UN's Ban seeks Israel-Palestine peace talks during upcoming Middle East visit

[Jingthing]

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Of course, I can only speak for myself and I do have my anti-semitic moments.

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I appreciate your honesty, but frankly, that isn't news.

[Jingthing]

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Was it Einstein that said, If you build a million dollar house in a thousand dollar neighborhood, you will never get along with your neighbors?

I don't know. That doesn't sound like something he would have said. Can you supply a link? Edited January 28, 2012 by Jingthing

[Steely Dan]

Was it Einstein that said, If you build a million dollar house in a thousand dollar neighborhood, you will never get along with your neighbors?

All the worse if your mansion is surrounded by caravans, whose owners think they pre-dated the park.

[Rusty2009]

Just curious, how can you elect terrorists ??,

Maybe you should ask Hamas.

If you look back in history most of the western folk hero`s were criminals and thiefs, i.e Robin Hood, Nelson Mandella, is a convicted terrorsit, and in the eyes of the English George Washington was also a terrorist

[Ulysses G.]

None of them - other than Mandella - purposely targeted innocent civilians for mass murder -, so what is your point?

[Rusty2009]

None of them - other than Mandella - purposely targeted innocent civilians for mass murder -, so what is your point?

What i am trying to say those without sin should cast the first stone, Benjamin Netanyahu himself is a decorated soldier gaining the rank of Captain with the special forces, and i am sure also a member of Mossad, who we all know are squeaky clean.

[Jingthing]

None of them - other than Mandella - purposely targeted innocent civilians for mass murder -, so what is your point?

What i am trying to say those without sin should cast the first stone, Benjamin Netanyahu himself is a decorated soldier gaining the rank of Captain with the special forces, and i am sure also a member of Mossad, who we all know are squeaky clean.

Rusty, both sides are not pure and both sides have legitimate issues they have every right to pursue. What bugs me are the people who try to paint this conflict as pure black and white, either way. Sure Palestinians deserve their own state. A fair reading of history shows they could have had that DECADES ago, and to only blame Israel for their failure is simply unfair.

[Rusty2009]

None of them - other than Mandella - purposely targeted innocent civilians for mass murder -, so what is your point?

What i am trying to say those without sin should cast the first stone, Benjamin Netanyahu himself is a decorated soldier gaining the rank of Captain with the special forces, and i am sure also a member of Mossad, who we all know are squeaky clean.

Rusty, both sides are not pure and both sides have legitimate issues they have every right to pursue. What bugs me are the people who try to paint this conflict as pure black and white, either way. Sure Palestinians deserve their own state. A fair reading of history shows they could have had that DECADES ago, and to only blame Israel for their failure is simply unfair.

Thank you sir, i agree 100% with you, and i truly hope they can find away to stop the killing.do we all not kneel to pray?,

[Morch]

They also demolish illegal Israeli buildings and settlements.

A bit. And after much debate, court proceedings and a lot of political give and take.

Not on the same scale or ease in which it is done vs. the Palestinians.

In 2011 more illegal Israeli buildings were demolished than Palestinian ones, the facts can be quite surprising when you strip away the biased propaganda.

Interesting. Could you provide a link to some data on this?

[Ulysses G.]

None of them - other than Mandella - purposely targeted innocent civilians for mass murder -, so what is your point?

What i am trying to say those without sin should cast the first stone, Benjamin Netanyahu himself is a decorated soldier gaining the rank of Captain with the special forces, and i am sure also a member of Mossad, who we all know are squeaky clean.

There is a big difference between serving your country as a professional soldier and purposely targeting innocent women and children for death for sport.

[Scott]

There is also a difference between making a point and endlessly arguing in an off-topic fashion....

Please stay on topic.

[Steely Dan]

In 2011 more illegal Israeli buildings were demolished than Palestinian ones, the facts can be quite surprising when you strip away the biased propaganda.

Interesting. Could you provide a link to some data on this?

Here is the Jerusalem situation, I believe the same applies nationally.

According to May, in 2011 the municipality carried out eight demolitions of illegal structures in east Jerusalem, compared to 67 in west Jerusalem. In 2010, there were 23 demolitions of illegal structures in east Jerusalem, and 58 in west Jerusalem.

http://www.jpost.com/NationalNews/Article.aspx?id=252812&R=R2

And here is an article showing that contrary to the press propaganda the reality is there is a massive illegal housebuilding operation by the PA funded by arab governments and even with this the rate of demolitions is only 1%. Also contrary to the propaganda the Jerusalem authority has granted 36,000 permits for new houses in the arab sector, enough until 2020.

http://frontpagemag.com/2011/12/20/idf-home-demolitions/

Not what you might expect but propaganda works by picking a few big lies and repeating them continually.

[Rusty2009]

None of them - other than Mandella - purposely targeted innocent civilians for mass murder -, so what is your point?

What i am trying to say those without sin should cast the first stone, Benjamin Netanyahu himself is a decorated soldier gaining the rank of Captain with the special forces, and i am sure also a member of Mossad, who we all know are squeaky clean.

There is a big difference between serving your country as a professional soldier and purposely targeting innocent women and children for death for sport.

i do not want to get into who is right who is wrong, i just want the killing to stop, but i did find a graph saying between 1987 and 2010 civilian casualtys stand at palestinians 7978- israelis 1503, such a waste of life makes me sad

[Ulysses G.]

It sounds like the Palestinian Arabs need to stop shooting rockets at civilians and sign that peace treaty.

Edited January 28, 2012 by Ulysses G.

[Rusty2009]

It sounds like the Palestinian Arabs need to stop shooting rockets at civilians and sign that peace treaty.

such a smug arrogant attitude, what are you trying to say, we can kill you faster than you can kill us, so we win you loose

[philw]

Just curious, how can you elect terrorists ??,

Maybe you should ask Hamas.

Your selective editing and quoting of peoples posts is really quite offensive and not clever.

[Morch]

In 2011 more illegal Israeli buildings were demolished than Palestinian ones, the facts can be quite surprising when you strip away the biased propaganda.

Interesting. Could you provide a link to some data on this?

Here is the Jerusalem situation, I believe the same applies nationally.

According to May, in 2011 the municipality carried out eight demolitions of illegal structures in east Jerusalem, compared to 67 in west Jerusalem. In 2010, there were 23 demolitions of illegal structures in east Jerusalem, and 58 in west Jerusalem.

http://www.jpost.com...?id=252812&R=R2

And here is an article showing that contrary to the press propaganda the reality is there is a massive illegal housebuilding operation by the PA funded by arab governments and even with this the rate of demolitions is only 1%. Also contrary to the propaganda the Jerusalem authority has granted 36,000 permits for new houses in the arab sector, enough until 2020.

http://frontpagemag....me-demolitions/

Not what you might expect but propaganda works by picking a few big lies and repeating them continually.

Well, yes...this is in Jerusalem and it's not a new issue. Especially since the building of the security wall, the city is effectively split, and much In the same way, the Jerusalem municipality doesn't provide other civic services as well.

The numbers quoted vary greatly (one source says 1000 new illegal buildings a year, other claims 10,000), which I think points to the ease with which facts and numbers could be played here (probably both sides are at it to some degree). Vague terminology helps some too - for example, "demolition" may refer both to destroying a whole building, or just tearing down an illegal addition to one.

But anyway, this differs greatly from the situation in the West Bank (which I think is what we were talking about). Out there, it's basically the IDF (and some police) who runs things, so (1) legal proceedings are faster (2) less bureaucracy while executing demolitions (3) IDF provides it's own security (4) a lot less media around, and not as sure to make a headline as Jerusalem.

Last point bring us back to the media's role, and here I quite agree with you that coverage is pretty biased. Same goes for UN resolutions etc

[Rusty2009]

The only way forward is to have a two state solution, the troubles have gone on to long and there is to much imbedded hate:The jewish people deserve to live in their rightful homeland. But the Palestinian people deserve their own land and have a right to self determination.Albert Einstein believed in Sympathetic cooperation,and insisted "no problem can be solved from the same level that created it". Two people in one land it would never work this would undermine Israel as a sovereign Jewish state. This i believe they would and should not give up. But they have to give the Palestinians room to move and evolve, the actions of the jewish settlers is immorally wrong in their land grabbing polacies.either Israel backs down or commits genocide. I do not put this lightly but with the modern history and persecution of the Jews,is this what the Jewish people want?

[Jingthing]

The use of the word genocide is completely wrong when talking about Palestinian Arabs. Please reserve that word for situations where that strong word actually fits.

[Rusty2009]

The use of the word genocide is completely wrong when talking about Palestinian Arabs. Please reserve that word for situations where that strong word actually fits.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genocide

[Jingthing]

What's your point? I find your suggestion that Jews are committing genocide upon Arabs to be totally obnoxious and totally false. Its the same kind of thing as suggesting modern Israel is equivalent to Nazi Germany. I suggest you back off. There is no reasoning behind it. Keep it real, OK? You want to talk genocide, talk Rwanda and Cambodia.

Don't get me wrong. In the history of the Jewish-Arab conflict there have certainly been cases of horrific mass murders of both Arabs and Jews. But to say that the nation state of Israel which includes a 20 percent Arab population is systemically mass murdering Arabs is just totally wrong. Also, the Palestinian Arabs even in Gaza, are certainly not starving. So, no genocide. Bad stuff is happening, yes, not genocide.

Here's an interesting factoid. The population of Palestinians has GONE UP every year since the 1967 war. Some genocide, huh? You give a wiki link about genocide in general and then no argument yourself to support using such an inflammatory accusation about the Palestinians in particular. Kind of weak, I would say.

Edited January 28, 2012 by Jingthing

[Rusty2009]

What's your point? I find your suggestion that Jews are committing genocide upon Arabs to be totally obnoxious and totally false. Its the same kind of thing as suggesting modern Israel is equivalent to Nazi Germany. I suggest you back off. There is no reasoning behind it. Keep it real, OK? You want to talk genocide, talk Rwanda and Cambodia.

Don't get me wrong. In the history of the Jewish-Arab conflict there have certainly been cases of horrific mass murders of both Arabs and Jews. But to say that the nation state of Israel which includes a 20 percent Arab population is systemically mass murdering Arabs is just totally wrong. Also, the Palestinian Arabs even in Gaza, are certainly not starving. So, no genocide. Bad stuff is happening, yes, not genocide.

ok so what is Israels ultimate goal, is it to hurd them together in a zoo like environment, and throw a banana over the wall ever now and then.Educate me please

[Jingthing]

What's your point? I find your suggestion that Jews are committing genocide upon Arabs to be totally obnoxious and totally false. Its the same kind of thing as suggesting modern Israel is equivalent to Nazi Germany. I suggest you back off. There is no reasoning behind it. Keep it real, OK? You want to talk genocide, talk Rwanda and Cambodia.

Don't get me wrong. In the history of the Jewish-Arab conflict there have certainly been cases of horrific mass murders of both Arabs and Jews. But to say that the nation state of Israel which includes a 20 percent Arab population is systemically mass murdering Arabs is just totally wrong. Also, the Palestinian Arabs even in Gaza, are certainly not starving. So, no genocide. Bad stuff is happening, yes, not genocide.

ok so what is Israels ultimate goal, is it to hurd them together in a zoo like environment, and throw a banana over the wall ever now and then.Educate me please

That doesn't even deserve a reply. Its insulting. Educate yourself. Then come back.

[Rusty2009]

What's your point? I find your suggestion that Jews are committing genocide upon Arabs to be totally obnoxious and totally false. Its the same kind of thing as suggesting modern Israel is equivalent to Nazi Germany. I suggest you back off. There is no reasoning behind it. Keep it real, OK? You want to talk genocide, talk Rwanda and Cambodia.

Don't get me wrong. In the history of the Jewish-Arab conflict there have certainly been cases of horrific mass murders of both Arabs and Jews. But to say that the nation state of Israel which includes a 20 percent Arab population is systemically mass murdering Arabs is just totally wrong. Also, the Palestinian Arabs even in Gaza, are certainly not starving. So, no genocide. Bad stuff is happening, yes, not genocide.

ok so what is Israels ultimate goal, is it to hurd them together in a zoo like environment, and throw a banana over the wall ever now and then.Educate me please

That doesn't even deserve a reply. Its insulting. Educate yourself. Then come back.

I am British, but i am based in Germany, my home town of Leeds has a very large jewish community. The small town where i live in Germany, the building which was the Synagugue still remains along with the jewish cemetry, which is still maintaned and cared for by the local council,i am no way anti-Semitic. I see the guilt the past has inflicted on this generation of Germans. But please explain your views on how the troubles can be ended

[Jingthing]

Actually, it was more insulting to the Arabs, dude. That banana crack was disgusting. As if they have no power to determine their own future and possible solutions. I ain't the Israeli government and I ain't the Palestinian leadership. Of course there are potential paths for peace. I have stated my views many times. I don't think the Palestinians have it in them to formally accept the existence of Israel as a Jewish state or give up their demand for unconditional right of return. That's nuts, what state would voluntarily negotiate their own demise?

[Rusty2009]

Actually, it was more insulting to the Arabs, dude. That banana crack was disgusting. As if they have no power to determine their own future and possible solutions. I ain't the Israeli government and I ain't the Palestinian leadership. Of course there are potential paths for peace. I have stated my views many times. I don't think the Palestinians have it in them to formally accept the existence of Israel as a Jewish state or give up their demand for unconditional right of return. That's nuts, what state would voluntarily negotiate their own demise?

Stop being such a drama queen, again you come in shouting and screaming. 20 years of talks have gained nothing, fact is there are two sides who are not equal, one is the oppressor and the other the oppressed, or the occupier and the occupied.Israel and the US are one and Obama god bless him has his hands tied, Israel has to back down and respect the 1967 border lines, its the only way to end this stalemate.

[Jingthing]

It sounds like the Palestinian Arabs need to stop shooting rockets at civilians and sign that peace treaty.

such a smug arrogant attitude, what are you trying to say, we can kill you faster than you can kill us, so we win you loose

If you had terrorists rocketing your country, you would hope your military was strong. UG is right. The Palestinians need to stop the rockets as basic first step.

[Jingthing]

Actually, it was more insulting to the Arabs, dude. That banana crack was disgusting. As if they have no power to determine their own future and possible solutions. I ain't the Israeli government and I ain't the Palestinian leadership. Of course there are potential paths for peace. I have stated my views many times. I don't think the Palestinians have it in them to formally accept the existence of Israel as a Jewish state or give up their demand for unconditional right of return. That's nuts, what state would voluntarily negotiate their own demise?

Stop being such a drama queen, again you come in shouting and screaming. 20 years of talks have gained nothing, fact is there are two sides who are not equal, one is the oppressor and the other the oppressed, or the occupier and the occupied.Israel and the US are one and Obama god bless him has his hands tied, Israel has to back down and respect the 1967 border lines, its the only way to end this stalemate.

Respect the borders of a force dedicated to wipe them out? Palestine isn't yet a country. They COULD be if they wanted peace, stopped attacks, and accept the existence of Israel. You are very open minded about what Jews should give up voluntarily and how they should loosen up and accept higher casualties. I doubt if it was you in that situation you would be so liberal. You paint the Palestinians as saints. Hamas is a disgusting radical Islamic fundamentalist regime, the kind like Iran that murders their own women and gays, completely intolerant. Yes the Gaza people VOTED for that! That's their right to repress their own people but they have no right to overthrow Israel. Both Palestinian government sides teach their children to murder Jews. Yes they are very racist. It is not black and white.

You express a typical Euro left wing sentiment that IF ONLY Israel gave up on the west bank settlements, magically the Palestinians would accept the existence of Israel and stop their movement to destroy Israel. You do realize, don't you, Israel painfully to them gave back Gaza as a peace gesture, and the result was the opposite of peace? Yes, the Palestinians don't trust Israel, that's understandable, but seriously why should Israel trust the Palestinians even one little bit?

Edited January 29, 2012 by Jingthing

[Ulysses G.]

Israel has to back down and respect the 1967 border lines, its the only way to end this stalemate.

They already tried giving the Palestian Arabs Gaza and they elected Hamas and turned it into an armed camp. The only way to end the stalemate is for the Arabs to renounce terrorism, sign a peace treaty and honor it.

[Rusty2009]

Actually, it was more insulting to the Arabs, dude. That banana crack was disgusting. As if they have no power to determine their own future and possible solutions. I ain't the Israeli government and I ain't the Palestinian leadership. Of course there are potential paths for peace. I have stated my views many times. I don't think the Palestinians have it in them to formally accept the existence of Israel as a Jewish state or give up their demand for unconditional right of return. That's nuts, what state would voluntarily negotiate their own demise?

Stop being such a drama queen, again you come in shouting and screaming. 20 years of talks have gained nothing, fact is there are two sides who are not equal, one is the oppressor and the other the oppressed, or the occupier and the occupied.Israel and the US are one and Obama god bless him has his hands tied, Israel has to back down and respect the 1967 border lines, its the only way to end this stalemate.

Respect the borders of a force dedicated to wipe them out? Palestine isn't yet a country. They COULD be if they wanted peace, stopped attacks, and accept the existence of Israel. You are very open minded about what Jews should give up voluntarily and how they should loosen up and accept higher casualties. I doubt if it was you in that situation you would be so liberal. You paint the Palestinians as saints. Hamas is a disgusting radical Islamic fundamentalist regime, the kind like Iran that murders their own women and gays, completely intolerant. Yes the Gaza people VOTED for that! That's their right to repress their own people but they have no right to overthrow Israel. Both Palestinian government sides teach their children to murder Jews. Yes they are very racist. It is not black and white.

You express a typical Euro left wing sentiment that IF ONLY Israel gave up on the west bank settlements, magically the Palestinians would accept the existence of Israel and stop their movement to destroy Israel. You do realize, don't you, Israel painfully to them gave back Gaza as a peace gesture, and the result was the opposite of peace? Yes, the Palestinians don't trust Israel, that's understandable, but seriously why should Israel trust the Palestinians even one little bit?

"Pease cannot be kept by force, it can only be achieved by understanding" Albert Einstein

i can only hope the Palestinian people have seen what is happening all around them, and come to realise violence is no answer, i grew up with the threat and a menace comming from Northern Irland, and a typical EURO left winger, no that is not me, i think i am a little bit to romantic.