Road Rage In Bangkok Ends In Fatal Stabbing

[rgs2001uk]

Man Stabbed to Death in Road Rage Dispute

A row over aggressive driving in the Pracha Uthit area turned violent and ended with a man being stabbed to death.

Two cars cut each other off and collided on Pracha Uthit Road yesterday, after which the two drivers got out of their cars and fought at an intersection near the Embassy of Cambodia in Bangkok.

One of the drivers, 35 year old Kanok Bunnim, lost his temper and stabbed the other man, 63 year old Chaiwat Limpawatcharapong, and cut the back of his neck with a pocket knife that he said he carries on a regular basis.

The stabber fled the scene before turning himself in to police that evening at Wang Thonglang Police Station.

He confessed to his crime, saying that he was furious with the victim's driving.

Deputy Commander of Metropolitan Police Division 4 Police Colonel Anut Kledmanee said sudden anger was apparently the motive for this murder.

The killer was charged with murder before police granted him temporary release upon seeing that he had no intention of escaping.

The man is being detained at the Criminal Court and will be called in later for interrogation.

-- Tan Network 2011-07-19

Quote from above

"He confessed to his crime, saying that he was furious with the victim's driving."

I can relate to that and know exactly how he feels, but I dont go around stabbing people, then again I dont give a shit about face and wouldnt have felt slighted.

[jonclark]

wow a bunch of farangs complaining that Thailand doesn't have the same laws and values as farangland. same same on TV today.

they were both wrong. one guy won the fight. that's a few years max prison in Thailand if it isn't deemed self-defense. the old guy did attack first. that is probably why the 'murderer' was released.

you guys complain about this country but wait until you get into <snip> legal bind. then u will be happy u aren't in the Nazi west..

Wonder if you'd be show the same attitude if this happened to one of your family members.

"Uncle Jims dead. Well he did attack first right, ahh well never mind, sorry for your loss Aunt Sylvia" - next.

so because you are related to the guy who attacks someone over a traffic dispute your uncle's actions are ok?

if u attack someone and get killed, thats your problem, not the guy who got attacked. its called self-defense and its not punishable in a reality-based country like Thailand.

u must be one of those guys that hangs the homeowner for shooting a thief.

so murder is reasonable self defense.

Shooing a potentially armed thief who has broken into your house , is slightly different to a couple of guys having fisty cuffs in the street. But, i do accept that if a person broke into your house the homeowner can in situations be justified shooting a thief. The intention and motive is entirely the thief's and he has trespassed onto your property without your consent. As opposed to a driving dispute on a public road.

But, if you and I were to meet, an argument broke out, became more heated and we ended up scrapping. I'd be justified stabbing, shooting, killing you if you swore and punched, kicked pushed etc at me first? (Which is effectively what happened in this situation). No. I'd expect to be arrested and charged with murder or manslaughter.

PS Reality based Thailand - love the description!!

Edited July 19, 2011 by jonclark

[Lancelot]

yea...but that guy used rude words...

who wouldn't stab a pensioner in the head, neck, shoulders, ear and stomach in such circumstances??

Unless its a family member, I don't think that there is very much respect for the elderly (in any country) these days.

[vahack]

wow a bunch of farangs complaining that Thailand doesn't have the same laws and values as farangland. same same on TV today.

they were both wrong. one guy won the fight. that's a few years max prison in Thailand if it isn't deemed self-defense. the old guy did attack first. that is probably why the 'murderer' was released.

you guys complain about this country but wait until you get into <snip> legal bind. then u will be happy u aren't in the Nazi west..

Wonder if you'd be show the same attitude if this happened to one of your family members.

"Uncle Jims dead. Well he did attack first right, ahh well never mind, sorry for your loss Aunt Sylvia" - next.

so because you are related to the guy who attacks someone over a traffic dispute your uncle's actions are ok?

if u attack someone and get killed, thats your problem, not the guy who got attacked. its called self-defense and its not punishable in a reality-based country like Thailand.

u must be one of those guys that hangs the homeowner for shooting a thief.

so murder is reasonable self defense.

Shooing a potentially armed thief who has broken into your house , is slightly different to a couple of guys having fisty cuffs in the street. But, i do accept that if a person broke into your house the homeowner can in situations be justified shooting a thief. The intention and motive is entirely the thief's and he has trespassed onto your property without your consent. As opposed to a driving dispute on a public road.

But, if you and I were to meet, an argument broke out, became more heated and we ended up scrapping. I'd be justified stabbing, shooting, killing you if you swore and punched, kicked pushed etc at me first? (Which is effectively what happened in this situation). No. I'd expect to be arrested and charged with murder or manslaughter.

PS Reality based Thailand - love the description!!

lol ya i think we agree but misunderstand.

the original story said the old guy chased the insurance guy after he got cut off then crashed into him. after that the old guy jumped out and started yelling at the other guy. we dont know the real details but that is assault by most definitions. assault with the car and then verbal assault. the other driver might have felt scared or threatened and defended himself using a knife.

in that specific case, i side with the younger guy trying to defend himself and his wife.

EDIT: and regarding the house thief - you are rarely justified in shooting someone breaking into your house. for instance, a guy in florida just got put away for 25 years for shooting a thief that was in his house. the reason - he was a tenant and not house owner. however, in Thailand, you wouldn't even be put in cuffs.

Edited July 19, 2011 by vahack

[Steely Dan]

Man Stabbed to Death in Road Rage Dispute

A row over aggressive driving in the Pracha Uthit area turned violent and ended with a man being stabbed to death.

Two cars cut each other off and collided on Pracha Uthit Road yesterday, after which the two drivers got out of their cars and fought at an intersection near the Embassy of Cambodia in Bangkok.

One of the drivers, 35 year old Kanok Bunnim, lost his temper and stabbed the other man, 63 year old Chaiwat Limpawatcharapong, and cut the back of his neck with a pocket knife that he said he carries on a regular basis.

The stabber fled the scene before turning himself in to police that evening at Wang Thonglang Police Station.

He confessed to his crime, saying that he was furious with the victim's driving.

Deputy Commander of Metropolitan Police Division 4 Police Colonel Anut Kledmanee said sudden anger was apparently the motive for this murder.

The killer was charged with murder before police granted him temporary release upon seeing that he had no intention of escaping.

The man is being detained at the Criminal Court and will be called in later for interrogation.

-- Tan Network 2011-07-19

Quote from above

"He confessed to his crime, saying that he was furious with the victim's driving."

I can relate to that and know exactly how he feels, but I dont go around stabbing people, then again I dont give a shit about face and wouldnt have felt slighted.

I'm sure many of us have metaphorically wanted to murder other road users, however to have the forsight to put a lethal weapon in the car within easy reach shows a premeditated intent to use it in such circumstances, ergo it's first degree murder as far as I can see.

[midas]

wow a bunch of farangs complaining that Thailand doesn't have the same laws and values as farangland. same same on TV today.

they were both wrong. one guy won the fight. that's a few years max prison in Thailand if it isn't deemed self-defense. the old guy did attack first. that is probably why the 'murderer' was released.

you guys complain about this country but wait until you get into <snip> legal bind. then u will be happy u aren't in the Nazi west..

Wonder if you'd be show the same attitude if this happened to one of your family members.

"Uncle Jims dead. Well he did attack first right, ahh well never mind, sorry for your loss Aunt Sylvia" - next.

so because you are related to the guy who attacks someone over a traffic dispute your uncle's actions are ok?

if u attack someone and get killed, thats your problem, not the guy who got attacked. its called self-defense and its not punishable in a reality-based country like Thailand.

u must be one of those guys that hangs the homeowner for shooting a thief.

so murder is reasonable self defense.

Shooing a potentially armed thief who has broken into your house , is slightly different to a couple of guys having fisty cuffs in the street. But, i do accept that if a person broke into your house the homeowner can in situations be justified shooting a thief. The intention and motive is entirely the thief's and he has trespassed onto your property without your consent. As opposed to a driving dispute on a public road.

But, if you and I were to meet, an argument broke out, became more heated and we ended up scrapping. I'd be justified stabbing, shooting, killing you if you swore and punched, kicked pushed etc at me first? (Which is effectively what happened in this situation). No. I'd expect to be arrested and charged with murder or manslaughter.

PS Reality based Thailand - love the description!!

I remember in California in the 1990s they used to sell bumper stickers saying " dont shoot , I'll pull over "

Edited July 19, 2011 by midas

[vahack]

I'm sure many of us have metaphorically wanted to murder other road users, however to have the forsight to put a lethal weapon in the car within easy reach shows a premeditated intent to use it in such circumstances, ergo it's first degree murder as far as I can see.

i always carry a pocket knife on me. carrying one isn't premeditation of anything except having a handy tool in your pocket.

[metisdead]

No matter how you disguise it, profanity is profanity, one post removed.

[foxteen]

He murdered a person (about twice his age) in cold blood and then gets released, and now wants to say "I am sorry." Something is wrong

Amazing Thailand

[Junglejumbo]

Being released on bail is quite normal in Thailand. It doesn't mention the bail here but I'm sure that there is some.

He also surrended to police so there's no reason to think that he would run away again. He's already admitted to the crime which is important in criminal convictions and almost guarantees him a 50% reduction in the years that he'll spend inside. He also works in an office probably with no previous conviction and the crime was not pre-meditated.

I think the police have used their common sense here based on the above and resolved that there's no reason why he shouldn't be released until some short time later. This will also help him do his own work obtaining a lawyer and finances which will save the police some time and bother.

Edited July 19, 2011 by Junglejumbo

[MaiChai]

Thats just around the corner from my apartment. Scary. Just goes to show, mind your own business and keep yourself to yourself.

[arrowsdawdle]

I would suspect he was released on bail.

To be released on bail, means here (we will give you the chance to flee the country)

Well, given he is a mid-level insurance employee with a wife and kid, it was probably assumed he wasn't a flight risk, a not uncommon assessment done in most courts around the world.

NOT!

[theoldgit]

i always carry a pocket knife on me. carrying one isn't premeditation of anything except having a handy tool in your pocket.

But remembering you have a "handy tool" in your pocket when you leave your car to argue with someone, getting it out, opening it and then stabbing the victim multiple times isn't the action of a reasonable, level headed person.

[arrowsdawdle]

The obvious question here is what kind of son sits idly by and watches his father murdered? Even if the father escalated the issue, the son's presence outside the car may very well have reduced the violence to words and accusations, especially if he'd tried to restrain the father and had attempted to calm the situation. Then again, it is the Buddhist way is it not, to avoid involvement?

[arrowsdawdle]

wow a bunch of farangs complaining that Thailand doesn't have the same laws and values as farangland. same same on TV today.

they were both wrong. one guy won the fight. that's a few years max prison in Thailand if it isn't deemed self-defense. the old guy did attack first. that is probably why the 'murderer' was released.

you guys complain about this country but wait until you get into <snip> legal bind. then u will be happy u aren't in the Nazi west..

]

Wonder if you'd be show the same attitude if this happened to one of your family members.

"Uncle Jims dead. Well he did attack first right, ahh well never mind, sorry for your loss Aunt Sylvia" - next.

so because you are related to the guy who attacks someone over a traffic dispute your uncle's actions are ok?

if u attack someone and get killed, thats your problem, not the guy who got attacked. its called self-defense and its not punishable in a reality-based country like Thailand.

u must be one of those guys that hangs the homeowner for shooting a thief.

so murder is reasonable self defense.

Shooing a potentially armed thief who has broken into your house , is slightly different to a couple of guys having fisty cuffs in the street. But, i do accept that if a person broke into your house the homeowner can in situations be justified shooting a thief. The intention and motive is entirely the thief's and he has trespassed onto your property without your consent. As opposed to a driving dispute on a public road.

But, if you and I were to meet, an argument broke out, became more heated and we ended up scrapping. I'd be justified stabbing, shooting, killing you if you swore and punched, kicked pushed etc at me first? (Which is effectively what happened in this situation). No. I'd expect to be arrested and charged with murder or manslaughter.

PS Reality based Thailand - love the description!!

I remember in California in the 1990s they used to sell bumper stickers saying " dont shoot , I'll pull over "

Do you remember on San Vicente Blvd. when OJ used a 9-iron on a guy's windshield during a road rage incident? No point intended.

[Colin Yai]

i always carry a pocket knife on me. carrying one isn't premeditation of anything except having a handy tool in your pocket.

But remembering you have a "handy tool" in your pocket when you leave your car to argue with someone, getting it out, opening it and then stabbing the victim multiple times isn't the action of a reasonable, level headed person.

Who said most Thai drivers are "level headed"!

[arrowsdawdle]

wow a bunch of farangs complaining that Thailand doesn't have the same laws and values as farangland. same same on TV today.

they were both wrong. one guy won the fight. that's a few years max prison in Thailand if it isn't deemed self-defense. the old guy did attack first. that is probably why the 'murderer' was released.

you guys complain about this country but wait until you get into <snip> legal bind. then u will be happy u aren't in the Nazi west..

Wonder if you'd be show the same attitude if this happened to one of your family members.

"Uncle Jims dead. Well he did attack first right, ahh well never mind, sorry for your loss Aunt Sylvia" - next.

so because you are related to the guy who attacks someone over a traffic dispute your uncle's actions are ok?

if u attack someone and get killed, thats your problem, not the guy who got attacked. its called self-defense and its not punishable in a reality-based country like Thailand.

u must be one of those guys that hangs the homeowner for shooting a thief.

so murder is reasonable self defense.

Shooing a potentially armed thief who has broken into your house , is slightly different to a couple of guys having fisty cuffs in the street. But, i do accept that if a person broke into your house the homeowner can in situations be justified shooting a thief. The intention and motive is entirely the thief's and he has trespassed onto your property without your consent. As opposed to a driving dispute on a public road.

But, if you and I were to meet, an argument broke out, became more heated and we ended up scrapping. I'd be justified stabbing, shooting, killing you if you swore and punched, kicked pushed etc at me first? (Which is effectively what happened in this situation). No. I'd expect to be arrested and charged with murder or manslaughter.

PS Reality based Thailand - love the description!!

lol ya i think we agree but misunderstand.

the original story said the old guy chased the insurance guy after he got cut off then crashed into him. after that the old guy jumped out and started yelling at the other guy. we dont know the real details but that is assault by most definitions. assault with the car and then verbal assault. the other driver might have felt scared or threatened and defended himself using a knife.

in that specific case, i side with the younger guy trying to defend himself and his wife.

EDIT: and regarding the house thief - you are rarely justified in shooting someone breaking into your house. for instance, a guy in florida just got put away for 25 years for shooting a thief that was in his house. the reason - he was a tenant and not house owner. however, in Thailand, you wouldn't even be put in cuffs.

The Florida anecdote is incomplete therefore useless.

There are rules of engagement for citizens and law enforcement officers alike in North America that can be summarized to say that you may be in legal trouble trying to justify why you shot a person that was trying to get away, as in shot in the back, lying on the floor, or going out a door or window. Use of deadly force is reserved as a last resort in self-defense situations under the law. When it's necessary to apply deadly force, it is advisable as outlined in law enforcement training to release two rounds in quick succession since the target experiences physiological shock about 1.5 seconds after the first round impact, desensitizing the anatomy to subsequent rounds. Unless of course the wise decision has been made to use .45 caliber equipment that rarely leaves a target standing even when hit in an extremity. TMI, sorry.

[vahack]

i always carry a pocket knife on me. carrying one isn't premeditation of anything except having a handy tool in your pocket.

But remembering you have a "handy tool" in your pocket when you leave your car to argue with someone, getting it out, opening it and then stabbing the victim multiple times isn't the action of a reasonable, level headed person.

lol ya some guy actually sucker punched me in a nightclub a few months ago. i pinned him against the wall and started pounding his face. it didn't trigger in my mind that i should pull my knife. the police that responded probably wouldn't have been laughing about the farang that kicked the drunk dude's ass.

The Florida anecdote is incomplete therefore useless.

There are rules of engagement for citizens and law enforcement officers alike in North America that can be summarized to say that you may be in legal trouble trying to justify why you shot a person that was trying to get away, as in shot in the back, lying on the floor, or going out a door or window. Use of deadly force is reserved as a last resort in self-defense situations under the law. When it's necessary to apply deadly force, it is advisable as outlined in law enforcement training to release two rounds in quick succession since the target experiences physiological shock about 1.5 seconds after the first round impact, desensitizing the anatomy to subsequent rounds. Unless of course the wise decision has been made to use .45 caliber equipment that rarely leaves a target standing even when hit in an extremity. TMI, sorry.

good infos. i remember a movie last year about a guy who shot a thief in the back on the way out of the house. he did time.

[lennois]

"the original story said the old guy chased the insurance guy after he got cut off then crashed into him. after that the old guy jumped out and started yelling at the other guy"

Err no, it doesn't say that at all actually.

You have made multiple assumptions based on the fact the old guy was angry. You think the other guy wasn't angry too? Sure sounds like it seeing as he pulled out his pocket knife and stabbed the old fella to death...

Edited July 19, 2011 by lennois

[zabaleta]

this is another example of why you should always walk away from an argument with a local....they really just don't know when too stop...

nutters in my opinion.

[gtm2k]

The murderer was released.

Cant be bothered reading anymore.

Enough said; I thnk.

no driving around pracha-uthit anymore...

[DiamondKing]

i always carry a pocket knife on me. carrying one isn't premeditation of anything except having a handy tool in your pocket.

But remembering you have a "handy tool" in your pocket when you leave your car to argue with someone, getting it out, opening it and then stabbing the victim multiple times isn't the action of a reasonable, level headed person.

lol ya some guy actually sucker punched me in a nightclub a few months ago. i pinned him against the wall and started pounding his face. it didn't trigger in my mind that i should pull my knife. the police that responded probably wouldn't have been laughing about the farang that kicked the drunk dude's ass.

The Florida anecdote is incomplete therefore useless.

There are rules of engagement for citizens and law enforcement officers alike in North America that can be summarized to say that you may be in legal trouble trying to justify why you shot a person that was trying to get away, as in shot in the back, lying on the floor, or going out a door or window. Use of deadly force is reserved as a last resort in self-defense situations under the law. When it's necessary to apply deadly force, it is advisable as outlined in law enforcement training to release two rounds in quick succession since the target experiences physiological shock about 1.5 seconds after the first round impact, desensitizing the anatomy to subsequent rounds. Unless of course the wise decision has been made to use .45 caliber equipment that rarely leaves a target standing even when hit in an extremity. TMI, sorry.

good infos. i remember a movie last year about a guy who shot a thief in the back on the way out of the house. he did time.

After reading your posts you seem like a class act

[hehehoho]

Terrible story, but one that sounds almost stereotypical of life here.

Poor, aggressive driving.

Lack of self control.

Violent murder, presumably due to 'snapping' when confronted.

Charged with murder and released the same day, be it on 'bail' or whatever.

[siamjimi]

wow a bunch of farangs complaining that Thailand doesn't have the same laws and values as farangland. same same on TV today.

they were both wrong. one guy won the fight. that's a few years max prison in Thailand if it isn't deemed self-defense. the old guy did attack first. that is probably why the 'murderer' was released.

you guys complain about this country but wait until you get into <snip> legal bind. then u will be happy u aren't in the Nazi west..

"NAZI WEST ' - &lt;deleted&gt; ? - It's people like you that "ARE" the problem - bet you have a job that gleans off the "NAZI WEST" to get your weekly paycheck

[Forethat]

Note to self: Keep biting your lip in every possible situation in traffic, no matter what. It's worth it.

[MaiChai]

My general attitude to driving these days, and this included anywhere, not just Thailand: if you get a nutter behind you or someone is acting stupidly or agressivly: just let them go. After all they don't have the benefit of your experience and wisdom! Anyway, who wants all the hassel of an accident and trying to prove it wasn't your fault; in Thailand the assumption is you are the low class foreigner, so it must be your fault?

I would even go as far to say, I don't drive in Bangkok unless I have to. For numerous reasons, including hassel of parking, higher chance of having an accident, stuck in traffic, etc. Take a taxi or go by motorbike. Why make problems for yourself when there are easier options?

Thus the benefit of having your own vechical is to make trips out of Bangkok. The freedom of the road to go where you want, when you want.

Edited July 19, 2011 by MaiChai

[FM505]

"Police charged Kanok with murder before releasing him."

Irritatingly vague... who is the SOB that ok'd that decision...?

[Nip]

wow a bunch of farangs complaining that Thailand doesn't have the same laws and values as farangland. same same on TV today.

they were both wrong. one guy won the fight. that's a few years max prison in Thailand if it isn't deemed self-defense. the old guy did attack first. that is probably why the 'murderer' was released.

you guys complain about this country but wait until you get into <snip> legal bind. then u will be happy u aren't in the Nazi west..

You missed the point completely ... He said he was sorry. Twenty minutes in the temple, buy a few amulets on the way out and its sorted. Just hope the wife is a good cook?

[MaxYakov]

Released to run out in to the rice fields. It's very easy for a Thai to co-opt another identity in Thailand. Might have been a handsome pay-off.

Was the murderer drunk? (legal drug), .......as opposed to hemp which is an illegal drug, and can't get you high at all. Go figure.

Had he eaten a load of MSG? Everyone in Thailand has MSG in their blood - and MSG has been shown to contribute to jangled thinking. It's particularly bad for kids, who ingest the hyper salty stuff as much as their parents (MSG can actually kill brain cells by hyper activating them).

I'm not saying these mind altering substances were to blame, am just saying they could be contributing factors. Ultimately, people have to take responsibility for their actions. No excuses. No easing of repercussions due to excuses.

Of course, being a 'hothead', having a nagging wife and complaining kid in the car, being rushed, having an irate driver chase you and then verbally abuse you (and who knows what else) and having a deadly weapon on one's person, couldn't have been contributing factors. I think it was his high sugar intake. That defense worked for Dan White in the Harvey Milk murder.

[Steely Dan]

My general attitude to driving these days, and this included anywhere, not just Thailand: if you get a nutter behind you or someone is acting stupidly or agressivly: just let them go. After all they don't have the benefit of your experience and wisdom! Anyway, who wants all the hassel of an accident and trying to prove it wasn't your fault; in Thailand the assumption is you are the low class foreigner, so it must be your fault?

I would even go as far to say, I don't drive in Bangkok unless I have to. For numerous reasons, including hassel of parking, higher chance of having an accident, stuck in traffic, etc. Take a taxi or go by motorbike. Why make problems for yourself when there are easier options?

Thus the benefit of having your own vechical is to make trips out of Bangkok. The freedom of the road to go where you want, when you want.

I would add never even assert your right of way if you have a psychopathic nutcase heading towards you flashing their lights whilst overtaking in your lane. They have lucky charm amulets and even if they don't work reincarnation is a fallback option.