Most Secure Perimeter Wall For House

[Deke]

Is Home Owner's Insurance, or something similar, available here?

Would insurance be cheaper and more realistic than a lot of extraordinary security precautions?

[NotNew2You]

Don't try to reason with anyone here...there're all paranoid. My guess is they all lived in the 'hood back home and have brought their seige mentality with them to Thailand. Why actually become a part of Thailand when you move here when you can wall yourself off from all those dirty natives behind your 3 meter high electrified walls

[VocalNeal]

Can't help but feel that some folks have missed the point of living in Thailand - electric fences, <deleted>.

Security, peace, contentment are all states of mind. If you are happy, and content in your belief that Thailand is a tropical paradise where no theft occurs then fine.

I used to live in Indo and parked my motorbike around the back of the house as there was no where else. For a while I used to wake up at the slightest sound imagining someone was thinking of walking off with my bike. Then I rigged up a simple self contained window alarm the kind used for shop entry announcement. In a whole year no one set off the alarm so I needn't have worried, but I slept better.

[Gary A]

One of the locals here was losing feeder pigs. He strung 240 volts around his pig shed. He caught the thief. He is still paying the guy's widow.

[VocalNeal]

Why actually become a part of Thailand when you move here when you can wall yourself off from all those dirty natives behind your 3 meter high electrified walls

Here in Bangkok 2m high walls with 800mmm spikes are the norm. That's for Thais. Where did they bring their siege mentality from?

Don't try to reason with anyone here

Now this is one of the smartest things i've read on TV.

Didn't someone famous write once something about "lying down with pigs? Oops they've all been stolen or electrified.

[Cuban]

He strung 240 volts around his pig shed. He caught the thief. He is still paying the guy's widow.

I read an article by a resident expat about getting rid of the body in such situations - if there is enough rough land nearby his suggestion was that it would be (technically) quite easy.

[MaximumSecurity]

The concern is not protecting your material wealth while you're not there. What every farang and wealthy Thai need be thinking about is that criminals in Thailand are progressing along the same trends as criminals everywhere else.

As they become bolder, criminal think bigger. A criminal who burglarizes a house and gets the "treasure" that was mentioned in previous postings, often will believe that anyone who has that much "stuff" must have crates full of gold bullion stashed somewhere. The house he is casing may cost more than he can imagine earning in his lifetime working in a factory. The car parked in front may cost more than he will make in ten years. He thinks in his often yaa-baa addled brain that the best way to get it would be to hold a knife to the wife's throat while the husband gets the gold for him.

This is not conjecture. This is how the criminal mind works and is what leads to home invasions and the horrific violence that usually accompanies them. Thinking, "I don't have much" doesn't mean that a criminal understands that. When he breaks into your house while you are sleeping, high on drugs and with a knife in his hand, he is not thinking about logic, morality or consequences. He is only thinking that you have what he wants. And when you disappoint him, it can be disastrous.

You wouldn't buy a car with windshield wipers and headlights but no brakes. You probably even want air bags, ABS and other safety features to protect your family and yourself while driving. Yet so many buy a house with a nice kitchen, air conditioning or even a pool, yet no real security. You would be safer sleeping in your car - it probably at least has locks and an alarm.

A/C and pools are luxuries. Security is a necessity.

Edited September 3, 2008 by MaximumSecurity

[MaximumSecurity]

The concern is not protecting your material wealth while you're not there. What every farang and wealthy Thai need be thinking about is that criminals in Thailand are progressing along the same trends as criminals everywhere else.

As they become bolder, criminal think bigger. A criminal who burglarizes a house and gets the "treasure" that was mentioned in previous postings, often will believe that anyone who has that much "stuff" must have crates full of gold bullion stashed somewhere. The house he is casing may cost more than he can imagine earning in his lifetime working in a factory. The car parked in front may cost more than he will make in ten years. He thinks in his often yaa-baa addled brain that the best way to get it would be to hold a knife to the wife's throat while the husband gets the gold for him.

This is not conjecture. This is how the criminal mind works and is what leads to home invasions and the horrific violence that usually accompanies them. Thinking, "I don't have much" doesn't mean that a criminal understands that. When he breaks into your house while you are sleeping, high on drugs and with a knife in his hand, he is not thinking about logic, morality or consequences. He is only thinking that you have what he wants. And when you disappoint him, it can be disastrous.

You wouldn't buy a car with windshield wipers and headlights but no brakes. You probably even want air bags, ABS and other safety features to protect your family and yourself while driving. Yet so many buy a house with a nice kitchen, air conditioning or even a pool, yet no real security. You would be safer sleeping in your car - it probably at least has locks and an alarm.

A/C and pools are luxuries. Security is a necessity.

[technocracy]

Well the rigor standard here in Lao is to have inner steel window grills and doors. A bit of a pain in the butt I admit but it does add piece of mind that just smashing a window won't gain anyone easy access.

Lets face it regardless of what you put as you perimeter security the fact is that if someone wants to bypass it they will.

I have a 2 metre tall perimeter wall all around my land here without any spikes - but it's more for privacy opposed to security - however it's certainly puts off any possible chancers out for easy pickings (that said in Laos - crime isn't as much of a problem as in Thailand). Also the village (as most do in Vientiane) have roaming security which everyone clubs together for buying them drinks and snacks etc. for nights.

Basic security as mentioned previous of making sure you use good locks and they are used ALL the time is essential. It's pointless having big gates if they aren't even locked!

Oh also all windows have toughened 5mm glass which takes a bit more smashing than your normal 3 or 4mm standard panes.

Edited September 3, 2008 by technocracy

[Beardog]

The biggest problem with an electric fence is you can safely remove the 2 feed wires from the meter to the house(making sure not to touch your body parts to both wires ) while the accomplice puts a sheet of sheet metal in front of the camera. If you have a backup V8 engine you might create enough current to energize the electric fence to due some good. A wetsuit over the wire would make the electric fence useless Rubber does not conduct electricity (if you do not touch the wire with your body parts.)

A good Ninja style black suit will pretty much negate the lame police prospects of catching (their cousin or who ever in the act.)

A friend with a high tech Whoop whoop backup alarm an awesome electric fence& cameras (the prevailing front camera saw a piece of corrugated steel & the other 3 cameras got great shots of short Thai guys in black hoods & masks .Truck was parked out of site as most thieves case your joint out by the time they get there- they already have a good idea & 2 dogs still got hit & the cops didn't do nothing.

If you are going to go the electric route better have a great backup generator not just a tickler Honda portomate.(400-1600 watt)

Best would be a silent system directly linked to the police dept with lots of grease to keep them alert(if available in Thailand) .......No bonus for capture as it might be a relative cashing in & no sticking charges in court.

As Guesthouse said you're best defense is knowing your neighbors & having a vigilant neighborhood watch. With the noise in Thailand who really pays attention to a house alarm, most would just figure a false alarm & who would call the heat as they might think you are in on it.

Short of setting your house like the Vietnamese war bamboo shoots- Clayborn mines betty bombs , etc. a thief can usually get in.

Best is to try not to show your wealth. A wallet labtop ,phones, jewelry & such should be well hidden not displayed where it can be seen. (Possibly the most common mistake made in Thailand) If the goods are that important scribe some id on the items. A Lo jack tracking (GPS) device can be hidden in some devices- then you could track your Plasma Tv to the cash extangers.

& last but not least train a dog (from a puppy to never eat food from anyone but you or your girl (or man) Be adamant to have the dog bite the offenders arm or face if he tries to feed them. Our Golden retriever will just bark if you throw food over the fence to poison it. If anyone comes over & your dog is trained to go off & not stop till you investigate- you can minimize a possible burglary & not be a mark. And my dog is a real gentle dog but is trained to alert me & all the neighbors of possible trouble makers. I rented a spot on a policeman's property(What a hoser!) Anyway he trained dogs & showed me the proper way to have your dog act to outsiders with intent to do harm. My dog is so tough he wouldn't stop growling & barking at me till he smelled my scent.If they shoot the dog (unless it is a crossbow. You will here the bang & figure it out from there. Your neighborhood probably is your prize asset in deterring a thief. Only 2 minutes needed to dismantle all exterior parts & interior in a car AAA insurance in the U.S. & now on U-tube. A house while your away?

[Naam]

What is the best angle of the spikes?

17.532º north, 31.689º south at noon

[Beardog]

What is the best angle of the spikes?

17.532º north, 31.689º south at noon

I like it. Best answer yet!!!!

[VocalNeal]

Hey Beardog,

What was that you were smoking today? Do you have any spare?

[RY12]

Many of you are talking about the drawbacks of an electric fence in terms of the shock; but it is the alarm, as described by kalamabob, that seems the most advantageous part of it- something that goes off if anything touches or snips the wire. I don't think it even needs to have a shock-

If the alarm is really loud, like wakes up the neighborhood, it seems almost like an infallible defense while you're away from your house.... pending 1. the burglar isn't so stoned he just goes on stealing anyway, and 2. you have at least one neighboor you can trust to turn it off.

Even if it wasn't too loud, I think actually that the neighborhood would have a keen interest in investigating the alarm because anyone would worry about their own house if there's a burglary going on next door. hm, even better if the alarm was a voice shouting 'burglary on soi 8! burglary on soi 8!'

Edited September 17, 2008 by RY12

[cobra]

Remember walls can also become traps,

Looking for emergency egress behind your security wall(s) while a crazed lunatic is chasing you around with a machete who got in by hook or crook ...,

Always have an escape plan for yourself

[VocalNeal]

Many of you are talking about the drawbacks of an electric fence in terms of the shock

Why would someone trying to gain access to your property getting an electric shock be a drawback? Maybe the idea of getting a shock is enough to keep potential intruders away. After all maybe they don't know it's alarmed.

[mickba]

Having spent far too many years using various electric fencing systems for outdoor pig production, I wouldn't get too excited about spending much money on one for home security. If you want one, then there's no reason why they should cost much and it would be easy DIY. Other posters have pointed out how easy they are to disable eg. by cutting or grounding them out. The initial shock/surprise is impressive, but it doesn't hurt that much, depending how well earthed you are. Presumably, these wires being 2 metres up in the air, you do have to make contact with both the live and the earth/post simultaneously (?) i.e. playing around with (cutting) the live wouldn't even require insulated cutters.

The associated alarm system may be another matter, but I (or my neighbours) wouldn't have wanted waking up every time some fault occurred in the night (a wet leaf or a ghekko across the insulator and wire etc etc).

It may deter some people, but perhaps it would be easier to just put the wire round and hang the signs without electrifying it. That didn't work with pigs of course, so...........

I can't help thinking someone has just taken basic agricultural equipment and repackaged (and repriced) it. If you want to do it then google "electric fence energisers" or something and look how cheap they are. No, you won't notice the electricity consumption and you could use a leisure type (or car) battery battery, with regular charging, to do exactly the same job, so no worries with temporary loss of power.

So would I bother? Probably not, but if I did then it's a DIY job for almost anyone up to the alarm system.

The angle of spikes should probably be whatever looks the prettiest.

Be sure that the recorder for your cameras isn't one of the first things they find and steal i.e. using your PC isn't the best option.

I think walls are mainly for keeping dogs, kids and buffalo out (or in) but they are an unfortunate necessity, if only for that. I think they should be as open as possible (so that neighbours can see in and the Rotweiller can see out) - and as pretty as possible of course.

[VocalNeal]

Having spent far too many years using various electric fencing systems for outdoor pig production,.......... but if I did then it's a DIY job.

A Pig's Ear of a job, presumably.

[MaximumSecurity]

Best is to try not to show your wealth.

If the goods are that important scribe some id on the items.

A Lo jack tracking (GPS) device can be hidden in some devices- then you could track your Plasma Tv

Our Golden retriever will just bark if you throw food over the fence to poison it

Your neighborhood probably is your prize asset in deterring a thief.

Beardog, you should come work for us. You have the right idea - no one element constitutes real security. It is the integration of systems and methodologies (like what would you do if you woke up hearing someone breaking into your house) that makes you safe.

But I have to disagree with whoever said that intruders can breach any security if they want to. We would be out of business if that were true - we offer a "double your money back guarantee" if anyone is harmed by an uninvited intruder in a home for which we have developed and implemented the security.

I apologize if this sounds like an ad but I get really upset when I read headlines of another in-home violent attack (like the double stabbings last week in Phuket) that I know I could have prevented. So please call any security company to get some kind of security installed in your home.

[Beardog]

Best is to try not to show your wealth.

If the goods are that important scribe some id on the items.

A Lo jack tracking (GPS) device can be hidden in some devices- then you could track your Plasma Tv

Our Golden retriever will just bark if you throw food over the fence to poison it

Your neighborhood probably is your prize asset in deterring a thief.

Beardog, you should come work for us. You have the right idea - no one element constitutes real security. It is the integration of systems and methodologies (like what would you do if you woke up hearing someone breaking into your house) that makes you safe.

But I have to disagree with whoever said that intruders can breach any security if they want to. We would be out of business if that were true - we offer a "double your money back guarantee" if anyone is harmed by an uninvited intruder in a home for which we have developed and implemented the security.

I apologize if this sounds like an ad but I get really upset when I read headlines of another in-home violent attack (like the double stabbings last week in Phuket) that I know I could have prevented. So please call any security company to get some kind of security installed in your home.

If I could get a work permit & lived up in your neck of the woods I might take you up on the offer.

That is a drag about the double murder!

In Pob choke village when the loud alarms go off(they have been hit 5 times in 2 years that I know of from living there for a while) the neighbors just get pissed & think it is a false alarm & think the owner is a j-off. Once there was bona fide stupidity,

the owner walked out of his house & did not lockup the house first inviting(probably a worker-Security guard or another neighbor-who knows) he lost his palm computer cellphone & his money in his wallet, he was lucky they didn't want to keep the wallet or passport.

If your company offers a silent alarm setup with report on breakin to your company as well as your clients cellphone - key pad with an alert to the client you probably have the best niche on the market. In Northern California where I lived for a while this was the best system as thieves are not the sharpest tool in the shed (in the common sense dept.) and often loligag around thinking they are invisible allowing enough time to get caught.

Still like most agree the best ways of protection is to be smart & not show your wealth team up with neighbors that are genuinely concerned to do a neighborhood watch & a goose is hella affective. Their multiple biting is way more irritating than most critters if you don't mind goose <deleted> everywhere.

Silent alarm with a report almost infallible!

[VocalNeal]

The biggest problem with an electric fence is you can safely remove the 2 feed wires from the meter to the house(making sure not to touch your body parts to both wires ) while the accomplice puts a sheet of sheet metal in front of the camera. If you have a backup V8 engine you might create enough current to energize the electric fence to due some good. A wetsuit over the wire would make the electric fence useless Rubber does not conduct electricity (if you do not touch the wire with your body parts.)

The electric shock,

, is just to keep inquisitive people away. Having said that an electric security fence is a monitored barrier, so any attempt to tamper with to gain access will generate an alarm. One key thing is that the alarm, audible or silent is generated before the intruder gains access. One can argue about the usefulness of an alarm in specific villages where there are many false alarms but generally intruders do not like to draw attention to themselves. As for the disconnection of the meter and throwing a wet suit over the wires, all good burglar alarms have backup batteries, so it follows that so do good electric fences. Wet suits are expensive so one would doubt guys wander around at night wearing them. Trucks do have rubber mats on the other hand but while they will prevent intruders from experiencing the bulk of the shock they will not prevent the alarm from being triggered.

The success of an electric security fence is due in part to the psychological threat of receiving an electric shock of unknown severity. The presence of an electric fence also makes a statement. It says the owner or resident is serious about protecting their property. Would be thieves do not know what other security systems may or may not be inside. It is therefore easier for them to go for a softer target somewhere else. Electric security fences are very popular and very effective in many countries, especially for commercial or industrial property. They may not be popular in the litigious USA but that does not mean they don’t work.

[paulfromphuket]

The biggest problem with an electric fence is you can safely remove the 2 feed wires from the meter to the house(making sure not to touch your body parts to both wires ) while the accomplice puts a sheet of sheet metal in front of the camera. If you have a backup V8 engine you might create enough current to energize the electric fence to due some good. A wetsuit over the wire would make the electric fence useless Rubber does not conduct electricity (if you do not touch the wire with your body parts.)

The electric shock,

, is just to keep inquisitive people away. Having said that an electric security fence is a monitored barrier, so any attempt to tamper with to gain access will generate an alarm. One key thing is that the alarm, audible or silent is generated before the intruder gains access. One can argue about the usefulness of an alarm in specific villages where there are many false alarms but generally intruders do not like to draw attention to themselves. As for the disconnection of the meter and throwing a wet suit over the wires, all good burglar alarms have backup batteries, so it follows that so do good electric fences. Wet suits are expensive so one would doubt guys wander around at night wearing them. Trucks do have rubber mats on the other hand but while they will prevent intruders from experiencing the bulk of the shock they will not prevent the alarm from being triggered.

The success of an electric security fence is due in part to the psychological threat of receiving an electric shock of unknown severity. The presence of an electric fence also makes a statement. It says the owner or resident is serious about protecting their property. Would be thieves do not know what other security systems may or may not be inside. It is therefore easier for them to go for a softer target somewhere else. Electric security fences are very popular and very effective in many countries, especially for commercial or industrial property. They may not be popular in the litigious USA but that does not mean they don't work.

and when the power is cut?

[VocalNeal]

The biggest problem with an electric fence is you can safely remove the 2 feed wires from the meter to the house(making sure not to touch your body parts to both wires ) while the accomplice puts a sheet of sheet metal in front of the camera. If you have a backup V8 engine you might create enough current to energize the electric fence to due some good. A wetsuit over the wire would make the electric fence useless Rubber does not conduct electricity (if you do not touch the wire with your body parts.)

The electric shock,

, is just to keep inquisitive people away. Having said that an electric security fence is a monitored barrier, so any attempt to tamper with to gain access will generate an alarm. One key thing is that the alarm, audible or silent is generated before the intruder gains access. One can argue about the usefulness of an alarm in specific villages where there are many false alarms but generally intruders do not like to draw attention to themselves. As for the disconnection of the meter and throwing a wet suit over the wires, all good burglar alarms have backup batteries, so it follows that so do good electric fences. Wet suits are expensive so one would doubt guys wander around at night wearing them. Trucks do have rubber mats on the other hand but while they will prevent intruders from experiencing the bulk of the shock they will not prevent the alarm from being triggered.

The success of an electric security fence is due in part to the psychological threat of receiving an electric shock of unknown severity. The presence of an electric fence also makes a statement. It says the owner or resident is serious about protecting their property. Would be thieves do not know what other security systems may or may not be inside. It is therefore easier for them to go for a softer target somewhere else. Electric security fences are very popular and very effective in many countries, especially for commercial or industrial property. They may not be popular in the litigious USA but that does not mean they don't work.

and when the power is cut?

Paul,

Hi. If you read the above again you will see they have backup batteries.

[Beardog]

And Alcatraz in Sanfrancisco was electric fence on 45% angled rolled barb wire & it was breached. Trust me Electric fence way over the top & can be breached fairly easy. If you have staff that look after your property they would be in an ultimate position to set up your house for a burglary. Rubber is an excellent way to cut the conductivity of Electricity.Most of the burglary's in the U.S. are from in house installers as they know the commands & all the overrides when they install. If a thief really wants in he will most likely get in. about a kilo from our casa 5 very nice houses have been getting hit very often. They don't team up Except me & 1 other friend which we contact each other immediately & I contact the govn. top official here in Bang Sare & he sends out 5 of his henchmen to scour the area. (he lives 2 blocks away). Unfortunately the time I spent in the 80's as an investigator with the insurance companies & the Palm Springs judicial department (in addition to having cops as friends & living on an ex-officers lot) I am inclined to believe most of these jobs are inside jobs. Triple A can strip a car outside & interior in 2 minutes. Tests that were done by agencies I worked with can tear a cars engine- tranny- computers Body & interior in 4& 12 minutes. The method most Judges or insurance companies use for investigation is hiring The cream of the crop top dog thieves to find out what happened & how to check for clues. houses are a little trickier as you can't load them on a truck. But anyone in the industry of security will agree whoever does your locks particularly in upper custom houses where you are having very expensive keys cut for you doors (not the 2000-4000 baht variety) the locksmith will have a master to it. The installer of a security company can be an easy in if the staff is on the take. Believe me There are some good companies that employ honest people. And I think Max security is one of the goodins, But believe me you can be had unless you got armed guards & Fort Knox setup. After Bob Hope's home was setup in Cathedral City California (14 miles outside Palm Springs metro area) We found 6 loopholes & had to close the Gaping holes in the way the the properties security was set up . Now electric keypads can be breached through the same roaming technology the same as getting credit card transfer info as the bandits drive by. security is a bread & butter industry & closely related to the auto & home building industry & my work moved toward using my brains instead of my brawn.

People in Pattaya area are constantly getting hit while they sleep. I doubt highly that the grade of thief here is better than the U.S. Not being paranoid just realistic. If you have staff best take care of them good!

[VocalNeal]

BearDog,

You are entitled to your opinion and I respect that but the fact is that electric fences DO prevent crime.

If I may quote this I found whilst surfing, as I just finished a book.

Distribution company's security nightmare solved

overnight by electric fence system – down from 4

crimes a week, to none in 12 months!

A succession of security measures, which failed to stop these attacks, included high security fencing, a monitored alarm system, remotely monitored infra-red CCTV and even nightly security guard

"The criminals were hitting us relentlessly. Eventually our local police suggested that we try the new PulseSecure™ electrified perimeter security system – I was totally amazed that it worked overnight,"

Edited September 23, 2008 by VocalNeal

[Beardog]

BearDog,

You are entitled to your opinion and I respect that but the fact is that electric fences DO prevent crime.

If I may quote this I found whilst surfing, as I just finished a book.

Distribution company's security nightmare solved

overnight by electric fence system – down from 4

crimes a week, to none in 12 months!

A succession of security measures, which failed to stop these attacks, included high security fencing, a monitored alarm system, remotely monitored infra-red CCTV and even nightly security guard

"The criminals were hitting us relentlessly. Eventually our local police suggested that we try the new PulseSecure™ electrified perimeter security system – I was totally amazed that it worked overnight,"

Sounds like the salesman made a great commission & the owner got a kickback for the wonderful testimony.

The best 2 components of the testimony are the infra-red sensors & the monitored alarm.

Use what makes you feel safe & hope we don't hear your story about getting hit while you were asleep.

There are much more advanced systems banks use that are near perfect- but they would cost a good part of the house you build!

Edited September 23, 2008 by Beardog

[simon43]

Get some geese!

Simon