Hiring A Car And Driving Round Thailand - A Few Questions Please

[happyaussie]

Agree about fuel consumption. The larger car may cost you an extra 500bht per day. So peanuts. If you go this way I'd suggest fortuner. Vigo is a pickup designed for commercial use and without a load in the back gets bouncy over any sort of bumpy road. I've owned 2 fortuners and loved them. I've also driven vigos several times. Nice,but too bouncy.

I've also driven the city and enjoyed it very much. Just make sure you insist on the new model.

[Deeral]

Actually the Vigo has "softened" sprining to make it feel more like a car - although the Fortuner has coil springs.

With the 4 door version and passengers the weight distribution will mean that the handling at normal speeds and conditions will be almost indecernably different from a "normal" family saloon.

The Fortuner is of course based on exactly the same basic mechanical components (chassis, engine etc) as the Vigo -

i really think that drivng around at normal speeds either vehicle would be fine - the national speed limit BTW is 90 kph on all roads except motorways - 120kph.

i hardly think that fuel figures for speeds of 160kph are relevant to this conversation.

Edited April 5, 2010 by Deeral

[asiancup2007]

Excellent post which mirrors my experiences. I used a gps and took a map too and suggest you do the same. Be aware cars or trucks flashing their lights mean they are coming thru not inviting you to go.

My experience driving in Thailand has been one of surprise. Having driven all over the country I have been pleasantly surprised how good the roads are. You'll drive on 2 lane duel carrageways between all major towns and cities. Even b roads are fine. So don't be afraid to venture off the beaten track. That's where you'll get a real taste of country Thailand. If you stick to highways you won't see much at all. Most towns look the same. Just be careful when driving in torential rain. Some roads aren't designed with this in mind. Road works are very poorly identified, if at all. You'll also notice a lot of police checkpoints. No worries the police are generally more interested in trying their English. However they will see a Farang as an easy target. 200bht should solve most issues - speeding, not wearing seatbelt and not staying in LH lane. Most signage is in Thai and English. However you may see a sign that says left to *** only to find out the turnoff is still 1km away. Getting through some towns maybe challenging. If you get lost ask a motorbike taxi or tuk tuk to guide you. It may cost 50bht but worth it. If you ask a Thai on the street they maybe too shy to help.

I don't know how good GPS works. I'd stick with a map.

Cars, the new model city is a good unit and should be okay. I drove one recently from Phuket to Bangkok and was impressed.A fortuner would be better but consdierably more expensive. Maybe consider shopping around. I used Thai Rent a Car a few times and always got a better deal, good service and new cars.

Lastly, don't be afraid of sampling local food in villages and towns. It is great.

Enjoy it's a great way to experience Thailand

[katabeachbum]

Actually the Vigo has "softened" sprining to make it feel more like a car - although the Fortuner has coil springs.

With the 4 door version and passengers the weight distribution will mean that the handling at normal speeds and conditions will be almost indecernably different from a "normal" family saloon.

The Fortuner is of course based on exactly the same basic mechanical components (chassis, engine etc) as the Vigo -

i really think that drivng around at normal speeds either vehicle would be fine - the national speed limit BTW is 90 kph on all roads except motorways - 120kph.

i hardly think that fuel figures for speeds of 160kph are relevant to this conversation.

Fortuner has 25cm shorter wheelbase, making it 40 cm shorter overall than Vigo. Softer front springs and much softer rear coilsprings makes it more comfortable. Individual reclining rearseats and closed luggagecompartment would also be an advantage. So only disadvantage would be rental price.

For OP fuelcosts has been a subject, the difference or similarity between different vehicles is the same at 90 kmh and 160 kmh.

Edited April 6, 2010 by katabeachbum

[Deeral]

I'm well aware of the specs of the Fortuner/Vigo etc - I think this bickering is for another thread.

[katabeachbum]

I'm well aware of the specs of the Fortuner/Vigo etc - I think this bickering is for another thread.

It wasnt for you, it was for OP to make a qualified choise based on facts. Fortuner is much more comfy than Vigo, unfortunately at a higher price

[Deeral]

a comment like yours which infers the vigo is either unsuitable for the purposes of the OP or is "uncomfortable" is simply not true

[katabeachbum]

a comment like yours which infers the vigo is either unsuitable for the purposes of the OP or is "uncomfortable" is simply not true

having had 3 Vigo 3,0 4x4 auto 4 door, 2004, 2006 and presently 2010, and covered 140k km with them I know their pros and cons. having only one Fortuner 3,0 4x4 auto for only 40k km I know the pros and cons of this one too.

I never said Vigo is "uncomfortable", a 2010 4 door 4X4 is the most comfy PICKUP on the thai market. I just said Fortuner is more comfy, and I said why it is so.

[Digitalbanana]

a comment like yours which infers the vigo is either unsuitable for the purposes of the OP or is "uncomfortable" is simply not true

The OP is coming from the UK. No one uses pick ups there, and a Fortuner is a better choice for holidaying foreign family with kids. Picks ups are for local tradesmen .

[Deeral]

I think you should check out the UK car market a bit before you make comments like that. Toop-selling pickup in UK is the Nissan Navara 4 door - fully loaded.

THe "Hurricane" - is that the right name - Strada to you - is also sold in a fully loaded spec as are the Vigo and Triton.

Now that's quite enough for one day!

Edited April 7, 2010 by Deeral

[bifftastic]

Sounds like a great trip you're planning, I haven't done a whole lot of driving in Thailand but I've done a bit in the north up around Chiang Rai, the roads are fine, there's some beautiful scenery. What i would say is that it takes a bit longer than you would imagine to get anywhere. You look on the map, it's around 65km, you think ok that will take 'x' amount of time, it takes longer, there's 'tractors', roadworks, something to stop and look at, the odd police checkpoint, someone who only takes their pick-up out for 10 minutes every day and goes 3km in it and it takes them an hour! etc.

I'd make your estimates a little longer than you first think. It'll save you feeling rushed or pressured into missing something if you need to get somewhere to drop your car off or make a hotel booking time/day.

Have fun, I reckon the kids will love it, especially if they can hook up with some Thai kids, who will also love it

As for which vehicle you should go for, unless you want to do this I'd go for a car.

Edited April 7, 2010 by bifftastic

[Digitalbanana]

I think you should check out the UK car market a bit before you make comments like that. Toop-selling pickup in UK is the Nissan Navara 4 door - fully loaded.

THe "Hurricane" - is that the right name - Strada to you - is also sold in a fully loaded spec as are the Vigo and Triton.

Now that's quite enough for one day!

Try not to be so judgmental my dear. Your not trolling are you? Nissan has less than 3% of the UK sales and Mitzubishi less than that, so pick ups are far more common in countries with large families and poorer traffic law enforcement, as shown in last posters photo. You weren't the driver by any chance?

[katabeachbum]

do you have the figures?

I drive very fast, highway 160km/h cruisingspeed

2006 yaris (similar to city/jazz), 9-10 km/l at 32 baht/litres

2004, 2006, 2010 vigo 3,0d 4x4 auto 4 door, 9-11 km/l at 28 baht/litres, if loaded with 600-900kg and load outside body 140 km/h only, 10-12km/l

2005 fortuner 3,0d auto 4x4, 10-12 km/l at 28 baht/litres

2007 Camry 2,4 auto 7 km/l at 32 baht/litres

2008 Accord 2,4 auto 8 km/l at 32 baht/litres

my own vehicles, each 40-90k km

That is fast for Thai roads, you have my admiration, more balls than me. I admit l haven't read all the threads but my initial advice to the OP was the Fortuna auto or Vigo 4x4 auto.

NO contest with any other. Don't want to slag off any particular make but l would not hire any other motor. Happy holidays.

As for Nissan in the UK, it has an overall good name BUT we are talking Thailand and a suitable vehicle, Nissan here is, shall we say, a poor man's purchase. Sorry.

not balls, just plain stupid

and like to leave 7 in the morning from Phuket and have lunch in Hua Hin 700km later without falling asleep on the highway.

every f-cking official speeding ticket I have saved is actually 158-162 kmh. like the cruisecontrol on the 2010 Vigo. Iv seen some posters mention speedo on Vigo is inaccurate, but the official speedingtickets are measured with laser and match my cruisingspeed exactly.

BTW, there are no large rentalcompanies renting anything else than Vigo or Fortuner trucks, so the chance of renting some crap is not present

Edited April 7, 2010 by katabeachbum

[johndmf]

All this makes interesting reading and everyone has made valid points.

At the moment we are veering strongly towards getting a 4x4 as it would be a shame to not be able to get to a village or waterfall because it was raining and the road was a bit dodgy. We are only renting for 15 or 16 days so we are prepared to put up with not having the ideal vehicle comfort wise if it will save some money we can spend on other things. I'm almost certain that the Vigo double cab and the Fortuner are both the petrol versions as there is a further option for a diesel Fortuner which is more expensive to hire.

I've spoken to my wife and kids about the car and at the moment we are veering towards the Vigo double cab as it is so much cheaper than the Fortuner. We were in Kanchanaburi 3 years ago and went on a day trip in a Vigo double cab. Having seen some of the Thais sitting in the back of the trucks we decided to have a ride in the back for a little bit and the kids absolutely loved it, so that's actually a plus point for the double cab Vigo! The main things that would put us off the Vigo are the lack of space to put the luggage inside or if it was a lot less economical fuel wise. We've gone away in our car at the moment with about the same amount of luggage that we'll have when we come out to Thailand, so as a test we put all the luggage on the back seat with the kids and it all fitted in and they still had plenty of room.

I think my real problem will be that I've got ideas of things I want to see or do and I'll try and fit too much in and we'll end up driving too far. I've just got to be ruthless.

I want to go to the Mukdahan/Nakhon Phanom area as I've seen some interesting places to stay. I also want to see some good views of life along the Mekhong. The books I'm looking at say the nicest bit of the Mekhong is the section from Nong Khai to Chiang Khan, but that would mean a big detour as we head over to North Thailand. Are there some nice sections between Nakhon Phanom to Mukdahan or just south of Mukdahan?

Thanks again for everyones help.

[bifftastic]

I think you should check out the UK car market a bit before you make comments like that. Toop-selling pickup in UK is the Nissan Navara 4 door - fully loaded.

THe "Hurricane" - is that the right name - Strada to you - is also sold in a fully loaded spec as are the Vigo and Triton.

Now that's quite enough for one day!

Try not to be so judgmental my dear. Your not trolling are you? Nissan has less than 3% of the UK sales and Mitzubishi less than that, so pick ups are far more common in countries with large families and poorer traffic law enforcement, as shown in last posters photo. You weren't the driver by any chance?

No, I was

[MikeyIdea]

I want to go to the Mukdahan/Nakhon Phanom area as I've seen some interesting places to stay. I also want to see some good views of life along the Mekhong. The books I'm looking at say the nicest bit of the Mekhong is the section from Nong Khai to Chiang Khan, but that would mean a big detour as we head over to North Thailand. Are there some nice sections between Nakhon Phanom to Mukdahan or just south of Mukdahan?

You can continue straight on west by the Mekong river at Chiang Khan and you can go passed Na Haew and up into Uttaradit and Nan. Roads are small but decent -> Chieng Khan - 2195 and 1268 to and pass Na Haew -> 1123 -> 1241. I liked that trip, nice is September when nature is lush and green

[katabeachbum]

All this makes interesting reading and everyone has made valid points.

At the moment we are veering strongly towards getting a 4x4 as it would be a shame to not be able to get to a village or waterfall because it was raining and the road was a bit dodgy. We are only renting for 15 or 16 days so we are prepared to put up with not having the ideal vehicle comfort wise if it will save some money we can spend on other things. I'm almost certain that the Vigo double cab and the Fortuner are both the petrol versions as there is a further option for a diesel Fortuner which is more expensive to hire.

I've spoken to my wife and kids about the car and at the moment we are veering towards the Vigo double cab as it is so much cheaper than the Fortuner. We were in Kanchanaburi 3 years ago and went on a day trip in a Vigo double cab. Having seen some of the Thais sitting in the back of the trucks we decided to have a ride in the back for a little bit and the kids absolutely loved it, so that's actually a plus point for the double cab Vigo! The main things that would put us off the Vigo are the lack of space to put the luggage inside or if it was a lot less economical fuel wise. We've gone away in our car at the moment with about the same amount of luggage that we'll have when we come out to Thailand, so as a test we put all the luggage on the back seat with the kids and it all fitted in and they still had plenty of room.

I think my real problem will be that I've got ideas of things I want to see or do and I'll try and fit too much in and we'll end up driving too far. I've just got to be ruthless.

I want to go to the Mukdahan/Nakhon Phanom area as I've seen some interesting places to stay. I also want to see some good views of life along the Mekhong. The books I'm looking at say the nicest bit of the Mekhong is the section from Nong Khai to Chiang Khan, but that would mean a big detour as we head over to North Thailand. Are there some nice sections between Nakhon Phanom to Mukdahan or just south of Mukdahan?

Thanks again for everyones help.

If the Vigo is only a couple of years old, a 4x4 auto 4 door comes only with 3,0diesel. same fuel cost as a city/jazz/yaris.. expect 30-50% more fuelcost for Vigo/Fortuner 2,7 petrol

[happyaussie]

Definitely get diesal if you go Vigo or Fortuner. Petrol is now pushing 40bht a litre. They are both big heavy cars and thirsty. Your luggage will get wet if you get the Vigo. Unless you get one with a fibreglass cover over the tray. 4 peoples luggage inside wouldn't be very comfortable.

I'd suggest Fortuner, then no probs at all.

I've travelled extensively and have yet to visit a place where 4x4 is needed. No doubt if you are super adventurous there would be places but I wonder if that's what you are looking for.

[Deeral]

many of the 4x4, 4 dr pickups are fitted with a locking lid that closes the back.

The four doors are very roomy now and have seat belts for 5.

The slightly smaller 2+2 cabs have only 2 doors and some have a small "backwards" opening access door for the cramped back seats.

I would certainly go for diesel over petrol.

diesel is 28 baht per litre where I live (outside Bkk) - it may cost a little more up North though.....still a lot cheaper than petrol.

Models you are likely to be offered are -

Toyota Vigo

Mitsubishi triton

Nissan Navara

also

Isuzu/Chevrolet. - ???

Ford/Mazda

the vehicles will come with air, electric windows/rearview mirrors, CD player, abs, airbag(s) etc etc....probably automatic transmission and part-time 4WD.

[Lancashirelad]

Having driven to & from & around Isaan before in September, including finding myself in a village that was completely flooded, i wouldn't dream of a petrol car.

Pick-up advantages:

Higher driving position, more comfortable seating position. Less stressfull on long drives due to the superior view of the road ahead and lower revs of the diesel engine.

Higher ground clearance. Much less susceptable to wheel/tyre/suspension damage due to hitting submerged pot holes.

Excellent fording capabilities with diesel engine providing air intake is kept dry.

Need i go on?

Just one point to watch with Budget. Read the small print re insurance VERY carefully. What looks like O liability isn't. You have to pay extra to get that. I got a star in the windscreen the size of a 20p piece from a flying stone kicked up by a truck going the other way.

They refused to return my deposit of 5/7,000 bht. (I forget).

Sounds like a great trip. Hope you have a lovely time. As said by others, don't plan too much. In torrential rain, headlights on, wipers on fast speed & just plod on slowly. You may well never have driven in rain like it. You will feel far more confident in the Vigo or similar.

Distance can be done in a day. I did Chiang Mai to Kanchanaburi in one hit, but remember, this is supposed to be a holiday, so take it easy.

[johndmf]

I don't think I've got any choice to specify whether the Vigo or Fortuner is petrol or diesel. On the websites it says they are both the 2.7 litre versions so I think they are the petrol versions. I suppose most people who are renting just look at the model of car rather than whether they are petrol or deisel. Is the only difference between the petrol and diesel versions the km per litre they do and the cost of the diesel against the petrol?

You can continue straight on west by the Mekong river at Chiang Khan and you can go passed Na Haew and up into Uttaradit and Nan. Roads are small but decent -> Chieng Khan - 2195 and 1268 to and pass Na Haew -> 1123 -> 1241. I liked that trip, nice is September when nature is lush and green

That looks an interesting trip. Is there anywhere to stop off overnight on the way or would we need to get from Chiang Khan to Nan in a day?

I've travelled extensively and have yet to visit a place where 4x4 is needed. No doubt if you are super adventurous there would be places but I wonder if that's what you are looking for.

What's making me go for the Vigo at the moment over the Honda City are people's comments about driving in the heavy rain and hitting potholes in the rain - that the Vigo has a higher clearance and driving position and would presumably cope with very heavy rain better. I've never driven a 4x4 so I wouldn't know. The sort of drives we're considering are ones like MikeyIdea has suggested and also going to some national parks and waterfalls. I guess if we do go to a hill tribe village we'd probably walk anyway. If it was the dry season I would go for the Honda City but if the Vigo is better in the rain then I think it is worth getting.

[MikeyIdea]

(MikeyIdea @ 2010-04-08 01:28:59)

You can continue straight on west by the Mekong river at Chiang Khan and you can go passed Na Haew and up into Uttaradit and Nan. Roads are small but decent -> Chieng Khan - 2195 and 1268 to and pass Na Haew -> 1123 -> 1241. I liked that trip, nice is September when nature is lush and green

That looks an interesting trip. Is there anywhere to stop off overnight on the way or would we need to get from Chiang Khan to Nan in a day?

Good questions , accommodation is a bit sparse. There's accommodation in Dan Sai and Na Haew, then it starts to get difficult. There is a national park just before you get in to Uttaradit province, it looked nice, lovely, don't know if it has accommodation but you can search on the internet, name of the national park is Phu Soi Dao. Then there is one national park called Sri Nan (just pass the Nan river and it comes) on the way to Na Noi, good accommodation of 800 bath I think it was, the national park itself is nothing special. Quite a drive to get there before 6 PM if you leave Chieng Khan at say 10 AM, it's a bit curvy Then there is one national park closer to Mae Charim, don't know the name, have never been there, must check if they have accommodation. Sorry but I don't have a map here

I really like driving the 4 digit roads close to the Lao border north from where road 1268 change name, roads are OK but it is slow going. Accommodation is sparse and far between but not totally non-existing, I suggest searching google with <village name> guest house and write down.

Lovely adventure, don't worry about the rainy season, I actually like the rainy season more than the other seasons for going up north, winter is too cold and summer is brown not not green... Too hot and everything is scorched. I just came back from a trip to Tak and Mae Hong Son with my 5 year old daughter, we slept one night in a class room in the school in the Karen village Baan Mae Ramung high up in the mountains, no electricity after the batteries went flat, great adventure. That's what my daughter liked the most with the whole trip

Go adventure go, the kids love it

[Digitalbanana]

Having seen some of the Thais sitting in the back of the trucks we decided to have a ride in the back for a little bit and the kids absolutely loved it, so that's actually a plus point for the double cab Vigo!

Even though Thais get away with, I'm sure this is illegal on public roads, despite being highly unsafe?

[SantiSuk]

Definitely buy your maps in Thailand. You seem like an explorer and are visiting home-stays, so you need a largeish scale. Buy the Think Net Regional maps at 120 baht each (£2.25) - available at all good book stores and department stores (probably at the airports). Scale of 1:550,000 - you can get slightly larger scale but you would then be buying a book of all Thailand for more like 500bht. You will need Northern Thailand, Central Thailand (if you are going down to Bangkok and beyond) and North Eastern Thailand.

I made the mistake of going to the specialist map book store, Stanfords, in Covent Garden before I first came to Thailand. The selection was rubbish on scale and very expensive.

Post script - my shot at driving hints on an earlier forum (albeit talking about smaller roads in Isaan) was as follows:

As long as you are well briefed on the idiosyncrasies of Thailand driving you should have no worries. My tips would be:

* Don't drive too fast - on roads going through villages slow down to 50 kph - dogs, children and assorted farm animals will assail you. Same applies to rural roads where there is farm traffic, pedestrians or motorcycles.

* On fast dual carriageway roads (well you are a Brit so you understand that curiously old fashioned description) you can safely drive at 140kph but keep 100 or 200 baht available for the BIB (boys in brown = cops). They hide on the fastest and safest stretches of roads to collect money. Unless you are in a hurry best to treat 110 kph as tops.

* At dusk (particularly dangerous) and after dark be very careful not to run into unlit farm tractor trailers - a meccano-like contraption that struggles along at 5mph and crazily are permitted to not have lights (so they never do).

* When approaching motorcycles expect them to swing out violently with no warning because of some pothole in the road. If you are on a smaller road or potholed road it makes sense to honk as you approach

* A single short honk on a horn is polite in Thailand to tell someone of your approach. Long angry blasts are not (but oh how I long to use them all the time!). Use the short bip on the horn a lot.

* When approaching dogs adjust your speed to be able to stop if necessary. They are stupid and untrained and will dart across the road or stop midstream or suddenly turn back into the road when you think they are walking off the tarmac. I have killed two in 3 years here - one before I knew these rules (i.e. my fault - I was driving at 80 kph on a four lane road but through a small town; had I been at 60 the dog would have lived) and one last night which I could do nothing about. It suddenly appeared in the headlights and froze. I was not about to swerve and risk all my Thai family of 11!

* On no account swerve for an animal. Thais expect their animals to get killed. They must do - I see them laugh when their own dogs chase out into the road to bark at vehicles. Sorry - I am very jaundiced after last night's experience.

* Cows are tethered by the road, but often their leads are long enough to allow them to get into the centre of the road and they are taken care of by half-wits who will beat one that does, thus causing all the others to break away into the road. Give cows a very careful watch on approach and a wide berth or slow to a crawl.

* Elephants don't have lights either. I've seen a few of those being ridden along Isaan roads

* When overtaking at speed, watch the car you are about to overtake carefully - if it is old and is moving toward the centre of the road it is possibly about to turn right in front of you and has no indicator signals working or will use them at the very last minute. If in any doubt give them a long blast on the horn (b*gger protocol!) and a long headlight flash or slow down to overtake with great care.

* Do not expect Thais to use indicators well before any maneuver (or at all)

* As already said Thais use the headlight main beam to signal - 'get out of the way I am not going to stop'

* Get over the fact that Thais are incredibly rude and sometimes aggressive when in their cars (less so on the aggression in Ubon province, but Bangkok??!!) - you will be amazed at the myth of the smiley Thai when you see their driving. They will drive you insane if you cannot control your induced road rage!

* Be your normal polite British driver and have a laugh at the incredulity shown on Thai driver's faces when you stop to let them in or the look of utter disbelief on a pedestrian's face if you stop at a pedestrian crossing (why do they waste the paint?). Actually I think the look is tinged with scepticism that says 'you are going to rev up and run me over aren't you if I put a foot onto this crossing'

* Concentrate, concentrate, concentrate

Driving, believe it or not, is actually good fun in Thailand - because of all the very obstacles I have described. After a long safe trip you can congratulate yourself on a job well done.

[khunstuart]

I have driven all over thailand in the last 15 years with my family, I now own a fortuner and for long distances and comfort i would recomend that any day. But if you are on a budget i would go for the next level up from a Jazz or something that size as they are in all hovesty two small for a family to travel in. Personally the pick up trucks such as vigo's have very uncomfortable back seats as well. A mid range toyota, or Honda car such as a Soluna may be ok for you, there ar a few models and makes that sort of size to choose from. In all my time here i have never needed a four wheel drive to get to parks etc even in the rainy season, so dont worry about that, most main roads here are in pretty good shape (its the drivers you need need to look out for) all joking apart drive carefully, small motorcycles here do not look where they are going and cars often change lane without any indication, leave a reasonable gap, somone will fill it etc, be patient dont get angry as that will make things worse, people drive a bit slower in the north east etc and there is less traffic so its not so daunting, Bangkok and Pattay and most tourist areas are different story though you need to really watch out. Get a good map or set of maps and study before you leave sighn posting is in thai and english on most major routes as well, One other thing, if your not booking hotels etc in advance and are just winging it ,get a lonley planet guide or something similar when i first started started travelling here, it was a great help in finding decent places to stay and where to go eat etc in towns i had never been too before.

Enjoy the trip i am sure you will

[Deeral]

Maps - you will without doubt have problems with maps - they will have roads that don't exist, wrong numberings and won't have some roads that do exist.

however it's all part of the adventure......and turning round and driving 30 km back the way you came to get back on the main road.

[MikeyIdea]

Driving, believe it or not, is actually good fun in Thailand

Totally agree, it is very fun, I love it and my daughter loves it

Even though Thais get away with, I'm sure this is illegal on public roads, despite being highly unsafe?

Nope, it's not illegal, and it's fun

Maps:

Must buy in Thailand -> agree. Maps are generally bad, many of the small roads (that we adventurers look for) aren't even on the map. Don't buy a book over the whole country, buy one overall map and then a few regional maps (7 provinces in the north, that kind of stuff) or provincial maps. It is so difficult to find good maps in Thailand...

4 wheel drive - never ever needed one after nearly 20 years in Thailand, driving almost everywhere. Oh, not true, I got stuck and couldn't come up from the bungalow on the wet grass at Sri Nan national park a few yesrs ago. OK, that's the only time. 4 wheel drive would be a nice-to-have on my list, if money allows and I wouldn't sacrifice anything else to get it

Have a wonderful adventure with the kids

[Deeral]

Illegal or not travelling in the back of a pickup - open or enclosed is extremely reckless. Hopefully the OP will get one with a lid and keep it locked.

It may also be "fun" but the possible consequences are anything but........Thailand is in the world top ten of road deaths and emulating the behaviour of native road users is not advisable.

[MikeyIdea]

It has just been Songkran and I have taken my 5 year old daughter out on the motor cycle playing every day, in Bangkok, without a helmet both of us. It is an enormous responsibility that weighs heavily on me, I do it as carefully and safe as I possibly can, and I do it for my daughter because I love her. It would have been much easier not to do it.

I am sure that the OP is thinking in the same terms as I do

Have I been in Thailand for too long?

[Deeral]

Getting a bit off topic here - again -

THere is a lot of "peer pressure" to emulate the locals especially in short-term situations.....however I would consider of some of the factors and consequences involved.

Unfortunately people do not seem to be very good at assessing risk - the perception of risk is not always obvious and is surrounded by myth and misconception.

A group of people driving around town in a pickup at about 3 kph is hardly hight risk....however cruising there on the highway is,

One has to think what would happen if things go wrong - a serious accident, well we all know what would ensue....

However it is far more likely that there would be no collision as such but you might just have to brake suddenly - this would mean the pickup slows rapidly - the folks in the back will not - with nothing holding them in place, they continue at the original speed until they hit something that will stop them - e.g. the bulkhead , rear window, or person in front of them - the injuries from this will be SERIOUS.

As for not wearing a crash hat - .......

imagine if you are standing near me and I walk past with a limp-hammer over my shoulder I turn and it accidentally hits you on the head - this is enough to crack your skull - and involves speeds of walking pace - helmets are no protection against direct hits or high speed - but it has beed proven again and again that they will protect against "glancing" blows to head and these are the most common cause of fatalities because they an occur at ANY speed on a motorbike.