Is It Time To Go Home

[MeetJohnDoe]

It's slowly but surely getting that way that over-all it’s much cheaper for me to live in the UK.

Good question that we long-termers always review and ask ourselves regularly.

I pay heavily to live here but at what point do I say enough is enough?

Your outline of expenses is pretty threadbare...but some of the major ones are covered.

In Thailand i rent a house for 15.000 Baht per month.

In the UK I own my own house.

I am not from UK so don't know the total cost of ownership of properties there even if it is owned outright. I own a condo in the States but I still have utilities, property taxes, insurance, maintenance, association dues. When I add these up, it costs me annually more than twice what I pay to rent my modest home in Pattaya (B 10k month). So if I returned and re-occupied my rented condo, my housing costs would more than double.

In Thailand my lady costs me somewhere in the region of 20.000 Baht every month.

This is certainly an expense most men have in one sort or another (whether one rents, leases, or buys)...and rents/purchase amounts vary all over the map. Are you saying if you go back to the UK, you will not have any expenses related to the opposite sex or will you find a relationship with a woman who is self-supporting? Or will you remain single and celibate?

Any kind of pay-to-play in UK is much more expensive the Thailand isn't it? Are you a truly young and "hansome" man who can depend on freebies or will you be celibate?

The annual visa shit is another story.

There are lots of <deleted> fees, costs, and expenses living in UK too I would imagine...as there are in California/USA.

Contrary to belief, the cost of living in the tropics doesn’t come cheap.

Depends of lifestyle but this is a common misperception. I just paid my full-cover first class auto insurance for my car in Thailand...cost about US$ 350 a year. Would be at least double in California. Annual registration fees also cheaper in Thailand. Speeding tickets in Thailand also cheaper by factor of 40-50x (B 200-400 vs. US$ 100-200).

I can name many more examples of things being cheaper. I can also name many where prices are higher than back home. On balance for my lifestyle and life-situation, Thailand is still probably 30-40% cheaper than what I would spend for what I would have to spend to be comfortable back home (but not equivalent lifestyle...some things better...others worse). The main savings for me are housing, restaurants, and P4P (don't do much but when I do, it's 1/3-1/4 the cost).

I've had twelve wonderful years here but!!

Is it time to bail out and go home?

So dependent of each individuals situation. However, I do think that if one had been thinking about doing so, this might be a good time to push the reset button back home as most Western economies are undergoing a major economic re-think and adjustment so even though times are tough, a good time for people with skills and new ideas to get back into the labor force or start a business. Of course, property prices and rents are cheaper than anytime in the past decade so can get back into the market at a very attractive time.

Edited May 15, 2009 by MeetJohnDoe

[midas]

Cut down on your expenses and stay put. If 'home' is the UK you'll last about a week.

Totally agree ! The mood in the UK right now is nothing short of GRIM !

Thailand has its problems but its warm here ....................I think you will regret it if you go back

[MeetJohnDoe]

the anwser is yes, it now cost me double here then it did 4 years ago !

also buiness has become slow and unrelible in the LOS

Why? Is this because of a loss of purchasing power due to a currency fluctionion or is it that your Thai business receipts are down by half? The cost of living in baht certainly hasn't doubled in 4 years. Are you buying like for like goods or more expensive goods and services?

[teacup]

TO: tea cup

I enjoy the western country, esp the USA more than thailand

What not to like....just naming a few here

- cleaner air ( that is true the US does have cleaner air on some areas but not all, then again I live on samui where I don't see much pollution anyway )

Well a typical normal town can't really compare to the resort island, isn't it? Unless I happen to live in Hawaii, then it's sure better than Samui

- dependable laws and order ( maybe so but how much redtape do you still see get through )

So far I haven’t experienced any redtape to cry over about

- excellent infrastructures ( last time I check roads, bridges, sewage system and electric grid need a massive improvement and will need at least 1 trillion dollars to update the system and make it better, excellent infrastructure is only as good as the weakest link in the structure )

Ahha…sewage system

Well it’s better to have existing system which needs improvement/repair than none at all - like Samui…where all those poopie of yours go huh

- housing price is getting sooo cheap now, better to buy than rent....and much better quality built (generally) than in thailand ( cheap on housing depends on where your buying the house at. )

Overall with the law of average in percentage change over the years, they are much cheaper now …..with secure ownership in your own name. so no need to dodging behind the scene like in Thailand for foreigners ….wink wink

- good consumer protection laws ( I"ll agree with this on many parts but always have to read that really small fine print and companies have gotten better at hiding details through endless pages on user agreements or warranties etc )

Well having some fineprints to read...is better than none ...haha

- endless activities and entertainments ( i suppose as long as you have a real job to support all those activities its fine, and as long it pays well )

Yep…better economic opportunities for the educated ones with freedom to make your own choices and dreams.

- true internet shopping experience, no comment on this as its very true

...etcs

BTW....Whatever it is,….overall Samui is worse than where I’m now

and I have not even a slight desire to move there...EVER.....nothing interesting to do or see there on everyday basis

Just me here

Edited May 15, 2009 by teacup

[MeetJohnDoe]

And the entire savings gone the second you buy a BMW..

Thats my point.. it takes an awful lot of cheap plates of rice to make up for the differences in what I consider only middle class luxuries.. Bought a bluray player here lately ?? Or a media center ?? Or high end audio (I nearly had a heart attack when i looked and B&W's price list) ??

Sure my laundries done cheaply.. And a maid isnt expensive.. But to live cheap requires giving up things or lowering standards. the balance is the climate, ability to go yachting more, those kind of intangibles..

I certainly get your point and it's a very good one. However, I think you get allot of the savings back in housing costs in Thailand...whether you buy or rent. Sure, that BMW (or any other imported marque) may cost 3x the price Stateside (don't know about UK/Europe), but your rent/house for a comfortable (not necessary comparable) place is 1/3rd the cost Stateside, and that's many times over in savings the extra cost you will spend for the extra cost of a Bimmer (if that's something you must have, which I feel is very debatable but is a personal choice issue). After splashing out on the car, you're still way ahead.

[lannarebirth]

It's slowly but surely getting that way that over-all it’s much cheaper for me to live in the UK.

I pay heavily to live here but at what point do I say enough is enough?

In Thailand i rent a house for 15.000 Baht per month.

In the UK I own my own house.

In Thailand my lady costs me somewhere in the region of 20.000 Baht every month.

That’s 35.000 Baht or 700 pounds worth of outgoings I don’t have in the UK.

The annual visa shit is another story.

Contrary to belief, the cost of living in the tropics doesn’t come cheap.

I've had twelve wonderful years here but!!

Is it time to bail out and go home?

In my opinion, if one doesn't enjoy living in Thailand for reasons other than it "being cheap", they are doomed to an unhappy existence here. If that's you, you will likely be happier elsewhere.

[MeetJohnDoe]

I forgot this one, definitively agree !

Especially a jazz concert during a summer evening !

or a small chamber orchestra playing Bach at an old country castle illuminated by hundreds of candles on a warm summer evening

I can get you a an Issan music concert, with traditional Thai dancing at Wat Hin Phimai, which of course you will not understand a word or gesture, and hundreds of mossies feasting on you in the insufferable heat and humidity of a Thai evening...will that suffice

[MeetJohnDoe]

I enjoy the western country, esp the USA more than thailand

What not to like....just naming a few here

- housing price is getting sooo cheap now, better to buy than rent....and much better quality built (generally) than in thailand

- endless activities and entertainments

I think this is a major factor that may push some people who are tired living in Thailand and were on the fence about going back, but held back because of the cost of buying a house during the bubble, may now see they have a once in a lifetime opportunity to get back in the market at a reasonable entry-point. In fact, I know people who have already returned for precisely this reason.

The boredom factor for long-term expats is also a major issue.

PS: Hope you have not had any problems with alligators in your pool/backyard recently

[MeetJohnDoe]

I just bought a Denon amp & a JBL surround sound system...about 2.5 x's the price in the US. You would think that these things would be cheaper here as they are all made in Asia. But no...

Why do people always make this assumption! How many amps do you think Denon sells in Thailand in a year...or JBL surround-sound speaker systems?

One Best-Buy electronics outlet in the USA probably sells as many of both than are sold in ALL of Thailand in a year. So when the distributor for Thailand and the buyer for Best-Buy goes to Denon for pricing, guess who gets the MUCH lower wholesale price, which is then reflected in the retail price...duhh!

This same logic goes for all expensive small-market "luxury" goods in LOS.

Edited May 15, 2009 by MeetJohnDoe

[teacup]

I enjoy the western country, esp the USA more than thailand

What not to like....just naming a few here

- housing price is getting sooo cheap now, better to buy than rent....and much better quality built (generally) than in thailand

- endless activities and entertainments

I think this is a major factor that may push some people who are tired living in Thailand and were on the fence about going back, but held back because of the cost of buying a house during the bubble, may now see they have a once in a lifetime opportunity to get back in the market at a reasonable entry-point. In fact, I know people who have already returned for precisely this reason.

The boredom factor for long-term expats is also a major issue.

YEP this is precisely the number one reason I'm afraid of ...When I make my move to thailand

[livinthailandos]

- cleaner air ( that is true the US does have cleaner air on some areas but not all, then again I live on samui where I don't see much pollution anyway )

Well a typical normal town can't really compare to the resort island, isn't it? Unless I happen to live in Hawaii, then it's sure better than Samui, ok fair point but in many areas in the US, pollution would still depend on where though, its cleaner in some ways but still needs improvement

- dependable laws and order ( maybe so but how much redtape do you still see get through )

So far I haven't experienced any redtape to cry over about, maybe not you theres always loopholes in the system as with anywhere, dependable laws don't seem to do well with criminals seems like you can do anything in the states and walk away from it, the judical system is practically broke and its over burden with cases

- excellent infrastructures ( last time I check roads, bridges, sewage system and electric grid need a massive improvement and will need at least 1 trillion dollars to update the system and make it better, excellent infrastructure is only as good as the weakest link in the structure )

Ahha…sewage system

Well it's better to have existing system which needs improvement/repair than none at all - like Samui…where all those poopie of yours go huh True but rome wasn't built in a day it takes time, only with here who knows, and any society still needs to fix, maintain, and upgrade infrastructure projects

- housing price is getting sooo cheap now, better to buy than rent....and much better quality built (generally) than in thailand ( cheap on housing depends on where your buying the house at. )

Overall with the law of average in percentage change over the years, they are much cheaper now …..with secure ownership in your own name. so no need to dodging behind the scene like in Thailand for foreigners ….wink wink

much cheaper thanks to greed and a housing bubble that bust. again pricing depends on location in the states, in city or in country, how many beds, value of land. etc

- endless activities and entertainments ( i suppose as long as you have a real job to support all those activities its fine, and as long it pays well )

Yep…better economic opportunities for the educated ones with freedom to make your own choices and dreams. true but have to love the US, 45 million people with no health insurance, country that has no idea on immigration issues, and which is fine because 30 years from now the majority will be hispanic and spanish could be the national language as from my understanding english was never made to be the national language because its a open society

BTW....Whatever it is,….overall Samui is worse than where I'm now

and I have not even a slight desire to move there...EVER

Just me here samui has up and downs, its ok if you dislike the place but for me i call it home plus I work and live here.

[runner]

If you live in Thailand your main source of savings will be housing(studio apartments are very cheap here), eating out, and women.

I live pretty well here, but I have to content myself with staying in a luxury studio apartment. I'm able to eat out everyday here. I could never afford do that at home.

[LivinLOS]

And the entire savings gone the second you buy a BMW..

Thats my point.. it takes an awful lot of cheap plates of rice to make up for the differences in what I consider only middle class luxuries.. Bought a bluray player here lately ?? Or a media center ?? Or high end audio (I nearly had a heart attack when i looked and B&W's price list) ??

Sure my laundries done cheaply.. And a maid isnt expensive.. But to live cheap requires giving up things or lowering standards. the balance is the climate, ability to go yachting more, those kind of intangibles..

I certainly get your point and it's a very good one. However, I think you get allot of the savings back in housing costs in Thailand...whether you buy or rent. Sure, that BMW (or any other imported marque) may cost 3x the price Stateside (don't know about UK/Europe), but your rent/house for a comfortable (not necessary comparable) place is 1/3rd the cost Stateside, and that's many times over in savings the extra cost you will spend for the extra cost of a Bimmer (if that's something you must have, which I feel is very debatable but is a personal choice issue). After splashing out on the car, you're still way ahead.

Not really.. Last villa was 75k per month or +-1500 GBP build quality so suspect it actually fell down.. Current home was 45k and I had to put a new kitchen in and drapes for the place because it simply wasnt up to standard.. Put over 180k into moving in and making it nice.. Already the pool is a constant hassle (currently drained and being repiled) the external woodwork is fast rotting, theres a never ending stream of repair men and bodgers coming to fix parts the actual quality under the gloss is poor.. So lets say its 50k a month and 1000gbp.

Well my old man just rented a 500k GBP house for sale, for 10k GBP per annum, council taxes add up to less than 200 so he pays less.. 3 car garage, large landscaped land plot, remote electric gates, all brand new high end western quality.

I also pay the rent on my mums home and support her, so I know what UK costs are as I have them at the same time !! She rents a beaut of a house, backs onto a river, 3 beds, garage, beautiful Devon beaches just by (cold mind), big parket floored south facing sun lounge 650 quid per month and some kind of poll tax relief cos of her age.. 650 quid is less than 30k baht, you wouldnt get that size, fit, or finish, on Phuket at that money.

I realise I dont live in Nakhon nowhere.. But I dont want to either.. But here I know many people with 40 - 50k rent on 'high end' condos.. A thai wanted me to pay 80k a month for a 2 bed penthouse.. So I dont see the 'saving in housing' costs your talking about.

[teacup]

Livinthailandos

Ahha based on your rebuttal above, I seem to have won the arguement by just a slight margin, that the US is the better place to live while we both still breathing!!!

Still a slight margin is....Good enough for moi tho

[LivinLOS]

In my opinion, if one doesn't enjoy living in Thailand for reasons other than it "being cheap", they are doomed to an unhappy existence here. If that's you, you will likely be happier elsewhere.

Best post so far !!! By a country mile !!

I will never live in the cold again.. Might not even visit.. I like to be somewhere I can mess about on boats sometimes.. Ride a motorbike without freezing..

Plus its a superb hub to jet about the region, cheap flights mean I can have a city break in sing or HK, head over to vietnam, just so many things I can do within a few hours travel of where I am..

[MeetJohnDoe]

And the entire savings gone the second you buy a BMW..

Thats my point.. it takes an awful lot of cheap plates of rice to make up for the differences in what I consider only middle class luxuries.. Bought a bluray player here lately ?? Or a media center ?? Or high end audio (I nearly had a heart attack when i looked and B&W's price list) ??

Sure my laundries done cheaply.. And a maid isnt expensive.. But to live cheap requires giving up things or lowering standards. the balance is the climate, ability to go yachting more, those kind of intangibles..

I certainly get your point and it's a very good one. However, I think you get allot of the savings back in housing costs in Thailand...whether you buy or rent. Sure, that BMW (or any other imported marque) may cost 3x the price Stateside (don't know about UK/Europe), but your rent/house for a comfortable (not necessary comparable) place is 1/3rd the cost Stateside, and that's many times over in savings the extra cost you will spend for the extra cost of a Bimmer (if that's something you must have, which I feel is very debatable but is a personal choice issue). After splashing out on the car, you're still way ahead.

Not really.. Last villa was 75k per month or +-1500 GBP build quality so suspect it actually fell down..

I realise I dont live in Nakhon nowhere.. But I dont want to either.. But here I know many people with 40 - 50k rent on 'high end' condos.. A thai wanted me to pay 80k a month for a 2 bed penthouse.. So I dont see the 'saving in housing' costs your talking about.

Well, from you posts in this thread, your idea of what's necessary for a comfortable "middle class" lifestyle in Thailand is not the same as my definition. I moved here to simplify my life and shed excess emotional and physical baggage. I live for me what I consider a very comfortable lifestyle for less than than half the cost of your last rental (and I've got air-cons, eat out 90% of meals, 24/7 cable internet, mobile phone, car, girls when nature calls, 42" Sony Bravia HD ready LCD TV, etc.). I guess our views of what's comfortable and necessary for living are different.

You and your friends have chosen (as is your right) to buy/rent what are quite high-priced housing. For whatever reason, this is the comfort, location, and amenity level you desire. For me, I don't need to live in a "villa," a nice clean and safe bungalow will do fine. I also don't need views or a pool but that's just me...maybe you do. I can swim for free at any number of pools when I visit friends who live in moobans that have pools or I can go to any of the hundreds of hotels in Pattaya that have pools and swim for B 50-100 (and leave the maintenance costs to the hotel or moobans).

As for the house and Bimmer example, in the San Francisco area where I'm from, it would still (post-crash) still be $ 500,000 for a house of any size in a safe area and lets just say $ 40,000 for a 3-series or $ 540,000. In LOS, a comfortable house in Pattaya (my standards) B 5-6 million or $ 170,000 at the higher end; lets say 3-series Bimmer costs $ 100,000 equivalent. House and car in San Francisco are $ 540,000; same in LOS is $ 270,000 or about half...you still come out ahead. Now, if you need to live in a "villa," the savings would be much less but probably will still be some.

Running costs for the house and car will also be much less in LOS than SF.

Edited May 15, 2009 by MeetJohnDoe

[MeetJohnDoe]

Plus its a superb hub to jet about the region, cheap flights mean I can have a city break in sing or HK, head over to vietnam, just so many things I can do within a few hours travel of where I am..

Just curious, how long have you been "livinLOS"?

That Thailand being a great hub for Asian travel and jetting to and fro were fun for me too for a couple years...now I can't stand the sight of an airplane

[CWMcMurray]

Livinthailandos

Ahha based on your rebuttal above, I seem to have won the arguement by just a slight margin, that the US is the better place to live while we both still breathing!!!

Still a slight margin is....Good enough for moi tho

I have to give you the win on this one Teacup...

I am not planning on heading back any time soon, but I still agree with you.

I am sticking around because I have a decent job here, my wife has her own company here, my wife would prefer to stay here and we do not yet have to think about the cost of educating our children here.

[CWMcMurray]

As for the house and Bimmer example, in the San Francisco area where I'm from, it would still (post-crash) still be $ 500,000 for a house of any size in a safe area and lets just say $ 40,000 for a 3-series or $ 540,000. In LOS, a comfortable house in Pattaya (my standards) B 5-6 million or $ 170,000 at the higher end; lets say 3-series Bimmer costs $ 100,000 equivalent. House and car in San Francisco are $ 540,000; same in LOS is $ 270,000 or about half...you still come out ahead. Now, if you need to live in a "villa," the savings would be much less but probably will still be some.

Running costs for the house and car will also be much less in LOS than SF.

Housing costs vary greatly in the US... my brother just built a 4 bedroom House in upstate NY (finished 9 months ago) for about $130,000 (in the berbs).

[teacup]

Livinthailandos

Ahha based on your rebuttal above, I seem to have won the arguement by just a slight margin, that the US is the better place to live while we both still breathing!!!

Still a slight margin is....Good enough for moi tho

I have to give you the win on this one Teacup...

I am not planning on heading back any time soon, but I still agree with you.

I am sticking around because I have a decent job here, my wife has her own company here, my wife would prefer to stay here and we do not yet have to think about the cost of educating our children here.

Thats all I'm seeing and thx

ok the case is now closed "officially", livinthailandos....haha

PS

Oii ....the education in thailand is not as bad as some people think.

I was educated there in a normal thai schools and continued my uni in the US ----no problem whatsoever,... including psychologically,

I seem to turn out ok.

Best of luck with your little ones

TC

Edited May 15, 2009 by teacup

[patklang]

Some people are not getting things into perspective.

Many people who are going to retire in the next few years will have a reduction in quality of life,as investments are down,free healthcare not as good now,reduced profits on savings.Take all these things into consideration and unless you have paid big money into pension funds then many will suffer when they retire.

I retired at 49 and to live in the Uk would have meant a slightly less quality in life,but thailand gave me a reasonably good lifestyle,even though the thai baht v the gbp is making me spend about 70 gbp a week more.Adding everything up,if i am spending the same amount of money that i was spending 6 years ago in the uk i would still live here and have a great life,much better than the uk.

Many on here always throw in the statement why live ehre if your quality of life goes down,if your lifestyle was good in the uk and you live on less here,whats the problem,one still has a good life.

stop being mamby pamby and enjoy

[Tafia]

go home

Wow! Did you type that all by yourself, unaided?

To the OP a couple of points:-

Regarding the housing costs have you checked out what your council tax bill is going to be?

As for the girlfriend, yes going back home you will be without that expense but you will also be without that company. So which is more important the money or the company? Both options are available in Thailand.

Do you work? Getting a job back in the UK right now is no fun. Transport in the UK is expensive and if you drive chances are you'll be appearing on the new police reality show "Speeding Fine".

Anyhow we all, in our hearts, know when it's time for a reality check better to go now on your own terms and still loving Thailand than to leave it until you are stony broke or bitter and twisted or both.

Every airliner leaving Thailand has a return sometime.

Ditto, I have only been out here 8mths you may finda few nasty shocks back in the UK its considerably more expensive to live there, but a lot depends on your needs, here I have a more simple and laid back lifestyle, which is very affordable on my pension, back in the UK I would have to continue to work as I just wouldn't have enough to live on even by simple terms but as they say if you dont try you will never know!!

[clausewitz]

How does one lady cost you 20,000 baht every month ? i could understand having many ladies costing you 20,000 baht per month !!

What else don't you understand? Geometry? Bathing? Why the grass is green? How to open a can of Pepsi? Turning left in an automobile?

Heh

[billd766]

Having read all the posts and as an expat Brit I think I WILL go home after all.

However as I am working in NZ for only 1 more week I am homeward bound to my wife and our son.

Home to warmth and friendliness of living in a 3 bedroom detatched house (hers) near a stream with my family on 4 acres of (her) land in central Thailand where we (she) has another 4 acres (or about 20 rai in all).

Back to live in the UK?

Yeah right.

Not in this lifetime I say.

It is all paid for so I pay

rent = none

rates or local taxes = none

eating out = any time I want but my wife has a shop and small restaurant

what else am I missing

girls = to old and I love my wife anyway

top of the line stereo = no need

big TV not a bad idea as my eyesight is getting worse

BMW = Ford Ranger pickup truck

gik = see girls above

Some people will say if I divorce I will lose it all.

Been there, done that in the UK. I drove away in a hired station wagon with all MY stuff and space to spare.

I have been living and working in and out of Thailand since 1993, still can't speak it that well and since I left school in 1959 at the age of 15 I have lived and worked in around 38 countries and the best one (for me) I have found is Thailand.

Yes I get frustrated at times with Thais, as I do in many other countries and peoples, but where I live waaaay out in the sticks I have made some good friends with Thais and to my knowledge very few people out in the country have tried to rip me off.

At the local markets I generally pay the same as the Thais next to me.

There is a national park at the end of the land where we live and if I go up into the park with family and friends I pay the same rate as them OR I pay the farang rate and they go in for free.

I know that there are a lot of things that I don't have but a) I don't really need them and if I really do then I will go out and get them.

We grow fruit and there is nothing nicer than a fresh pineapple, mango, custard apple, jackfruit etc that you just picked fresh from the garden.

I can live without a high speed internet link, the latest movies, a big flash car or the rest of the crap that some people consider essential for living.

I now can sit back and smell the flowers or watch butterflies and live without so much stress.

I don't NEED to work just to live and survive as many people do in the west, nor do I want to.

It is Thailand for me until I die and after I am cremated and my ashes dumped around the house then I will be home again but this time there will be no need for a visa.

:D

Edited May 15, 2009 by billd766

[teacup]

It is Thailand for me until I die and after I am cremated and my ashes dumped around the house then I will be home again but this time there will be no need for a visa.

Well I like to LIVE in the US,

but I want to die in thailand tho, coz those nurses are sure "prettier" to look at when I'm sick and on my dead bed!!

Like sort of my last "fun-dee" experience

[MJP]

Why don't you rent your house in the UK, I do.

I agree about the money situation though, I think everyone is feeling it.

Maybe when you get back to the UK, you will want to come back again.

Yes, indeed.

The old grass is always greener thing works both ways.

To the OP, cut your living costs if you can old boy. 15,000 a month seems very high to me for rent. Not sure where you live, perhaps move to Korat, Surin or some place cheaper.

20,000 Baht a month, you need to talk to her about that. Remembering that 5000 Baht is now a hundred quid!

[MJP]

Having read all the posts and as an expat Brit I think I WILL go home after all.

However as I am working in NZ for only 1 more week I am homeward bound to my wife and our son.

Home to warmth and friendliness of living in a 3 bedroom detatched house (hers) near a stream with my family on 4 acres of (her) land in central Thailand where we (she) has another 4 acres (or about 20 rai in all).

Back to live in the UK?

Yeah right.

Not in this lifetime I say.

It is all paid for so I pay

rent = none

rates or local taxes = none

eating out = any time I want but my wife has a shop and small restaurant

what else am I missing

girls = to old and I love my wife anyway

top of the line stereo = no need

big TV not a bad idea as my eyesight is getting worse

BMW = Ford Ranger pickup truck

gik = see girls above

Some people will say if I divorce I will lose it all.

Been there, done that in the UK. I drove away in a hired station wagon with all MY stuff and space to spare.

I have been living and working in and out of Thailand since 1993, still can't speak it that well and since I left school in 1959 at the age of 15 I have lived and worked in around 38 countries and the best one (for me) I have found is Thailand.

Yes I get frustrated at times with Thais, as I do in many other countries and peoples, but where I live waaaay out in the sticks I have made some good friends with Thais and to my knowledge very few people out in the country have tried to rip me off.

At the local markets I generally pay the same as the Thais next to me.

There is a national park at the end of the land where we live and if I go up into the park with family and friends I pay the same rate as them OR I pay the farang rate and they go in for free.

I know that there are a lot of things that I don't have but a) I don't really need them and if I really do then I will go out and get them.

We grow fruit and there is nothing nicer than a fresh pineapple, mango, custard apple, jackfruit etc that you just picked fresh from the garden.

I can live without a high speed internet link, the latest movies, a big flash car or the rest of the crap that some people consider essential for living.

I now can sit back and smell the flowers or watch butterflies and live without so much stress.

I don't NEED to work just to live and survive as many people do in the west, nor do I want to.

It is Thailand for me until I die and after I am cremated and my ashes dumped around the house then I will be home again but this time there will be no need for a visa.

BRAVO!

Same as that.

[livinthailandos]

TO Teacup

Didn't realize it was competition you are after on a simple posting. How unaspiring. I was simply pointing out events and needed improvements, right now the US might be ok, but as with everything in life nothing in life is stable and we as humans have very little control over much in life. My only real dream in that we see some actual improvement in the US. i dont know what mr Barak Obama can do in 4 years, but based on the mass amount of wealth division. Eventually in the US it will be your either poor or rich, the middle class is slow disappearing, wages have not realistically ever caught up with the actual cost of living. Health care in the US is a joke. Between the national debt of being more than 10 trillion and raising, plus social security debt. the only thing the US can do is raise taxes, spend less. American Auto industry is a joke they failed to innovate, only did they when gas prices where more than $4 dollars a gallon, to much reliance on SUV's, Trucks for profits. Between Bank Bailouts, Airlines Bailouts, Auto Bailouts, I woner who is next in line to come up and ask for a bailout. Anyway I'm logging off this topic I basically have a love - hate relationship with the US. Whenever I go home all I see are thugs who wear baggy pants who care more about thug culture and rap, disregard for anything and showing their butt cheeks and speaking ebonics ( note I have meet those who are educated, speak actual english, but their far few and inbetween )

[Abrak]

may i ask how the unit of volume prohibits a comparison?

As soon as I saw it I knew it was coming

Actually it was probably best if someone else did this calculation for him as he could easily have got it wrong.

I was brought up believing the conversion ratio of litres to gallons was about 4.6, not about 3.7. Noone told me that the US had their own version of what constituted a gallon (presumably on the basis that gallon measurements were not used much.) It used to irritate me enormously that in the US the price of a gallon of fuel was so much cheaper than say the UK (so everyone drove Hummers etc...) and I least now know that this is partly due to getting a smaller gallon.

I wonder if Americans bought 'fuel efficient' european cars on the basis that their mpg may well have been based on a larger g or whether European manufacturers had to adjust their guages before exporting. Mind you maybe they didnt have guages in those days - remember there was a stage that cars were built where a hand winch was used to close the window. I was not exposed to such poverty and it bugged me for years that my mother would ask me to 'wind the window up' when all it involved was pressing a button - a copy of which she had at her fingertips.

[G54]

If you feel the need to go home best that you go if not you will only regret it in the future and if it is not as comfortable back home then you can always return back to LOS.

^^^ Is my line of thought too.

Look at it this way, go back to the UK for the summer. Enjoy those evenings. Have a few decent beers, a chin wag in the local. Chill out.

Then, when the urge overcomes you, come back to Thailand.

The only possible difficulty might depend on circumstances. If you own a car here, selling it. Same with furniture and other goods you have acquired.

Sometimes we need a break. Look at it as a holiday. You might be refreshed.