Blackhawk Helicopter Sent To Retrieve Five Men Killed In Helicopter Crash In Phetchaburi

[Scott]

One inflammatory post has been deleted and a quote to the post has been edited. Please keep your opinion of other posters to yourself.

Stay on topic, please.

[Atmos]

I do not recall reading that kind of news in helicopter deaths ever in my country.

Dag - do not know what country you are from - but if you follow the link in my post #26 you'll see there have been, and continue to be, many military helicopter accidents/crashes worldwide.

There would be plenty of civilian crashes also, just today a Bell 206 LongRanger crashed in bad weather in Sydney, Australia, killing both occupants.

[Dag]

I do not recall reading that kind of news in helicopter deaths ever in my country.

Dag - do not know what country you are from - but if you follow the link in my post #26 you'll see there have been, and continue to be, many military helicopter accidents/crashes worldwide.

There would be plenty of civilian crashes also, just today a Bell 206 LongRanger crashed in bad weather in Sydney, Australia, killing both occupants.

Understand that....also read the sydney accident today.

The difference is that these are military machines....there should not be such monetary shortcomings to leave out a small piece of essential equipment considering the tropical weather nature here....doubt the blackhawks in Afghanistan and iraq would need them as much as here where monsoons can come into and sock in a pilot in the mountains so quick.

Then throw in the fundamentals that we know in this country for incompetence and accidents are waiting to happen like this. Nine more people dead while going to recover dead people is such a waste. Whether it was pilot error or pressure from those on board to continue...all points back to incompetence somewhere along the line in a big way. If the weather was so bad, the machine simply should have diverted and landed at nearest clear and safe destination...especially with 9 people on board.

One machine flies into bad weather and kills 5 people...another follows and kills 9 people.....how many of you were waiting for news of the third ?? Don't lie....I know I was.

[Atmos]

^ hmm we could debate that forever - I am thinking of the USA Seals helicopter that crashed in their capture/kill of Osama bin Laden; I don't recall anyone mentioning incompetence there?

Until facts are known, words such as incompetence are merely conjecture; not necessarily 'defending' anyone here - just remembering that 9 people died - sons/brothers/fathers/husbands.

[Dag]

^ hmm we could debate that forever - I am thinking of the USA Seals helicopter that crashed in their capture/kill of Osama bin Laden; I don't recall anyone mentioning incompetence there?

Until facts are known, words such as incompetence are merely conjecture; not necessarily 'defending' anyone here - just remembering that 9 people died - sons/brothers/fathers/husbands.

But them seals were not killed right and they were doing what was perceived as an essential mission....OBL would not have waited around I guess.....5 bodies were not going anywhere.

14 people actually altogether and for sure a loss to a lot of families out there.

To go off on another tangent...you know this 'face' thing here has been/will be the cause of many an accident and death for a long time still. As an example...have you noticed that a car overtaking you somewhere that then suddenly realises there is oncoming traffic, 9 times out of 10 will continue to pass, cut you off, force the others off the road and how many of them have resulted in an accident and/or death....they will continue to pass rather than lose face and hit the breaks and pull back in behind.....for sure similar things happen in the military here with senior officers on board and 2 machines turn back because of bad weather, but one does not.

[aussiebebe]

Very sad news. Even sadder than the thought of the Thai navy running their six second-hand nuclear subs. That's just wrong.

[Dag]

Very sad news. Even sadder than the thought of the Thai navy running their six second-hand nuclear subs. That's just wrong.

Are you serious ?? Do they really have Nuke subs ?

[ginjag]

^ hmm we could debate that forever - I am thinking of the USA Seals helicopter that crashed in their capture/kill of Osama bin Laden; I don't recall anyone mentioning incompetence there?

Until facts are known, words such as incompetence are merely conjecture; not necessarily 'defending' anyone here - just remembering that 9 people died - sons/brothers/fathers/husbands.

Just to add, I noticed it said 9 people "ABROAD" if the crash happened in Burma that would be correct. ( I also am aware it was a spell/err). just in case a poster didn't cop on.

[Mrjlh]

I was at the RTAF Museum a little after 11AM today when the news came in. An academy class was there to getting ready for graduation I think. By every ones reactions to me came across as a very big loss. The general was apparently well respected leader. The the rest on the men were highly trained. Talking to the Group Captain, he said the neither helicopter had radar. They save 20 million Baht by doing so. he didn't think that'll happen again or at least he hoped so. The area is very densely forested jungle area with high peaks and low valleys. The weather was clear but he said the weather can change in minutes in that area and is most likely what happened. Without the radar he probably flew into the mountain trying to get under the clouds. That was his guess. In fact they had to call back the ground search teams for awhile this morning because of heavy rain.

Sad day for sure.

[webfact]

The search is over

By The Nation

The dayslong search for an Army Black Hawk helicopter in dense jungle ended yesterday with the discovery of its wreckage and nine bodies.

Killed in the apparent crash were 9th Infantry Division chief MajGeneral Tawan Ruengsri, first pilot Major Praphan Jiamsoongnern, second pilot Major Choophan Phollawan, mechanics SgtMajor Somkhid Wongtasaeng and Sergeant Aram Phongsing, Captain Jes Sukjai, Captain Jakkraphan Bamrungphuet, Lance Corporal Itthisak Hinasut and Channel 5 cameraman Sornwichai Kongtannikul.

The bodies were yesterday being carried down a mountainside by search team members walking on foot, as the weather was not yet clear enough for another helicopter to collect the bodies.

"We know their relatives want to get their bodies back as soon as possible but we have to focus on the safety issue too. Such a tragic accident must not take place for a third time," First Army Region chief LtGeneral Udomdej Seetabut said at a press conference.

The Black Hawk went down on Tuesday during a mission to airlift the bodies of five military victims of another helicopter crash, which took place last Saturday.

The exact causes of the accidents have yet to be determined.

The Black Hawk was broken into pieces but had not exploded. Its emergency location transmitter had not been triggered either, which explained why many initially hoped that those on board might have survived.

"We are so sorry for what happened," Royal Thai Army spokesman Colonel Sansern Kaewkamnerd said about the fatalities.

Caretaker Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajjiva also extended his condolences to the victims' families. Yingluck Shinawatra, the incoming prime minister, posted a message of condolences on her Facebook wall.

Speaking at a press conference, Sansern said the eight soldiers killed in the Black Hawk crash would be posthumously promoted.

"The families of each victim will get more than Bt2million in compensation," he said.

He added that Army chief General Prayuth Chanocha had ordered that Sornwichai's family receive compensation and welfare equal to those of the soldiers.

-- The Nation 2011-07-23

[webfact]

Tears for the nine

By The Nation

Tears yesterday streamed down the faces of relatives waiting for news of people on board the Army Black Hawk helicopter that went missing on Tuesday.

Despite initial reports of a possible crash, the relatives had been hoping for a miracle.

When it was officially confirmed yesterday that all nine people on the aircraft were killed, it was almost too much for those waiting at home to bear.

Ubon Wongtasaeng broke into tears upon hearing that her son, SgtMajor Somkhid Wongtasaeng, had been killed.

The widow of Major Choophan Phollawan, meanwhile, said the tragic crash had brought her "a huge loss".

Choophan was the second pilot of the Black Hawk that crashed in the dense jungle on Tuesday during an attempt to airlift the bodies of five soldiers killed in another helicopter crash.

He leaves behind his wife, Suwimol Phollawan, and their two sons.

"We just gave alms to monks together last Saturday," the 41yearold woman said.

In Nakhon Ratchasima, Khiam Jiamsoongnern, 79, was yesterday kept in the dark about her only son's death. Because the reported crash had already hurt her so much, relatives and neighbours decided not to let her watch the news any more out of concern for her frail health.

Her son, Major Praphan Jiamsoongnern, was the Black Hawk's first pilot.

"Her health has significantly weakened since the Black Hawk disappeared. We won't let her know about his death because we fear she won't be able to cope with it," Khiam's soninlaw Ma Rakphakwaen said.

The elderly mother had been praying for her son's safety since he disappeared.

Her relatives and neighbours would not allow any reporter to get close to Khiam's house.

"She still believes he's safe," said a neighbour, Yong Klongsoongnern.

Yong described Praphan as nice, friendly and helpful.

"All locals knew he was greeting his mum from the sky whenever a helicopter circled over our village a few times. When a helicopter roared nearby, Khiam always got out of her house and waved," the neighbour recounted. "It was a moving sight."

Locals in Nakhon Si Thammarat's Nopphitam district were mourning the deaths of Praphan, Chuphan and two more soldiers.

"Many villagers shed tears. We remember so well how they helped us sincerely when our town was hit by floods and landslides," said Kreetha Innarong, a kamnan in Nopphitam district.

-- The Nation 2011-07-23

[webfact]

Rest in peace

By The Nation

It is time for Thailand to say "rest in peace" to nine people who were on board an Army Black Hawk helicopter that went missing in Phetchaburi province on Tuesday.

Among the dead were eight soldiers and Sornwichai Kongtannikul, a Channel 5 cameraman accompanying the team on a mission to retrieve the bodies of five victims of another helicopter crash last Saturday near the ThaiBurmese border.

Since Tuesday, Thais have been hopeful that those on board the second missing chopper were safe. Sadly, those hopes have been dashed.

Members of the media are mourning a beloved colleague. Sornwichai's photos have become profile pictures for many journalists on social media. Statuses have been updated to "rest in peace", along with other words of tribute.

The eyes of political news reporters and journalists who knew him overflowed with tears when they saw the bad news on television.

"I loved him so much. I felt as if he were my younger brother. We've worked together for years," said Wanrudee Yommawan, a politicalnews reporter for Channel 5 who worked with Sornwichai when he was in charge of political news. "I'm so sad after finding out that he died."

She said the channel had lost a valuable and hardworking team member. As well as being a cameraman, he could edit video and link signals to broadcast news via satellite.

Surakit Phinyachawanit, a Channel 5 news editor, said: "I felt as if everything around me stopped and became silent right after I heard confirmation of his death."

He said a team of Channel 5 staff had been sent to bring Sornwichai's body back from the forest.

Surakit said the channel would reward Sornwichai, following its regulations.

The News Broadcasting Council of Thailand and the Thai Broadcast Journalists Association issued a statement praising him and mourning his death.

-- The Nation 2011-07-23

[cloudhopper]

<br />Shame that the militaries budget didn't extend an extra 20 million bht to pay for the radar that may have saved the second crews lives. Now they will be paying much more than that in compensation and a lifetime support for the families.<br />

<br /><br /><br />

Contrary to popular opinion radar is not particularly useful for terrain avoidance, especially in heavy rain, as anyone who has actually used one would agree.

GPS with a moving map display is, and is far less expensive.

Edited July 22, 2011 by cloudhopper

[apetley]

I have no idea of your own experience using helicopter radar but a member of my own family has flown military copters and says that the terrain following and avoidance radar is invaluable

Have to agree with you regards the GPS system being useful in bad weather. Tragic that such a system appears not to have been installed.

Edited July 23, 2011 by apetley

[cloudhopper]

It would appear that you are in fact correct apetley

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrain-following_radar

[Crushdepth]

Or it could just be incompetence.

before you wave the incompetence stick from your point of perfection; have a browse through

List of accidents and incidents involving military aircraft (2000–present)

and have a look at the military accidents from eg 2010. Plenty of your 'incompetent' military worldwide it seems.

Or it could just be incompetence. I hope this third accident will stir some renewed interest in addressing issues such as maintenance and training.

Edited July 24, 2011 by Crushdepth

[gregb]

<br />Shame that the militaries budget didn't extend an extra 20 million bht to pay for the radar that may have saved the second crews lives. Now they will be paying much more than that in compensation and a lifetime support for the families.<br />

<br /><br /><br />

Contrary to popular opinion radar is not particularly useful for terrain avoidance, especially in heavy rain, as anyone who has actually used one would agree.

GPS with a moving map display is, and is far less expensive.

If it truly was "turbulence" as reported, weather radar is going to be completely useless. Sounds to me more like a microburst driving the aircraft into the ground. I have had the misfortune of being caught in one of these once in a single engine fixed wing aircraft during a landing approach. Not fun at all. Terrifying in a check your shorts kind of way. Full power at max rate of climb and I was still getting pulled down. And it doesn't matter how experienced you are. There is no way you can see it or avoid something like this. Getting hit with one of these in a helicopter flying low and slow could very well be a death sentence.

There are always ways to improve training and maintenance, but 3 accidents in the same area in a short time would seem to implicate the area as being primarily at fault. We need to wait on the full investigation, but it is not clear any amount of equipment or maintenance could have prevented these tragedies.

[Dag]

All i can say is WOW......

I was quietly expecting this.

Really does not require any more comment.

[webfact]

Remains of seven killed in downed Black Hawk arrive Kanchanaburi

Follow this link:

[webfact]

Bodies of nine killed in fallen Black Hawk helicopter moved to Wat Thung Lad Ya for funeral ceremony; royally sponsored bathing rites at 11am /MCOT

[Thai at Heart]

If the copters all came from the same place, I would suggest contaminated fuel or an incorrectly spec'd lubricant change.