House Or Condo?

[chonburi12]

Hi all,

What would you consider to be the pros and cons of living in either a house or condo here in Thailand? Originally, I was thinking about purchasing a house; however after thinking in more detail, I am considering condo living now.

C O N F U S E D!!

[Darrel]

The main advantage of condo ownership is that you can.

The main disadvantage of house ownership is that you cant.

Many people with an axe to grind (agents, lawyers, vendors) will tell you that you, farang, can buy a house and land here, but the truth is that you cant except by legal trickery that may backfire on you one day.

Other advantages/disadvantages?

In a condo you probably wont need to think about security, alarms, getting someone to do the pool, repairs to the building structure or roof, mowing the lawn, termites, snakes, dogs barking, karaoke bars, flooding.

But of course you will be sharing your surroundings and pool with a few hundred other people, and your immediate neighbour may be the world's noisiest drunk. But if he is then he will probably be annoying several other people as well as you, and by the time you have all complained to the building management it may well turn in your favour. Good luck trying to do the same in a house.

I'm sure some other posters will have a few ideas of relative merits also.

[guzzi850m2]

I live in a house with my family.

If I lived alone I would properly live in a condo but with a family, no thanks.

My 2 year old son can play in the garden (no pool) and he can drive in his small electric car around in the fenced/gated village very safely (with either his mom or me off course).

My 10 year old daughter can go swim/play in the communal pool with her friends.

Family = house. We have a app. 300 m2 house so lots of room which everybody likes and we grow mango and papaya and other stuff in the garden. I can go tinker with my car/motorbikes, have tools in a small outside room next to the car port. Lots of washing of clothes going on so nice to have space for hanging it (covered or in the sun).

Alone = condo. Maybe great sea views and close to restaurants and bars.

My 2 cents.

[Hooters]

The main advantage of condo ownership is that you can.

The main disadvantage of house ownership is that you cant.

Many people with an axe to grind (agents, lawyers, vendors) will tell you that you, farang, can buy a house and land here, but the truth is that you cant except by legal trickery that may backfire on you one day.

Other advantages/disadvantages?

In a condo you probably wont need to think about security, alarms, getting someone to do the pool, repairs to the building structure or roof, mowing the lawn, termites, snakes, dogs barking, karaoke bars, flooding.

But of course you will be sharing your surroundings and pool with a few hundred other people, and your immediate neighbour may be the world's noisiest drunk. But if he is then he will probably be annoying several other people as well as you, and by the time you have all complained to the building management it may well turn in your favour. Good luck trying to do the same in a house.

I'm sure some other posters will have a few ideas of relative merits also.

"But of course you will be sharing your surroundings and pool with a few hundred other people"

this is true but probably only 10% of them at any given time or the halls lobby and pool will be interesting to say the least

[pkrv]

I live in a house with my family.

If I lived alone I would properly live in a condo but with a family, no thanks.

My 2 year old son can play in the garden (no pool) and he can drive in his small electric car around in the fenced/gated village very safely (with either his mom or me off course).

My 10 year old daughter can go swim/play in the communal pool with her friends.

Family = house. We have a app. 300 m2 house so lots of room which everybody likes and we grow mango and papaya and other stuff in the garden. I can go tinker with my car/motorbikes, have tools in a small outside room next to the car port. Lots of washing of clothes going on so nice to have space for hanging it (covered or in the sun).

Alone = condo. Maybe great sea views and close to restaurants and bars.

My 2 cents.

Your wifes house - lets be blunt here.

[wpcoe]

I live in a house with my family.

If I lived alone I would properly live in a condo but with a family, no thanks.

That's pretty much how I view it, but maybe for different reason.

I am single, and have no intentions of ever getting married and/or having children. However, I might be interested in owning a townhouse (or maaaaybe a house) IF IT WERE LEGAL to do so IN MY NAME. It isn't, so I don't even consider it an option.

Married folks, if at least one spouse is Thai, can make a different, LEGAL, choice.

[london]

Chonburi12,

ALL the replies above have been spot on.

You have to decide on one thing and one thing only: what lifestyle do you want?

IF you have children, then they will feature very heavily in your needs and wants. If you don't, then your decision should be a lot simpler.

Once you have decided that, taking into consideration too the replies you have above, then your decision shouldn't be that difficult.

[thaiwanderer]

Assuming you are a foreigner - you can own a condo unit...but it's a condo unit.

As above lifestyle dependent so very personal. Beyond that depends on your appetite for risk, also very personal.

Edited January 6, 2012 by thaiwanderer

[ignis]

C O N F U S E D!!

Your not the 1st, myself cannot work out why people could be confused ?

I have lived once in a City [3 years in Berlin] years ago, so lived many places out in the sticks for 59 years, there is no question I would have not moved to Thailand if I could not live out in the sticks/Village, sure the house is not in my name but all legal via a Thai friend.. I have a garden all around my house, 200 odd Fish, 6 dogs, car and pickup, can do what I want when i want + do things on the house and garden without having to ask someone 1st, could not have/do any of that in a Condo...

All I can add is was the best move for me in 2003, and up to today.

[PattayaParent]

The main advantage of condo ownership is that you can.

The main disadvantage of house ownership is that you cant.

Many people with an axe to grind (agents, lawyers, vendors) will tell you that you, farang, can buy a house and land here, but the truth is that you cant except by legal trickery that may backfire on you one day.

Other advantages/disadvantages?

In a condo you probably wont need to think about security, alarms, getting someone to do the pool, repairs to the building structure or roof, mowing the lawn, termites, snakes, dogs barking, karaoke bars, flooding.

But of course you will be sharing your surroundings and pool with a few hundred other people, and your immediate neighbour may be the world's noisiest drunk. But if he is then he will probably be annoying several other people as well as you, and by the time you have all complained to the building management it may well turn in your favour. Good luck trying to do the same in a house.

I'm sure some other posters will have a few ideas of relative merits also.

The last condo unit I lived in had termites on the 12th floor, the current condo building has termites but not in my unit.

Snakes are sometimes found in the trees of the car park and one time caused a power outage by dropping onto the transformer and shorting it out.

Lots of soi dogs around barking day and night (and attacking passers by) and although no karaoke the bar next door can get noisy on the rare occasions it has a customer. But then I always have the windows open so get more noise than most.

Flooding is a problem if you are trapped in the condo building because the streets around are under water.

[LennyW]

Far too much rules and regulations of what you cannot do in a condo - all decided by other people of course - house every time for me!

I don't see why the OP would be CONFUSED though - completely different lifestyles.

[PattayaPhom]

I live in a house with my family.

If I lived alone I would properly live in a condo but with a family, no thanks.

My 2 year old son can play in the garden (no pool) and he can drive in his small electric car around in the fenced/gated village very safely (with either his mom or me off course).

My 10 year old daughter can go swim/play in the communal pool with her friends.

Family = house. We have a app. 300 m2 house so lots of room which everybody likes and we grow mango and papaya and other stuff in the garden. I can go tinker with my car/motorbikes, have tools in a small outside room next to the car port. Lots of washing of clothes going on so nice to have space for hanging it (covered or in the sun).

Alone = condo. Maybe great sea views and close to restaurants and bars.

My 2 cents.

Your wifes house - lets be blunt here.

Lets be blunt here, you dont know anything about the ownership situation with the poster and are talking rubbush

[PattayaPhom]

The main advantage of condo ownership is that you can.

The main disadvantage of house ownership is that you cant.

Many people with an axe to grind (agents, lawyers, vendors) will tell you that you, farang, can buy a house and land here, but the truth is that you cant except by legal trickery that may backfire on you one day.

Other advantages/disadvantages?

In a condo you probably wont need to think about security, alarms, getting someone to do the pool, repairs to the building structure or roof, mowing the lawn, termites, snakes, dogs barking, karaoke bars, flooding.

But of course you will be sharing your surroundings and pool with a few hundred other people, and your immediate neighbour may be the world's noisiest drunk. But if he is then he will probably be annoying several other people as well as you, and by the time you have all complained to the building management it may well turn in your favour. Good luck trying to do the same in a house.

I'm sure some other posters will have a few ideas of relative merits also.

Many posters with an axe to grind against property ownership in Thailand. Hundreds of Thousands have bought land and houses and are very happy...differences between a house and condo are obvious really.

[Darrel]

The last condo unit I lived in had termites on the 12th floor, the current condo building has termites but not in my unit.

Snakes are sometimes found in the trees of the car park and one time caused a power outage by dropping onto the transformer and shorting it out.

Lots of soi dogs around barking day and night (and attacking passers by) and although no karaoke the bar next door can get noisy on the rare occasions it has a customer. But then I always have the windows open so get more noise than most.

Flooding is a problem if you are trapped in the condo building because the streets around are under water.

I did say "probably" wont have trouble.

I've seen them here also (Metro, Sky Beach) but termites in condo buildings are fairly rare, and the management should sort it out before it becomes a real problem.

Snakes in the car park and flooding outside the building doesnt bother me too much. At least my unit will not be directly affected. Dogs and other pests should be removed by the management.

[Darrel]

Far too much rules and regulations of what you cannot do in a condo - all decided by other people of course - house every time for me!

The only things that are banned in condos I know are things that are likely to annoy other residents. If you find that you are affected by those rules then you are probably a neighbour from hell anyway. So good riddance to you.

There isnt a single rule in my building that causes me any trouble at all. I fact they should have more rules. I would vote for banning anyone under 50 from entering, and fining people who leave their front door open.

[guzzi850m2]

Far too much rules and regulations of what you cannot do in a condo - all decided by other people of course - house every time for me!

The only things that are banned in condos I know are things that are likely to annoy other residents. If you find that you are affected by those rules then you are probably a neighbour from hell anyway. So good riddance to you.

There isnt a single rule in my building that causes me any trouble at all. I fact they should have more rules. I would vote for banning anyone under 50 from entering, and fining people who leave their front door open.

What a miserable old bastard you are Darrel, he-he, banning anyone under 50 entering, so I guess you are not uncle Darrel for all the kids in your condo building huh.

[Darrel]

I guess you are not uncle Darrel for all the kids in your condo building huh.

Spot on. Luckily there are very few.

[mrbojangles]

Op. Have you considered renting for a while? Try renting a condo for 6 months and then a house for 6 months. Then way up the pros and cons. At least you won't be stuck and won't have forked out too much money.

[LennyW]

One major point to consider is "value for money", a house will always offer you far more square meters for your money.

[trogers]

One major point to consider is "value for money", a house will always offer you far more square meters for your money.

Depends on whether intention is for long term self-occupation, or possibly be rented out or sold 5-7 years later. A house has lower rental yield and lower price appreciation compared to a condo. Thus, value has to be redefined.

[andre47]

Many posters with an axe to grind against property ownership in Thailand. Hundreds of Thousands have bought land and houses and are very happy...differences between a house and condo are obvious really.

_{http://www.sunbeltle...In-Thailand.php}

Buying Land In Thailand

^{Foreigners are not legally allowed to own land although with a few exceptions they can own one rai of non-inheritable land.}

^{That said, many foreigners started majority Thai owned limited companies with the sole reason of buying land and this loophole is now being closed as more land offices are cracking down on non-active companies that purchase land. The Thai government has issued guidelines for local Land Offices to follow in regards to partially foreign owned companies buying and holding land. The use of nominee shareholders is being eliminated and this is not a wise way to obtain land.}

^{Current regulations require that the company be an actively trading business with money flowing through the books, shareholders meetings must be held, minutes taken and yearly audits filed. Additionally the company must have a legitimate business purpose that is registered with the Business Registration Department.}

^{The Land Office will investigate all Thai shareholders of a company wishing to purchase land and ensure that they are legitimate investors with enough financial resources to actually invest the required amount of capital in the company.}

^{The Thai spouse of a foreigner can purchase land but he or she must show there is no foreign claim to the money. While a foreign spouse can give the money to their Thai spouse they will most likely be required to sign a paper at the Land Office stating they make no claim on the money or the land, that it is personal property (Sin Suan Tua) and not common property (Sin Som Rot).}

^{This can also be recorded at the Thai Embassy overseas if the foreign spouse is overseas or by a qualified notary.}

^{The Thai spouse is the sole owner of the land and can mortgage, transfer or sell it without requiring the permission of the foreign spouse as it is not joint marital property. It is only the land that this regulation applies to and not any structures built jointly upon the property.}

^{Foreigners can obtain management of the property either through a 30 year lease that may be renewable at the discretion of the owner or through a usufruct that can be given for life.}

^{With a 30 year lease the foreign tenant does not own any interest in the land. This is generally completely acceptable with the Thai government and the foreigner can have a wide spectrum of rights to the land during the term of the lease. The Foreigner may, if the lease stipulates it, even be able to own any building structure on the land in his name.}

^{If the Lessee is renting an undeveloped piece of land and he or she intends to build his or her own structural building (house) on the designated land, it is best to specify the ownership of the building in the original agreement. If it is not specified and the lease expires, then the building will be considered the property of the landowner.}

^{If the tenant would like to transfer his rights to the land he will be limited to assigning those rights to the land to a third party (if allowed by the Lessor or the lease). In order to be valid, any lease longer than a three year period must be registered with the local Land Office where the land is located. Leases for up to three years may be entered into with a simple contract and do not need to be registered. Any lease longer than 3 years would be registered at the local Land Office and on the back of the title deed or Certificate of Use. Registering the lease at the local Land Office allows any potential third party purchasers of the land to know of the tenant's rights to the land during the period of the lease. If a third party buyer was to buy it, the tenant’s rights would be acquired for the remainder of the term of the lease.}

^{Many foreigners are told by sellers or developers that they can get the initial 30 year lease plus a second term of 30 years plus an additional third term 30 year lease option. However, under the Civil Commercial Code only the first 30 years is guaranteed valid for the tenant's rights to the lease (once the lease is registered at the local Land Office). There are court decisions which indicate that the renewal clause is personal to the landlord and thus may not be binding on his heirs or future landlords (Lessor).}

^{Also a lease contract can contractually bind the lessor to agree to a second term of 30 years, but again this is only enforceable after the owner of the land goes with the tenant to the Land Office and registers a 2nd term of 30 years. If the owner of the land does not wish to register the second term of thirty years, the tenant could file a lawsuit with the civil court against the owner, reason being breach of a contract between two individuals.}

^{A lease for industrial or commercial purposes can be granted for a term of up to 50 years and this may also include an option to renew for a further 50 years.}

^{A usufruct is a right granted by an owner of land in favour of a usufructuary where the usufructuary has the right to possess, use and enjoy the benefits of the property. The usufructuary can also have the right of management of the property.}

^{A usufruct may be created for your natural life. You also can lease the land to a third party which would not end if you died. Example: If you died, you can lease out the property to a third party before your demise as per the Supreme Court ruling 2297/1998; “the lessor does not have to be the owner of the property. Therefore the usufructuary can rent out the land. In the event of death of the usufructuary within the lease term, only the usufruct will be terminated but not also the lease.”}

^{However, any lease agreements longer than 3 years must be registered with the Land Office and with the title deed.}

^{A usufruct can also be given to more than 1 person at the time. With the usufruct, you are registered on the title deed. The land can never be sold or transferred by the owner of the land until the servitude is terminated. You can also get a yellow book which is a House Registration Certificate (Thor. Ror 13).}

^{The usufruct would be registered with a 1.5% tax of the value of the benefit (if you are not married to a Thai wife, if you are, the tax is less than 100 Baht).}

^{A 40 million baht investment into Thailand in specified assets or government bonds deemed beneficial to the Thai economy may allow a person to purchase one rai of non-inheritable land but it requires approval of the Ministr of Interiot.}

^{While in theory a foreigner married to a Thai national may, as their statutory heir or legatee, own property through inheritance, in practice we are unaware of this ever being the case. The caveat of the rule is that the foreigner's ownership of the land is contingent upon the approval of the Minister of the Interior under Section 93 of the Land Code Act. That "approval" is very, very unlikely to ever be obtained and therefore the foreign heir who has "inherited" 1 rai of property or 10 rai of agricultural property will not be allowed to keep it. This is because Section 86 states, in part, "aliens may acquire land by virtue of the provisions of a treaty giving the right to own immovable properties and subject to the provisions of this Code".}

^{The last treaty was terminated in 1970 and there is currently no treaty in effect with any country that allows foreigners to acquire land. No ministers have allowed foreigners to inherit Thai-land. Under present law any foreigner who acquires land by inheritance will have to dispose of the land within a reasonable period (meaning within 1 year) to a Thai national (or other entity allowed to own land in Thailand).}

^{If the foreigner fails to dispose of the land the Director General of the Land Department is authorized to dispose of the land and will retain a fee of 5% of the sale price before any taxes or liens are deducted.}

[london]

[london]

Andre47,

believe it or not, I would suggest that almost all of us who own property in Thailand are aware of all the points in this document.

We've seen it and heard it all before.

This is not to say its not correct.......

But thank-you for outlining it.

[andre47]

Andre47,

believe it or not, I would suggest that almost all of us who own property in Thailand are aware of all the points in this document.

We've seen it and heard it all before.

This is not to say its not correct.......

But thank-you for outlining it.

They should be aware about this, but many times you can read or hear from farangs who are thinking that they/or their advisors knows it better. They are buying the property and some of them are loosing it. Many times everything works fine because the Thai authorities are not checking, but if they do, most of them would loose their money. Sometimes it seems to me like a pyramid scheme. The devil takes the hindmost.

Edited January 8, 2012 by andre47

[london]

"They should be aware about this, but many times you can read or hear from farangs who are thinking that they/or their advisors knows it better. They are buying the property and some of them are loosing it. Many times everything works fine because the Thai authorities are not checking, but if they do, most of them would loose their money. Sometimes it seems to me like a pyramid scheme. The devil takes the hindmost."

Dear Andre47, honestly, I think that the vast majority are aware.

Do you actually know (first hand, not heresay) of cases where "They are buying the property and some of them are loosing it" ?

I have never heard of this happening when things have been done under the law as it exists at the time.

"Many times everything works fine because the Thai authorities are not checking, but if they do, most of them would loose their money"

Remember that only a fool buys without a lawyer checking everything. The Thai authorities can only act under the laws and legislation as it exists at the time. I doubt that most of them would lose any money if things have been done correctly.

A "pyramid scheme" ? I must say that I don't see that in any shape or form.

Remember too that retrospective legislation is fraught with dangers for the legislators.

However, getting back tot he question to OP asked, I take it that you would say either: don't buy anything or don't buy a house.

[thaiwanderer]

Remember that only a fool buys without a lawyer checking everything. The Thai authorities can only act under the laws and legislation as it exists at the time. I doubt that most of them would lose any money if things have been done correctly.

That's the rub though. Many believe (or at least claim) they are operating in a grey area / loophole when often the structures are totally illegal and entirely transparent. For these, enforcement of current laws rather than retrospective legislation is all that's required. Without rehashing (too much) old and repeated thread issues here, past enforcement is no guide to future, a general countrywide policy change / 'crackdown' isn't necessary, real estate isn't some protected golden goose and even if it was would require Thai authorities not shooting themselves in the foot (unheard of I know ).

As always its all about appetite for risk which is very personal (as is the assessment of the scale of the risk and the relevant amount of money at stake).

[thaiwanderer]

Remember that only a fool buys without a lawyer checking everything. The Thai authorities can only act under the laws and legislation as it exists at the time. I doubt that most of them would lose any money if things have been done correctly.

That's the rub though. Many believe (or at least claim) they are operating in a grey area / loophole when often the structures are totally illegal and entirely transparent. For these, enforcement of current laws rather than retrospective legislation is all that's required. Without rehashing (too much) old and repeated thread issues here, past enforcement is no guide to future, a general countrywide policy change / 'crackdown' isn't necessary, real estate isn't some protected golden goose and even if it was would require Thai authorities not shooting themselves in the foot (unheard of I know ).

As always its all about appetite for risk which is very personal (as is the assessment of the scale of the risk and the relevant amount of money at stake).

[Darrel]

..... I think that the vast majority are aware.

I've met several people, fresh off the banana boat, who have purchased company name condos from the developer in new Pattaya buildings without being made aware of any of the disadvantages of doing so.

Moral: dont trust agents selling you new builds, or used places for that matter.

[flying]

Op. Have you considered renting for a while? Try renting a condo for 6 months and then a house for 6 months. Then way up the pros and cons. At least you won't be stuck and won't have forked out too much money.

I think that is the best way for folks to really get a first hand experience of how it affects them.

All else will be based on experiences that may differ from the OP.

One side thought though..........If you are not 100% full time in Thailand....A condo is nice in that you can secure it & leave without worry

[PattayaParent]

Far too much rules and regulations of what you cannot do in a condo - all decided by other people of course - house every time for me!

The only things that are banned in condos I know are things that are likely to annoy other residents. If you find that you are affected by those rules then you are probably a neighbour from hell anyway. So good riddance to you.

There isnt a single rule in my building that causes me any trouble at all. I fact they should have more rules. I would vote for banning anyone under 50 from entering, and fining people who leave their front door open.

I think you live in my building