Cambodian Government Lambast Us Internet Giant Google

[webfact]

PREAH VIHEAR TEMPLE

Cambodia lambast Google Earth for locating temple in Thai soil

PHNOM PENH -- The Cambodian government sent a strongly-worded letter Friday to US internet giant Google, complaining that its online Google Earth map incorrectly places parts of the 11th century Preah Vihear temple in Thailand.

The letter comes ahead of an expected visit this weekend by Cambodia's Prime Minister Hun Sen to the temple, which is situated on land claimed by both Cambodia and neighbouring Thailand.

Government spokesman Phay Siphan told the German Press Agency dpa he had sent an initial letter to Google three years ago asking it to remedy the problem, but had received no response.

Friday's letter called on Google to withdraw the map, calling its demarcation of the border 'radically misleading and totally misguided' for showing 'almost half of the temple in Thailand.'

The International Court of Justice awarded Preah Vihear temple to Cambodia in 1962, but did not rule on nearby land that is claimed by both nations.

Google's map, which shows the yellow border line running through the contested temple, 'is devoid of truth and reality and professionally irresponsible, if not pretentious,' the letter stated.

The temple location on Google Maps/Google Earth: Google Earth

Over the past 18 months Thai nationalists have used the Preah Vihear issue to stoke tensions, to which the visit by Hun Sen may add.

Phay Siphan said he had no official confirmation that Hun Sen would visit Preah Vihear temple at the weekend, but said people expected him to be there.

'Everyone is talking about it and expects to see [Hun Sen] on the top [of the temple] to pay his respects to Cambodian culture,' Phay Siphan said late Friday.

He added that the area was 'very stable, and there are no irregularities. Soldiers are chitchatting with each other.'

The relationship between Cambodia and Thailand has been tense for more than a year with sporadic clashes between troops in the area around the temple. Much of the border between the two countries has yet to be demarcated.

Diplomatic relations plunged to a new low in October after Phnom Penh appointed Thailand's fugitive ex-premier Thaksin

-- The Nation 2010-02-06

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

[hammered]

Mildly amusing.

[Scott]

Oops!

[TheWalkingMan]

Tempest in a teapot.

[JustinCredible]

Why should Google respond? Surely, if the International Courts have not ruled on the border, "cutting it in half" is the fairest thing. Maybe Thailand should ask for "land rent money" from Cambodia, for half of the Temple......

Edited February 6, 2010 by JustinCredible

[Thailand]

Perhaps Google maps are providing the wisdom of Solomon and cutting the baby in half to resolve the issue.

[iono]

Maybe both countries will realize they are both idiots arguing over a shared history and come to their senses; dogging goggle earth, come on.

[ManilaLover]

Yeah ego is a real big problem and unfortunately human rights and environment are always non issues in this region...

[Insight]

Wonder if its way of drawing international attention to the situation...?

(albeit a really childish and pathetic way)

[mythBuster]

It seems Google has its own international laws.

[phuketrichard]

Living here in Thailand and observing the spats betwen thailand over the last 5 years or so all i can see is Hun Sen is looking for a fight and by appointing Thaksin to ANY position is just rubbing it in Thailands face.

The temple is Cambodia's no question about it.

Expect things to heat up in the coming months. The reds will mount more attacks in the next 2 weeks leading up to the courts decision on Thaksins ill gotten money. If things deteriate further the only one to lose is Camboidna as it depends on Thailand for eveything from electricty to cable TV, internet and tourism.

Edited February 6, 2010 by phuketrichard

[chillibilly]

I realize Thais have a different view on this dispute...BUT, amazing how both sides neglected the ancient site until the UN declared it as a UNISCO sight I must mention (correct me if I am wrong) that a couple years ago the UN threatened to pull funds out of the historic UNESCO Ayuthaya sight because the Thai government was not taking care of the historical ruins ... So if Thailand cannot take care of their UNISCO Ayuthaya site, how can they take care of Phanom Rung?

Edited February 6, 2010 by chillibilly

[Ponbkk]

 Having experience in mapping I would say that (what I just looked and saw on Google Maps) a 10-15 meter "error" is quite good, especially in this area. The location data and boundary data are probably from slightly different sources. Nothing to be concerned of. 

Edited February 6, 2010 by Ponbkk

[elcent]

Why should Google respond? Surely, if the International Courts have not ruled on the border, "cutting it in half" is the fairest thing. Maybe Thailand should ask for "land rent money" from Cambodia, for half of the Temple......

Is this called the Siamese Twins?

[khunjamespittman]

Why should Google respond? Surely, if the International Courts have not ruled on the border, "cutting it in half" is the fairest thing. Maybe Thailand should ask for "land rent money" from Cambodia, for half of the Temple......

Unbelievable! International Courts have not ruled but you have decided it is fair "cutting in half". What do we need International Courts for? We have your infinite wisdom. What is your opinion on the latest bank robberies? Please tell us what is fair! We're all waiting for the oracle to speak.

[Foggy Bottom]

Looking at the aerial photo in the OP link, my first reaction was - notice how verdant and complete is the forest on the Cambodian side, and how much cleared land and degraded forest there is on the Thai side. Then I also noticed that the only "development" of any type is on the Thai side (Highway 221 and the group of buildings next to it at the north end of the temple-line)

Hate to say it, but that situation alone puts me on the Khmer's side of the argument - give them all the disputed land and let it return to healthy forest, with just the temple grounds as open land. I visited several sites of similar location in Central America, deep in the jungle, and the contrast it causes to be 100% surrounded by forest is stunningly beautiful and adds to the awe and mystique of such ancient monuments, making them far more worthy of a visit.

If Thailand does the same to Preah Vihear as they have done to Ayutthaya, Phimai, Sukhothai, Wieng Kum Kam et al, then it'll simply become a concrete-patched Disney-park mess.

Send in the UNESCO archaeologists, restorers, troops, and border demarkers I say. Make it set in stone (pillars) once and for all.

[Totster]

I realize Thais have a different view on this dispute...BUT, amazing how both sides neglected the ancient site until the UN declared it as a UNISCO sight I must mention (correct me if I am wrong) that a couple years ago the UN threatened to pull funds out of the historic UNESCO Ayuthaya sight because the Thai government was not taking care of the historical ruins ... So if Thailand cannot take care of their UNISCO Ayuthaya site, how can they take care of Phanom Rung?

<deleted> has Phanom Rung got to do with it?

totster

[brianb1944]

<deleted> has Phanom Rung got to do with it?

totster

Thats what I wondered but wasnt game to ask

[fiddlehead]

Interesting.

If you take the coordintes from the google maps link above, and copy and past them into google earth, then go there.

Zoom in (to the temple area where all the blue squares which are photographs are) and then, holding down your shift key while scrolling with your mouse scroller, (the whole terrain shifts into a profile view) you can see that the boundary line basically goes up the ridge on the East/Northeast side.

Then when it almost gets to the peak of the mountain, it gets moved way over to the advantage of Cambodia.

Not so easy to explain. Better if you do it yourself and see what I mean.

Of course, Google is not the judge. Nor I.

But, I believe if Solomen were to look at it this way, Cambodia already seems to have gotten more than they deserve.

just my opinion of course

I certainly get a kick out of those blaming this on Taksin

[ferd54]

Tempest in a teapot.

Or temple in a teapot .. or tempest in a temple ... of temple tempest in a teapot .. or, well never mind.

[nullx8]

(albeit a really childish and pathetic way)

Absolutely !!!

Google provide the tools to see places maps and images(satelite images/terrain)

but does not Own the data ... the different layers like Sat-images, border maps, stretmaps and POI (like this temple) are from uncountable sources.

google simply put them all together and display then .. thats it

the location of the temple may correct but the satelite image may offset and shifted under the border .. anyway .. if i where google i would react the same way (not at all) .. as he data always comes from a local company supply google with this informations and locations.

childish is the perfect word !

Edited February 6, 2010 by altf4

[Jonathanpattaya]

In the grand scheme of things, is it REALLY that important?

[IvanDobsky]

Interesting.

If you take the coordintes from the google maps link above, and copy and past them into google earth, then go there.

Zoom in (to the temple area where all the blue squares which are photographs are) and then, holding down your shift key while scrolling with your mouse scroller, (the whole terrain shifts into a profile view) you can see that the boundary line basically goes up the ridge on the East/Northeast side.

Then when it almost gets to the peak of the mountain, it gets moved way over to the advantage of Cambodia.

Not so easy to explain. Better if you do it yourself and see what I mean.

Of course, Google is not the judge. Nor I.

But, I believe if Solomen were to look at it this way, Cambodia already seems to have gotten more than they deserve.

just my opinion of course

I certainly get a kick out of those blaming this on Taksin

well it was Thaksin's lawyer who allegedly confirmed that the temple belongs to Cambodia in exchange for alleged concessions

allegedly

I don't care if it belongs to the Khmer people or not, based on French boundaries or not, but you have to admit that mr. popular made a cock up of it and reinforced the xenophobic mantra of the yellow

[way2muchcoffee]

Interesting.

If you take the coordintes from the google maps link above, and copy and past them into google earth, then go there.

Zoom in (to the temple area where all the blue squares which are photographs are) and then, holding down your shift key while scrolling with your mouse scroller, (the whole terrain shifts into a profile view) you can see that the boundary line basically goes up the ridge on the East/Northeast side.

Then when it almost gets to the peak of the mountain, it gets moved way over to the advantage of Cambodia.

Not so easy to explain. Better if you do it yourself and see what I mean.

Of course, Google is not the judge. Nor I.

But, I believe if Solomen were to look at it this way, Cambodia already seems to have gotten more than they deserve.

just my opinion of course

I certainly get a kick out of those blaming this on Taksin

Yes. I see what you mean. On the other hand, if you zoom out a bit and look at the flow of the border there is a larger deviation of the boundary that seems to significantly advantage Thailand in the demarcation.

Edited February 6, 2010 by way2muchcoffee

[nullx8]

Why should Google respond? Surely, if the International Courts have not ruled on the border, "cutting it in half" is the fairest thing. Maybe Thailand should ask for "land rent money" from Cambodia, for half of the Temple......

Unbelievable! International Courts have not ruled but you have decided it is fair "cutting in half". What do we need International Courts for? We have your infinite wisdom. What is your opinion on the latest bank robberies? Please tell us what is fair! We're all waiting for the oracle to speak.

unbelivable reading a quote like this

anyway declaring the area to a free zone would solve the problem indeed ;-)

[Tywais]

Some background information > Understanding the Temple of Preah Vihear issue (pdf)

Obviously a bit dated as the word "amicable" shows up often.

[ballpoint]

Having seen other examples of letters written by Cambodian government officials in the local papers I'm not surprised Google hasn't bothered to respond. The quoted text of this letter isn't a lot better:

...devoid of truth and reality and professionally irresponsible, if not pretentious...

Pretentious??? Until these so called diplomats can start communicating in an adult manner the whole world will either ignore them or laugh at them.

[ILOOKFORWORK]

Why should Google respond? Surely, if the International Courts have not ruled on the border, "cutting it in half" is the fairest thing. Maybe Thailand should ask for "land rent money" from Cambodia, for half of the Temple......

International court already ruled on it long ago; and gave the temple back to Cambodia (as it is a Cambodian temple). This seems like very simple logic, but the clowns in the Apishit admin don't want to admit the truth. I think the article misnames them as Thai "nationalists". Rather, it should be renamed "fascists".

[junglist]

Maybe both countries will realize they are both idiots arguing over a shared history and come to their senses; dogging goggle earth, come on.

Well you get my vote. We will be sending you to the boarder to fix all these stupid problems. So pack up you leave next week. Hahahahahah (in Thai 555555555).

[IvanDobsky]

Why should Google respond? Surely, if the International Courts have not ruled on the border, "cutting it in half" is the fairest thing. Maybe Thailand should ask for "land rent money" from Cambodia, for half of the Temple......

International court already ruled on it long ago; and gave the temple back to Cambodia (as it is a Cambodian temple). This seems like very simple logic, but the clowns in the Apishit admin don't want to admit the truth. I think the article misnames them as Thai "nationalists". Rather, it should be renamed "fascists".

Yes, they're playing to the (significant) nationalistic sentiment. It's a shame because Abhisit seems to be such an intelligent chap. It appears he has too many "interests" to obey