Home Being Built In Isaan,i Need Advice Please

[dmax]

i am building a small home for the wife in isaan..tha kanto/kranuen area,it will be basic just a living room 1 bedroom and 1 western style toilet and shower room, it will be a simple rectangle shape and 9m long by 5m wide, the land is my wifes and it is allready filled etc as her family has home next door. lets say i want only the foundations /walls /plumbing/wiring /roof on and windows in.i will leave tiling /painting/plastering untill i come back next year as im only staying another 2 months.how do i work the payments out with the builder,i spoke to the builder last night and he wants me to buy materials etc,he will do the work,i wont have a clue what type of materials to buy or where,im 60 k from udon thani and around 80k from khon kaen..will i tell the builder i want cavity walls and what type blocks are best..i want to start questions about foundations and walls first and ask questions about plumbing etc as i go along so as to keep it simple and less confusing..i am on a budget and this house is for us to stay in when we come to visit every year it wont be used very often,i have promised my wife a small house and she told her family months ago that i will make one for her so i dont want to lose face and neither do i,i have allready commited myself to it. i asked to see some homes he built allready and he took me right away to a large house he was building for 3 m baht...

[StasD]

i am building a small home for the wife in isaan..tha kanto/kranuen area,it will be basic just a living room 1 bedroom and 1 western style toilet and shower room, it will be a simple rectangle shape and 9m long by 5m wide, the land is my wifes and it is allready filled etc as her family has home next door. lets say i want only the foundations /walls /plumbing/wiring /roof on and windows in.i will leave tiling /painting/plastering untill i come back next year as im only staying another 2 months.how do i work the payments out with the builder,i spoke to the builder last night and he wants me to buy materials etc,he will do the work,i wont have a clue what type of materials to buy or where,im 60 k from udon thani and around 80k from khon kaen..will i tell the builder i want cavity walls and what type blocks are best..i want to start questions about foundations and walls first and ask questions about plumbing etc as i go along so as to keep it simple and less confusing..i am on a budget and this house is for us to stay in when we come to visit every year it wont be used very often,i have promised my wife a small house and she told her family months ago that i will make one for her so i dont want to lose face and neither do i,i have allready commited myself to it. i asked to see some homes he built allready and he took me right away to a large house he was building for 3 m baht...

you must buy all the materials by yourself, and pay the money to the builder only after finishing the job. Otherwise your house will cost as gold made. It would be better if the builder will not know that the farang is here- the price will doubled immediately at least. I know a lot of my friends here who are unhappy now having been involved in this problem

[keeniau96]

I would not even think of starting without proper plans. Get Thai architect to draw them up, not much money at all. Need foundation, floor and roof plans, plus plumbing and electrical layout.

Standard builder practice is to either fixed price or M/S+. If fixed price then agree of price in advance then pay progress payment starting with some advance money. But note that Thais just don't understand that fixed price is fixed, they always come back at you for extras and overruns ... and if you don't agree they walk off the job. Thais never have money to buy the cement, sand, rebar, etc, so you have to spend some up-front no matter how you go about it. The alternative is M/S+ that you pay-as-you go, buying all materials and then paying the builder for labor plus some overhead and profit for him. Try to get somebody in the family who is a builder because he will have to face the family if bugger-up.

Hope this points out why you need the plans; how can you build if you don't know what/how much material you need. Above all don't skimp on the foundation, it is indeed the basis for everything else. Do it wrong and you will have neverending problems.

[Crossy]

You may find some suitable plans here http://www.crossy.co.uk/Thai_House_Plans/index.html free

[scorecard]

There is a good point in not letting the builder know that a franag is involved, as said, it will increase the price a lot, but from what your saying, seems like the builder already knows a farang is in the picture.

It may not be practical since you don't live here full time, but I wouldn't let any building work proceed unless I was on the spot, all day, every day.

My family has had two bad experiences of telling builders exactly what we wanted and expected (and both times using professional, very detailed and complete plans drawn up by a professional architect), then coming back just a few days later and discovering that the builder had ignored our detailed verbal instructions and the actual plans in regard to location of internal walls, doors, plumbing etc.

We should have learned from the first bad experience but we put it down to bad luck - picked the wrong builder (and by the way we did check on the quality of his previous work, which looked fine).

On second occasion we quickly dismissed the builder and found a new one, his first task was to pull down several walls and to discard some amount of poor quality plumbing work. Then we started again with myself or my adult Thai son on site at all times.

[slapout]

Losing face to a farang may be much more acceptable than losing money on construction on which you have no input. If you elect to be a absentee builder/atm I can see very little possibility of anyone being happy in the final product or expectations of either party. My experience, after building 3 houses and working with several friends on their building experiences here in Thailand is that house/building plans mean f..k all to the builder and workers as many cannot read plans anyway. Scale on plans can be ignored as no one is there to verify that anyone can understand them. Now if the potential builder can show you a building like you want, which he has built, is willing to build a copy for a predetermined sum, (shell only) and agrees to install plumbing, windows, doors, electrical and receive payment upon your return and approval of same, I would still caution you against it. If site is prepared, the actual building of what you describe should not be a long term project during the right season. 2 months should handle it.

[SantiSuk]

You would be better off asking the quaestion can anyone recommend a builder in the Udon Thani/Kon Kaen area (or wherever). If you get a good guy then 90% of the problems drop away. May not be bottom dollar price though - you get what you pay for even in LoS, but you are on a hiding to nothing with some local cheap Charlie and you not there

I supervised in absentia the design and build of the house I now share with TW. Yes the builder did get the dimensions wrong - he give us an extra half meter (free) because he failed to turn up one day when his groundworkers were putting in the posts, but most other stuff was ok - except the windows - you have to make sure you can be there to re-direct them where to put the windows and internal fittings, otherwise you'll end up with a dog's breakfast. Oh and the plumbing - Thais cannot plumb hot water sytems so just get those bathroom electric shower wall units or suffer misery like me. But if you can try not to be too picky about life and accept it's not going to be perfect you can get a perfectly liveable hose with a reasonable builder and your wife won't understand why falang are so anal about such stuff anyway

[rgw]

My inlaws just build their house up in Isaan / Ubon, out in the sticks, in a small village.

No real plans, just some quick drawings.

9x6 meters (6x6 living/bedroom, 3x3 kitchen, 3x3 bathroom) made of concrete and a decent roof on top.

Standard style, just added a few western style things (like glass in the window slides, etcetera) and a regular toilet.

Looks great, only 300K

Local contractor made it all and it's OK for the inlaws. I wouldn't be able to live in it comfortably, but for them it's more then fine.

Only took 3 months, for start to end, in the rainy season.

I bought myself a house here, on rama2. in a decent project.

Quality is OK, considering it's a bit upscale, but it's not like back in Holland (maybe 85%)

[dmax]

thanks guys, as i say its a simple rectangle shape shell all in it will be 75 sqm ,15x5, the land needs a little more din put in just to bring it up to level and wifes father is arranging that now, i came down to patts with the kids for 5 days and am due to go back in 2 days to see the architect and at least give the builder something decent to work on instead of a drawing made by me..the builder has agreed a price with me to do work only 50.000 thb to complete and pay on completion, i supply all materials. but last night the wife got a call from the big boss (whoever he is) i thought i had talked to big boss allready ? anyway the boss wants now to buy materials himself and give me a complete price so im wondering why ? is he going to add on some prices for materials ? i can buy most materials within a 40 mile radius,even in her villiage there are 2 decent stores which have a choice of doors and tiles etc. i will be there everyday of the build and will do my best to oversee things but people on here must understand my wifes family (all of them) are lets just say (thick) last week trying to talk with the builder i had to repeat to my wife what to say to him,even they were not understand eachother,i was litterally pulling my hair out with frustration trying to get them to understand some simple things such as where the windows are going to be etc etc. i wish i hadnt of told her i would build the bloody thing but its started now so i cannot backtrack on it..i also would of taken the services of a couple of good falang builders from kk and buriram who,s details i got off here but the simple truth is that i just havent got the money now so have to go with 2nd best .

anymore advise would be much appreciated thankyou

Edited October 23, 2009 by dmax

[longball53098]

My feeling is this "big boss" is trying to make a better profit. That's how they do it by selling a complete build. i would find another builder if he won't accept a labor only deal. They try to make at least 25% profit and who knows what kickbacks from the places he buys the materials.

[SantiSuk]

thanks guys, as i say its a simple rectangle shape shell all in it will be 75 sqm ,15x5, the land needs a little more din put in just to bring it up to level and wifes father is arranging that now, i came down to patts with the kids for 5 days and am due to go back in 2 days to see the architect and at least give the builder something decent to work on instead of a drawing made by me..the builder has agreed a price with me to do work only 50.000 thb to complete and pay on completion, i supply all materials. but last night the wife got a call from the big boss (whoever he is) i thought i had talked to big boss allready ? anyway the boss wants now to buy materials himself and give me a complete price so im wondering why ? is he going to add on some prices for materials ? i can buy most materials within a 40 mile radius,even in her villiage there are 2 decent stores which have a choice of doors and tiles etc. i will be there everyday of the build and will do my best to oversee things but people on here must understand my wifes family (all of them) are lets just say (thick) last week trying to talk with the builder i had to repeat to my wife what to say to him,even they were not understand eachother,i was litterally pulling my hair out with frustration trying to get them to understand some simple things such as where the windows are going to be etc etc. i wish i hadnt of told her i would build the bloody thing but its started now so i cannot backtrack on it..i also would of taken the services of a couple of good falang builders from kk and buriram who,s details i got off here but the simple truth is that i just havent got the money now so have to go with 2nd best .

anymore advise would be much appreciated thankyou

I hope your builder builds from the subsoil strata not from the new landfill level. I saw an engineer comment somewhere on TV that the soil-fill platforms beloved by Isaan paddy field buyers need to settle 15 years before you can build up from them! We built before we filled, raising the first floor up accordingly. It means there is water in the foundations during the rainy season, so must have concrete not wood first flooring, but at least the house will not sink (hopefully)

[dmax]

exactly what im thinking the new big boss is trying to up the price of materials etc..im hoping to keep it around 500,000 thb,,just standard 1 bed,living room and shower,is it possible i can do it for this price im wondering,,,the wife is telling me we can build (nice house ) for 300,000 but i doubt it very much from what im reading on here.

Edited October 23, 2009 by dmax

[Rimmer]

75 square meters divided by your target budget of 500,000 comes out at baht 6,667 a square meter, builders cost for a well well built and well finished house should be between 5 and 6k a meter. Maybe the builder can build for less but be warned building materials contrary to popular belief are not cheaper away from towns.

[slapout]

Does the 50,000 include labor for installing and welding the roof frame, electrical, painting, etc? There are so many questions that could be asked prior to talking about labor, material price, finished house price, etc. You can have a cement block building built and stuccoed , windows/doors installed, roof/with frame, electric/plumbing installed with false ceiling, after the fact for cheap cheap, on up. If you feel family is thick, wait until you try to convey to the workers what you want. Good luck and look at this as a new learning experience.

[dmax]

none of the builders speak any english..but hopefully when i go back up then this (big boss ) speaks a little...the 50,000thb for labour did include plumbing,painting and electrical work inc...yes the whole family dont have the first clue about much and its frustrating to say the least, is rimmer saying that i can build this for 500,000 thb ? what is the most expensive materials i will be paying for roof tiles? interior floor tiles ? concrete ? bricks ? i have priced blocks and tiles etc,,im wondering should i go to some big store in udon thani 60k away and order nearly everything from them and hopefully i can pay a little for delivery ?

[lilleper]

i build about 120 sqm for 650000 k and i bougt every thing my self i think the labour cost was about 150000k and all materials was the best i could find in the area