Khon Farang, Khon Kaek?

[Jingthing]

Yet here we are castigating the Thai people simply for using one word to refer to all caucasians, because we find it offensive. Unbelievable really.

Remember when Asians were called Orientals in the US? Asian people didn't like that. People who still use the term Oriental are considered stupid.

Right. Unbelievable really.

Words do matter. I don't know that people are castigating the Thai people though. I think you are wildly exaggerating.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080822083323AAWGCqo

Edited July 17, 2010 by Jingthing

[Johnniey]

Yeah, bit of a silly comparison. I like the way people leave their home country behind and criticise everything about Thailand, saying that any of us who don't agree with their point of view are looking at Thailand through rose-tinted glasses when this is exactly what they are doing with their home country.

I mean, I don't find the word farang offensive (and yes Tomo I know we are straying ever so slightly from the topic of the OP) but I can see it might appear a little backward to some people. But if Thailand is 20 or 30 years behind the West in being politically correct then so what? It's mainly a facade in the developed world anyway. There are still plenty of people with deep-seated prejudices, they just hide it a bit better. It wasn't so very long ago that English football fans used to throw bananas at black football players and I believe a judge in the USA had to order schools in Mississippi to stop segregation as late as 1970....

Yet here we are castigating the Thai people simply for using one word to refer to all caucasians, because we find it offensive. Unbelievable really.

Some people use the word with no ill-intent:somewhat similar to my grandmother calling all black people 'niggers' 20 years ago. Of course anyone saying that these days is rascist just like many Thai people using the word 'farang'. People who don't realise that the word, 'farang' is used in a derogatory way these days, either can't speak Thai, have just come off the boat, or live in cloud cuckoo-land.

[Chunky1]

inthepink, on 2010-07-15 19:16, said:

I would say that the word farang is analogous to foreigner in English. You could say foreign person but usually we don't. Incidentally English could be construed as being ruder than Thai. Why do we say an Englishman and a Frenchman but an Italian and a Greek? Does that mean we don't consider Italians and Greeks to be people?

good to know that i am referred to in a polite way... i am a German.

by the way, in my [not so] humble opinion i conclude that all the threads and the complaints that Thais call us westerners "Farangs" originate from insecure persons who possess a wealth of inferiority complexes and/or are whingers and whiners. personally i give a flying fart what names a Thai or any other person calls me. that of course does not apply to our staff which calls me "Sir" but perhaps in their heart of hearts they think that my appropriate name should be "winer"

I agree with you but I would also add that they cannot adjust to the fact that they are a racial minority in this country and that everything does not revolve around them.

did everything revolve around them in their home countries? a good part of Farangs live in Thailand because they wouldn't be able to make ends meet in their country of origin. but instead of accepting some trouble and perhaps even some hardship they keep on whining and complaining even when it concerns trivial things which are none of their <deleted> business. i am a member of TV since nearly 4 years and have seen countless ridiculous complaints about things which do not affect a Farang's lifestyle in Thailand. for these people not only Thai but also Indian, Arab, African and dark skin in general bashing seems to be a dire necessity as it makes them feel superior even though most of them are nothing but dirt poor à........

You nailed it Nam.

[thomo]

in any country where foreign ethnic groups are economically above average successful (because they work harder than the locals) they are considered "dogs".

Every prime minister for the past 3 decades (at least) has been Chinese Thai.

[ozzieovaseas]

Just to make another point:

There could be another explanation as to why the use of the word farang may sound offensive when used by some Thais.....

Might it be be that certain islands of Thailand attract a rather dubious quality of forieners, and hence the locals who witness to their daily antics might view them in a very DIM light?

So, when these people refer to farangs they are probably speaking from a mindset of total comtempt, if not disdain for all of us, thinking that all farangs are like the few unsavoury ones they have had to suffer. This point of comparison could be made anywhere by anyone.

To take an extreme case...If i were to think of the very placid, very likeable Asians who were university students in my home town, (OZ-country NSW) i would consider them to be the most polite and respectful people on earth...I'd do anything i could to help them.....

Compare this scenario to the pack of little Asian thugs that roam around Melbourne terrorising decent ordinary people....ive even seen reports in the media of packs of four of these little B&stards doing home invasions on eldery women who live alone..robbing them and in some cases even assaulting them. This often leaves them scarred for what little life they have left

Can't even think of words strong enough to label these little #$%^'s

Still, we expats have been brought up and educated in countries slightly more tolerant, where society aspires to a few different ideals and morals, so in that regard we have the better sense not to tar all of one nationality with the same brush.

Some Thais havent been afforded this luxury, not their fault, and not to say they are stupid or biggoted...just unfortunate that Thais are all to often taught not to question the old school mindset and its thinking.

Having said the above, i still doggedly stick to my opinion that the word farang is not rude..

Considering its so freely and widely used, and, if it were in fact such a dirty word as other posters say, i'd like to think its not possible that SO many Thais would be prepared to be so publicly rude and disrespectful on a daily basis

[Jingthing]

I said it was not a polite word. Not really the same thing as being overtly rude. Of course, the word is often used in a derogatory manner, that is a clear fact. But most any word can be used in a derogatory manner.

[kudroz]

How about the Thais donot like the Burmese, or Cambodians very much either. And the Indians in Thailand are not much better than dogs. So nothing new here move on.

in any country where foreign ethnic groups are economically above average successful (because they work harder than the locals) they are considered "dogs". fact is that the locals bark, the dogs smile and... cash in.

I agree with Naam. We don't agree often, but this time we do

[inthepink]

Yeah, bit of a silly comparison. I like the way people leave their home country behind and criticise everything about Thailand, saying that any of us who don't agree with their point of view are looking at Thailand through rose-tinted glasses when this is exactly what they are doing with their home country.

I mean, I don't find the word farang offensive (and yes Tomo I know we are straying ever so slightly from the topic of the OP) but I can see it might appear a little backward to some people. But if Thailand is 20 or 30 years behind the West in being politically correct then so what? It's mainly a facade in the developed world anyway. There are still plenty of people with deep-seated prejudices, they just hide it a bit better. It wasn't so very long ago that English football fans used to throw bananas at black football players and I believe a judge in the USA had to order schools in Mississippi to stop segregation as late as 1970....

Yet here we are castigating the Thai people simply for using one word to refer to all caucasians, because we find it offensive. Unbelievable really.

Some people use the word with no ill-intent:somewhat similar to my grandmother calling all black people 'niggers' 20 years ago. Of course anyone saying that these days is rascist just like many Thai people using the word 'farang'. People who don't realise that the word, 'farang' is used in a derogatory way these days, either can't speak Thai, have just come off the boat, or live in cloud cuckoo-land.

It can be used in a derogatory way. It isn't a derogatory word, not as far as the Thai people I know think anyway. I speak pretty good Thai, have lived here for a few years, but I am not sure if the province I live in is in cloud cuckoo land or not!

It isn't impolite it's merely informal.

[kudroz]

in any country where foreign ethnic groups are economically above average successful (because they work harder than the locals) they are considered "dogs". fact is that the locals bark, the dogs smile and... cash in.

Nonsense.

Look at Chinatown.

Or the Japanese on mid-Sukhumvit.

Both of these ethnic groups are as you described yet both are looked up to, and almost revered by the Thais.

If a Thai woman was able to snag a Chinese or Japanese husband here, the fact would almost certainly be brought up by her parents at every possible opportunity.

I agree. All Chinese, Japanese, Koreans are looked upon as Gods and afforded the utmost respect and referred to as Kon Jean, Look Kha poochai, pooying etc etc. Yet in every situation, westeners are always referred to as the ubiquitous farang/falang. Farangs are never seen as nor referred to as customers, people, man, woman, boy, girl , they are just farang. Even right in front of you all Thais when speaking to each other will refer to you , the westener, as the farang . It's just plain rude and ignorant and hypocrytical.

I know, it's ridiculous. But remember we are in Thailand. Most of them are uneducated, ignorants and not civilized. Don't get too offended - they're just Thais. Just call them Meung ban nok (hillbillies) smile and laugh.

[inthepink]

Yet here we are castigating the Thai people simply for using one word to refer to all caucasians, because we find it offensive. Unbelievable really.

Remember when Asians were called Orientals in the US? Asian people didn't like that. People who still use the term Oriental are considered stupid.

Right. Unbelievable really.

Words do matter. I don't know that people are castigating the Thai people though. I think you are wildly exaggerating.

http://answers.yahoo...22083323AAWGCqo

I don't think it's worth my time debating anything with you any further as when you hear something you don't like, you simply accuse me of lying.

[ozzieovaseas]

Yet here we are castigating the Thai people simply for using one word to refer to all caucasians, because we find it offensive. Unbelievable really.

Remember when Asians were called Orientals in the US? Asian people didn't like that. People who still use the term Oriental are considered stupid.

Right. Unbelievable really.

Words do matter. I don't know that people are castigating the Thai people though. I think you are wildly exaggerating.

http://answers.yahoo...22083323AAWGCqo

I don't think it's worth my time debating anything with you any further as when you hear something you don't like, you simply accuse me of lying.

Well there are those of us who do appreciate your time...and watching the debate.

Jingting....if true to form....will soon produce a wikapedia referance as to the meaning of the word "castigate" and also explain the differance between lying and wildly exaggerating..

but then again maybe he wont, and my crystal ball has run out of batteries

[Jingthing]

Yet here we are castigating the Thai people simply for using one word to refer to all caucasians, because we find it offensive. Unbelievable really.

Remember when Asians were called Orientals in the US? Asian people didn't like that. People who still use the term Oriental are considered stupid.

Right. Unbelievable really.

Words do matter. I don't know that people are castigating the Thai people though. I think you are wildly exaggerating.

http://answers.yahoo...22083323AAWGCqo

I don't think it's worth my time debating anything with you any further as when you hear something you don't like, you simply accuse me of lying.

Fine with me, mate, as clearly I never accused you of lying. No wiki needed. Just common sense and reading skills. Cheers and goodbye!

Edited July 18, 2010 by Jingthing

[inthepink]

Castigate = to criticise or reprimand severely. I'd say that calling them ignorant, racist and uneducated was pretty severe criticism.

[Jingthing]

I don't think we are talking about the same thing. What a pain.

[inthepink]

Yet here we are castigating the Thai people simply for using one word to refer to all caucasians, because we find it offensive. Unbelievable really.

Remember when Asians were called Orientals in the US? Asian people didn't like that. People who still use the term Oriental are considered stupid.

Right. Unbelievable really.

Words do matter. I don't know that people are castigating the Thai people though. I think you are wildly exaggerating.

http://answers.yahoo...22083323AAWGCqo

I don't think it's worth my time debating anything with you any further as when you hear something you don't like, you simply accuse me of lying.

Fine with me, mate, as clearly I never accused you of lying. No wiki needed. Just common sense and reading skills. Cheers and goodbye!

So when you said you didn't believe me, (post #49) that wasn't calling me a liar then? I've come across many people like you who, when they have nowhere to go in an argument, resort to insults.

I said the hi-so Thai people I knew did not think farang was a rude word. So which part of that don't you believe? Whichever part it is, you are clearly intimating that I am not telling the truth.

From your comment about asking a random hi-so Thai I would guess that you are one of these people labouring under the misapprehension that anyone with a bit of money and a nice car is a hi-so.

Edited July 18, 2010 by inthepink

[Jingthing]

We were talking about different posts. You created this confusion by not being clear about what you were talking about, not me. I assumed you were talking about a much more recent post. You expect people to read your mind?

On that note, yes I do think you were telling porkies about your knowledge of hiso Thais. People can put on all kinds of airs here, don't you know?

Edited July 18, 2010 by Jingthing

[inthepink]

I didn't make a reference to any particular post. It seems you are the one who has problems with his reading skills. I said here "we" are castigating the Thai people for their use of the word farang.

With your lack of manners I find it highly unlikely that you know any high society Thai people whatsoever, so stop claiming you know how they think.

EDIT: aah, so now you change your tune and admit to calling me a liar. I have nothing to prove to you and certainly wouldn't start making things up just to try and win an argument on an internet forum.

I didn't claim to have "knowledge of hiso Thais", I stated that some of them were friends of mine and those ones do not consider the word farang to be rude.

Edited July 18, 2010 by inthepink

[Jingthing]

I didn't make a reference to any particular post. It seems you are the one who has problems with his reading skills. I said here "we" are castigating the Thai people for their use of the word farang.

With your lack of manners I find it highly unlikely that you know any high society Thai people whatsoever, so stop claiming you know how they think.

I thought you said you were finished debating with me. You had me fooled for a minute there, Mr. Hiso.

[thaifkrlim]

you can all put the blame on the french failed invasion in Indo-China particularly cambodge for making its inhabitants generalise every evil looking european as "barang" and bastardised thai version "farang"

[inthepink]

I didn't make a reference to any particular post. It seems you are the one who has problems with his reading skills. I said here "we" are castigating the Thai people for their use of the word farang.

With your lack of manners I find it highly unlikely that you know any high society Thai people whatsoever, so stop claiming you know how they think.

I thought you said you were finished debating with me. You had me fooled for a minute there, Mr. Hiso.

I said I didn't have time. I've cleared my diary for you though.

You've said goodbye to me twice and you're still here making incoherent posts...

Also, I said I have some hiso friends, not that I am hiso. Maybe you should learn English properly before you start making judgements on the Thai language

[ozzieovaseas]

I thought anyone that does'nt ride a baht bus was high society

[lazygourmet]

Being half Belgian/half Indonesian, nobody ever called me farang...

My skin completion makes Thai people think that I am a Luk kreung coming for the South, especially regarding the fact that I am speaking the dialect and understand Yawi, which is simlar to Bahasa Indonesia

[thomo]

Looks like a poo-fest.

Little did I know the topic would get like this.

[Kilgore Trout]

by definition, "falang" does not, never has, and never will be synonomous with "foreigner."

It means WHITE foreigner. Who cares if they do not use the most polite term as long as they are not insulting us?

I suppose you are right, I feel the same way about black people; shame on them for being offended when I call them ni$%ers!

Do you really think that the term "farang" is anything like calling black people people n_____s?   

Yes, I do. And if you understood Thai well you would see that it is in many cases used the same way; sometimes it is used in a less negative tone; such as my friends dad in Kentucky referring to a type of chocalate as "nig$er toes."

[Jingthing]

Looks like a poo-fest.

Little did I know the topic would get like this.

You must be a new farang in the barrio ...

[Ulysses G.]

Yes, I do. And if you understood Thai well you would see that it is in many cases used the same way

The old "My Thai is better than your Thai" argument.

Edited July 18, 2010 by Ulysses G.

[kevozman1]

I could not care what Thai people refer to me as. As a European

you can hold your head high walking any continent in the world.

Outside Thailand being a Thai means sweet fa to anybody so

when you ever feel like you are being offended by a Thai just ignore.

[skyaslimit]

I could not care what Thai people refer to me as. As a European

you can hold your head high walking any continent in the world.

Outside Thailand being a Thai means sweet fa to anybody so

when you ever feel like you are being offended by a Thai just ignore.

And how much Thai you can understand?

[kevozman1]

^Sorry I do not understand, the first part of your

sentence starts as a question then finishes with a

conclusion only to be followed by a question mark.

[sabaijai]

Flames deleted. How about staying on topic?

Moved to Thai Language subforum so the experts can sort it out