Not Happy

[andrew55]

Did I read a thread here recently with a commitment to get people through immigration departures in 20-30mins?

1hr 45 mins in queue at departure passport control today and missed flight. Bugger.

Accept my fault as they advise 3hr prior. But really? I guess so. Less than 1/3 of the booths staffed. Queue over 100m before entering the actual glassed area. Many others late and pushing in etc. Airports sure bring out the worst.

Then the infomation desk doesn't know how I get back out of the airport as departure card taken already. Information desk also can not get carrier(Jetstar) to pick up phone. They suggest I try to phone after 6.00 tonight. Don't worry about my checked bag which will nave been unloaded. Now been sitting at info desk for an hour waiting for carrier's staff to come and see me 'in about 10 mins',

Jai yen and get here early tomorrow for another try.

[Lakegeneve]

I fly in and out of the airport approx 20 times each year, I can never recollect waiting at immigration longer than 20-25 mins. On average, I wait 10 mins max. I honestly cannot imagine how you could be in a line for 1.45hrs and not ask to go to the front given your impending flight departure?

There are 2 departure immigration zones (there used to be 3 but 2 years ago the middle one was given over exclusively for VIPs and Airport Pass holders).

The immigration zones are rarely equal in the number of departing pax - usually one is packed and the other is relatively empty. (The same goes for arrivals). It used to be that I would go from one to the other depending on the airline and time of day to check which had less people. However, 6-8 months ago the AOT did something very smart (for na change) and installed monitors outside each zone showing the other zone. That way a person can check if the other immigrationzone has less people.

As a rule, the east zone is full in the early morning & late afternoon as it is closer to the TG and AK/FD (Airasia) check-in desks. The west zone is usually busier in the late evening before midnight due to the number of intercontinetal flights departing. My advice, check the monitors before entering the zone closest to your check-in counter.

Also, if you are really waiting that long in line I believe it is generally acceptable to ask the person at the front of the line or an AOT staff member if you can proceed to an immigration counter ahead of others. We have all been late for that one flight and needed the assistance and co-operation of others.

[Lakegeneve]

Here is a map of the departures level if the description above does not make sense.

The two immigration departure zones are the orange areas (west on the right side). Outside each are monitors showing live shots of the other;

Available at: http://www.bangkokai...ine.com/node/87 , which is the site I use to check if flights status.

[andrew55]

Here is a map of the departures level if the description above does not make sense.

The two immigration departure zones are the orange areas (west on the right side). Outside each are monitors showing live shots of the other;

Available at: http://www.bangkokai...ine.com/node/87 , which is the site I use to check if flights status.

Hey Lakegeneve,

Appreciate your time and effort in reply to my venting.

I have departed Swampy twice a month for the last 4 years on short international flights and have not had queue like today's.

Good point about the 2 departure areas. Even got a screen so you can see what the other 1 is like. We should keep this between us or everyone on TV will know... Today was a no win at both. Because of the delays many pax were asking to go ahead and none allowed, so I didn't even bother to ask.

Anyway, now having a San Mig. light with lemon in Silom while waiting for confirmation of flight for tomorrow am. - only to Sing. All good.

Think I might turn up early.

[andrew55]

And don't even ask about getting back out and of the airport and collecting off-loaded bag..

Apologies to the pax that were delayed because of my tardiness.

[andrew55]

Departure immigration is getting worse? Didn't think it was possible. Let me guess, the thai booths each had 2 officers and had no queue at all?

What time of day was this? I fly out Saturday at 6pm, I really don't want to have to get to the airport at 3.

Andy,

I've not had much to complain at Suv. before. Just a bad day.

I'd still suggest that if your flight is important or connecting do the 3 hour thing and follow good advice from Lakegeneve.

Good luck.

[howzat]

Two things I am sure I remember correctly;

1. Frequent visitors to Thailand and I I inlude ex pats residing here can use Fast Track on arrival. Did that ever happen. Bit like the frequent visitors channel on arrival and departure in Hong Kong.

2. A guarantee was given by AOT that Immigration on departure and on arrival was going to be a maximum about 20 minutes. Am I right.

Also what is the CIP fast track channel.

[ClockworkOranges]

I have lived in Thailand for 8 years and flown out of the country probably around 30 times. I have never ever waited more than 10 minutes going out. Coming back in the most I have waited is 20 minutes.

I just flew to the states and on arival in LA there was a monster line at immigration. Maybe 150 people in front of me and i had an hour to clear immigration, get my bag, clear customs, clear final check and THEN walk over to domestic terminal, check in and board.

I asked three different staff if i could jump the line - I showed them my ticket for my flight in an hour but they all said no. So I just walked right up to the front of the line, went under three rope barriers, and just said to the person at the front of the line that "Im sorry - Im not being an arsehol_e but i genuinely have to get a flight in an hour" and he let me jump.

Thats what you should have done realy. Walked up to the front - dont expect the officials to help - and politley beg the person at the head of the line to let you in.

[mstribling]

There was quite the line on Monday night as well. It was backed up past the VIP entrance. I was definitely thankful the Mrs. was flying with me (1 minute wait )

On the flip side, coming back in on Thursday night there was NO ONE even manning the Thai passport control. We went through the Foreign passport control. Fortunately again, Maybe 3 people in line.

As with many things in life, your experience is likely to vary.

Better luck

[chuang]

I have lived in Thailand for 8 years and flown out of the country probably around 30 times. I have never ever waited more than 10 minutes going out. Coming back in the most I have waited is 20 minutes.

I just flew to the states and on arival in LA there was a monster line at immigration. Maybe 150 people in front of me and i had an hour to clear immigration, get my bag, clear customs, clear final check and THEN walk over to domestic terminal, check in and board.

I asked three different staff if i could jump the line - I showed them my ticket for my flight in an hour but they all said no. So I just walked right up to the front of the line, went under three rope barriers, and just said to the person at the front of the line that "Im sorry - Im not being an arsehol_e but i genuinely have to get a flight in an hour" and he let me jump.

Thats what you should have done realy. Walked up to the front - dont expect the officials to help - and politley beg the person at the head of the line to let you in.

You asked the person at the front of the queue to jump...did you asked permisson from the rest of 149 persons..

[andrew55]

I have lived in Thailand for 8 years and flown out of the country probably around 30 times. I have never ever waited more than 10 minutes going out. Coming back in the most I have waited is 20 minutes.

I just flew to the states and on arival in LA there was a monster line at immigration. Maybe 150 people in front of me and i had an hour to clear immigration, get my bag, clear customs, clear final check and THEN walk over to domestic terminal, check in and board.

I asked three different staff if i could jump the line - I showed them my ticket for my flight in an hour but they all said no. So I just walked right up to the front of the line, went under three rope barriers, and just said to the person at the front of the line that "Im sorry - Im not being an arsehol_e but i genuinely have to get a flight in an hour" and he let me jump.

Thats what you should have done realy. Walked up to the front - dont expect the officials to help - and politley beg the person at the head of the line to let you in.

You asked the person at the front of the queue to jump...did you asked permisson from the rest of 149 persons..

Appreciate advice on queue jumping but just not the way my parents taught me to do things. Everyone was waiting longer than expected. To make another pax miss out because of my situation seems poor form to me. I would have trouble fibbing to the person at the front of the queue(and all behind) who'd legitimately waited that I wasn't being an 'arsehol_e'. The price of my up-bringing is that I missed my flight and you didn't yours. Still think we reap what we sow in the scheme of things.

Queued 1 hour 20 mins this morning.

At the risk of sounding pedantic, I found myself with time to jot down a few observations.

*Both departure halls appeared equally busy on physical inspection. The monitors only capture inside the glassed area of each hall. Once the halls are full the monitors aren't indicative as the overflow queue before entering is not recorded.

*Separate overflow queues outside for foreigners and Thais. Both queues busy.

*No staff dealing with queue jumpers.

*14 Thai stations of which 6 were staffed.

*14 foreigner stations of which 5-6 operating.

*Security screening after passport control were keeping up with flow.

*Amazed(dismayed) as to how many people wait all that time in the line and then need the immigration officer's pen to fill out their departure card at the desk taking the time of 3 others. Gives the officer time to phone wife, kids, mia noi, etc is the silver lining.

* 3 pax had bags unloaded this morning from my flight delaying departure. Guess they hadn't anticipated delay.

I expect to wait a longer time for procedures at some airports around the world. I allow for this. Swampy is usually 20 mins. Dare I suggest a lack of consistency being the problem? I do think that Thailand needs to do better at it's primary entry/exit point. Makes it difficult for carriers and pax alike. Make it a business( see Singapore's Changi) and charge airport taxes that allow required staffing. I'd imagine that the authority responsible could do a pretty tight forecast of peak times and ensure there are hands on deck during these periods. Not many short notice movements with aircraft(toilets excluded).

Bit nasty, but I'd love a few of the well-bred officials in star-studded uniforms with #4 phones attached to their ears to do a week or 2 labouring on a building site @ 180 baht per day so that they can compare their good fortune with that of so many of their countrymen.. Guess that's when you choose a shirt colour. No opinion implied.

I still love 'Land of Smiles - Thailand' (L.O.S.T.)

Edited January 14, 2011 by andrew55

[rixalex]

I have lived in Thailand for 8 years and flown out of the country probably around 30 times. I have never ever waited more than 10 minutes going out. Coming back in the most I have waited is 20 minutes.

I just flew to the states and on arival in LA there was a monster line at immigration. Maybe 150 people in front of me and i had an hour to clear immigration, get my bag, clear customs, clear final check and THEN walk over to domestic terminal, check in and board.

I asked three different staff if i could jump the line - I showed them my ticket for my flight in an hour but they all said no. So I just walked right up to the front of the line, went under three rope barriers, and just said to the person at the front of the line that "Im sorry - Im not being an arsehol_e but i genuinely have to get a flight in an hour" and he let me jump.

Thats what you should have done realy. Walked up to the front - dont expect the officials to help - and politley beg the person at the head of the line to let you in.

Why should officials help? I'm sure they get asked many times a day the same thing. Should they make an exception for them all, everyday?

"Everyone who is late please come to the front and jump ahead of all those who got here on time" perhaps?

[andrew55]

I have lived in Thailand for 8 years and flown out of the country probably around 30 times. I have never ever waited more than 10 minutes going out. Coming back in the most I have waited is 20 minutes.

I just flew to the states and on arival in LA there was a monster line at immigration. Maybe 150 people in front of me and i had an hour to clear immigration, get my bag, clear customs, clear final check and THEN walk over to domestic terminal, check in and board.

I asked three different staff if i could jump the line - I showed them my ticket for my flight in an hour but they all said no. So I just walked right up to the front of the line, went under three rope barriers, and just said to the person at the front of the line that "Im sorry - Im not being an arsehol_e but i genuinely have to get a flight in an hour" and he let me jump.

Thats what you should have done realy. Walked up to the front - dont expect the officials to help - and politley beg the person at the head of the line to let you in.

Why should officials help? I'm sure they get asked many times a day the same thing. Should they make an exception for them all, everyday?

"Everyone who is late please come to the front and jump ahead of all those who got here on time" perhaps?

Fair call Rixalex

[rixalex]

Fair call Rixalex

Fair call to you for being a gent, respecting other passengers and dealing with the consequences of your mistake. Wish all travellers were more like you.

[Travel2003]

I flew out from BKK (2 PM) Sunday the 2nd of january.

After 10+ years here, it was the worst ever.

The line before the actual Pass port area stretched through the entire air port, passing all the check in rows.

The ones joining the line from a check in row closer to the pass port control would jump the line by probably 2-300 persons.

No barriers before the last 10 meters before entering the actual pass port area.

It was an amazing sight.

Thank God I was early at the air port, wanted to eat something before the flight.

Noticed as soon as I was through that several flights started to become delayed.

I can only guess many of the flights were just waiting for the 1000s of Pax which were already checked in, but not arrived the gates yet.

Never ever seen such a thing anywhere in the world (including the dreaded US Immigration).

Then, when I returned the 12th of January (around 10 PM) another amazing sight waited me.

Not kidding, but when walking towards the immigrations booths, I quickly noticed it could not have been more than 15 people (travelers) there.

20 booths with Officers on duty waiting.

It took me 3 minutes to check through the immigration, which included a few kind words from the Officer as well.

It felt good to be back.

[PattayaParent]

I have lived in Thailand for 8 years and flown out of the country probably around 30 times. I have never ever waited more than 10 minutes going out. Coming back in the most I have waited is 20 minutes.

I just flew to the states and on arival in LA there was a monster line at immigration. Maybe 150 people in front of me and i had an hour to clear immigration, get my bag, clear customs, clear final check and THEN walk over to domestic terminal, check in and board.

I asked three different staff if i could jump the line - I showed them my ticket for my flight in an hour but they all said no. So I just walked right up to the front of the line, went under three rope barriers, and just said to the person at the front of the line that "Im sorry - Im not being an arsehol_e but i genuinely have to get a flight in an hour" and he let me jump.

Thats what you should have done realy. Walked up to the front - dont expect the officials to help - and politley beg the person at the head of the line to let you in.

Why should officials help? I'm sure they get asked many times a day the same thing. Should they make an exception for them all, everyday?

"Everyone who is late please come to the front and jump ahead of all those who got here on time" perhaps?

Fair call Rixalex

There is quite often ariline reps wandering the queues calling for passengers who's flights are about to leave. They know when there's delays at immigration.

Edited January 14, 2011 by PattayaParent

[PattayaParent]

[

Appreciate advice on queue jumping but just not the way my parents taught me to do things. Everyone was waiting longer than expected. To make another pax miss out because of my situation seems poor form to me. I would have trouble fibbing to the person at the front of the queue(and all behind) who'd legitimately waited that I wasn't being an 'arsehol_e'. The price of my up-bringing is that I missed my flight and you didn't yours. Still think we reap what we sow in the scheme of things.

Queued 1 hour 20 mins this morning.

At the risk of sounding pedantic, I found myself with time to jot down a few observations.

*Both departure halls appeared equally busy on physical inspection. The monitors only capture inside the glassed area of each hall. Once the halls are full the monitors aren't indicative as the overflow queue before entering is not recorded.

*Separate overflow queues outside for foreigners and Thais. Both queues busy.

*No staff dealing with queue jumpers.

*14 Thai stations of which 6 were staffed.

*14 foreigner stations of which 5-6 operating.

*Security screening after passport control were keeping up with flow.

*Amazed(dismayed) as to how many people wait all that time in the line and then need the immigration officer's pen to fill out their departure card at the desk taking the time of 3 others. Gives the officer time to phone wife, kids, mia noi, etc is the silver lining.

* 3 pax had bags unloaded this morning from my flight delaying departure. Guess they hadn't anticipated delay.

I expect to wait a longer time for procedures at some airports around the world. I allow for this. Swampy is usually 20 mins. Dare I suggest a lack of consistency being the problem? I do think that Thailand needs to do better at it's primary entry/exit point. Makes it difficult for carriers and pax alike. Make it a business( see Singapore's Changi) and charge airport taxes that allow required staffing. I'd imagine that the authority responsible could do a pretty tight forecast of peak times and ensure there are hands on deck during these periods. Not many short notice movements with aircraft(toilets excluded).

Bit nasty, but I'd love a few of the well-bred officials in star-studded uniforms with #4 phones attached to their ears to do a week or 2 labouring on a building site @ 180 baht per day so that they can compare their good fortune with that of so many of their countrymen.. Guess that's when you choose a shirt colour. No opinion implied.

I still love 'Land of Smiles - Thailand' (L.O.S.T.)

A couple of observations.

The poster wasn't fibbing that he would miss his flight so wasn't being an arsehol_e.

The overflow queue before entering is obvious, it's out into the check-in area right next to those monitors you're looking at.

[andrew55]

[

Appreciate advice on queue jumping but just not the way my parents taught me to do things. Everyone was waiting longer than expected. To make another pax miss out because of my situation seems poor form to me. I would have trouble fibbing to the person at the front of the queue(and all behind) who'd legitimately waited that I wasn't being an 'arsehol_e'. The price of my up-bringing is that I missed my flight and you didn't yours. Still think we reap what we sow in the scheme of things.

Queued 1 hour 20 mins this morning.

At the risk of sounding pedantic, I found myself with time to jot down a few observations.

*Both departure halls appeared equally busy on physical inspection. The monitors only capture inside the glassed area of each hall. Once the halls are full the monitors aren't indicative as the overflow queue before entering is not recorded.

*Separate overflow queues outside for foreigners and Thais. Both queues busy.

*No staff dealing with queue jumpers.

*14 Thai stations of which 6 were staffed.

*14 foreigner stations of which 5-6 operating.

*Security screening after passport control were keeping up with flow.

*Amazed(dismayed) as to how many people wait all that time in the line and then need the immigration officer's pen to fill out their departure card at the desk taking the time of 3 others. Gives the officer time to phone wife, kids, mia noi, etc is the silver lining.

* 3 pax had bags unloaded this morning from my flight delaying departure. Guess they hadn't anticipated delay.

I expect to wait a longer time for procedures at some airports around the world. I allow for this. Swampy is usually 20 mins. Dare I suggest a lack of consistency being the problem? I do think that Thailand needs to do better at it's primary entry/exit point. Makes it difficult for carriers and pax alike. Make it a business( see Singapore's Changi) and charge airport taxes that allow required staffing. I'd imagine that the authority responsible could do a pretty tight forecast of peak times and ensure there are hands on deck during these periods. Not many short notice movements with aircraft(toilets excluded).

Bit nasty, but I'd love a few of the well-bred officials in star-studded uniforms with #4 phones attached to their ears to do a week or 2 labouring on a building site @ 180 baht per day so that they can compare their good fortune with that of so many of their countrymen.. Guess that's when you choose a shirt colour. No opinion implied.

I still love 'Land of Smiles - Thailand' (L.O.S.T.)

A couple of observations.

The poster wasn't fibbing that he would miss his flight so wasn't being an arsehol_e.

The overflow queue before entering is obvious, it's out into the check-in area right next to those monitors you're looking at.

Thanks for your obs PattayaParent.

I wasn't suggesting that the poster was fibbing about missing their flight. Was trying to say I would feel that I was being an 'arsehol_e' to queue jump when so many pax were in the same position as me. My lack of wordcraft. Sorry.

Yes the overflow queue is obvious.

Didn't see any reps calling pax for imminent flights. May have been that the task would have been too difficult as so many late pax.

Edited January 14, 2011 by andrew55

[powderpuff]

There is quite often ariline reps wandering the queues calling for passengers who's flights are about to leave. They know when there's delays at immigration.

This is totally correct.

Why would a flight leave when Passengers have been issued boarding passes but can't reach their departure gates?

Is it quicker to umload the baggage compartment & remove bags or have airline staff gather up the stragglers? Something not quite right here.

[powderpuff]

The best solution would have been that check-in staff refuse to issue a boarding pass saying "You arrived too late & there is a horrendous jam at passport control."

[bangkokburning]

I went to Myanmar in June and Bali in October. Pretty much low season. Return was a breeze but I did encounter the longest lines I had ever seen on these departures as well. Took me about 30+mins to get through the line. One time I was through, but my Thai gf was held up. Thai's may have fully staffed kiosks but they seem to get put through a ringer. BTW, both my flights AirAsia.

That second departure zone might be interesting, but its a hell of a walk to the other end of the airport if departing from F6

Edited January 15, 2011 by bangkokburning

[davee58]

The best solution would have been that check-in staff refuse to issue a boarding pass saying "You arrived too late & there is a horrendous jam at passport control."

Not when the passenger has arrived on time. The airline check in staff cannot just decide to not honour the ticket.

The Best Solution would be for the Immigration officers to get their act in order, and ensure that they cause minimal delays.

1 hr 45 mins is clearly unacceptable.

I asked three different staff if i could jump the line - I showed them my ticket for my flight in an hour but they all said no. So I just walked right up to the front of the line, went under three rope barriers, and just said to the person at the front of the line that "Im sorry - Im not being an arsehol_e but i genuinely have to get a flight in an hour" and he let me jump.

Queue jumping is rude and uncivilised, I have utter contempt for people who think they are more important than those who arrived earlier and have been queuing for longer. And, yes, you were being an arsehol_e, other passengers might have missed their flight because of you.

Did I read a thread here recently with a commitment to get people through immigration departures in 20-30mins?

Less than 24 Minutes from 24th June 2010,

Suvaranbhumi Airport, together with the Immigration division, have signed a memorandum of understanding to improve the airport service quality. Starting from 24th June 2010, passengers won't have to stand in passport queues longer than 24 minutes. This will result in the passengers having more time for pre-boarding activities such as shopping and eating. Their ultimate aim is to put Suvarnabhumi in the Top Ten Best Airports in the World.

What is a "memorandum of understanding" ?

Edited January 15, 2011 by davee58

[NanLaew]

Here is a map of the departures level if the description above does not make sense.

The two immigration departure zones are the orange areas (west on the right side). Outside each are monitors showing live shots of the other;

Available at: http://www.bangkokai...ine.com/node/87 , which is the site I use to check if flights status.

I posted a few months back about the 'conga line' fiasco in the west (right-hand in the diagram) immigration hall. As a rule, regardless of what row I check in OR what gate the flight departs from, I avoid that west hall. Sure I may have to walk a few hundred meters further on either side of passport/security but beats missing planes IMHO.

Judging by the amount of officers manning the desks as reported in this thread, it appears the MOU doesn't take into account sleeping in, taking long lunches and extended tea breaks. Sounds as bad as inbound passport control at KLIA!

As far as I know, the CIP 'fast-track' lanes in and out are only accessible on certain classes on certain airlines and invariably with a special pass given out when checking in.

Point of note; my boss transited through Manila airport last Wednesday. He had a 3 hour transit between domestic and international and almost missed it. He said it was also a disaster area with long lines and what appeared to be hordes of migrant workers heading back to the mid-east after the hols. May explain why there's thousands jamming up the departures at Suvarnabhumi and bugger all coming in?!

[powderpuff]

The best solution would have been that check-in staff refuse to issue a boarding pass saying "You arrived too late & there is a horrendous jam at passport control."

Not when the passenger has arrived on time. The airline check in staff cannot just decide to not honour the ticket.

The Best Solution would be for the Immigration officers to get their act in order, and ensure that they cause minimal delays.

1 hr 45 mins is clearly unacceptable.

Then why didn't they hold the flight till all the passengers had boarded?

Monkeys _ _ football.

Edited January 15, 2011 by powderpuff

[chuang]

I think to alleviate the situation...the thai immigration should station their staff and check passport on board before touchdown....do i sound silly....

[whybother]

Then why didn't they hold the flight till all the passengers had boarded?

Monkeys _ _ football.

Sometimes passengers may check in 1.5-2 hours before the flight leaves, but only go through immigration with 30-45 minutes to spare (and that's not taking into account boarding 15 minutes before take off). Some passengers even go through immigration with enough time to spare, but then sit down for a drink or a meal and forget about the time. The flight can't wait for all the lazy idiots out there, too.

I would imagine that check in is closed to flights at about 1 hour before the flight leaves, although I'm not sure exactly when they do close check-in.

[neverdie]

Its a bit of a nightmare really because alot of people that are departing have connecting flights somewhere else, so its not just a case of missing the flight one day & coming back the next, it might actually involving losing 'domestic fares abroad', accomodation & whatever else.

Alot of airlines wont let you check in anymore than 3 hours before the flight. If its taking 2 hours to get thru immigration, given all the other stuff that needs to occur between check in and sitting on the plane, theres a very real chance your gonna miss the flight even when you are on time.

There really is no excuse for this sort of shenanigans

[mrtoad]

Its a bit of a nightmare really because alot of people that are departing have connecting flights somewhere else, so its not just a case of missing the flight one day & coming back the next, it might actually involving losing 'domestic fares abroad', accomodation & whatever else.

Alot of airlines wont let you check in anymore than 3 hours before the flight. If its taking 2 hours to get thru immigration, given all the other stuff that needs to occur between check in and sitting on the plane, theres a very real chance your gonna miss the flight even when you are on time.

There really is no excuse for this sort of shenanigans

Agreed, it is the worst departing immigration area that I have been through. For a modern airport, you would have thought they would have got this bit sorted

[neverdie]

Its just another nail in the coffin as far as im concerned.

Main problem being is they are running out of timber in the coffin to actually nails into

"hey mommy, look there goes Thailands coffin made from nails"

Edited January 15, 2011 by neverdie

[powderpuff]

Sometimes passengers may check in 1.5-2 hours before the flight leaves, but only go through immigration with 30-45 minutes to spare (and that's not taking into account boarding 15 minutes before take off). Some passengers even go through immigration with enough time to spare, but then sit down for a drink or a meal and forget about the time. The flight can't wait for all the lazy idiots out there, too.

Some of you really don't spend the 15 seconds needed to anaylze the situation.

So according to you ground staff remove all the bags from the hold & remove the bags of the no shows? I wonder how long that takes.

Budget airlines can go pound sand as far as I am concerned. Backpacker _____.

Jeez I get tired of repeating myself.

Edited January 15, 2011 by powderpuff