Thai Drivers & How To Stay Alive Here.

[GungaDin]

I found this pearl from Longball53098 in another section, I think it's worth repeating here. (With his permission)

Quote:

"Here is the answer. ALWAYS, ALWAYS be alert! You cannot have a lapse for a moment and try to use the techniques you were trained with in you're home country. You must be alert here at all times and expect the

unexpected. Thai drivers whether it's on a bicycle, motorbike, auto, truck or any other conveyance will do what ever they want when they want. There is no real training/education here for walker's/riders or driver's.

They learned all their habits (good & bad) from who ever was showing them and in many cases they just learned by sitting/standing on the family motorbike or car when they were babies. So it's all ingrained from birth

.

Many Thais grow up in the country and it was okay to do whatever you wanted to do as it affected no one and they bring that to the village and city and never change.

We as a brainwashed farang from wherever have had the benefit of some type of educational system and then were subjected to rules and enforcement of those rules and penalties if you don't follow the rules.

These two types of driver's don't mesh together. Thai driver's are not going to change until they are subjected to the same kinds of training and education and enforcement we have endured all our lives in our home

countries. This education will take generations to change.

Bottom line is if you are going to drive here ,,,,,STAY ALERT ! Keep your eyes moving in all directions and never forget a driver/walker car/bike/moto/or whatever can appear from any direction at any time."

End quote.-----------

Apart from staying home, any road safety ideas?

This isn't meant to be a slag-off Thai drivers topic, we all know how stupid & inconsiderate they can be.

What are your tips for staying alive here?

Around here I try to stick to the pavement as much as possible, I don't want to be the Guest of Honour at the local Wat, just yet, the alt is the 8 lane highway full of ratbags. & the Dreaded U-Turns

GD

Source: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Everytime-St...t&p=3578903

[H2oDunc]

The first thing to do is expect the unexpected at all times and then-----

1 get a louder horn than the standard one on the scooter / bike.

2 Ride with a finger hovering over the horn button and USE IT! OFTEN!

3 NEVER EVER be in a rush to get anywhere. If it takes longer so what ! its why you came here remember!

4 ride using the two finger braking or 1 finger / big toe braking method depending on the type of bike you ride. If you require more than 1 finger or toe to stop you are riding too fast. SEE RULE #3

5 WEAR A LID!!!! riding without one will cost you either a little bit of money in a fine or a shed load for a hospital bill. IT MAY ALSO SAVE YOUR LIFE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

6 ENJOY Thailand is a bikers paradise and the best way to see it is by bike!

7 If ever you see tree branches in the road BEWARE!!!! This is the Thai emergency triangle and is placed in the road to warn drivers there is a broken down vehicle ahead or workers on the road!

Edited May 10, 2010 by H2oDunc

[Bobr]

Yes, it's dangerous to drive here but the pettiness at home is worse. I did not mind it in the old days when speeders vs. the Cops was like a game, but now these radar cameras and stop light cameras are ridiculous. The stupid record keeping that only benefits insurance companies looking to increase your rates is another example of western stupidity I do not miss.

[jchfriis]

I do believe that the same rule apply here as in my home country, just even more so, where my teacher said to me when I got my bike licence:

When you go out in traffic remember that everybody else are BLIND, DEAF, probably DRUNK and OUT TO KILL YOU.

Edited May 10, 2010 by jchfriis

[mausplan]

Watch out for cars with heavy tint on the windows. Give them extra space and expect them to try to push in. The drivers are always idiots. Drivers who are visible generally behave ok

[VocalNeal]

I am not sure there is much that happens here that does not happen anywhere.

Dogs run across roads in all countries

Tractors can turn into farmyards in France, Wales or anywhere else. Here it is pickups!

OK there are not many logging trucks here so you may forget that one.

Children are still prone to chasing balls into the street.

People turn across traffic without signaling in all countries

The list goes on

If anything and it is not only here. Since all bikes now have daytime running lights(headlight), the average motorist will not be expecting a motorbike to be approaching at 100 , 120 or 140 kph. Because they normally don't.

100% concentration is the key and " Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition"

OT

That is what make riding a bike, "relaxing" in a perverse way. One cannot afford to think about anything else. That is why riding is such good therapy and recommended by Psychiatrists.

OK I'll get back to work

Hat and coat......................

[GungaDin]

7. If ever you see tree branches in the road BEWARE!!!! This is the Thai emergency triangle and is placed in the road to warn drivers there is a broken down vehicle ahead or workers on the road!

Thanks Dunc, I didn't know that.

[kevinbkk]

I'm driving here since over 10 years without accident. It's funny to see how most people driving, most of them do really need some education or at least a couple of crash test videos, telling them what a helmet or a safety belt is for. Not to mention education about driving in the right direction of the road, using lights at night and most importantly, it would be nice if someone could tell them that slow cars should drive on the left side.

I always very happy when I can go back to Germany during holiday and drive there, no hassle at all.

Edited May 10, 2010 by kevinbkk

[olivier2553]

<i>They learned all their habits (good & bad) from who ever was showing them and in many cases they just learned by sitting/standing on the family motorbike or car when they were babies. So it's all ingrained from birth</i>

That is very true.

And it's funny it is true in every country all around the world.

That's not the 20 hours of driving lessons that teach you how to drive, but the childhood sitting in your father's vehicle.

So give Thai people a brake, that's only the second generation where the vehicle (at least motorbike) are almost spread everywhere, and things are improving.

When you come to live in a country you chosen, you have to accept its own rules, even if they are not up to your standard or they do not seem the best possible.

[GungaDin]

^^^^ Just another apologist.

Let's see what you have to say when you have an accident, not your fault, and you have to buy your way out of jail.

Edited May 10, 2010 by GungaDin

[kevinbkk]

<i>They learned all their habits (good & bad) from who ever was showing them and in many cases they just learned by sitting/standing on the family motorbike or car when they were babies. So it's all ingrained from birth</i>

That is very true.

And it's funny it is true in every country all around the world.

That's not the 20 hours of driving lessons that teach you how to drive, but the childhood sitting in your father's vehicle.

So give Thai people a brake, that's only the second generation where the vehicle (at least motorbike) are almost spread everywhere, and things are improving.

When you come to live in a country you chosen, you have to accept its own rules, even if they are not up to your standard or they do not seem the best possible.

Thailand has over 100.000 traffic deads per year. Some education in regards to safe driving would certainly help to decrease the numbers. Beside that, every pickup driver carrying his child's or any person on the back of the truck while driving at high speed over the express way, should be fined with such high amounts, that he never do that again. Same for not using safety belts or leaving the kids jump around the car while driving. That's simply crazy and has nothing to do with "second generation" of vehicles, that is simply stupid what they do.

Edited May 10, 2010 by kevinbkk

[jlaaway]

I mentioned this in another thread already, I pretend to be invisible. Especially when riding a motor bike. Don't EVER assume that someone sees you. Always expect them to pull out in front of you, or cut you off.

Edited May 10, 2010 by jlaaway

[Prudent_rabbit]

Buses Stop frequently, just because he is in the outside lane doesnt mean he wont stop and disgorge his passengers as they run across two lanes of traffic to get to safety!

[dudemeister]

Buses Stop frequently, just because he is in the outside lane doesnt mean he wont stop and disgorge his passengers as they run across two lanes of traffic to get to safety!

The BIB may also, already be stopped in the outside lane, on a corner - and wave you down to stop on the outside lane!

(but that was another story in another thread).

Logging trucks? Does transporting eucalyptus sticks count?

If so plenty of that going on round our way. All far too top heavy. Almost as bad as those durian fruit laden pick-ups.

[CMX]

An important idea that goes along with "pretending to be invisible" - which I now understand means that I should drive as if "nobody can see me" - is to do what we can to be seen. BEING SEEN is not only a matter of clothing - black is a dark statement - but behavior. When I have a second, I try to recall that a driver in a car probably can see me better if I am not in his blind spot. But yes, I assume that NOBODY can see me. The intensity of attention required has even driven me from drink when I'm driving home on two wheels, an extreme measure, I admit.

Bikers new to motorbikes or new to driving in Asia might wisely start with an automatic - less to do when it is crazy.

Probably the most important safety notion is the least popular with me. Speed kills. (That is an UGLY thing to say!) Watch, and there will come from everywhere the view that by going very fast (to get ahead of traffic, to speed away from this or that) or by wearing the best mesh armor, full helmet, gloves, high boots, the fall won't damage one as much from 140kms/hr as it would someone with no protection at 60 (apples and oranges - the comparison is unequal. What's it like to fall armored - or without - at 140 is a fair question). But when impacts come, higher speeds are never our friends, and at higher speeds, the best of us have less time to react. Sadly true, but with infinite permutations; I do NOT say that we all should walk and cannot know the percentages - but the principle works.

Edited May 10, 2010 by CMX

[wjmark]

I move out of the way of big fast things that come up behind me.

Even doing 120/130, there will still be a Toyota Commuter flying up behind you. And they really haul ass.

I move out of the way...

[VocalNeal]

Logging trucks? Does transporting eucalyptus sticks count?

If so plenty of that going on round our way. All far too top heavy. Almost as bad as those durian fruit laden pick-ups.

Maybe that as a bit cryptic.

In some parts of the world where they harvest small diameter tall trees the trees stick out behind the truck, maybe 8 to 10 feet or more.

When the truck makes a 90 degree turn the trees sweep the opposite way to the turn and partially block the road even after the truck has left the road.

Many accidents are caused in this way because the truck pulls into the far or turning lane preparing to turn and vehicles try to pass on the inside, the trees sweep into their vehicle. Or oncoming vehicle tries to anticipate the turn and tries to pass the back of the truck as he make the turn.

[agord]

<i>They learned all their habits (good & bad) from who ever was showing them and in many cases they just learned by sitting/standing on the family motorbike or car when they were babies. So it's all ingrained from birth</i>

That is very true.

And it's funny it is true in every country all around the world.

That's not the 20 hours of driving lessons that teach you how to drive, but the childhood sitting in your father's vehicle.

So give Thai people a brake, that's only the second generation where the vehicle (at least motorbike) are almost spread everywhere, and things are improving.

When you come to live in a country you chosen, you have to accept its own rules, even if they are not up to your standard or they do not seem the best possible.

I don't agree with this or having to accept stupidity on the roads. I shouldn't have to beep my horn to warn the numbskull pulling out that Im coming and he/she should look first before pulling into oncoming traffic. That should be common sense. What is irritating are all the illegal salongs (side car bikes) on the road they are the absolute worse offenders since their vehicle shouldn't even be on the road in the first place, can't keep up with traffic secondly, can't go up hills faster than 5 clicks leaving a long line of cars behind them since they won't pull their slow moving pc of crap over and on top of this they never seem to have working signal lights and just weave over into much faster moving traffic without so much as a look over thier shoulder? It's insane! i don't agree that we have to accept insanity as the norm. No I'm not a guest here No I'm not going to go home if I don't like it.

Yes leave one finger directly over the horn and use it often use it long and loud to wake them up.

Yes I agree also dark tinted windows are a tell tale sign of an Ahole driver. Thais have to be so polite and reserved around each other and once they get behind tinted glass it's a free for all and complete disregard for others. If you have an accidnet here it's YOUR fault and count on them to run away and turn themsleves in at their convenience. See it far too often.

[VocalNeal]

I don't agree with this or having to accept stupidity on the roads.

Sadly you had better move to a different planet or when in Rome......

[villagefarang]

If you want to stay alive, never say 'I have the right of way' or 'I shouldn't have to do this or that…'. Expect the unexpected and anticipate the most stupid actions from others. It is not about being right or wrong. It is about staying alive regardless of blame.

[thaicbr]

Be as visible as possible, especially at night. i've had a few accidents here in Thailand.

And the last one was a pickup pulling out in front of me ' i didnt see you' was what he said. if you travel in a car then all headlights look the same, white light.

My advice is to get some extra lighting either flashing leds or yellow spots and use them. my bike now looks like an x-mas tree but boy do they wake up when i flik on the yellow spots. You actually see them look in the rear view mirror for probably the 1st time in their driving life.

[CMX]

Say, what is truly legal in terms of flashing or attention getting lights - fore, aft, and sideways???

[thaicbr]

Say, what is truly legal in terms of flashing or attention getting lights - fore, aft, and sideways???

CMX. you do make me chuckle sometimes . Its Thailand, whats illegal. what ever the BIB makes up

White light at the front. red light at rear. DO NOT use the combo red/blue or red at the front. Mine was fitted by an ex bib turned mech. with a copper watching he said ' sua(beautiful) where you buy'

Gotta love Thailand

Ps i do have them switched just in case. and if i see a check point i'll turn off (see underlined statement above)

[JSixpack]

Great advice here. I can add: always wear gloves, a jacket (motorcycle jacket or at least jeans jacket), sturdy shoes (boots or hiking boots, never sandals), and at least jeans. True, denim shreds quickly, but that's just so much less skin shredded.

I always wince seeing idiots wearing no shirt, shorts, and sandals. And have seen a number of them bloodied on the streets and hobbling in hospital clinics.

Next: avoid getting around farang drivers, esp. the motorbike drivers. Most of them are worse drivers than most Thais. The AVERAGE Thai driver (not talking about the homicidal maniac) has a certain predictability, believe it or not, that the farangs don't have. Get ahead of them or let them get well ahead of you.

[sevenhills]

<i>They learned all their habits (good & bad) from who ever was showing them and in many cases they just learned by sitting/standing on the family motorbike or car when they were babies. So it's all ingrained from birth</i>

That is very true.

And it's funny it is true in every country all around the world.

That's not the 20 hours of driving lessons that teach you how to drive, but the childhood sitting in your father's vehicle.

So give Thai people a brake, that's only the second generation where the vehicle (at least motorbike) are almost spread everywhere, and things are improving.

When you come to live in a country you chosen, you have to accept its own rules, even if they are not up to your standard or they do not seem the best possible.

I don't agree with this or having to accept stupidity on the roads. I shouldn't have to beep my horn to warn the numbskull pulling out that Im coming and he/she should look first before pulling into oncoming traffic. That should be common sense. What is irritating are all the illegal salongs (side car bikes) on the road they are the absolute worse offenders since their vehicle shouldn't even be on the road in the first place, can't keep up with traffic secondly, can't go up hills faster than 5 clicks leaving a long line of cars behind them since they won't pull their slow moving pc of crap over and on top of this they never seem to have working signal lights and just weave over into much faster moving traffic without so much as a look over thier shoulder? It's insane! i don't agree that we have to accept insanity as the norm. No I'm not a guest here No I'm not going to go home if I don't like it.

Yes leave one finger directly over the horn and use it often use it long and loud to wake them up.

Yes I agree also dark tinted windows are a tell tale sign of an Ahole driver. Thais have to be so polite and reserved around each other and once they get behind tinted glass it's a free for all and complete disregard for others. If you have an accidnet here it's YOUR fault and count on them to run away and turn themsleves in at their convenience. See it far too often.

Ha Ha Ha "That should be common sense". Not sure how long u have been here but that's something that the Thai gene pool lacks COMMON SENSE. Drive at your own risk.

[Kimera]

Great advice here. I can add: always wear gloves, a jacket (motorcycle jacket or at least jeans jacket), sturdy shoes (boots or hiking boots, never sandals), and at least jeans. True, denim shreds quickly, but that's just so much less skin shredded.

I always wince seeing idiots wearing no shirt, shorts, and sandals. And have seen a number of them bloodied on the streets and hobbling in hospital clinics.

Next: avoid getting around farang drivers, esp. the motorbike drivers. Most of them are worse drivers than most Thais. The AVERAGE Thai driver (not talking about the homicidal maniac) has a certain predictability, believe it or not, that the farangs don't have. Get ahead of them or let them get well ahead of you.

Yes wear the clothes and boots, and I find your comment on the farang motorcycle drivers interesting, I have found this myself, if you see a farang out of place ie not 2/3 out in the lane I but it down to the fact that they have never taken a m/c test in a western country, just done the Thai, ride around and dont fall off It would be interesting to have a pole of TV m/c riders I think the results would tell a story.

Mind, lets not forget on our bike we still have to stay in the m/c lane in Thai. law

[JonnyF]

Some of these are already covered but...

1. 2 fingers on the front brake at all times.

2. Assume no-one can see you, even if you know they have.

3. If you sense someone is about to do something stupid then they probably will, beep the horn and/or flash the lights.

4. No sudden movements, especially side to side but also rapid acceleration and deceleration (unless avoiding an accident - obviously).

5. Don't rely on indicators, brake lights etc. working, if they're indicating there's a good chance they're not turning and vice versa.

6. Never let a Thai think you're racing them, they'll take obscene risks not to lose face and put themselves and others in danger.

Not bashing, just observations.

[BigBikeBKK]

Probably the most important safety notion is the least popular with me. Speed kills.

Yeah, well, going slow can get you killed too when that Fortuner or Benz runs you over from behind...

Going fast means you only have to worry about what's in front of you. Works for me

[BigBikeBKK]

Mind, lets not forget on our bike we still have to stay in the m/c lane in Thai. law

Amazing some people still think this law exists...

[CMX]

BigBikeBKK

"Yeah, well, going slow can get you killed too when that Fortuner or Benz runs you over from behind.

Going fast means you only have to worry about what's in front of you. Works for me."

This actually makes some sense if I'm on a high-speed highway where we find them buzzards. Course, you are supposing that I'm not over on the bike lane with all the cast off glass. (In town, incidentally, I don't like Commuters at all.)

But a fall under the specific conditions you mention, if less likely, is more likely to be fatal.

But there was posted that video of a race and an accident (poster was Not Job, Not Joshua, Not Noah?? I forget) in which the drivers followed your principles and raced over rural curved public streets, crashed - and walked away. They could as easily have killed, and I regard their behavior a crazy absence of responsibility and deserving a huge bike-repair bill, and I hope their vehicles were not insured so as to get their attention. Terrific testimony to personal gear though.

However, I live by firm beliefs half of which are convenient rather than true, so who am I to point? If you want to believe that speed saves lives as a personal principle, and it works for you ... Good Luck with it. (Seriously) (Cause that's what it is, high speeding on public roads, luck, and we know it) (Finished now)

Edited May 10, 2010 by CMX