2008 by sonnyJ

[farang prince]

The truth is the Chinese care very much what the rest of the world thinks about them. The Chinese government was looking at this year's Olympics as a medium to show the world how far the country has advanced over the last decade. As I have been told by a close Chinese friend of mine, the Chinese people are very distraught over the protests being directed towards the Olympic flame. Don't forget, China is an incredibly diverse country...the majority of its people have no way of knowing about the protests that have been conducted against the Olympic flame and probably wouldn't care if they knew because they are busy surviving on a day to day basis. My friend, who is a very intelligent university student, is very angry about the protests and hopes that the Chinese government will initiate retribution against those countries who have "embarassed" their country. No doubt there are Chinese citizens who are very sympathetic to the protests, but they are in the extreme minority. I'm afraid that the protests will sear a scar into the Chinese psyche and there will be many years of retribution in front of us.

[Daffy D]

This whole world wide protest thing is being blown out of proportion. I would bet the majority of “protesters” hardly know what it is all about but like to jump on the current bandwagon. Perhaps it gives some meaning to their life.

There are countries with far worse violations of human rights and peoples displaced that have a far greater effect on grater amount of the population than this. Zimbabwe farmers for instance.

The games should be just that keep politics out of it.

[garro]

I find it quite amusing when people keep saying that politics should be kept out of the Olympics. As another poster already mentioned it is already political. That is why many of the world leaders will be at the opening ceremony. The Olympics is probably one of the most political events there is.

On the other hand, I do think some people are critical of China out of fear. The fear that their country is losing its importance on the world stage and that in the not so distant future China will be the new world leader - after all it is only a matter of time.

Other people do have a legitimate gripe with China and the people of Tibet are one such people. I do respect the legitimate protesters.

[bonobo]

I am a guest in this country. I make my living in this country. But I am not a citizen. Yes, there are things about Thailand which frustrate me, but it my choice to stay or leave.

And as a guest, I do not think it is my place to protest anything like the Chinese torch relay. The Thai government wants a peaceful relay--and if I want to stay here, I need to comply. That seems reasonable to me. In my home country, I have all the rights in the world to protest as I please. but not in another country. And this is not related to Thailand. I would not protest in any other country either. A protest should be a reflection of the population of that nation's or region's views on a matter, not the views of foreign visitors.

As far as the protest itself, well, I am against the further politicizing of the Olympics. Yes, I know the history of politics in the Games: Berlin, Mexico City, Munich, Los Angeles, Moscow, etc. Bu the more we politicize them, the less and less they reach their ideals. I have been to three Olympics, and when the games commence, national pride runs rampant, but politics fade. I have waited breathlessly while a French kayacker slid from first to third with the reigning world champ coming up, her father sitting next to me. Then cheering joyously when she held on for the bronze, hugging this man I had never met before. I have vigorously cheered in Hindi (not knowing the first word in the language) when surrounded by Indian fans when the Indian field hockey team played. I have partied with euphoric Irish when their swimmer brought home a gold. This is what the Olympics are about, or should be about. And I am an unabashed fan of the Games.

And to the poster who wrote that the Olympics is only a western event, which, "unlike the World Cup," had no interest outside the west, well he or she is sadly mistaken. I have seen the pride a "small" nation has in a 10-th place finish in the luge, much less a medal in the 100 m sprint..

Sure China is the current flavor-of-the-week as far as international boogeymen go. I speak Chinese and had a company in Taiwan, and now Chinese companies are my biggest competition for my Thai company. And sometimes, their short-sighted business practices drive me to the point of screaming. I have dealt with the cultural gaps, the superstition, the different social expectations. But all of us have our own cultural idiosyncracies. BUt to say that Chinese have no humor or are somehow inherently evil is pretty racist. I have had Chinese g/f's in my life, and my two best friends are Thai/Chinese, and nothing could be further from the truth. THese particular people are funny, warm-hearted, good people.

Should we pressure China to change its ways? Sure. Pollution is a major issue, as is Human Rights. But as an American, our own pollution record is not too great, and the EU is not really much better (OK, some countires may be, but others are even worse). We (the West) may be moving to the right direction at last, but we have had much longer to work to ruin the planet.

Let's just let the Olympics be a time where we can pretend, for a few weeks, that we are all part of the same brotherhood of men.

[MustaphaMond]

.....The original post was from The Nation/xtra 2008-04-17. This paper frequently reports any rumors and passes them off as fact. It is the closest thing Thailand has to The Weekly World News

I think you mean X press - I agree, what happened to The Nation, it was respectable but this new rag is deplorable.

"X Press, Too fast to check facts.."

[Maestro]

The topic of this thread is "Any Foreigner Protesting In Bangkok Will Be Deported And Blacklisted". Of the the last 20 posts all but three had to be deleted for being off topic. This thread is not -- to quote from deleted posts -- about Russians and their satellites, the Cold War, the rights of people in America, the population size of China, Chinese democratic rights over Tibet, pollution in America, economic profits from the Olympics, Australian aborigines, the lack of Chines humour, Kool Aid, American Indians, the ability to get along with Chinese people, pollution in China.

Please stay on topic. As said, the topic is "Any Foreigner Protesting In Bangkok Will Be Deported And Blacklisted"

--

Maestro

P.S. Topic title has changed to "Warning against disrupting Olympic torch relay in Bangkok, Any foreigner doing so will be deported and blacklisted"

Edited April 18, 2008 by Maestro

[MustaphaMond]

...this title is misinformation. Not protesting but disrupting. Perhaps a correction is in order...

I have now changed the title to be in line with the news article's headline.

--

Maestro

[MustaphaMond]

So many topics here... DRAT!

Ok yes it seems protesting is OK within limits,

standing quietly with a sign for instance.

But disrupting the run, i.e. getting in the way throwing paint etc

will be prosecuted, at least for a few show cases.

Right, protesting, OK ..Disrupting, bad-dog . And of course Thai ( China- Lite ?) authorities will be very careful about distinguishing the two.

Yes, very careful.

You know the more I look at the FORMER title of this thread " Foreign Protesters.. deported ....playing with fire!!) the more I realize... Delete delete delete

//Edit: returned format of quoted text to the default format used by the poster. - Maestro

Edited April 18, 2008 by Maestro

[j_cheung]

On the original topic, I whole-heartedly agree with the Thai government's position on violent & uncalled for protests on this.

//Edit: deleted quote from other post, off-topic comments on Carrefour, France, etc. - Maestro

Edited April 18, 2008 by Maestro

[richardb]

I was thinking of going along to see the Torch run ,

but i don't think i will chance it, it will only need one nutter to kick off and knowing the police they will just round up everyone .

Personally speaking I am planning to boycott as many products sold by olympic sponsors as I possibly can. It always puzzles me that the Thais dont get more het up over seeing Buddhist monks beaten, abused and murdered. ( Burma also ) . Mbai pen rai. The tourch will be back in UK soon for some other publicity thing. I read the Ausis have the right attitude threatening to arrest any of the blue tracksuited thugs who attack demonstrators.

Richard

[jstumbo]

I was thinking of going along to see the Torch run ,

but i don't think i will chance it, it will only need one nutter to kick off and knowing the police they will just round up everyone .

Personally speaking I am planning to boycott as many products sold by olympic sponsors as I possibly can. It always puzzles me that the Thais dont get more het up over seeing Buddhist monks beaten, abused and murdered. ( Burma also ) . Mbai pen rai. The tourch will be back in UK soon for some other publicity thing. I read the Ausis have the right attitude threatening to arrest any of the blue tracksuited thugs who attack demonstrators.

Richard

I would be willing to bet that any security people that are escorting the torch have diplomatic passports. Worse that would happen to them is they would be deported.

[lopburi3]

US Embassy alert sent this afternoon:

Warden Message – April 18, 2008

The American Embassy in Thailand advises American citizens in Bangkok to exercise caution with respect to the upcoming Olympic torch relay in Bangkok, which will result in the closure of numerous streets, leading to transportation disruptions. Protests can escalate with little warning, disrupting transportation systems and city services and posing risks to travelers' personal safety. American citizens should also monitor news reports regarding the location of any disturbances that may occur.

On Saturday, April 19, 2008, the Olympic torch relay will take place in Bangkok. Several organizations have announced they are planning protests on April 19, 2008 to coincide with the Olympic torch relay. The relay is scheduled to start in the afternoon and run for approximately two hours and 45 minutes. It will begin in Bangkok's Chinatown and end at the Royal Plaza.

Following reports that foreign activists intend to join the activities, local officials have threatened to deport foreign activists who participate in protests. Several thousand police officers will guard the torch route that runs for approximately 10 km (about 6 miles). Officials have stated that despite the heavy security, plans are in place to re-route or shorten the relay should protests get out of hand.

[geriatrickid]

stick with the facts = if you support Tibet - go show your support -- not against the Olympic flame - do a sit in at the chinese embassy --- leave sports alone -- its the pride of each nation to send participants to compete and they do this because they want to represent their countries and have pride of nation --

STOP THE CHINESE BASHING - who cares if you were not treated the way A GOOD WHITE MAN =would expect --

.

Personally, I think they should do the torch run in keeping with the historical origins and have the runners do it in the nud_e. What's that you say? Disgusting?? But hey, this is about respecting the purity of the event and the glorification of the male body. OH you say, times have changed. Indeed they have.

It's all about genetic engineering and chemical enhancement therapies now. The run is a celebration of corporate and political largesse and a statement of support for the corruption that is now the Olympics. No better place to pay homage to such an event than in lovely Thailand. No one will protest. This is Thailand.

[LaoPo]

I'm amazed but not surprised.

Never, since becoming a TV member myself, I saw so many, also new, posters bashing and flaming and I didn't even read the many deleted messages by the Moderators.

Speaking about taking (dis)-advantage of a news message about the Olympic torch relay in Bangkok....

LaoPo