Rip Off

[Cyprus1951]

I've read in a few posts now that Thais will always rip you off. Well I can't speak on this as I have not lived full time in Phuket, YET!

However, what I have noticed in Europe is that if you are an ex-pat the locals rip you off regardless. My main residence is in Cyprus, the Cypriots are proud of the fact that there are prices for Cypriots and higher prices for English/Others. I do think that if a country is not your native land then there is a tendency to be taken advantage of, often in the nicest way, but it still costs you regardless. So getting back to where I started, where ever you are it's a fact of life that if you're not a native, you will be taken advantage of, for as much as can be got away with, and we shouldn't be surprised or horrified as it's a fact of life.

[LivinLOS]

Well having lived in England, ireland, holland, belgium, germany, the USA, and Morocco, before coming here I can say that only in backward / 3rd world / developing countries does that seem the case to me.

The more backward and banana republic somewhere is, the more this seems to be the case.. The more developed a place, the more safeguards and consumer protections are there to stop it.

Its certainly not 'everywhere'

[CroBiker]

In Asia I lived in Singapore and Malaysia - never been subjected to double pricing.

[valentinob29]

I've read in a few posts now that Thais will always rip you off. Well I can't speak on this as I have not lived full time in Phuket, YET!

However, what I have noticed in Europe is that if you are an ex-pat the locals rip you off regardless. My main residence is in Cyprus, the Cypriots are proud of the fact that there are prices for Cypriots and higher prices for English/Others. I do think that if a country is not your native land then there is a tendency to be taken advantage of, often in the nicest way, but it still costs you regardless. So getting back to where I started, where ever you are it's a fact of life that if you're not a native, you will be taken advantage of, for as much as can be got away with, and we shouldn't be surprised or horrified as it's a fact of life.

then they are proud of being stupid backward ingrates

real pride there...

[Cyprus1951]

Well having lived in England, ireland, holland, belgium, germany, the USA, and Morocco, before coming here I can say that only in backward / 3rd world / developing countries does that seem the case to me.

The more backward and banana republic somewhere is, the more this seems to be the case.. The more developed a place, the more safeguards and consumer protections are there to stop it.

Its certainly not 'everywhere'

You're not wrong in that Cyprus is a bit 3rd world! ...and i'm sure your correct in that this applies more to the smaller destinations.

Particularly in those places that have only just seen the effect of mass development.

[Ping]

Although some taxi drivers and tour operators seem to be the same everywhere...

[laphroaig]

Is double pricing necessarily a 'rip off' by definition? In a free market surely a vendor can charge what they wish. It is up to the consumer as to whether they choose to pay or look elsewhere.

It only appears unsavoury when farang presumes the higher prices are based on the assumption that they can afford it.

Let's also remember that Thailand culture encourages haggling for a price so it is not really comparable with other developed countries in this regard

Edited February 23, 2009 by laphroaig

[TheWalkingMan]

Is double pricing necessarily a 'rip off' by definition? In a free market surely a vendor can charge what they wish. It is up to the consumer as to whether they choose to pay or look elsewhere.

It only appears unsavoury when farang presumes the higher prices are based on the assumption that they can afford it.

Let's also remember that Thailand culture encourages haggling for a price so it is not really comparable with other developed countries in this regard

You know, this haggling works when shopping at an open market or something of that nature. Then of course you bargain and bargain hard. However, when purchasing goods/services which have dual prices purely because the person is a falang... then it does become a rip-off.

Example (I think I posted this before) Le Cordon Bleu Cooking School in association with Dusit Hotel Group...

Each course is 30k baht higher for non-Thais.

Smells like a rip-off to me.

TheWalkingMan

[laphroaig]

Is double pricing necessarily a 'rip off' by definition? In a free market surely a vendor can charge what they wish. It is up to the consumer as to whether they choose to pay or look elsewhere.

It only appears unsavoury when farang presumes the higher prices are based on the assumption that they can afford it.

Let's also remember that Thailand culture encourages haggling for a price so it is not really comparable with other developed countries in this regard

You know, this haggling works when shopping at an open market or something of that nature. Then of course you bargain and bargain hard. However, when purchasing goods/services which have dual prices purely because the person is a falang... then it does become a rip-off.

Example (I think I posted this before) Le Cordon Bleu Cooking School in association with Dusit Hotel Group...

Each course is 30k baht higher for non-Thais.

Smells like a rip-off to me.

TheWalkingMan

Fair enough,

My mentioning of the haggling was more to illustrate the fundametal differences between Thai commercial structure and western developed nations. I just wonder if the 'rip off' feeling is simply because it is decided on race rather than ability to pay.

I am not going to admonish the system in New Zealand or England as ageist because pensioners and kids pay less than adults for train fares, cinema entries etc but it is not too far removed from the context of the thread. I am not going to admonish my Gym for being sexist because women get a cheaper deal for certain aspects than men.

certain insurers charge less for women drivers than men.

It is only a rip off if it upsets you.

Cheers

[chickencurry]

I've read in a few posts now that Thais will always rip you off. Well I can't speak on this as I have not lived full time in Phuket, YET!

I can only speak personally and have been here just over a year, but I've found that the Farangs here rip you off far more than Thais. True the greengrocer charges me slightly higher prices than locals (though getting lower as I speak more Thai) but she's still cheaper than Tescos so I don't consider it a rip-off particularly. Just my view.

[stevenl]

I can only speak personally and have been here just over a year, but I've found that the Farangs here rip you off far more than Thais.

Totally agree with that.

[Boater]

London Black Cab Drivers ' Used ' to be really bad a double faring forigners in the capital a few years back

[cotambear]

Is double pricing necessarily a 'rip off' by definition? In a free market surely a vendor can charge what they wish. It is up to the consumer as to whether they choose to pay or look elsewhere.

It only appears unsavoury when farang presumes the higher prices are based on the assumption that they can afford it.

Let's also remember that Thailand culture encourages haggling for a price so it is not really comparable with other developed countries in this regard

You know, this haggling works when shopping at an open market or something of that nature. Then of course you bargain and bargain hard. However, when purchasing goods/services which have dual prices purely because the person is a falang... then it does become a rip-off.

Example (I think I posted this before) Le Cordon Bleu Cooking School in association with Dusit Hotel Group...

Each course is 30k baht higher for non-Thais.

Smells like a rip-off to me.

TheWalkingMan

Fair enough,

My mentioning of the haggling was more to illustrate the fundametal differences between Thai commercial structure and western developed nations. I just wonder if the 'rip off' feeling is simply because it is decided on race rather than ability to pay.

I am not going to admonish the system in New Zealand or England as ageist because pensioners and kids pay less than adults for train fares, cinema entries etc but it is not too far removed from the context of the thread. I am not going to admonish my Gym for being sexist because women get a cheaper deal for certain aspects than men.

certain insurers charge less for women drivers than men.

It is only a rip off if it upsets you.

Cheers

Once again cultural relativism is used to justify objectionable behavior - though in this case you have compounded your error by getting the facts wrong.

Where haggling - eg in a market buying tshirts - is the accepted norm then I`m happy to do it.

However I don`t see thais haggling with the vendor of pancakes who charges 20baht to get 2baht off the price. But I do then see that vendor trying to charge 40 baht to a farang.

The insurance argument is plain silly. Insurers are risk assesors. they will charge say car insurance to a younger driver at a higher price because their acturial tables inform them that younger drivers are more likely to crash the car - nor because they are trying a higher price through discrimination.

There are always people who will try to justify what is accepted as the `norm`, even though it is logically abnormal.

[laphroaig]

Once again cultural relativism is used to justify objectionable behavior - though in this case you have compounded your error by getting the facts wrong.

Diverse views and opinions do not equate to 'wrong'. If you take a wider viewpoint to the one you clearly have already decided upon you may be pleasantly enlightened.

Where haggling - eg in a market buying tshirts - is the accepted norm then I`m happy to do it.

However I don`t see thais haggling with the vendor of pancakes who charges 20baht to get 2baht off the price. But I do then see that vendor trying to charge 40 baht to a farang.

For the hard of hearing and slow to understand, I repeat what I said in my previous message.

My mentioning of the haggling was more to illustrate the fundametal differences between Thai commercial structure and western developed nations. I just wonder if the 'rip off' feeling is simply because it is decided on race rather than ability to pay.

Thai commercial culture is different to Western Culture. What is acceptable in one culture may not be so in the other. If it is unacceptable to you then so be it, that is your fundamental right to accept or otherwise. Whether it is acceptable or not to others or as stated 'a rip off' is a matter of individual opinion.

The insurance argument is plain silly. Insurers are risk assesors. they will charge say car insurance to a younger driver at a higher price because their acturial tables inform them that younger drivers are more likely to crash the car - nor because they are trying a higher price through discrimination.

Once more, if you read my message properly, I never mentioned the insurance issue in the context of age. I have an actuarial background and am well aware of how insurers set their rates. There is no evidence or sufficient data in place to actuarially state that women are less of a risk than men, yet some insurers reward women with lower premiums. It is a marketing thing, no different to the age or occupational discounts.

Altering what I actually said to support your own argument adds little credibility to your contribution.

There are always people who will try to justify what is accepted as the `norm`, even though it is logically abnormal.

and there are always people who are so set in their ways that they are unable to see beyond the end of their noses.

Cheers

Edited February 24, 2009 by laphroaig

[bkkjames]

I've read in a few posts now that Thais will always rip you off. Well I can't speak on this as I have not lived full time in Phuket, YET!

However, what I have noticed in Europe is that if you are an ex-pat the locals rip you off regardless. My main residence is in Cyprus, the Cypriots are proud of the fact that there are prices for Cypriots and higher prices for English/Others. I do think that if a country is not your native land then there is a tendency to be taken advantage of, often in the nicest way, but it still costs you regardless. So getting back to where I started, where ever you are it's a fact of life that if you're not a native, you will be taken advantage of, for as much as can be got away with, and we shouldn't be surprised or horrified as it's a fact of life.

then they are proud of being stupid backward ingrates

real pride there...

Lived there for a few months last year and don't disagree with your proud assertion (is it different than here?), however never felt like I was being charged double for anything while on the island.

kalamara!

[Cyprus1951]

Lived there for a few months last year and don't disagree with your proud assertion (is it different than here?), however never felt like I was being charged double for anything while on the island.

kalamara!

What I said was 'there are prices for Cypriots and higher prices for English/Others. ' Not Double!

[barky]

Well having lived in England, ireland, holland, belgium, germany, the USA, and Morocco, before coming here I can say that only in backward / 3rd world / developing countries does that seem the case to me.

The more backward and banana republic somewhere is, the more this seems to be the case.. The more developed a place, the more safeguards and consumer protections are there to stop it.

Its certainly not 'everywhere'

LivinLos, agree totally. Look at Australia generally seldom a problem. And when there is, it is often from a person who has come from one of the less developed (even non-Christian) areas of the world.

[cotambear]

Once again cultural relativism is used to justify objectionable behavior - though in this case you have compounded your error by getting the facts wrong.

Diverse views and opinions do not equate to 'wrong'. If you take a wider viewpoint to the one you clearly have already decided upon you may be pleasantly enlightened.

Where haggling - eg in a market buying tshirts - is the accepted norm then I`m happy to do it.

However I don`t see thais haggling with the vendor of pancakes who charges 20baht to get 2baht off the price. But I do then see that vendor trying to charge 40 baht to a farang.

For the hard of hearing and slow to understand, I repeat what I said in my previous message.

My mentioning of the haggling was more to illustrate the fundametal differences between Thai commercial structure and western developed nations. I just wonder if the 'rip off' feeling is simply because it is decided on race rather than ability to pay.

Thai commercial culture is different to Western Culture. What is acceptable in one culture may not be so in the other. If it is unacceptable to you then so be it, that is your fundamental right to accept or otherwise. Whether it is acceptable or not to others or as stated 'a rip off' is a matter of individual opinion.

The insurance argument is plain silly. Insurers are risk assesors. they will charge say car insurance to a younger driver at a higher price because their acturial tables inform them that younger drivers are more likely to crash the car - nor because they are trying a higher price through discrimination.

Once more, if you read my message properly, I never mentioned the insurance issue in the context of age. I have an actuarial background and am well aware of how insurers set their rates. There is no evidence or sufficient data in place to actuarially state that women are less of a risk than men, yet some insurers reward women with lower premiums. It is a marketing thing, no different to the age or occupational discounts.

Altering what I actually said to support your own argument adds little credibility to your contribution.

There are always people who will try to justify what is accepted as the `norm`, even though it is logically abnormal.

and there are always people who are so set in their ways that they are unable to see beyond the end of their noses.

Cheers

Theres an old saying - keep an open mind, but not so open that your brains fall out.

Perhaps I could add - take a wide view, but not so wide that you can`t see whats right in front of you?