Do You Make An Effort To Learn Thai?

[kiakaha]

I used to learn 5 new words everyday. I used to have a lot of learning Thai books and hung out with Thai people. I've never been to a class but think it's necessay for some if they have the time/money. When learning to read and write I put aside 1 hour a day, which when you think about it is nothing.

The best way to learn is immersion, in MHO.

I think it's sad when someone who has been here for 20 years can't pick up the local newspaper or have a proper conversation. I'd be embarassed. I remember many years ago sitting in a Pat Pong bar not being able to ask for a knife and fork after being here for 18 months. Knowing then I'd probably be here fo a while, I made a huge effort and am so glad I did.

It's amazing the number of times I go to a new restaurant and the waitress gives a menu to only my wife and totally ignores me. Thailand must be the only country in the world that treats foreigners this way, probably due to the number who can't speak. Can you imagine a waiter in UK asking a Uk woman what her brown-skinned partner wanted to drink.

What do you do to improve your Thai?

If you do nothing, why?

Laziness, arrogance, fear, stupidity?

I learnt to speak some thai when I was a lot younger when I was single. I made a big effort in my first few (3 month long) visits to Thailand.

Nowadays I speak thai when I am in Thailand but when I'm in New Zealand I speak english to thai people. When I speak thai my daughter teases me and pretends she doesn't understand me which is a little off putting - I know she's my daughter - what am I thinking?

But my understanding of thai still improves all the time. My partner speaks thai to our daughter at home so I'm around it all the time. Also, when thai friends visit they all speak thai and I just sit and listen. It's always funny when a new thai visits us and chats away for a long time to my partner about all sorts of things assuming I do not understand. Then after witnessing me chuckle at various things said she will turn to my partner and ask (in thai) if I speak thai. My partner will tell her yes I do. The visitor will blush usually reflecting on what she has said now realising I have understood. Still not fully believing I really speak thai the visitor will then direct the question at me - "phut pasaat thai dai mai". "Yes" I will reply and then a few testing questions will be posed to me, and I will answer.

It plays out the same every time. Always makes me laugh. I do feel that there is a different level of respect from them once they are aware I understand thai.

I do need to put more effort into learning to read and write in thai - I'm hopeless on that front . Why? Laziness I guess. That, and time restraints - but that's just an excuse really!

Whenver I visit NZL(a couple of times a year), or any other country for that matter , I NEVER let on that I can read/write/speak thai, ...its more fun...the things I've overheard in thai restaurants, at the casino, out and about, around groups of thais .....as well as read on noticeboards and in the thai news pamphlet.......well, lets just say its priceless

[villagefarang]

I learnt to speak some thai when I was a lot younger when I was single. I made a big effort in my first few (3 month long) visits to Thailand.

Nowadays I speak thai when I am in Thailand but when I'm in New Zealand I speak english to thai people. When I speak thai my daughter teases me and pretends she doesn't understand me which is a little off putting - I know she's my daughter - what am I thinking?

But my understanding of thai still improves all the time. My partner speaks thai to our daughter at home so I'm around it all the time. Also, when thai friends visit they all speak thai and I just sit and listen. It's always funny when a new thai visits us and chats away for a long time to my partner about all sorts of things assuming I do not understand. Then after witnessing me chuckle at various things said she will turn to my partner and ask (in thai) if I speak thai. My partner will tell her yes I do. The visitor will blush usually reflecting on what she has said now realising I have understood. Still not fully believing I really speak thai the visitor will then direct the question at me - "phut pasaat thai dai mai". "Yes" I will reply and then a few testing questions will be posed to me, and I will answer.

It plays out the same every time. Always makes me laugh. I do feel that there is a different level of respect from them once they are aware I understand thai.

I do need to put more effort into learning to read and write in thai - I'm hopeless on that front . Why? Laziness I guess. That, and time restraints - but that's just an excuse really!

As you have found, it is not necessary to show off when you have self-confidence about your ability to speak and understand Thai. A simple "yes" is the appropriate answer. Of course you need to politely answer their questions, if they persist.

Learning to read and write a bit in the beginning, is indeed helpful and explains a few things. Except for signs, menus, and some scripts in my acting days, I have found very little practical use for reading and writing in my 30+ years of living here.

[hhiser]

I admit to laziness. When I first arrived in Thailand I tried to learn the language dilligently. That curtalied when I started realizing that not all of the helpful Thai people were actually helpful. Sometimes the words I learned were not Thai but were Northern Thai instead, which is not all bad. Other times the words I learned were not the proper words to say, but instead were usually an example of thai humor. Most of the times the word they told me to say was not a horrible word to say, but sometimes it was. Another reason I lapsed in my desire to learn Thai was whenever I tried to speak Thai most Thai people assumed I was speaking English and thus did not understand me. Anyway I have put off learning Thai for another day in the not so distant future.

[kiakaha]

I learnt to speak some thai when I was a lot younger when I was single. I made a big effort in my first few (3 month long) visits to Thailand.

Nowadays I speak thai when I am in Thailand but when I'm in New Zealand I speak english to thai people. When I speak thai my daughter teases me and pretends she doesn't understand me which is a little off putting - I know she's my daughter - what am I thinking?

But my understanding of thai still improves all the time. My partner speaks thai to our daughter at home so I'm around it all the time. Also, when thai friends visit they all speak thai and I just sit and listen. It's always funny when a new thai visits us and chats away for a long time to my partner about all sorts of things assuming I do not understand. Then after witnessing me chuckle at various things said she will turn to my partner and ask (in thai) if I speak thai. My partner will tell her yes I do. The visitor will blush usually reflecting on what she has said now realising I have understood. Still not fully believing I really speak thai the visitor will then direct the question at me - "phut pasaat thai dai mai". "Yes" I will reply and then a few testing questions will be posed to me, and I will answer.

It plays out the same every time. Always makes me laugh. I do feel that there is a different level of respect from them once they are aware I understand thai.

I do need to put more effort into learning to read and write in thai - I'm hopeless on that front . Why? Laziness I guess. That, and time restraints - but that's just an excuse really!

As you have found, it is not necessary to show off when you have self-confidence about your ability to speak and understand Thai. A simple "yes" is the appropriate answer. Of course you need to politely answer their questions, if they persist.

Learning to read and write a bit in the beginning, is indeed helpful and explains a few things. Except for signs, menus, and some scripts in my acting days, I have found very little practical use for reading and writing in my 30+ years of living here.

I consider reading to be a mandatory(not just "helpful") prerequisite to being able to speak correctly and tonely acccurately. Also for learning new words from thai script dictionarys(not translitered thai). And I would say that I use reading everyday in practical situations (bills, bank, post office, signs, newspaper, some internet sites, packaging etc... so many things, and many other areas on a less regular basis...ie: legal agreements). I rarely use writing(handwriting or typing) though....i think that text messaging in thai is my biggest usage of writing.

[manjara]

I've been in Thailand for around 6 years now and my Thai is terrible! I will admit I have not really put in the required level of effort in order to improve it, and I am embarrassed about that.

I do find it quite amazing though, that as bad as I am, the taxi drivers always tell me I speak more thai than most of the farang that have been here for longer than I have.

I travel away on business a lot so I'm usually only around for 40-50% of the time, and my daughters speak English now (international school), as does my wife.

I find the tonal aspect of Thai very hard and the fact that the alphabet is different means that reading is much more difficult. I have usually been fairly good with languages, having lived in many countries, and I speak 3 European languages fairly fluently, but my learning strategy is always to read a lot and 'sound' out the words. It's not working too well in Thailand. I can just about determine what kind of meat is in each dish in the Thai menus, but that's it.

I always think to myself that this year I will really get down to learning Thai properly. Enrol in a class, do some immersion learning, but I never get around to it.

My Thai is better than it was last year though, so even if the improvements are small, they are happening....

[joes125]

I have to disagree.I have lived all my adult life in asai. And yet, cannot speak a word of any language other than my native english.

And to be perfectly honest with you I am quite happy to leave it that way.

(My greatgrandmother once told me when I was very young that one does not help the native's. (I know that sounds a tad racist nowaday's but we know what she meant) by leaning their language as much as one does when one teaches them english.

Your great grandmother's comment may not have been so out of step with the mainstream of thinking back in her day but anyone who believes this today is profoundly ignorant.

then I am happy to be profoundly ignorant, along with my whole family.And quite a number of friends, thank you very much kind Sir!

I wonder then how, if this were so, we manage to get by rather nicely and have qualified from some of the top place's of education.Can you perhap's help explain that.

I am fed up with this nonsense political correctness that seem's to say one must learn the language of a place one choose's to live it.

What nonsense.! I will stay, profoundly ignorant!

[Underbelly]

Im learning Thai at Thamasat Uni which I have been to about 10 classes, its pretty easy IMO with practise, I have to admit at first when trying my Thai at the market buying things and a shops buying shoes etc. I did butcher the language, but it was actually fun as the Thai people are always willing to help.

Tomorrow I have a class which we are all going out to buy fruit and vegetables from the markt which IMO will be alot of fun.

IMO if you live here you should learn the language, I understand if your 65plus then it would be difficult and maybe just knowing Hello and the simple words is fine.

But the young guns should all learn it.

[ballpoint]

Has anyone else found that seeing a foreign word, such as Vietnamese, written in Thai makes it easier to pronounce? I find that it removes any ambiguity as to how to pronounce the vowels and, to a lessor extent, the tones. When I work in Vietnam, I carry a Vietnamese - Thai dictionary for this purpose.

[Underbelly]

Im sure it does, I will be taking a reading and writing class next to improve my tones. I just want to understand the Thai movies as I actually like some of there action movies but cant always make out what they are saying unless they are buying food or a shirt.

[qualtrough]

In my humble opinion, about 90% of the issues people on this forum have with Thais, Thailand, etc. is due to an inability to really understand what is going on around them. Imagine if you were back in your home country and you could not read a paper or magazine, could not understand what was being said on the TV or radio, could not express your thoughts, or could not understand anything said by anyone at higher than a 4th grade level? That would be very frustrating, and also lead to endless misunderstanding.

[villagefarang]

In my humble opinion, about 90% of the issues people on this forum have with Thais, Thailand, etc. is due to an inability to really understand what is going on around them. Imagine if you were back in your home country and you could not read a paper or magazine, could not understand what was being said on the TV or radio, could not express your thoughts, or could not understand anything said by anyone at higher than a 4th grade level? That would be very frustrating, and also lead to endless misunderstanding.

If it were only so. Unfortunately knowledge and understanding doesn't always lead to agreeing, cooperation or compassion. There will always be those who can't tolerate the fact that others are different. "Of course I'm right and everyone should understand that and do it my way."

Many people may be better off not really knowing what is going on around them. It might make it even more unbearable for them.

[qualtrough]

In my humble opinion, about 90% of the issues people on this forum have with Thais, Thailand, etc. is due to an inability to really understand what is going on around them. Imagine if you were back in your home country and you could not read a paper or magazine, could not understand what was being said on the TV or radio, could not express your thoughts, or could not understand anything said by anyone at higher than a 4th grade level? That would be very frustrating, and also lead to endless misunderstanding.

If it were only so. Unfortunately knowledge and understanding doesn't always lead to agreeing, cooperation or compassion. There will always be those who can't tolerate the fact that others are different. "Of course I'm right and everyone should understand that and do it my way."

Many people may be better off not really knowing what is going on around them. It might make it even more unbearable for them.

I just reread my comment and don't see anything in it that says that a firm grounding in the language would lead to 'agreeing, cooperation, or compassion.' If you want to think that being for the most part illiterate, deaf, and dumb in any country is not a huge impediment, fine.

[qualtrough]

Has anyone else found that seeing a foreign word, such as Vietnamese, written in Thai makes it easier to pronounce? I find that it removes any ambiguity as to how to pronounce the vowels and, to a lessor extent, the tones. When I work in Vietnam, I carry a Vietnamese - Thai dictionary for this purpose.

ยู แฮฟ เอ กูด ไอเดีย I totally agree with you. I have often thought that it would be helpful for beginners to work on reading, say, English text transliterated into Thai for the very reason you state. The fact that they would recognize the foreign word more readily would be a real aid. Written languages are nothing more than elaborate codes with rules that must be learned, and this would be a great method for getting the hang of things. Eventually or in parallel they could work on Thai words.

[kiakaha]

Has anyone else found that seeing a foreign word, such as Vietnamese, written in Thai makes it easier to pronounce? I find that it removes any ambiguity as to how to pronounce the vowels and, to a lessor extent, the tones. When I work in Vietnam, I carry a Vietnamese - Thai dictionary for this purpose.

ยู แฮฟ เอ กูด ไอเดีย

"You have a good idea" ? Well, at least its better than what you could approximate with japanese katakana

[oevna]

In my humble opinion, about 90% of the issues people on this forum have with Thais, Thailand, etc. is due to an inability to really understand what is going on around them. Imagine if you were back in your home country and you could not read a paper or magazine, could not understand what was being said on the TV or radio, could not express your thoughts, or could not understand anything said by anyone at higher than a 4th grade level? That would be very frustrating, and also lead to endless misunderstanding.

If it were only so. Unfortunately knowledge and understanding doesn't always lead to agreeing, cooperation or compassion. There will always be those who can't tolerate the fact that others are different. "Of course I'm right and everyone should understand that and do it my way."

Many people may be better off not really knowing what is going on around them. It might make it even more unbearable for them.

Ok, in a previous post I defended people who are living in Thailand and don't have the inclination or need to learn Thai, but now you are saying that some people should actively pursue ignorance of the local language, to protect themselves from the harsh truths of their surroundings? (I.e. a sort of "ignorance is bliss" expat experience.) I can't agree with that. That just sounds like an excuse for not getting around to learning the language. If you don't want to learn it, and you can get by without it, fine. There's nothing wrong with that, as long as you don't expect others to cater to your special linguistic needs, and you are able to pay the premium for this inherently more expensive existence. But people who are in that situation should admit it to themselves and others, and not make the excuse that they are somehow better off for not knowing what is going on around them.

My experience has been that people who "can't tolerate the fact that others are different" are going to be in conflict with the people around them whether or not they share a common language.

[oevna]

Has anyone else found that seeing a foreign word, such as Vietnamese, written in Thai makes it easier to pronounce? I find that it removes any ambiguity as to how to pronounce the vowels and, to a lessor extent, the tones. When I work in Vietnam, I carry a Vietnamese - Thai dictionary for this purpose.

ยู แฮฟ เอ กูด ไอเดีย I totally agree with you. I have often thought that it would be helpful for beginners to work on reading, say, English text transliterated into Thai for the very reason you state. The fact that they would recognize the foreign word more readily would be a real aid. Written languages are nothing more than elaborate codes with rules that must be learned, and this would be a great method for getting the hang of things. Eventually or in parallel they could work on Thai words.

Along those lines, but slightly off-topic: I got some good laughs by writing this on a piece of paper and having a (Thai) bartender read it out loud: เฮา ยู้ ดวน

Got a real confused look from the bartender, but it was entertaining for the other English-speaking customers who heard the her say that out loud.

[villagefarang]

I still say that learning to speak Thai is not going so solve "90% of the issues people on this forum have with Thais, Thailand, etc." Being able to mouth off in Thai, and be understood, could make things much worse. Do you somehow assume that learning Thai will change them to reasonable people. Taking away any doubt about what they are saying, could be detrimental to their health. Rant in English or some other language, and you might get away with it. Rant in Thai, and you are just looking for trouble.

[villagefarang]

In my humble opinion, about 90% of the issues people on this forum have with Thais, Thailand, etc. is due to an inability to really understand what is going on around them. Imagine if you were back in your home country and you could not read a paper or magazine, could not understand what was being said on the TV or radio, could not express your thoughts, or could not understand anything said by anyone at higher than a 4th grade level? That would be very frustrating, and also lead to endless misunderstanding.

If it were only so. Unfortunately knowledge and understanding doesn't always lead to agreeing, cooperation or compassion. There will always be those who can't tolerate the fact that others are different. "Of course I'm right and everyone should understand that and do it my way."

Many people may be better off not really knowing what is going on around them. It might make it even more unbearable for them.

I just reread my comment and don't see anything in it that says that a firm grounding in the language would lead to 'agreeing, cooperation, or compassion.' If you want to think that being for the most part illiterate, deaf, and dumb in any country is not a huge impediment, fine.

By saying that "90% of the issues...(are) due to an inability to really understand", you imply that understanding Thai will solve these "issues". I think their "issue", is who they are, not which language they speak. Again, life will be different, depending on whether or not you speak the same language. It will not, however, solve 90% of the problems.

One last word form me and I will shut up. Some of you guys sound like missionaries. Thai is a language, not a religion. There is no need to be so evangelical. Speak whichever language you choose and allow others to do the same. It is really that simple.

Edited March 17, 2009 by villagefarang

[FairwayJack]

My indonesian wife and I have been here 6 years. I tried learning and can speak a little but the best method....my 7 yr old son who translates for me.

[myauq]

i spent about a year in my home country learning to read and speak thai before coming here. i can read and pronounce words, without knowing their meanings. i've learnt a number of other asian languages, so i've never seen it as a problem or a big deal, and with the excitement of relocating to a new country i used to be quite motivated to learn and attain fluency in - what was then - a new language.

however...

the longer i stayed in thailand the longer i realised how different thais were from other asian cultures, and i felt that me learning their language wasn't appreciated, and often made things worse (ie they saw me as a long term resident, thinking i was a poor farang and not respecting me). many people also look down upon my girlfriend, and we still hear racist comments every other week (she is not thai, and comes from a neighbouring country). these experiences really put me off learning considerably.

i would say that i have lived mainly in bangkok, so i realise that my encounter with 'thai culture' is probably skewed towards urban people who are more arrogant. i say this because i travelled recently and found that issan and western country folk were very lovely and hospitable, less prone to ripping us off and talking down to us. that experience perked my interest in learning thai again.

sad but true.

[oevna]

I still say that learning to speak Thai is not going so solve "90% of the issues people on this forum have with Thais, Thailand, etc." Being able to mouth off in Thai, and be understood, could make things much worse. Do you somehow assume that learning Thai will change them to reasonable people. Taking away any doubt about what they are saying, could be detrimental to their health. Rant in English or some other language, and you might get away with it. Rant in Thai, and you are just looking for trouble.

I think the argument for learning Thai in this instance is that the ranting or mouthing off won't be necessary if there is no misunderstanding, and misunderstandings are far less common when people can, well, understand each other.

Learning Thai has definitely made my interactions with Thai people more enjoyable. Almost everyone I know who has lived in Thailand and also learned to speak Thai has said the same. Just the process of learning it makes you interact with Thais more, and makes you less insular. That alone tends to resolve many misunderstandings, or at least make Thai people more sympathetic to your side of an issue.

Admittedly, this correlation of learning Thai language and having better interactions with Thai people does not necessarily mean that there is a causal relationship. The type of person that is inclined to go out and learn the language of his new home might also be the type of person that is less prone to conflict anyhow, but I haven't seen a proper study so I can't say one way or the other.

Now it looks like I've switched sides and I'm arguing against what I said before! I am only arguing against the suggestion that people deliberately avoid learning a language for the sake of insulating themselves from whatever it is that is being said about them. I'm just not convinced by that argument at all.

[kiakaha]

I still say that learning to speak Thai is not going so solve "90% of the issues people on this forum have with Thais, Thailand, etc." Being able to mouth off in Thai, and be understood, could make things much worse. Do you somehow assume that learning Thai will change them to reasonable people. Taking away any doubt about what they are saying, could be detrimental to their health. Rant in English or some other language, and you might get away with it. Rant in Thai, and you are just looking for trouble.

The more you learn thai, the more you understand the culture, the more you realise that "mouthing off" and "ranting" is not the way to approach things here.

[villagefarang]

The type of person that is inclined to go out and learn the language of his new home might also be the type of person that is less prone to conflict anyhow, but I haven't seen a proper study so I can't say one way or the other.

What was that old line? I believe it was something like familiarity breeds contempt. I think you might be on to something with your statement above, however.

[PeaceBlondie]

I have the time, the intelligence, and some motivation to learn Thai. But I was also 60 when I arrived, and too busy then to learn any Thai. I got Benjawan Poontang's beginner book, and immediately saw that she could not even explain how to pronounce the letter a, transliterated. I took a course at the YMCA and another at CMU. Both were taught by well dressed culturally correct Thai ladies who spoke bargirl English poorly, ran through the lessons fast, did not answer questions, and were simply poorly trained M.A. graduates from the best school in northern Thailand.

Thai is only spoken by 60 million people in a 6 billion people world. Their unique alphabet is indeciphrable outside its borders. Its tonal system is bizarre and too complex, with the vowels arranged around the consonants like a bad Jewish-Masoretic joke. Thais speak several dialects, poorly, too fast.

If I had come here at age 25 or 45 and had ten hours a week spare time in the first few years, it might have been possible and profitable. If my language instruction had been decent, I might have learned. If ....ah,never mind.

To those of you who can learn Thai, good on ya' mate. Bless you, and pass the somtam. Me,I will remain very ignorant and slightly arrogant. Hopefully, your mileage will vary.

[Jingthing]

The more you learn thai, the more you understand the culture, the more you realise that "mouthing off" and "ranting" is not the way to approach things here.

I got news for you buster. You don't have to know one word of Thai to learn that. Now that we ALL know, yet another reason not to learn Thai.

Edited March 18, 2009 by Jingthing

[Underbelly]

I see where your coming from PeaceBlonde, my Thai Teacher at Thammasat Uni can just speak english, she cant answer all our questions but its good enought to answer 80% of them which is good.

Our teacher takes us out to the market etc and makes us buy things and order food. We totally butcher the language but we are getting pretty good. The Thai's seem happy to help with tines etc and even have a laugh with you.

Thai is not easy, but is fun to learn IMO, but im only in my late 20's so picking another language up might be easier for me.

But there is this French guy who is 58 and he is picking it up better then us younger ones so not sure if I believe the "Im to old to learn" group.

But I plan to live here for a long time, so I think larning th language for me will help me enjoy my experiences here alot more then someone who refuses to even learn to say "hi" in Thai

[oevna]

...

I got Benjawan Poontang's beginner book, ...

... and immediately saw that she could not even explain how to pronounce the letter a, transliterated. ...

I didn't have the same experience with her books at all. Those were the first books that I used to study Thai, and I thought the transliteration system was one of the better ones. I don't think she developed it though. If she did, she based it on pre-existing systems because I have seen very similar ones used in older text books. What was unclear about it?

Admittedly, I recall that her pronunciation examples seemed somewhat specific to American English pronunciation, and I am from the US. If you are from the UK, I can see how the vowel pronunciation could be misleading in her book.

[kiakaha]

The more you learn thai, the more you understand the culture, the more you realise that "mouthing off" and "ranting" is not the way to approach things here.

I got news for you buster. You don't have to know one word of Thai to learn that. Now that we ALL know, yet another reason not to learn Thai.

lets agree to disagree on the merits(too many to mention) of learning the thai language . Period.

[roamer]

Do You Make An Effort To Learn Thai?

Its a lot like golf really, I am always reminded of the old Gary Player saying “the more I play the luckier I get.”

Same same.

[lobospec]

i have never heard a farang speak like a native thai. not even andrew biggs or any other farang on tv.

i apppreciate the effort they put in, but 20 year expat heros who claim to speak obscure dialects or claim to 'waal isaan' still speak 'mai chat'.

polite thai is essential to learn.