So What'S With All The Bread?!

[Birdman]

Here people like their unhealthy 7/11 sandwiches the way they are best.

[toptuan]

A city slicker phenomena.

Not really. In our university of 35,000 students (mostly from rural communities), the school food markets and local 7-11's can hardly keep enough bread goods in stock. They're the first shelves to empty.

Incidentally, the head nurse of our city government hospital tells me that the incidence of sugar diabetes is skyrocketing in local villages--mostly from a gradual change in veggies/rice diet to more sweets, sugary drinks and breads (which generally are much sweeter in Thailand than in the West).

[daoyai]

The body processes white rice the same as sugar, as people move off the farm and vigorouse farm work and into a desk job or other sedentary lifestyle the rice is not burned off, they get fat and then the type 2 sets in. It can happen with any starch.

[toptuan]

Enlightening, Daoyai. I better back off the rice, myself!

[NanLaew]

Khanom. Thailand has always had khanoms, small snacky, invariably sweetened cakes and bite-sized finger foods. They were not mass produced so were scarcer. Now 7-eleven and Family Mart have racks of the factory-produced things. In the early days, most bread products were made with tapioca flour, hence the crappy burger bread of yore. Now there's more variety and I would argue that not all local bread products are too sweet. I like the croissants that S&P makes but they are hard to get as I have seen many a Thai descend on the half dozen on the counter at any one time (baked fresh you see) and buy the bloody lot! Whilst I was doing some oil exploration earlier this year near Salaya, I found a Dunkin' Donuts factory; a 4-shophouse unit that was totally unmarked apart from the lineup of delivery pickups parked out front and the flour-dusted chefs having smoko at the side entrance.

[richardjm65]

When we lived in Bangkok (back in the 90's) there was good bread to be had at some of the better hotels and at supermarkets (such as Foodland) which had their own bakeries and knew their target market. Up country, alas, this was not the case, so ignoring the rubbish bread sold locally, we started baking our own. No flour extenders, no preservatives, no sugar, no bread improvers, but all top grade ingredients. The word spread among the local foreign community and we found we had ourselves a nice little earner. Wish we'd done this right from the beginning - it would have been interesting. Our local customers are now quite blase about being able to get hot crusty rolls, wholewheat and sesame loaves, brown rice loaves, Italian loaves, burger buns and, yes, even plain white bread still warm from the oven. Surprising, sometimes, when an opportunity suddenly pokes its head up.

[jfchandler]

Richard, how did you make brown rice bread back in that time?

I like it, prefer it....but cannot for the life of me find any brown rice flour around BKK....

I've been bringing bags back from the U.S. on my periodic trips....

The other alternative, I suppose, would be to take whole brown rice (jasmine) and grind it myself into flour... I haven't taken that step yet....

When we lived in Bangkok (back in the 90's) there was good bread to be had at some of the better hotels and at supermarkets (such as Foodland) which had their own bakeries and knew their target market. Up country, alas, this was not the case, so ignoring the rubbish bread sold locally, we started baking our own. No flour extenders, no preservatives, no sugar, no bread improvers, but all top grade ingredients. The word spread among the local foreign community and we found we had ourselves a nice little earner. Wish we'd done this right from the beginning - it would have been interesting. Our local customers are now quite blase about being able to get hot crusty rolls, wholewheat and sesame loaves, brown rice loaves, Italian loaves, burger buns and, yes, even plain white bread still warm from the oven. Surprising, sometimes, when an opportunity suddenly pokes its head up.

[JimShortz]

There is a lot more bread, but it is mainly a desert or a snack, not the main part of the meal. Even in Bangkok it is still a problem to get good bread, you have to go to specific stores to get it. The selection of bread at my local Tesco is no better than what you get at 7-11, it's awful. Way more difficult than in Cambodia, Laos, or Malaysia where you can buy good bread easily and street vendors sell awesome sandwiches.

I've just been to Tesco here in Chiang Mai this morning and to my complete amazement they are selling REAL BREAD! Not the sliced stuff with a two year shelf life, but actual fresh baked bread - white, wholemeal, rye, all sorts. I thought I'd ended up in Carrefour or Rimping by mistake, but no, it was Tesco.... wow!

[Jim's_a_Thai_Fox]

I wonder how many westerners living in Thailand who don't like not being able to eat 'good bread' used to eat typical, boring sliced loaves back home in their respecitve farangland...? Is it possibly a case of "I miss it because I know I can't have it" syndrome?

[richardjm65]

For jfchandler: We don't use brown rice flour, we use fresh cooked brown rice (drained of course) and mix that with a hard white flour in the proportion of 100gm brown rice to 400gm white flour, with 1 TBSP sesame oil, salt to taste (about 7-10gm/loaf), 1 tsp sugar to activate the 7-10gm of dried yeast dissolved in about 350ml tepid water. Bake at 180deg C for about 20 mins, remove from tin, glaze with diluted egg white, return to oven for an additional 10 mins, still at 180. That makes 1 loaf. Play around with proportions rice/flour according to taste but with too much rice, rising is affected. Time and temp depends on your oven of course. We use an electric fan-assisted job. PM me if you need more info as we've strayed into the cookery forum with this!

[daoyai]

I wonder how many westerners living in Thailand who don't like not being able to eat 'good bread' used to eat typical, boring sliced loaves back home in their respecitve farangland...? Is it possibly a case of "I miss it because I know I can't have it" syndrome?

The opposite is true for me, I find the bread I buy at Rimping in CM is far superior to what was available on Hawaii Island.

[filingaccount]

Khanom. Thailand has always had khanoms, small snacky, invariably sweetened cakes and bite-sized finger foods. They were not mass produced so were scarcer. Now 7-eleven and Family Mart have racks of the factory-produced things.

Exactly, not rocket science, just a slight twist of a country tradition of sorts.

And Thai's do eat often, not a lot, but often. This helps metabolism, and most will stay skinny even though it seems they always eat something.

There is no voodoo nor mystique nor foul play here, but of course that's boring....

And if you want "good bread", bake it yourself. It's not difficult at all. Simply add some flour, water, yeast, salt, flavorings and heat up (slight variations do occur).

[DP25]

I wonder how many westerners living in Thailand who don't like not being able to eat 'good bread' used to eat typical, boring sliced loaves back home in their respecitve farangland...? Is it possibly a case of "I miss it because I know I can't have it" syndrome?

Nope, I mainly ate tortillas, but when I ate bread it was good stuff.

[GuestHouse]

The twin evils facing the developing world are sugar and fat. Oh, and 'growth hormones', apparently. (rolleyes)

{once again, the PC fools continue to herd us over a cliff}

Maybe you've been out of circulation, because the concerns over Growth Hormones (and antibiotics) in our food are right up there in the discussion on food safety and food health.

And why not - Increased use of Growth Hormones in food production and increasing Obesity.

The US FDA with it's close links to the US Agroindustry has not been able to convince Canada and the EU to accept it's position that there are no health issues arising from the use of Growth Hormones on meat and milk production.

-----

And please can you explain what Political Correctness has to do with people being concerned over the safety of food production?

[rijb]

McDonalds, Burger King, Subway, KFC, Pizza Hut, Dominoes et al....welcome to the Western world and obesity courtesy of the good ole U.S of A and those ex-pats who come here , (Thailand), for a change of culture but cannot do without that processed crap thay ram down their fat guts everyday. USA, saviours of the world promoters of the gastric band!

No offence intended.

Should we blame the French for introducing Indochina to bread in the 50's?

MSG and flavor enhancers (leading cause for overeating) are in almost everything we eat, including "low fat" and "no fat" foods. Should we blame the Japanese?

Studies show that lack of exercise is the main contributor to obesity in 11-15 year olds. Should we blame their parents?

hel_l no! Let's blame the USA and fat expats! A "simple and EAZY" answer for "simple and EAZY" intellectuals. No offence/offense.

Edited August 7, 2010 by rijb

[GuestHouse]

The Consumer Union doesn't seem to like Growth Hormones in Food and seem concerned over the health risks - Hey but what do the Consumer Union know?... It's not like they've ever looked into the subject, or that there's any Published Research on the subject

[thepanicandthevomit]

The twin evils facing the developing world are sugar and fat. Oh, and 'growth hormones', apparently. (rolleyes)

{once again, the PC fools continue to herd us over a cliff}

Maybe you've been out of circulation, because the concerns over Growth Hormones (and antibiotics) in our food are right up there in the discussion on food safety and food health.

And why not - Increased use of Growth Hormones in food production and increasing Obesity.

The US FDA with it's close links to the US Agroindustry has not been able to convince Canada and the EU to accept it's position that there are no health issues arising from the use of Growth Hormones on meat and milk production.

-----

And please can you explain what Political Correctness has to do with people being concerned over the safety of food production?

The non-interventionist, all-people-are-wonderful-and-we-should-let-them-eat-whatever-they-want stance has led to an acceptance of gluttony; my local secondary school has a burger van and an ice cream van parked permanently outside, for instance. At the stroke of noon, hundreds of kids stream out to the nearest Sainsburys Local, to fill their increasing fats little tums with as much sugary snacks as they can. There is no will to tackle the issue for fear of being branded intolerant and controlling.

Growth hormones and anti-biotics are a concern, naturally, but the real issue here is sugar, fat and lack of exercise. We have tolerated an addiction to the former and an aversion to the latter. It's madness. We have a situation where you are not allowed to say 'fat' any more. Shock! horror! fat people don't like to be called fat, so we modify our language to prevent "offence". This leads to 'acceptance' of obesity , which is reinforced by do-gooders, those who can make money out of it, and the feckless themselves. A vicious, unbreakable cycle forms.

PC - treating children like adults and adults like children since 1980.

[GuestHouse]

Well I'd agree that Sugar, Fat add (carbohydrates, artificial additives, salt), growth hormones, antibiotics, lack of exercise) all play a part - I certainly do not think any one of these is the culprit by itself.

But I've never come across anyone being hauled into court for calling someone else fatty, and even so, name calling has no impact on the causes above.

Labeling and information on food safety might have an impact - and guess what, the US Government has fought tooth and nail to have the EU remove labeling that provides information on food concerns that the US Agroindustry would rather you not know about.

[thepanicandthevomit]

But I've never come across anyone being hauled into court for calling someone else fatty, and even so, name calling has no impact on the causes above.

Yeah? You don't know how pernicious our "law-makers" are? There's no need to look very far on that one!

Name calling is very effective: it's known as peer pressure, the single most effective tool at moderating behaviour, other than price. The price of sugar has plummeted, the levels of obesity have rocketed. Go figure.

[GuestHouse]

But I've never come across anyone being hauled into court for calling someone else fatty, and even so, name calling has no impact on the causes above.

Yeah? You don't know how pernicious our "law-makers" are? There's no need to look very far on that one!

Name calling is very effective: it's known as peer pressure, the single most effective tool at moderating behaviour, other than price. The price of sugar has plummeted, the levels of obesity have rocketed. Go figure.

That's quite claim regarding name calling - Do you have some background information/studies on that?

[thepanicandthevomit]

But I've never come across anyone being hauled into court for calling someone else fatty, and even so, name calling has no impact on the causes above.

Yeah? You don't know how pernicious our "law-makers" are? There's no need to look very far on that one!

Name calling is very effective: it's known as peer pressure, the single most effective tool at moderating behaviour, other than price. The price of sugar has plummeted, the levels of obesity have rocketed. Go figure.

That's quite claim regarding name calling - Do you have some background information/studies on that?

What, the effectiveness of peer-pressure? Are you mad?

You change behaviour through price and supply on one hand, and social acceptability on the other. Make it socially unacceptable to be fat and obesity levels will plummet (there are parallels with my smell thread here btw). Instead of the media spotlight being shone on lazy, selfish behaviour, it is placed on the dangers of eating disorders, which pale compared to the dangers of overeating. But eating disorders sell papers.

All worthy causes require their sacrificial lambs...

Edited August 7, 2010 by thepanicandthevomit