Road Digging Begins To Save Bangkok From Flooding

[tombkk]

Foreigners will lose their confidence in us due to our failure to protect our capital city," she said in hoarse voice.

So from that remark it would seem as if the welfare of the locals is of no importance compared to what, "foreigners" may think or see what is happening ?

Indeed it is so nice that now in her and her governments desperation they seem to be trying to shift blame for their inaction in the past which have led to the current actions onto the , " dreaded foreigners."

It's called face and all Thais can relate to losing face.

It's called jobs and all Thais can relate to having one or not.

[FarangBuddha]

The real fact may well be, that in terms of natural disasters the Japanese do have long, extensive and recent history. Plan for the worst, hope for the best doesn't translate well here. You are right though, it is interesting that they jump at the first sign of foreign advice.

Yep, those Japanese really know what they're doing...building nuclear power plants in active earthquake and tsunami zones And as for after the fact clean-up, they did such a bang-up job with that that they now have radiation hot-spots popping up in Toyko!

Edited October 29, 2011 by FarangBuddha

[viathais]

Meanwhile, Transport Minister Sukampol Suwannathat said yesterday that there would be no excavation of roads in eastern Bangkok, as had been proposed by a group of engineers as a way to help with the movement of flood water into the sea.

The transport minister also said there was no need to cut through Bang Na-Trat Road and the Motorway, which links Bangkok and the eastern seaboard provinces, as had been suggested by some experts

Well, I'm sure Mr Transport Minister is far more qualified at making these decisions than the team of engineers Toyota Motor Company graciously put on the task, that came up with those solutions.

I'd like to see Mr Transport Minister's qualifications/experience, any chance of posting a brief summary?

[viathais]

Foreigners will lose their confidence in us due to our failure to protect our capital city," she said in hoarse voice.

So from that remark it would seem as if the welfare of the locals is of no importance compared to what, "foreigners" may think or see what is happening ?

Indeed it is so nice that now in her and her governments desperation they seem to be trying to shift blame for their inaction in the past which have led to the current actions onto the , " dreaded foreigners."

It's called face and all Thais can relate to losing face.

It's called jobs and all Thais can relate to having one or not.

Actually there are many Thai's who would rather sit around doing jack than work for a living. I arranged transport, advance payment, rooms, clothing and jobs for 8 fit young strong "Ayutthayans". They worked monday, tuesday took they day off, wednesday worked half day and then disappeared.... back to Ayutthaya I think.

[satiariyan]

The affected section is located somewhere between the east-west Rangsit Canal and Hok Wa Canal on the border with Bangkok.

The water channelling is aimed at speeding up the flow of run-off water into the Hok Wa Canal, and then into the city's Saen Saeb Canal.

Wonder how they can be certain that channelling more flood through Saen Saeb, won't just speed up and increase the flooding of inner city?

[tombkk]

It's called jobs and all Thais can relate to having one or not.

Actually there are many Thai's who would rather sit around doing jack than work for a living. I arranged transport, advance payment, rooms, clothing and jobs for 8 fit young strong "Ayutthayans". They worked monday, tuesday took they day off, wednesday worked half day and then disappeared.... back to Ayutthaya I think.

I don't know abut these eight individuals, but I was talking about long-term jobs.

[Payboy]

"To any person affected, I assure full compensation," she added.

Seems there is massive elephant in the corner, and no one noticed.

It's the old "million baht if you can prove you caught bird flu / SARS in Thailand" trick.

Edited October 29, 2011 by Payboy

[scorecard]

Crazy isn't it ^^^, seems that only roads in the east of the city won't be dug.

What would be really useful to all would be maps showing where the cuts are taking place, or are they scared that those affected will try to save their homes and property? I for one don't believe a word of the 'full compensation' statement.

A few lunch boxes with red stickers I guess.

Edited October 29, 2011 by scorecard

[Buchholz]

Meanwhile, Transport Minister Sukampol Suwannathat said yesterday that there would be no excavation of roads in eastern Bangkok, as had been proposed by a group of engineers as a way to help with the movement of flood water into the sea.

The transport minister also said there was no need to cut through Bang Na-Trat Road and the Motorway, which links Bangkok and the eastern seaboard provinces, as had been suggested by some experts

Well, I'm sure Mr Transport Minister is far more qualified at making these decisions than the team of engineers Toyota Motor Company graciously put on the task, that came up with those solutions.

I'd like to see Mr Transport Minister's qualifications/experience, any chance of posting a brief summary?

Transportation Minister Air Chief Marshal Sukampol was a classmate of former prime minister Thaksin Shinwatra at Class 10 of the Armed Forces Academies Preparatory School and is close to Thaksin and his ex-wife Potjaman Damapong.

He was a jet pilot while in the Air Force.

.

Edited October 29, 2011 by Buchholz

[viathais]

It's called jobs and all Thais can relate to having one or not.

Actually there are many Thai's who would rather sit around doing jack than work for a living. I arranged transport, advance payment, rooms, clothing and jobs for 8 fit young strong "Ayutthayans". They worked monday, tuesday took they day off, wednesday worked half day and then disappeared.... back to Ayutthaya I think.

I don't know abut these eight individuals, but I was talking about long-term jobs.

So was I talking about long term jobs.

How about the Issan workers I got from Libya, these guys or their relatives paid Bt120,000 to an agency to work there for Bt16,000/month.

When the poo hit the fan and it went tits up, they were shipped back to Thailand by the Thai navy. In their time of need, I gave 15 of them housing, clothing, advance payment, transport to and from work, wages of Bt12,000 + OT only to see them leave after a month..... <deleted>, Maybe I paid them too much.

[magpie3]

Referring to the digging of roads and Yingluck using the well worn phrase - "full compensation" - when speaking to the worried residents.

For anyone that believes that an official offering "full compensation" means anything at all, just get the hell out of Dodge.

This is no place for the weak minded liberal, Flak Jackets and tin hats are not issued here, it is and always will be a bare knuckle fight against the 'haves' - whether that be 'have power' or 'have money'.

Before you assume the knee-jerk position . . .

NO, I DO NOT HAVE ANY PARTISAN POLITICAL PERSUASION

I have been known to favour the educated informed approach to government but have never condoned the abuse of power which is commonplace at every level and on all sides in Thailand. Winning at any cost is the mantra, regardless of the casualties; innocent or otherwise. It is not 'what you know' in Thailand but 'who you know' and that just means someone can always have a better contact to out-rank yours or pay more to get their way.

First hand experience? Yes. And yes again - it has left me somewhat embittered or twice shy. We bought land 40 years ago, received permission to build 25 years ago, and now predominantly suffer 80-90Db and the house shaking (literally) until 1:30am from first morning flights. EIA? - my armpit. Don't believe all that <deleted> either. It's just another bit of window dressing data to be ignored, misinterpreted or misrepresented.

They promised us compensation and came up with a few thousand Baht to soundproof our house (impossible, and you can't soundproof or pollution proof the gardens) - after 4 years! Now it is blighted, the residents have aquiesced to the expectation modification - protracted broken promises and the 'pag wan' techniques that the Thais love from authority figures. Their war of attrition over the last 7 years has been effective, and we have no effective way to redress our position or extricate ouselves from this war zone other than to cash in our pensions.

It is always someone elses problem in Thailand, unless the heavy weight is actually on your own toes.

Compensation? For pity's sake tell them not to fall for that one again!

Edited October 29, 2011 by magpie3

[moe666]

Referring to the digging of roads and Yingluck using the well worn phrase - "full compensation" - when speaking to the worried residents.

For anyone that believes that an official offering "full compensation" means anything at all, just get the hell out of Dodge.

This is no place for the weak minded liberal, Flak Jackets and tin hats are not issued here, it is and always will be a bare knuckle fight against the 'haves' - whether that be 'have power' or 'have money'.

Before you assume the knee-jerk position . . .

NO, I DO NOT HAVE ANY PARTISAN POLITICAL PERSUASION

I have been known to favour the educated informed approach to government but have never condoned the abuse of power which is commonplace at every level and on all sides in Thailand. Winning at any cost is the mantra, regardless of the casualties; innocent or otherwise. It is not 'what you know' in Thailand but 'who you know' and that just means someone can always have a better contact to out-rank yours or pay more to get their way.

First hand experience? Yes. And yes again - it has left me somewhat embittered or twice shy. We bought land 40 years ago, received permission to build 25 years ago, and now predominantly suffer 80-90Db and the house shaking (literally) until 1:30am from first morning flights. EIA? - my armpit. Don't believe all that <deleted> either. It's just another bit of window dressing data to be ignored, misinterpreted or misrepresented.

They promised us compensation and came up with a few thousand Baht to soundproof our house (impossible, and you can't soundproof or pollution proof the gardens) - after 4 years! Now it is blighted, the residents have aquiesced to the expectation modification - protracted broken promises and the 'pag wan' techniques that the Thais love from authority figures. Their war of attrition over the last 7 years has been effective, and we have no effective way to redress our position or extricate ouselves from this war zone other than to cash in our pensions.

It is always someone elses problem in Thailand, unless the heavy weight is actually on your own toes.

Compensation? For pity's sake tell them not to fall for that one again!

What does Liberal have to do with you building your house near an airport.

[viathais]

Referring to the digging of roads and Yingluck using the well worn phrase - "full compensation" - when speaking to the worried residents.

For anyone that believes that an official offering "full compensation" means anything at all, just get the hell out of Dodge.

This is no place for the weak minded liberal, Flak Jackets and tin hats are not issued here, it is and always will be a bare knuckle fight against the 'haves' - whether that be 'have power' or 'have money'.

Before you assume the knee-jerk position . . .

NO, I DO NOT HAVE ANY PARTISAN POLITICAL PERSUASION

I have been known to favour the educated informed approach to government but have never condoned the abuse of power which is commonplace at every level and on all sides in Thailand. Winning at any cost is the mantra, regardless of the casualties; innocent or otherwise. It is not 'what you know' in Thailand but 'who you know' and that just means someone can always have a better contact to out-rank yours or pay more to get their way.

First hand experience? Yes. And yes again - it has left me somewhat embittered or twice shy. We bought land 40 years ago, received permission to build 25 years ago, and now predominantly suffer 80-90Db and the house shaking (literally) until 1:30am from first morning flights. EIA? - my armpit. Don't believe all that <deleted> either. It's just another bit of window dressing data to be ignored, misinterpreted or misrepresented.

They promised us compensation and came up with a few thousand Baht to soundproof our house (impossible, and you can't soundproof or pollution proof the gardens) - after 4 years! Now it is blighted, the residents have aquiesced to the expectation modification - protracted broken promises and the 'pag wan' techniques that the Thais love from authority figures. Their war of attrition over the last 7 years has been effective, and we have no effective way to redress our position or extricate ouselves from this war zone other than to cash in our pensions.

It is always someone elses problem in Thailand, unless the heavy weight is actually on your own toes.

Compensation? For pity's sake tell them not to fall for that one again!

What does Liberal have to do with you building your house near an airport.

I think the airport was built near his house

[anterian]

The problem with this scheme is that it takes very careful planning and implementation. Engineers are people who work with precision. They need maps, elevations, types of soil and a lot of other data. They are not the best people to deal with a looming disaster. They are the ones to prevent a disaster.

That said, however, they are worth listening to. I will be fleeing the city, however, when I hear Yingluck is reading Thaivisa for ideas!

A fair point. The main issue for the Government here is that they are being reactionary instead of pro-active. As soon as someone comes up with a new idea they seem to implement it without the slightest bit of analysis or even testing (on paper) the potential solution to see if it will actually work.. A strategy like this is always going to end in tears. As has already been said on here by BKKdreaming, if the road foundations are as poor as we all suspect and they are dug up then the water will wash out all the foundations horizontally and further parts of the road or near bye buildings will collapse. I hope they don't do this road digging near any tall buildings!

Regarding foundations I noticed something rather alarming a few days ago. After the initial surge of water stabilised, I noticed the level in my house dropped slightly, yet in the street it was unchanged. The only explanation I can think of is swelling and uplift of the subsoil beneath my foundations. I am glad that, using car terminology, my house is a monocoque design.

[siampolee]

I think the airport was built near his house

The airport had been an ongoing issue for years and everyone in the area knew it, not so much a case of the airport was built near his house more of a case of his house was built near the airport.

[ThaiFelix]

More confusion.

Yesterday, the Transportation Minister said they would not dig roads.

This morning the other paper is reporting that government scrapped the idea to dig roads.

....

and yet, roads are being dug.

The article is confusing. The first line says ' Some roads (plural) being excavated.....' but then the rest of the article only mentions one in Pathum Thani. Not sure if its bad comunication or just bad English grammer??

[animatic]

I will be fleeing the city, however, when I hear Yingluck is reading Thaivisa for ideas!

No doubt she will be reading this esteemed forum for information as to which way her escape route would be. No excavated roads or traffic jams that would impede the landing ability of her helicopter and as to where suitable accommodation for someone of her standing can be found.

What ever way we say, she'll go the other to be safe.

[joe beets]

The transport minister also said there was no need to cut through Bang Na-Trat Road and the Motorway, which links Bangkok and the eastern seaboard provinces, as had been suggested by some experts

Well, I'm sure Mr Transport Minister is far more qualified at making these decisions than the team of engineers Toyota Motor Company graciously put on the task, that came up with those solutions.

I'd like to see Mr Transport Minister's qualifications/experience, any chance of posting a brief summary?

Transportation Minister Air Chief Marshal Sukampol was a classmate of former prime minister Thaksin Shinwatra at Class 10 of the Armed Forces Academies Preparatory School and is close to Thaksin and his ex-wife Potjaman Damapong.

He was a jet pilot while in the Air Force.

.

Thanks. That's all I needed to know.

Fully qualified.

Nothing to see here, folks, just move along..

[XAR]

if there is only sand and dirt under the road when the water flows it will take the sand / dirt away and make the hole wider , plus damage the road base....

But I am sure they thought of that

BK

If they are digging up the road then there won't be any road base to damage will there?

Really? Of course there will be. They are only digging a hole through the road, not the whole road. If they make, for instance, a 6M passage through the road, then the base and sub-base to the left and right of this passage will be prone to erosion. When the base and sub-base erodes, then the road above will collapse. You will no longer have only a 6M passage.

[Buchholz]

I'd like to see Mr Transport Minister's qualifications/experience, any chance of posting a brief summary?

Transportation Minister Air Chief Marshal Sukampol was a classmate of former prime minister Thaksin Shinwatra at Class 10 of the Armed Forces Academies Preparatory School and is close to Thaksin and his ex-wife Potjaman Damapong.

Thanks. That's all I needed to know.

Fully qualified.

Nothing to see here, folks, just move along..

That's because folks saw this before:

Thai PM-elect denies Thaksin picking cabinet

Thaksin Calls In To 'Instruct' Thai Cabinet

Yingluck: Elected Pheu Thai MPs' Meeting With Thaksin Not Related To Cabinet List

Cabinet Line-Up To Show Thaksin's Resolve

[EarthAlien]

"Meanwhile, Transport Minister Sukampol Suwannathat said yesterday that there would be no excavation of roads in eastern Bangkok, as had been proposed by a group of engineers as a way to help with the movement of flood water into the sea.

He said instead, canals in the areas would be dredged to help speed up the water movement."

errm,... shouldn't the dredging of canals have been

attended to

at least a week ago

when this scenario was clearly inevitable???

[animatic]

"Meanwhile, Transport Minister Sukampol Suwannathat said yesterday that there would be no excavation of roads in eastern Bangkok, as had been proposed by a group of engineers as a way to help with the movement of flood water into the sea.

He said instead, canals in the areas would be dredged to help speed up the water movement."

errm,... shouldn't the dredging of canals have been

attended to

at least a week ago

when this scenario was clearly inevitable???

4-6 weeks ago....

And why is the Air minister considered an expert on Floods and fluid dynamics of water in cities?Personally I think engineers have more logical ideas on this than pilot / politicians.

Edited October 29, 2011 by animatic

[DizietSma]

Photos of the abortive digging here:

go to visualthailand dot com and add this to the rest of the URL: "/story.php?id=1693#"

Sorry, can't post links. Very anticlimactic for a Toyota sponsored plan that involved at least 2 helicopter rides!!

[bangon04]

Crazy isn't it ^^^, seems that only roads in the east of the city won't be dug.

What would be really useful to all would be maps showing where the cuts are taking place, or are they scared that those affected will try to save their homes and property? I for one don't believe a word of the 'full compensation' statement.

""To any person affected, I assure full compensation," she added." - seems she hasn't learnt the lesson about making promises, and yet to see if people have learnt the lesson about believing the promises. This particular promise does seem quite open ended, and legally testable.....

[tombkk]

It's called jobs and all Thais can relate to having one or not.

Actually there are many Thai's who would rather sit around doing jack than work for a living. I arranged transport, advance payment, rooms, clothing and jobs for 8 fit young strong "Ayutthayans". They worked monday, tuesday took they day off, wednesday worked half day and then disappeared.... back to Ayutthaya I think.

I don't know abut these eight individuals, but I was talking about long-term jobs.

So was I talking about long term jobs.

How about the Issan workers I got from Libya, these guys or their relatives paid Bt120,000 to an agency to work there for Bt16,000/month.

When the poo hit the fan and it went tits up, they were shipped back to Thailand by the Thai navy. In their time of need, I gave 15 of them housing, clothing, advance payment, transport to and from work, wages of Bt12,000 + OT only to see them leave after a month..... <deleted>, Maybe I paid them too much.

Maybe you have a problem retaining your staff. Anyway, this is off-topic here.

[bangon04]

Really? Of course there will be. They are only digging a hole through the road, not the whole road. If they make, for instance, a 6M passage through the road, then the base and sub-base to the left and right of this passage will be prone to erosion. When the base and sub-base erodes, then the road above will collapse. You will no longer have only a 6M passage.

Actually the trench they dig only needs to be wide enough so they can wedge a motor boat into it - then they can run the propellers really fast and save bangkok - like last time. So enough trenches to wedge in 1000 small boats with fast propellers...... its not rocket science is it? Why don't the falangs understand?

[rubl]

I just stumbled over a breakingnews from the other newspaper, mind you it's date/timed at "28/10/2011 at 09:30 PM". I can't literally quote, but it referred to a daily briefing with FROC rejecting the proposal to dig up roads. After a aerial inspection it was concluded the present method of dredging and pumping could do the job just as good or even better.

Anyway, I can imagine that the floodwaters have caused a lot of debris to be transported and that for sure needs to be removed

Edited October 29, 2011 by rubl

[magpie3]

SIAMPOLEE wrote

"The airport had been an ongoing issue for years and everyone in the area knew it, not so much a case of the airport was built near his house more of a case of his house was built near the airport".

Well I must be completely mistaken then, and I've imagined the last 40 years of events.

Or perhaps there is not a big enough weight on your toes to make your eyes open wider?

[TAWP]

I think the airport was built near his house

The airport had been an ongoing issue for years and everyone in the area knew it, not so much a case of the airport was built near his house more of a case of his house was built near the airport.

Not when the land for his house was bought 40 years ago and the house was built 25 years ago.

[TAWP]

Photos of the abortive digging here:

go to visualthailand dot com and add this to the rest of the URL: "/story.php?id=1693#"

Sorry, can't post links. Very anticlimactic for a Toyota sponsored plan that involved at least 2 helicopter rides!!

Fixed url: http://visualthailand.com/story.php?id=1693#