Moving And Living In Thailand

[Blackandwhite]

Hi all

I know this is allot to ask of people but I would really value your thoughts to the following post.

My name is Simon ( 35 yo ) and I have been married to my wife Yo ( Thai ) ( 30 yo ) for 9 years and we have an eight year old daughter with dual nationality. We are very settled and content with each other, we have a very comfortable life in the Uk and we have everything we wish for within reason. My daughter takes part in Ballet and is highly graded and has been asked to join every dance completion group there is. the only problem I have is I do wonder if we miss out as a family the life we could have in Thailand if we were able to find a way of living in Thailand, yes surely the life is massively different and we have all the usual security of the UK Bla Bla Bla. But that aside and material things aside where is life as in real life better. I have my own thoughts on this and will gladly share if any one want to hear it. I do not need to hear from anyone wishing to disrespect any of the Thai people and what they do or the culture of the Land so please I do not need to hear any self inflicted horror stories. I am a non drinker and have no intention of living in Thailand with the sole purpose of getting drunk each day in a bar or riding round bare back on a huge motorbike, please take no offence if that is you and what you enjoy, it is each to there own and this just puts you in the picture.

So that aside, I am looking to move at some point to Thailand to live.

We could probably find spare cash here of about 3'000000.00 thai baht to buy a house and I guess where we chose to live would depend on what style and size of house we might get for that amount of money. We would also be able to leave a certain amount of money in the form of a house here in the Uk as a back up plan if all goes wrong for any reason. Could even consider leaving a little less here and look at buying a small guest house or similar venture.

I understand all the culture things, the food is no problem as we only eat Thai at home and the language I can nearly speak now, the weather I enjoy I am half African guess you could say I have a built in resistance to the sun. I also have heard most of the stories about the fact that Thais from time to time might stub European / Thai families in some areas of the community, I can handle this as the same happens here in the Uk from time to time.

What I could do with is some incite on what you gave up to live in Thailand and what you do now your in Thailand and your thoughts and experiences in doing this, including the main reason for doing so. Especially when it comes to children growing up in Thailand and the experiences they have and the things you might think could have been better if you have stayed in Europe. Interested in your thoughts to Schools, family life, thoughts on family back home ect, children growing up and the position in society they have and the things they learn and the things they might not have learnt in Europe. Do you spend more or less time as a family now you live in Thailand. What are the worst things about the transition and the new life in such vastly different place. Also hobbies and dancing, drama and singing classes for children is there the same things there for them to do, these have to be seen as opportunities as this is the foundation so far of my daughters life.

Please PM me or simply post your thoughts,

Thank you, and I mean no offence to anybody by posting this Topic.

[ianf]

Hi all

I know this is allot to ask of people but I would really value your thoughts to the following post.

My name is Simon ( 35 yo ) and I have been married to my wife Yo ( Thai ) ( 30 yo ) for 9 years and we have an eight year old daughter with dual nationality. We are very settled and content with each other, we have a very comfortable life in the Uk and we have everything we wish for within reason. My daughter takes part in Ballet and is highly graded and has been asked to join every dance completion group there is. the only problem I have is I do wonder if we miss out as a family the life we could have in Thailand if we were able to find a way of living in Thailand, yes surely the life is massively different and we have all the usual security of the UK Bla Bla Bla. But that aside and material things aside where is life as in real life better. I have my own thoughts on this and will gladly share if any one want to hear it. I do not need to hear from anyone wishing to disrespect any of the Thai people and what they do or the culture of the Land so please I do not need to hear any self inflicted horror stories. I am a non drinker and have no intention of living in Thailand with the sole purpose of getting drunk each day in a bar or riding round bare back on a huge motorbike, please take no offence if that is you and what you enjoy, it is each to there own and this just puts you in the picture.

So that aside, I am looking to move at some point to Thailand to live.

We could probably find spare cash here of about 3'000000.00 thai baht to buy a house and I guess where we chose to live would depend on what style and size of house we might get for that amount of money. We would also be able to leave a certain amount of money in the form of a house here in the Uk as a back up plan if all goes wrong for any reason. Could even consider leaving a little less here and look at buying a small guest house or similar venture.

I understand all the culture things, the food is no problem as we only eat Thai at home and the language I can nearly speak now, the weather I enjoy I am half African guess you could say I have a built in resistance to the sun. I also have heard most of the stories about the fact that Thais from time to time might stub European / Thai families in some areas of the community, I can handle this as the same happens here in the Uk from time to time.

What I could do with is some incite on what you gave up to live in Thailand and what you do now your in Thailand and your thoughts and experiences in doing this, including the main reason for doing so. Especially when it comes to children growing up in Thailand and the experiences they have and the things you might think could have been better if you have stayed in Europe. Interested in your thoughts to Schools, family life, thoughts on family back home ect, children growing up and the position in society they have and the things they learn and the things they might not have learnt in Europe. Do you spend more or less time as a family now you live in Thailand. What are the worst things about the transition and the new life in such vastly different place. Also hobbies and dancing, drama and singing classes for children is there the same things there for them to do, these have to be seen as opportunities as this is the foundation so far of my daughters life.

Please PM me or simply post your thoughts,

My wife and I are in the same position. She is in Thailand now buying a house. You can buy decent property for 3m, but our budget is higher than that. I have a pension and private means so financially we are fine. My 9 year old will go to a small international school in Chiang Mai and my wife may resume her career as a Civil Engineer. The future holds no concerns for me but if I were you I'd think about your source of income. You should get in on a marriage visa but you may have to show how you can support yourself. For a friend we just found a really nice house in Bangkok for 1.6m and a small photocopy/office service business for 400k. It means that she can be self-sufficient right away. Other costs include shipping your stuff, furnishing/equipping a house, buying a vehicle (very expensive it seems in Thailand, and so on. But there are many good reasons for quitting the UK and we are looking forward to getting out.

[Boo]

Education would be (and is) my main concern. How will you afford it & what type of education do you want her to have. What about her ballet, is it something she can peruse in Thailand to the same level?

[Lucifer]

Don't burn any bridges.

If you have a house in the UK, keep it and rent it out.

Rent yourself a house in Thailand. Away from your in-laws(about 1.5 hours away).

[Blackandwhite]

Education would be (and is) my main concern. How will you afford it & what type of education do you want her to have. What about her ballet, is it something she can peruse in Thailand to the same level?

Yes education is important and will be my only concern, I have looked in the past at St Stevens in Korat, seamed like a good option, still to look in other areas of Thailand such as Hua Hin

Ballet I am not sure about Boo, but will be interesting to find out.

Simon

[rleaton]

Simon:

As a long time resident I can recommend no better place than Chiang Mai.....There is a large expat community and many facilities of which you can avail yourself....supermarkets, restaurants, etc. There are many groups here...sports clubs etc.......There are also many Christian churches and warm caring families. The schools here are very good, offering an English language education and a mixed culture enrollment that really broadens the students horizon. My granddaughter attends Chiang Mai International School and we are very pleased with her education! I suggest you try http://www.cmis.ac.th/ Also check out a couple of the news magazines there to find out what is happening http://www.chiangmainews.com/. Would love to welcome you to the community!

[chiangmaibruce]

Hi. You can given a reasonable insight into your position but there are still a lot of other personal variables you haven't touched on.

Have a good scroll through thaivisa, especially the General Forum for other "is the grass greener on that side of the fence" stories. there are many of them and some of the related discussions are quite informative. Look at some of the gripe stories here and think if these issues being raised are the sort of things which (cumulatively) would get to you after a while (I mean after the initial novelty of being here wears off).

Definitely rent for the first year and definitely don't sell your place in the UK for at least that period of time.

Generating an income here is very difficult, and some international schools are very expensive. You may also find that if you eventually move back to the UK you will have some difficulty re-starting your career there. If money not a great issue however then perhaps give it a go on the basis of a one year trial.

You will probably do just fine, but listen to what folks are saying about not burning any bridges

[Blackandwhite]

The things that are sure is this,

I fully understand that there needs to be an out back to the Uk if I need one,

I will not sell up here in the Uk and leave to move to Thailand it will be a planned exercise using money that I might have to write off if things hit the fan in any way or it simply does not work out.

My daughter is at the very top on my list of priorities,

I would look to be very involved with local groups of other expatriates and of course any groups of friends my wife might have.

I thank you for the info and ask please keep it coming it is forming a great case study of thoughts for me to consider.

While you all enjoy the sun out the, think of us in the Uk in the cold!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! lol

[torrenova]

I came here single so my situation was different to the OP's. I now have an 18 month old daughter and I have owned and run a number of businesses in Thailand, largely connected with the nightlife and entertainment sector but not exclusively.

With a 9 year old daughter and living in the UK I would have to really think why I was considering this potential move. Personally, I think you should stay in the UK unless you are more wealthy than you have portrayed.

I would budget Bt1,000,000 each year for your daughter's education. You are presumably the breadwinner so at £20,000 a year for your daughter, another Bt1m (£10k) a year for household expenses and another Bt1m (£10k) a year for incidentals you are looking at £40,000 or Bt2,000,000 a year expenses. You have that responsibility for presumably another 13 years until after university. You don't state you have £500,000 floating around which you don't need.

At 35 you will not have a significant pension unless you have your own business or perhaps on a significant salary.

Thailand has real inflation way above the official figures and has had for a number of years now.

The world is in recession, Thailand has additional problems. I would not invest here now unless it was a real bargain. I certainly would not uproot my family to come here now.

Ride out the recession in the UK. Get your daughter through her change to senior school at age 11. Things will look very different then.

As for a guest house then you don't have the money to buy the buildings so you will need a long lease. Watch out for rent increases and key money to renew the lease.

I will speak about Pattaya as I did most of my business there. Kitting out a room to good quality is a ballpark Bt100,000 a room. Over 12 rooms and you need different licenses. Working on 12 rooms with a decent location you should be able to achieve 66% occupancy in year 2 at about Bt750 average and perhaps 75% average at the same rate in year 3. You will need to be inventive though and spend on an internet presence (professional, not mickey mouse) and advertising.

You will need extra income streams so your guest house will need a restaurant and a bar area. You will need experience or training to manage these well.

So what about income ? your 365*12*750*66% brings you about Bt2.2m. I expect a cost ratio including depreciation of around 25% to 33% leaving you with a contribution of some Bt1.5m upwards.

Your bar and restaurant should add another million to that after costs.

You then have deductions for rent and utilities and some additional depreciation.

At those levels you would be just about over the £40,000 you currently need but if you required management instead of doing it yourself then the numbers would fall. You have to ask yourself whether you could be a hotelier or whether it is too different a job for you and your wife. The hours for instance are not very social in respect of your daughter. Therefore I think you'd need some management and foreign and thus expensive at that.

However, running such a business is not particularly tasking so you would have time to look at other ideas or developing your business.

Finally for now, do not forget start up costs. Rent, don't buy but no need to pay more than Bt15k a month in Pattaya for 3 bed/bath houses. Less in other areas but harsher business conditions I suspect. You'll need a car or two so budget Bt1.5m for a truck and a car, Bt800k for a 4 door pick up truck.

I'd plan towards having an opportunity in 2 years and save for that. Hopefully nothing will have changed dramatically but one must always have plans for the future and Thailand may well be a very different place sooner rather than later.

[thaihome]

If you have a good job in the UK don’t leave it unless you get one that pays at least that much or more in Thailand. Why take a step back in your working life?

Do you run a small business in the UK? If not, what makes you think you can do so in foreign country?

TH

[JacknDanny]

I came here single so my situation was different to the OP's. I now have an 18 month old daughter and I have owned and run a number of businesses in Thailand, largely connected with the nightlife and entertainment sector but not exclusively.

With a 9 year old daughter and living in the UK I would have to really think why I was considering this potential move. Personally, I think you should stay in the UK unless you are more wealthy than you have portrayed.

I would budget Bt1,000,000 each year for your daughter's education. You are presumably the breadwinner so at £20,000 a year for your daughter, another Bt1m (£10k) a year for household expenses and another Bt1m (£10k) a year for incidentals you are looking at £40,000 or Bt2,000,000 a year expenses. You have that responsibility for presumably another 13 years until after university. You don't state you have £500,000 floating around which you don't need.

At 35 you will not have a significant pension unless you have your own business or perhaps on a significant salary.

Thailand has real inflation way above the official figures and has had for a number of years now.

The world is in recession, Thailand has additional problems. I would not invest here now unless it was a real bargain. I certainly would not uproot my family to come here now.

Ride out the recession in the UK. Get your daughter through her change to senior school at age 11. Things will look very different then.

As for a guest house then you don't have the money to buy the buildings so you will need a long lease. Watch out for rent increases and key money to renew the lease.

I will speak about Pattaya as I did most of my business there. Kitting out a room to good quality is a ballpark Bt100,000 a room. Over 12 rooms and you need different licenses. Working on 12 rooms with a decent location you should be able to achieve 66% occupancy in year 2 at about Bt750 average and perhaps 75% average at the same rate in year 3. You will need to be inventive though and spend on an internet presence (professional, not mickey mouse) and advertising.

You will need extra income streams so your guest house will need a restaurant and a bar area. You will need experience or training to manage these well.

So what about income ? your 365*12*750*66% brings you about Bt2.2m. I expect a cost ratio including depreciation of around 25% to 33% leaving you with a contribution of some Bt1.5m upwards.

Your bar and restaurant should add another million to that after costs.

You then have deductions for rent and utilities and some additional depreciation.

At those levels you would be just about over the £40,000 you currently need but if you required management instead of doing it yourself then the numbers would fall. You have to ask yourself whether you could be a hotelier or whether it is too different a job for you and your wife. The hours for instance are not very social in respect of your daughter. Therefore I think you'd need some management and foreign and thus expensive at that.

However, running such a business is not particularly tasking so you would have time to look at other ideas or developing your business.

Finally for now, do not forget start up costs. Rent, don't buy but no need to pay more than Bt15k a month in Pattaya for 3 bed/bath houses. Less in other areas but harsher business conditions I suspect. You'll need a car or two so budget Bt1.5m for a truck and a car, Bt800k for a 4 door pick up truck.

I'd plan towards having an opportunity in 2 years and save for that. Hopefully nothing will have changed dramatically but one must always have plans for the future and Thailand may well be a very different place sooner rather than later.

You talk a lot of sense, but I just dont agree with some of those figures.

International schools, for example. 1m/year is a bit top heavy! 500k will get you a very good international school(150k/term)

Remember the OP is a non drinker, happy at home eating Thai food, again 80k per month is top heavy for someone who is not out socialising all the time.

Having said all that, if I were the OP I would want to have a bit more liquid cash available than what he appears to have, especially with the exchange rate UK to Baht being so low.

To the OP, unfortunately there are no international schools in Hua Hin (that I am aware of)..

The last paragraph from torrenova is spot on.

[Blackandwhite]

If you have a good job in the UK don’t leave it unless you get one that pays at least that much or more in Thailand. Why take a step back in your working life?

Do you run a small business in the UK? If not, what makes you think you can do so in foreign country?

TH

Hi

I agree 100% with the above without giving to much info away. I have a two houses in the Uk that have a combined value of £400000.00 with £250000.00 in mortgages.

I have a house in Issan

I run my own business that earns about £200000.00 profit per year, getting there and the plan is gradually taking shape. Looking more of a better option once my daughter goes to high school 4 years time, By then the house will be paid for here in the Uk and will rent well.

Business will sell at a fair price to enable me to take some of the funds to Thailand, as the MD of a very successful company I of course can have a fair imput in running businesses, I am a qualified chef and specialise in Pan Asian Cuisene I also as a side line offer Thai cookery lessons to English and Thai people here in the Uk.

Guess the idea is to work hard and save hard !!!!

[torrenova]

You talk a lot of sense, but I just dont agree with some of those figures.

International schools, for example. 1m/year is a bit top heavy! 500k will get you a very good international school(150k/term)

Remember the OP is a non drinker, happy at home eating Thai food, again 80k per month is top heavy for someone who is not out socialising all the time.

Having said all that, if I were the OP I would want to have a bit more liquid cash available than what he appears to have, especially with the exchange rate UK to Baht being so low.

To the OP, unfortunately there are no international schools in Hua Hin (that I am aware of)..

The last paragraph from torrenova is spot on.

I agree with you but in my budgeting I just pencil in Bt1m a year. I guess that if the fees are 500k then there will always be other things associated with school and school friends which add up. Laptops, holidays, non curricular activities etc. Getting more expensive as time goes on.

The really frightening numbers come from university costs for some subjects if you are classed as a foreign student. Add in accommodation and spending money and you are looking at anything from $50,000 to $100,000 a year.