Cambodia Replaces Controversial Stone Tablet Near Preah Vihear Temple

[webfact]

Cambodia replaces controversial stone tablet

The Cambodian authorities have replaced a stone tablet near Preah Vihear temple on the country's northern border after its inscription angered the Thai government, local media reported Wednesday.

The original stone tablet, which was sited near the temple last month, originally read: "Here! Is the place where Thai troops invaded Cambodian territory on July 15, 2008, and withdrew at 10:30am on December 1, 2010."

The new tablet simply states: "Here! Is Cambodia."

An anonymous Cambodian army officer stationed in the area confirmed the switch.

"I heard (the placement of the sign) was ordered by Prime Minister Hun Sen," the officer told the Phnom Penh Post newspaper, which carried a photograph of the new tablet.

A senior Thai army official said last weekend that Thailand refused to accept the sign, and threatened to erect a similar tablet on the Thai side of the border if the offending message was not removed.

Tensions between the two Association of South-East Asian Nations members increased sharply after the UN cultural body UNESCO listed the 11th-century Hindu temple of Preah Vihear as a World Heritage Site for Cambodia. Thai nationalists claim the temple belongs to Thailand.

The replacement tablet comes just days after a group of Thai nationals - including ruling Democrat Party parliamentarian Panich Vikitsreth - were convicted of entering Cambodia illegally.

Five of them, including Panich, flew back to Thailand over the weekend. The two remaining Thais, including political activist Veera Somkwamkit, have yet to appear in court on spying charges, which carry a maximum 10-year term.

The Cambodian government has insisted the case would not affect relations between the two nations, and said the judicial process needed to take its natural course.

-- The Nation 2011-01-26

[geovalin]

Good move Hun Sen, this tablet was stupid! As stupid as the Yellow provocation.

Well, we still don't know who "covers" the Yellow...

[random]

brilliant

The yellows are complaining even more about this tablet

[webfact]

Cambodia replaces tablet against Thai military with tablet that says 'this is Cambodia' but PM affirms 2nd tablet has also been removed /TAN_Network

[random]

the new tablet is an expensive video display, LED. showing this

[Deez]

the new tablet is an expensive video display, LED. showing this

LMAO

[Soutpeel]

An average 4 year old child exhibits more maturity than this lot....

[jillwilliams999]

Well done Mark. Many thanks.

[MrWizard]

Can somebody tell me why this small piece of land with an old ruined small temple is worth fighting for like small children ?

I understand the importance of the temple but still... In my opinion it's a non-issue, better cooperate for making it a nice historical monument for both countries.

[Soutpeel]

Can somebody tell me why this small piece of land with an old ruined small temple is worth fighting for like small children ?

Why do children fight over sweeties..??

Same same, but different....

[webfact]

PM: Cambodia’s controversial carved stones removed

BANGKOK, Jan 26 - Thai Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva on Wednesday confirmed that Cambodia has removed two stone tablets bearing a Cambodian message accusing Thai troops of invading Cambodia's territory and laying claim on the dispute land, saying the move was considered a positive sign.

The prime minister made the statement following news report that the Cambodian troops have removed the controversial carved stone in the disputed area near the ancient Preah Vihear temple, but replaced it with a new banner which reads "Here! is Cambodia".

Mr Abhisit said he has been informed of the removal of the two tablets Wednesday afternoon, saying the issue has now ended after Cambodia responded to the Thai concern.

Regarding the case of Thai Patriots Network coordinator Veera Somkwamkid and Ratree Pipattanapaiboon accused of illegal entry to Cambodian territory and espionage, Mr Abhisit pledged his government continues to help the two Thais and awaits the court ruling on the case earlier scheduled for Feb 1.

Following the People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) 'Yellow Shirts' plan to sue the premier and his deputy Suthep Thaugsuban for allegedly losing Thai territory to Cambodia, Mr Abhisit dismissed the charge, saying he has done nothing wrong and is open to scrutiny and ready for discussion with the PAD leaders.

The Yellow Shirts earlier threatened to prolong their rally near Government House if their three demands are not met.

The movement demanded the withdrawal of Thai membership from the United Nations Education Scientific and Culture Organisation (UNESCO)'s World Heritage Committee, revoke the

2000 MoU signed with Cambodia and push Cambodian people now living in areas which they claim belong to Thailand back to their homeland.

The premier however said it depends on the protesters whether they are willing to talk with the government or not, but his government is ready to talk and to create mutual understanding with them.

Mr Abhisit asserted he will not accept the Yellow Shirt demands as this will be adverse to Thailand's well-being, but the government still wants to clarify to the PAD representatives why it has to make such a decision. (MCOT online news)

-- TNA 2011-01-26

[Soutpeel]

BANGKOK, Jan 26 - Thai Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva on Wednesday confirmed that Cambodia has removed two stone tablets bearing a Cambodian message accusing Thai troops of invading Cambodia's territory and laying claim on the dispute land, saying the move was considered a positive sign.

The prime minister made the statement following news report that the Cambodian troops have removed the controversial carved stone in the disputed area near the ancient Preah Vihear temple, but replaced it with a new banner which reads "Here! is Cambodia".

....got to give Cambodia some credit for that move

The one thing that puzzles me about about this whole fiasco is what language was the "Cambodian Message" written in....If written in Khmer, how do the Thai's know what it said....The tablet could have said "get your free Somtam here" for all they knew...

[Guest]

Could it be vaguely possible that at least one Thai is capable of reading Khymer, unlike the majority of farangs here who can't read Thai.

[Soutpeel]

Could it be vaguely possible that at least one Thai is capable of reading Khymer, unlike the majority of farangs here who can't read Thai.

:jerk:....and I suppose you can ?

Having a little joke at a farce which could be straight out of Monty Python, thats all...... wasnt meant to be taken seriously...there are medical procedures availible which could get that stick removed from your bottom you know

[SantiSuk]

Probably some red faced Thai officials have been asked by the Thai leadership today "what the eff did you say to those pesky Khmers when you told them we wanted that tablet removed" .... "Err - we asked if they would kindly replace the tablet" and they said "glad to".

Communication skills equivalent to those between me and my Thai wife no doubt

[DP25]

Could it be vaguely possible that at least one Thai is capable of reading Khymer, unlike the majority of farangs here who can't read Thai.

Yeah. Lots of Thais in that part of the country speak Khmer as their first language, they know exactly what it says.

[mikebike]

The one thing that puzzles me about about this whole fiasco is what language was the "Cambodian Message" written in....If written in Khmer, how do the Thai's know what it said....The tablet could have said "get your free Somtam here" for all they knew...

Cummon Sout. Many of the indigenous people of that region be they Thai or Khmer understand each other... To those who think the Thai's and Khmer are behaving like children about this "little piece of land" have we westerners not fought for two freakin' thousand years over a little piece of desert in the middle east?

[sabaijai]

Can somebody tell me why this small piece of land with an old ruined small temple is worth fighting for like small children ?

I understand the importance of the temple but still... In my opinion it's a non-issue, better cooperate for making it a nice historical monument for both countries.

The ownership of the temple is not disputed by either country. It's in Cambodian territory according to that ruling, which is accepted by both governments.

It is adjacent land not governed by the 1962 ICJ ruling. and which is subject to a bilateral 2000 MOU affirming a Joint Boundary Commission that is in dispute, along with other areas of the Thai-Cambodian border for which detailed mapping and boundary markers do not exist.

[Soutpeel]

have we westerners not fought for two freakin' thousand years over a little piece of desert in the middle east?

Agreed,and they are a gang of little children as well... ....not discriminating here against Thai's and Khmer's in this regard

[Soutpeel]

Can somebody tell me why this small piece of land with an old ruined small temple is worth fighting for like small children ?

I understand the importance of the temple but still... In my opinion it's a non-issue, better cooperate for making it a nice historical monument for both countries.

The ownership of the temple is not disputed by either country. Its in Cambodian territory.

It is adjacent land not governed by the 1962 ICJ ruling. and which is subject to a bilateral 2000 MOU affirming a Joint Boundary Commission that is in dispute, along with other areas of the Thai-Cambodian border for which detailed mapping and boundary markers do not exist.

If the ownership of the temple is not in dispute....why do we keep having references to Preah Vihear temple when this border dispute is taked about, it seems to me in Thai media is implying that the temple was "stolen" from Thailand.

[h90]

Can somebody tell me why this small piece of land with an old ruined small temple is worth fighting for like small children ?

I understand the importance of the temple but still... In my opinion it's a non-issue, better cooperate for making it a nice historical monument for both countries.

PAD tells it is about the maritime borders which may change also (I don't understand exactly how) and there are the gas and the oil fields. And the real game is the oil, because Hun Sen is cheaper to pay (the tea money) than the many always changing Thai politicians.

(not my opinion....I just got told that)

[random]

Can somebody tell me why this small piece of land with an old ruined small temple is worth fighting for like small children ?

I understand the importance of the temple but still... In my opinion it's a non-issue, better cooperate for making it a nice historical monument for both countries.

The ownership of the temple is not disputed by either country. Its in Cambodian territory.

It is adjacent land not governed by the 1962 ICJ ruling. and which is subject to a bilateral 2000 MOU affirming a Joint Boundary Commission that is in dispute, along with other areas of the Thai-Cambodian border for which detailed mapping and boundary markers do not exist.

Just watching TAN news and the reporter clearly stated the temple is on Thai land, it seems that thais dont believe it is in cambodia, My undestanding also was it was the land for entry to the temple in dispute, the temple is on cambodian soil but the entrance is on thai soil.

[animatic]

The theoretical line from the temple demarcation tangents straight out to sea.

Thus, by changing the degree of the angle 1/2º it adds many kilos of seafloor as the triangle of deviation widens. 20 miles out this means a LOT of potential oil drilling sights directly over the deposit get added to the THAI side...This translates to future hundreds of millions of US dollars in oil revenue profits. No doubt someone backing PAD or the other fringe groups is eying this, but not telling them, as quietly money comes forth. If you figure Abhisit is not looking at them as stake holders, then they would back, quietly, the group that most puts that issue obliquely, but loudly, on the table.

This no doubt had much to do with Hun Sens calculations for temporarily backing Thaksins play tacitly, when he thought Thaksin had a chance of taking the shooting match, when he didn't win Hun Sen went back to backing Abhisit, within the vagaries of Thai and Cambo internal politics.

Edited January 26, 2011 by animatic

[Soutpeel]

20 miles out this means a LOT of potential oil drilling sights directly over the deposit get added to the THAI side...This translates to future hundreds of millions of US dollars in oil revenue profits. No doubt someone backing PAD or the other fringe groups is eying this, but not telling them, as quietly money comes forth. If you figure Abhisit is not looking at them as stake holders, then they would back, quietly, the group that most puts that issue obliquely, but loudly, on the table.

This no doubt had much to do with Hun Sens calculations for temporarily backing Thaksins play tacitly, when he thought Thaksin had a chance of taking the shooting match, when he didn't win Hun Sen went back to backing Abhisit, within the vagaries of Thai and Cambo internal politics.

The thing is, it is still unknown what oil reserves, if any, exist in these disputed locations, Natural gas certainly...Oil ?...maybe maybe not, obviously if there is oil, the quantites, if there need to be finanically viable to recover.

The "Oil belt" in the Thai gulf runs north/south right down the middle of the gulf, starting at, (to give a geographic reference) approximately at Chumpon and finishing at +/- Surat Thai....below this....only natual gas , so even gaining an addtional 20km out to sea does not benefit anybody.

The Oil thing may be a little bit of a red herring, not saying there isnt anything there, but beleive there is a lot of rumour and speculation flying about

[DP25]

The theoretical line from the temple demarcation tangents straight out to sea.

Thus, by changing the degree of the angle 1/2º it adds many kilos of seafloor as the triangle of deviation widens. 20 miles out this means a LOT of potential oil drilling sights directly over the deposit get added to the THAI side

Preah Vihear is in north near Laos, how can it affect maritime boundaries

[dighambara]

Can somebody tell me why this small piece of land with an old ruined small temple is worth fighting for like small children ?

Why do children fight over sweeties..??

Same same, but different....

YES, this situation seems frivilous to us, but Preah Vihear was 100 miles inside Siam when the French took control. Then the French were underhanded in incorrectly drawing the map, but that would have meant nothing, if they had followed thru with their agreement to give those provinces back to Siam. Instead, they handed them over to Cambodia to win favors from the Cambodian Government.

As for language, yes, many folks in the region speak a dialect of Cambodian, but to call it Khmer is no more correct than saying Vietnamese or Thai is Khmer. Khmer words survive in all the local dialects.

An important point - Cambodian history tells the story with all the fiction of a glorious legend - how the Siamese hordes came pouring in and slaughtered them. However, Khmer was famous for its large Armies (100,000 regular soldiers) and Ayuttaya could barely field 10,000 conscripts - a little out of balance, don't you think?

Some research indicates that the Khmer Empire succumbed to the bubonic plague. So the Thai story about rebuilding Cambodia out of the ashes of the Khmer Empire actually makes more sense than the story of the field mouse trampling the elephant...

[whybother]

Can somebody tell me why this small piece of land with an old ruined small temple is worth fighting for like small children ?

Why do children fight over sweeties..??

Same same, but different....

YES, this situation seems frivilous to us, but Preah Vihear was 100 miles inside Siam when the French took control. Then the French were underhanded in incorrectly drawing the map, but that would have meant nothing, if they had followed thru with their agreement to give those provinces back to Siam. Instead, they handed them over to Cambodia to win favors from the Cambodian Government.

As for language, yes, many folks in the region speak a dialect of Cambodian, but to call it Khmer is no more correct than saying Vietnamese or Thai is Khmer. Khmer words survive in all the local dialects.

An important point - Cambodian history tells the story with all the fiction of a glorious legend - how the Siamese hordes came pouring in and slaughtered them. However, Khmer was famous for its large Armies (100,000 regular soldiers) and Ayuttaya could barely field 10,000 conscripts - a little out of balance, don't you think?

Some research indicates that the Khmer Empire succumbed to the bubonic plague. So the Thai story about rebuilding Cambodia out of the ashes of the Khmer Empire actually makes more sense than the story of the field mouse trampling the elephant...

The incorrect maps (because of not using the watershed) were in the 100's of metres, not 100 miles. The Thais gave those provinces to Cambodia (ie the French) to stop the French from thinking about taking even more.

[jayjay0]

BANGKOK, Jan 26 - Thai Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva on Wednesday confirmed that Cambodia has removed two stone tablets bearing a Cambodian message accusing Thai troops of invading Cambodia's territory and laying claim on the dispute land, saying the move was considered a positive sign.

The prime minister made the statement following news report that the Cambodian troops have removed the controversial carved stone in the disputed area near the ancient Preah Vihear temple, but replaced it with a new banner which reads "Here! is Cambodia".

....got to give Cambodia some credit for that move

The one thing that puzzles me about about this whole fiasco is what language was the "Cambodian Message" written in....If written in Khmer, how do the Thai's know what it said....The tablet could have said "get your free Somtam here" for all they knew...

You don't suppose they are as stupid as the red shirts and wrote it in English.

[jayjay0]

The theoretical line from the temple demarcation tangents straight out to sea.

Thus, by changing the degree of the angle 1/2º it adds many kilos of seafloor as the triangle of deviation widens. 20 miles out this means a LOT of potential oil drilling sights directly over the deposit get added to the THAI side

Preah Vihear is in north near Laos, how can it affect maritime boundaries

If that map is even close to accurate It would for sure make the claim for sea bed out of the question.

[DickFarang]

Could it be vaguely possible that at least one Thai is capable of reading Khymer, unlike the majority of farangs here who can't read Thai.

Yeah. Lots of Thais in that part of the country speak Khmer as their first language, they know exactly what it says.

Khmer Thai indeed do speak Khmer but do not read, nor write it, due to the educational system in Thailand and even though the Thai script seems to be derived from the Khmer script.