British kick-boxer to be extradited to Thailand over murder of US Marine

[hehehoho]

"The extradition shall not take place unless the evidence be found sufficient according to the laws of the State

applied to, either to justify the committal of the prisoner for trial, in case the crime had been committed in

the territory of the said State..."

The above quote is from Section 11 of:

TREATY BETWEEN THE UNITED KINGDOM AND SIAM RESPECTING THE

EXTRADITION OF FUGITIVE CRIMINALS.

Sign at Bangkok, March 4, 1911.

(Ratifications exchanged at London, August 1, 1911.)

It's quite probable the Thai authorities have little or no evidence that would stand up in a UK court of law on a charge of murder (assuming the charges as laid are appropriate to the offense and can be prosecuted with a high probability of conviction) and therefore the subject/accused of extradition would not be compelled to be extradited. But of course, falsification of documents is pretty standard in TH. So, wait and see the outcome of the accused's appeal.

There are literally dozens of witnesses.[ CCTV footage of him in the initial fight, CCTV footage of him robbing the knives from the 7-11 and CCTV footage of him in the hotel where he stabbed the Marine. I am pretty sure even the most liberal of courts would call this enough evidence to bring the man to trial. Why would you make a comment about the Thais falsifying documents? It is all but a gurantee that this extradition is being driven by the US not the Thai government. I am not sure if you remember this initial reporting of this case, but it was hardly a quiet crime. This guy went on a drunken drug addled rampage through the streets wielding knives covered in blood, the murder was only the most heinous of his crimes that evening.

Why is hating Thailand such a passion of people who post on this board? If you are that unhappy in Thailand why do you stay?

There are no witnesses of the murder. The GF has seemed to (fishily) change her story. Initial reports were that she saw 'a man' leaving after the murder took place.

The 7-11 knife is not the reported murder weapon.

He wasn't stabbed in a Hotel. He was living in an apartment complex, and I have yet to hear of CCTV footage showing the accused there.

As for the last sentence I highlighted.... eh waht?

Edited September 5, 2011 by metisdead
Do not modify someone else's post in your quoted reply, either with font or color changes.

[Northbank]

If he gets put in a Thai prison, he may wish he had received the death sentence instead.

Exactly.

It likely is a fate worse than death,

or death by other means, if he is the arrogant juice-head (steroids) he appears to be. Plus being a Muay Thai fighter, how many will want to prove he is not as good as they are....How long will this nutter last in the general population before his premature exit is assured?

I think if any Muay thai fighters languishing in jail have seen this footage, i doubt they will be too impressed with his muay thai skills, which are almost non existent....He's a brawler nothing more...

Also, I don't know why , but everytime i see that footage i expect to see half a dozen thais running in from the blindside taking potshots at him while he's fighting the thai guy...

On a more serious note...this guy is a bully boy, a thug and all round scum bag... The sooner he is extradited, put on trial and sent to a thai prison where he belongs, the better...

Edited September 5, 2011 by metisdead
Do not modify someone else's post in your quoted reply, either with font or color changes

[ChristopherWilliamsBKK]

Simple as really.

This <deleted> will get TV, garibaldis, mobile phones in UK nick.

He killed an American marine.

He can't be harmed in the UK but he very certainly can be here - with no come back.

It's not the Thai's wanting to extradite him - it's the American military.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Here's a U.S. ABC television news network report on the case, with comments from Longfellow's mother, shortly after the murder... Has some interesting background on Longfellow's Marine service record.

http://abcnews.go.co...ory?id=11410962

Beyond that, a very odd thing... I did a quick news search of U.S. news sources... And I found almost nothing on the case except on the original murder and then the arrest of Aldhouse... But after that...nothing...

Even the U.S. Marine Corps has its own service newspaper. And a search of the Marine Corps Times finds only one AP brief article on Aldhouse's arrest... but nothing else...\

Considering the circumstances, you'd think there'd be some U.S. media interest in what happens with the accused and will justice ever come in the case....

Edited September 4, 2011 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Beetlejuice]

They had to give up the death penality to make it happen, what will be the basis for his appeal be, I donot like Thailand

And not forgetting the British human rights laws.

Our man may avoid extradition because he doesn`t like the Thai food served up in Thai jails, therefore contravening his human rights.

[mango1969]

Sorry, I don't understand.... He is a British citizen. Now in the UK. So can a British government send its citizen? It is their duty to protect him. OK .. he killed another person. Then a trial in his own country (UK), and a prison in his country

[theanimaster]

Hoping he gets thrown in a Thai prison -- that is MUCH better than the death penalty... depending on how you view the word "better" Here's to justice.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Did find this Facebook memorial page on Longfellow....

https://www.facebook.com/groups/150680324943961/

[PuaSai]

I am surprised his lawyers have not tried to get the US to charge him and get him extradited there ... but not sure even with the victim being a serviceman that the US could hold any jurisdiction.

I thought the fact he allegedly murdered a US citizen gives them jurisdiction worldwide

The victim was also a U.S. service member on shore leave, so there could be later repercussions regarding that. Why did the guy have to use a knife anyway?? I know moot at this point, but it's not like he couldn't possibly handle himself. Was there more to this?

[endure]

Does the UK have the death penalty? If so, than all 3 countries have the death penalty. This cowardly murder should warrant death, regardless where it occurred. Next time you got your arrogant butt kick by a combat hardened US Marine, and as embarrassing as it may be, just go home.

No the UK doesn't, except for treason i think - The right to life is rightly sanctioned by the government irrespective of the crime. Having served alongside US Marines in my Army days I know they are professional in every way and are mainly a great bunch of lads who take pride in their work.

The UK does not have the death penalty for any crimes at all.

[Pompey50]

From what I understand of the legal position, there may well be a last ditch effort to prevent extradition in the high court. That is as far as he can go, he will not be able to appeal to the ECHR as this is a treaty matter and also his rights are fully covered by the UK human rights act.

You also have to remember that there are fugitives in Thailand wanted by UK authorities. This will be a case of we scratch your back you scratch ours.

From what I have read about the incident the guy deserves whatever happens to him, however we should not pre-judge the trail, I believe under US law as well as UK law there is a presumption of innocence until guilt is proven. I have no idea how the Thai legal system works (apart from badly).

I would not be surprise to here he has suddenly been put on a plane to Thailand with escort.

[LisuLover]

Thailand would rather 'open a vein' than have this eerie guy back. They are following protocol, doing what civil servants "respectfully suggest", they are toeing the line knowing he aint coming back. It's Wormwood Scrubs for Mr Smallbrain.

[PuaSai]

Thailand would rather 'open a vein' than have this eerie guy back. They are following protocol, doing what civil servants "respectfully suggest", they are toeing the line knowing he aint coming back. It's Wormwood Scrubs for Mr Smallbrain.

You know, it blows my mind why people can't just go to Thailand and have a great time... Someone always has something to prove and there are people who drink who shouldn't be drinking..or whatever... Just a sad story overall because of the family's who suffer because of this.

[poanoi]

Next time you got your arrogant butt kick by a combat hardened US Marine, and as embarrassing as it may be, just go home.

If that was the case, it was self defense

[Maestro]

I have deleted some nonsensical and off-topic posts and the replies to them.

[PuaSai]

Thailand would rather 'open a vein' than have this eerie guy back. They are following protocol, doing what civil servants "respectfully suggest", they are toeing the line knowing he aint coming back. It's Wormwood Scrubs for Mr Smallbrain.

You British folks have to translate that for us yanks. England was the only country I went to where I couldn't understand anyone.

They have the Flintstones on TV! LOL I had the same problem. :-)

[PuaSai]

Next time you got your arrogant butt kick by a combat hardened US Marine, and as embarrassing as it may be, just go home.

If that was the case, it was self defense

Not if you left the scene and returned to the scene or a different location with a weapon. Now its premeditated.

Edited September 4, 2011 by PuaSai

[bristolgeoff]

what were they fighting about and what caused the death apart from the fighting.if he skipped thailand to avoid capture thru cambodia then it seems something nasty

[PuaSai]

I am surprised his lawyers have not tried to get the US to charge him and get him extradited there ... but not sure even with the victim being a serviceman that the US could hold any jurisdiction.

I thought the fact he allegedly murdered a US citizen gives them jurisdiction worldwide

The victim was also a U.S. service member on shore leave, so there could be later repercussions regarding that. Why did the guy have to use a knife anyway?? I know moot at this point, but it's not like he couldn't possibly handle himself. Was there more to this?

Well, it appears per the U.S. story that the victim was a war vet Marine and was finished with his service. He had gone to Thailand to learn the art of Muay Thai. So, he wasn't on leave as I assumed initially. If you follow the link posted elsewhere in the topic you can read the ABC News story.

[roamer]

Lets clear a couple of things up: The 1996 amendments to 18 U.S.C. 3181 and 3184 permit the United States to extradite, without regard to the existence of a treaty, persons (other than citizens, nationals or permanent residents of the United States), who have committed crimes of violence against nationals of the United States in foreign countries.

Put simply, that means that should you have managed the extradition their is no barrier to prosecution in the US. It didn't happen. End of argument,

The ECHR argument is very thin. Its long been accepted that prison conditions vary differently between countries, doubt that arguments under Article 3 would be sufficiently robust to persuade the court to accept the case. The comparison between the case of Abu Hamza and extradition to the US (still awaiting judgement) focuses on two very different points; a life sentence without parole and imprisonment in complete isolation in Supermax.

Pitbull will be on a plane to Thailand.

[BOS2BKK]

He'll beg for the death penalty after a year in Thai jail.

If anyone thinks that the US government won't apply pressure for justice is sadly mistaken.England won't say no to the US over a two bit thug.

He will be coming back to do some hard time for the crime.

You guys really don't get it. He won't be coming back, it's not up to the UK. They can rubber stamp 'approved' in onto the extradition request as much as they want, it makes little difference to the final outcome of the case. In the end it's not up to them anymore, it's up to the EU. Believe me when I say this - the EU don't give a hoot what the US nor Thailand thinks, they will make their decision after years of deliberation and that will be the final word on the subject.

They'll keep him in prison for as long as possible but there is no way in the world he will be extradited back to Thailand.

But the EU will be the first ones who will complain about how Thailand is a haven for criminals and they should all be extradited. Always the victim, never the law. Typical of the European ineffectiveness that requires Americans to periodically come bail them out. What a sad sad Joke. How many more millions of Americans will have to truck over to Europe to bail out there messes in the next century. EU 2011....finally around to copycatting America circa 1776, and screwing it up.

[Mario2008]

This is not subject to a ruling of the EU, other than that under the European Treaty of Human Rights extradition cannot take place if a person faces the death penalty, torture or a degrading treatment. The Thai prison consitions are bad, but will not be considered as inhumane. The criteria the European court on Human rights for that are very high.

It is very possible that he is will be etradited to face trail in Thailand but will serve his sentence in the UK.

[samran]

If he gets put in a Thai prison, he may wish he had received the death sentence instead.

problem with your little thought out one liner is that more than one foreign prisoner who has experienced a Thai jail have stated that they'd probably prefer to spend their sentence in a Thai jail due to the relative freedoms you do have inside (esp if you have a little cash).

Not that it is exactly a pleasant choice to make, but many prefer the Thai system where they can be left alone, vs. being bottom fodder in western jails. A little bit of cash can make your time tolerable in a Thai jail. Your sore arse also freezes in winter back in blighty as well.

[dmcguire70]

Sorry, I don't understand.... He is a British citizen. Now in the UK. So can a British government send its citizen? It is their duty to protect him. OK .. he killed another person. Then a trial in his own country (UK), and a prison in his country

If the UK authorities grant an extradition order it means the Thai's would have sufficient evidence for a conviction.The death penalty wouldn't apply in this case and with the crime being particularly heinous he'll be extradited no doubt.

It'll also be interesting to see was his steroid filled physique will look like after 6 months in a Thai jail.

Edited September 5, 2011 by dmcguire70

[chrisandsu]

may be better then Richard if you refrained from attacking Brits along with your buddy buz2.

Then the mud slinging and posturing would stop ?

if the guys guilty then yes bang him up for life but do not throw every Brit into the mix with it as Americans are hardly seen in a great light there self are they?

[Richard4849]

may be better then Richard if you refrained from attacking Brits along with your buddy buz2.

Then the mud slinging and posturing would stop ?

if the guys guilty then yes bang him up for life but do not throw every Brit into the mix with it as Americans are hardly seen in a great light there self are they?

Who attacked Brits? Not I. The only thing I questioned was the release of the Lockerbie bomber -- a government action, completely unrelated to individuals.

[chrisandsu]

the miscarrige of justice has not even happened they are just going through the formalities , did you see the casey anthony trial by any chance? now that was a joke! by the way im smoking the peace pipe here being a Brit living in America

[samran]

If the murderer had been Thai, he would have been tried, judged, and sentenced (along with the 70 million other Thais) on this forum days ago. The fact that he is British somehow puts doubts into people's minds?

Who 'The' murderer is is yet to be proven in a court of law, so there is no 'fact' regarding their nationality.

Some people use the phrase 'innocent until proven guilty'.

Not Americans though, it seems.

You're right. The murderer was probably a cowardly Thai guy. The valiant British kick boxer probably tried to save him, to no avail.

and the Thai authorities stitched him up for it. Obviously.

I wonder though what the ranters and the loons will say though when the UK court approves the extradition, with the Thai gathered evidence meeting the requirements of a UK court to grant the extradition.

[Richard4849]

The guy was MURDERED...so, unless he fell on that knife a couple dozen times, there is indeed a murderer.

Listen, I don't have anything against anyone. My posts were simply to point out the absurdity of the way this forum condemns, convicts, and bashes Thais mercilessly and with seeming impunity -- yet the troops circle to protect their own when a farang is involved. Pack mentality -- same thing as when gangs of Thais reputedly rush in to help a countryman in a fight with a foreigner.

Sometimes, a mirror reveals an ugly thing.

[random]

If the murderer had been Thai, he would have been tried, judged, and sentenced (along with the 70 million other Thais) on this forum days ago. The fact that he is British somehow puts doubts into people's minds?

Who 'The' murderer is is yet to be proven in a court of law, so there is no 'fact' regarding their nationality.

Some people use the phrase 'innocent until proven guilty'.

Not Americans though, it seems.

You're right. The murderer was probably a cowardly Thai guy. The valiant British kick boxer probably tried to save him, to no avail.

I guess the deceased was just quietly minding his own business, extolling the virtues of the good lord to all those nasty brits drinking in that bar, trying to steer them on the straight and narrow. Oh no, wait, he was involved in a bar brawl, added to a second knife found at he scene etc, he was not an innocent party in this.

he may have won the battle, but he certainly lost the war.

now this thread should be about the extradition, is is not about innocence or guilt of the alleged killer, lets discuss whether he will be extradited or not, my guess is that he will not be extradited to Thailand, and then america can go all gung ho and invade britain, we can call it the new 'battle of the bulge', the fat yanks attacking Europes fattest country,a real heavyweight tussle

i am British, and like I say the posturing by the yanks in this thread is embarrassing to say the least