Songkran Is It Timeto Legislate?

[theoldgit]

Putting ice in the bucket is something only Thais would understand. It is called Sanuk. If you don't understand sanuk - then there is no point in replying to you.

I didn't know what the word Sanuk meant, so I had to Google it, it days "The concept of sanuk in Thailand is all about injecting a sense of enjoyment into every day life." - assuming that's correct, it still doesn't explain why somebody has to soak somebody with iced water to enjoy everyday life.

Referring to an earlier comment I made, I'm totally shocked that now four posters have voted that they believe the fact that 5050 human beings have lost their lives during this festival is acceptable.

[Jingthing]

Legislate !! What a bloody stupid thing for a foreigner to say in Thailand for one of many.

We have few problems in the Songkran festival it's great to see people enjoying themselves.

Funny my Thai teacher friend was here while I opened this, after explaining a bit about what the OP was on about, he just said " He is not Thai why does he want to interfere in what Thais do ", unable to post the reply.

Typical paranoid-arrogant attitude. If we live here, we have a basic human right to at least have OPINIONS about what goes on here.

[StreetCowboy]

How would you feel if an Asian or an African told you how you should behave after a Superbowl game or during Thanksgiving. No matter how you put it - it would sound unwelcome. They should realize that there is too much carnage on the road. You can whine all you like and it won't matter because we are just visitors here. Be aware of the danger. Be aware that while you are not DUI, the other guy might be. Keep off the highway.

Putting ice in the bucket is something only Thais would understand. It is called Sanuk. If you don't understand sanuk - then there is no point in replying to you.

The accidents are caused by DUI, lax implementation of traffic laws, massive traffic mobilization during the festival and NOT the festival itself. The poll wants to become a nanny to a foreign country. Love it or leave it.

I don't think that the OP was trying to legislate against songkran; no doubt it would still appear on calendars. What he was suggesting was clamping down on throwing buckets of iced water over motorcyclists. So far, I've not seen anyone explain the benefits of this, though not having tried it myself, I am interested to know how many of the 500 killed each year die from such foolishness, and therefore whether it is a problem that we (meaning they) should be clamping down on, or whether it is just a problem in our perception.

SC

At the risk of labouring the point...

I thought that sanuk was all about getting pissed up and doing 360s on your motor bike while smoking a spliff and dancing till 3 in the morning.

I had not realised it was about throwing buckets of iced water over passing motorcyclists to see if they did 360s while going about their innocent business.

Since I don't ride a motorcycle, it is of only academic interest, particularly as the Thai tax system no longer burdens me, and I don't need to worry about the cost or loss of potential.

As you say, I don't understand sanuk, but perhaps you would like to explain it, leading up to the iced water over passing motorcycles part, and then you may feel justified in replying. However, as you rightly said, if you can't explain that clearly, its probably not worth your while replying.

To be honest, I doubt if the majority of Thais feel that 500 fatalities over a few days' holiday is acceptable, or it would not be front-page news for several days. Perhaps Thais don't understand sanuk as well as you do, either.

Where I come from, sanuk involves Hogmanay getting singing drunk and snogging a copper, but what do I know? I understand they (the coppers) are not allowed to do that any more, for fear of industrial illness, and if they do, they're not supposed to use their tongues.

SC

[GuestHouse]

Funny my Thai teacher friend was here while I opened this, after explaining a bit about what the OP was on about, he just said " He is not Thai why does he want to interfere in what Thais do ",

I'd say odd rather than funny.

Oddly convenient of him to call by at such an opportune moment and offer such a convenient prop to your argument.

And odd in that its a barely credible claim.

I think it best under the circumstances to let the reader decide.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

The big problem with Songkran is the drunk driving, not the water fights. Banning the squirtguns and water bucket trucks will make grumpy old farts drier but people will still be dieing in huge numbers.

Agree completely. Note also that the number of accidents and deaths around other holiday periods (that don't involve water) are very similar on a per-day basis. It's the drunk driving, combined with mass move of people visting relatives / their home province that causes the horrific numbers.

[robblok]

The big problem with Songkran is the drunk driving, not the water fights. Banning the squirtguns and water bucket trucks will make grumpy old farts drier but people will still be dieing in huge numbers.

Agree completely. Note also that the number of accidents and deaths around other holiday periods (that don't involve water) are very similar on a per-day basis. It's the drunk driving, combined with mass move of people visting relatives / their home province that causes the horrific numbers.

I agree 100% its the drunk driving that is the problem. I never have a problem with songkran. I just stay home and work. If you don't want to be involved then avoid it.

[Mobi]

The big problem with Songkran is the drunk driving, not the water fights. Banning the squirtguns and water bucket trucks will make grumpy old farts drier but people will still be dieing in huge numbers.

Agree completely. Note also that the number of accidents and deaths around other holiday periods (that don't involve water) are very similar on a per-day basis. It's the drunk driving, combined with mass move of people visting relatives / their home province that causes the horrific numbers.

Precisely the point I have made in two posts but is conveniently ignored by those who seem to think that chucking ice is the cause of most of the deaths.

if you're going to legislate against Songkran, why don't you legislate against New Year celebrations as well, as that holiday also produces a huge number of deaths - THROUGH DRUNK DRIVING - NOT BECAUSE OF WATER THROWING!

And while you're about banning festivals that cause unnecessary injuries and deaths, how about banning 'bonfire night' in the UK as that usually kills or maims a fair number of people, or how about Chinese New Year? Fireworks are deadly as the Suphan Buri residents discovered a few weeks ago.

As for the cops making money at Sonkran road blocks - on the whole, this is the one time that they do not accept bribes and are usually very diligent about locking up drunks.

[MAJIC]

Putting ice in the bucket is something only Thais would understand. It is called Sanuk. If you don't understand sanuk - then there is no point in replying to you.

I didn't know what the word Sanuk meant, so I had to Google it, it days "The concept of sanuk in Thailand is all about injecting a sense of enjoyment into every day life." - assuming that's correct, it still doesn't explain why somebody has to soak somebody with iced water to enjoy everyday life.

Referring to an earlier comment I made, I'm totally shocked that now four posters have voted that they believe the fact that 5050 human beings have lost their lives during this festival is acceptable.

I am also shocked,and a result totally unexpected, and difficult to believe,or understand, the thinking behind it. It seems to indicate as long as the people are having fun,never mind the Carnage? surely i'm wrong?

Sadly it's now five votes,and perhaps more to come.

[Ulysses G.]

I'm totally shocked that now four posters have voted that they believe the fact that 5050 human beings have lost their lives during this festival is acceptable.

That is because the poll is rigged to make it almost impossible to vote for allowing the Thais to do as they like with their hoilday, but also express support for doing something to prevent traffic deaths.

Edited February 6, 2012 by Ulysses G.

[cobbler]

Putting ice in the bucket is something only Thais would understand. It is called Sanuk. If you don't understand sanuk - then there is no point in replying to you.

I didn't know what the word Sanuk meant, so I had to Google it, it days "The concept of sanuk in Thailand is all about injecting a sense of enjoyment into every day life." - assuming that's correct, it still doesn't explain why somebody has to soak somebody with iced water to enjoy everyday life.

Referring to an earlier comment I made, I'm totally shocked that now four posters have voted that they believe the fact that 5050 human beings have lost their lives during this festival is acceptable.

I am also shocked,and a result totally unexpected, and difficult to believe,or understand, the thinking behind it. It seems to indicate as long as the people are having fun,never mind the Carnage? surely i'm wrong?

Sadly it's now five votes,and perhaps more to come.

You are not wrong.So lets ban driving cars because people die in them,Ban motorcycles cause people die on them,ban buses cause people die in them,ban walking on the street cause people die on the street,ban buildings cause they fall in on people,ban water and the ocean cause people drown in it,ban glass cause people cut there wrists with it after reading your communist ideas and die,ban shit cause people get constipated and die,ban kidneys cause people die of kidney stones,ban marriage in Australia cause 4 seperatedf fathers suicide every day,and ban guests who come to other countries and then mouth off about what they don't like,I'm just so thankful to be here,I love this place..Thank you THAILAND for having me.

P.S. My wife says "go home,what are you doing here,enjoy your easter coming up soon,oh so sorry you can't Jesus died,so ban that too.HAHAHA

[Semper]

What is needed is a massive shift in education towards a belief in materialistic consequences- in other words, if you drive drunk or stupidly, you increase your chance of accidents. Driving drunk and/or recklessly is already illegal, but as you point out, it's hardly stopping anyone. So I doubt new legislation would really help.

Well, it would help, if it would be legislated to 1 or 2 days only. But other members would surely be happy if it was going on for 1 month.

[MAJIC]

Legislate !! What a bloody stupid thing for a foreigner to say in Thailand for one of many.

We have few problems in the Songkran festival it's great to see people enjoying themselves.

Funny my Thai teacher friend was here while I opened this, after explaining a bit about what the OP was on about, he just said " He is not Thai why does he want to interfere in what Thais do ", unable to post the reply.

You and your Thai Teacher friend should learn the difference between: having an "Opinion" and "Interference"we all know nothing we say on TV will make any difference. As for "We have few problems in the Songkran Festival" do carry on deluding yourself.

[MAJIC]

What is needed is a massive shift in education towards a belief in materialistic consequences- in other words, if you drive drunk or stupidly, you increase your chance of accidents. Driving drunk and/or recklessly is already illegal, but as you point out, it's hardly stopping anyone. So I doubt new legislation would really help.

Well, it would help, if it would be legislated to 1 or 2 days only. But other members would surely be happy if it was going on for 1 month.

Very true,reducing the amount of days allowed for Songkran,would in itself reduce the death toll and accidents quite considerably.

[Ulysses G.]

I have to admit that I would much prefer if it were only one or two days.

[MAJIC]

I'm totally shocked that now four posters have voted that they believe the fact that 5050 human beings have lost their lives during this festival is acceptable.

That is because the poll is rigged to make it almost impossible to vote for allowing the Thais to do as they like with their hoilday, but also express support for doing something to prevent traffic deaths.

In every Poll I have ever seen on TV there is always someone who critisises the format,not enoughquestions/too many.....not enough choices/too many...... too complicated/too simple,...I have not Rigged the Poll,or biased it in any way intentsionally,the questions were mean't to be simple Yes or No answers.and I never claimed the Poll was scientifically perfect,even proffessional Pollsters would struggle on that one.

Maybe you should do a Poll? then you will understand you can't please everyone.

In any case the Thais are already doing what they want with their holiday,so what was your point?

Edited February 6, 2012 by MAJIC

[Kwasaki]

Legislate !! What a bloody stupid thing for a foreigner to say in Thailand for one of many.

We have few problems in the Songkran festival it's great to see people enjoying themselves.

Funny my Thai teacher friend was here while I opened this, after explaining a bit about what the OP was on about, he just said " He is not Thai why does he want to interfere in what Thais do ", unable to post the reply.

Typical paranoid-arrogant attitude. If we live here, we have a basic human right to at least have OPINIONS about what goes on here.

No we do not !! Maybe on thaivisa.com but not in the real world.

[Ulysses G.]

So the main question on this:..... is having fun worth dying for? or losing a family member,friend etc?

Sorry, but this poll is rigged to force anyone who does not agree with banning Songkran to not have a vote unless they say that deaths are OK and that there can not be any minor changes in the current system.

I agree that it is hard to do polls well, but this is designed to make anyone who does not agree with the Grumpy Old Men types look heartless.

Edited February 6, 2012 by Ulysses G.

[Kwasaki]

Funny my Thai teacher friend was here while I opened this, after explaining a bit about what the OP was on about, he just said " He is not Thai why does he want to interfere in what Thais do ",

I'd say odd rather than funny.

Oddly convenient of him to call by at such an opportune moment and offer such a convenient prop to your argument.

And odd in that its a barely credible claim.

I think it best under the circumstances to let the reader decide.

I don't think you would believe anything I posted, and me being accused of arrogance already, I think the OP's post is arrogrant, maybe the Thai teacher I know is not so hi-so of the Thais you know but that what he read was understood by him. He said who is this he, not really just my thoughts.

Edited February 6, 2012 by Kwasaki

[Kwasaki]

Legislate !! What a bloody stupid thing for a foreigner to say in Thailand for one of many.

We have few problems in the Songkran festival it's great to see people enjoying themselves.

Funny my Thai teacher friend was here while I opened this, after explaining a bit about what the OP was on about, he just said " He is not Thai why does he want to interfere in what Thais do ", unable to post the reply.

You and your Thai Teacher friend should learn the difference between: having an "Opinion" and "Interference"we all know nothing we say on TV will make any difference. As for "We have few problems in the Songkran Festival" do carry on deluding yourself.

I am always learning in Thailand and probably always will, it appears I am not so clever as some of the alien people think that are living here or part time already.

Delusion, that's a bit strong !!

No not at all I am just embarrassed trying to explain the idiot things said on thaivisa by foreigners who live in Thailand and start talking about legislation.

What goes on in Songkran Festival is for the Thai people to decide, not some foreign person who think they are so bloody clever and spouting on about safety when Thai sites have already warned of some of the dangers.

[StreetCowboy]

The big problem with Songkran is the drunk driving, not the water fights. Banning the squirtguns and water bucket trucks will make grumpy old farts drier but people will still be dieing in huge numbers.

Agree completely. Note also that the number of accidents and deaths around other holiday periods (that don't involve water) are very similar on a per-day basis. It's the drunk driving, combined with mass move of people visting relatives / their home province that causes the horrific numbers.

Precisely the point I have made in two posts but is conveniently ignored by those who seem to think that chucking ice is the cause of most of the deaths.

if you're going to legislate against Songkran, why don't you legislate against New Year celebrations as well, as that holiday also produces a huge number of deaths - THROUGH DRUNK DRIVING - NOT BECAUSE OF WATER THROWING!

And while you're about banning festivals that cause unnecessary injuries and deaths, how about banning 'bonfire night' in the UK as that usually kills or maims a fair number of people, or how about Chinese New Year? Fireworks are deadly as the Suphan Buri residents discovered a few weeks ago.

As for the cops making money at Sonkran road blocks - on the whole, this is the one time that they do not accept bribes and are usually very diligent about locking up drunks.

My point was that the statistics we are offered do not distinguish the fatalities through our own stupidity from those due to other people's stupidity, If the latter is relatively small, and Thais are not unhappy with the carnage, then we have no choice but ot live with it. If noyt, then perhaps we should be trrying to draw to their attention the cost and inconvenience,

SC

Anyway, I'm safe at home with a skinful in the fridge, so if I need to, ...

I am fortunate that the loss of a few more thais will not affect me, and no-one I know rides a motorcycle, to the best of my knowldege. Therefore, whether anyone listens to my opinion or not is irrelevant to me, but may be distressing to doctors in A & E. TIT.

SC

Edited February 6, 2012 by StreetCowboy

[MAJIC]

So the main question on this:..... is having fun worth dying for? or losing a family member,friend etc?

Sorry, but this poll is rigged to force anyone who does not agree with banning Songkran to not have a vote unless they say that deaths are OK and that there can not be any minor changes in the current system.

I agree that it is hard to do polls well, but this is designed to make anyone who does not agree with the Grumpy Old Men types look heartless.

First you accuse me of Rigging the Poll, because the questions don't suit you,and now you are also saying the poll is forcing people to agree with Banning Songkran,and there can't be any minor changes in the current system (as above)

So when did I advocate Banning Songkran?

Or that there can't be any minor changes in the current system?

It seems to me you are reading much too much into this simple Poll,that was never there in the first place! it was designed to get other members views on Songkran that is all and nothing sinister intended,or forcing people to do anything,the choice was always up to the member/voter.

[cobbler]

So the main question on this:..... is having fun worth dying for? or losing a family member,friend etc?

Sorry, but this poll is rigged to force anyone who does not agree with banning Songkran to not have a vote unless they say that deaths are OK and that there can not be any minor changes in the current system.

I agree that it is hard to do polls well, but this is designed to make anyone who does not agree with the Grumpy Old Men types look heartless.

To anybody who cares about keeping there FREEDOM .Google search the term fabian society, on the net,and then tell me these people don't stink like fabians.Be aware of people like these.They are like a cancer that comes in and slowly spreads and takes over everything while telling everybody it's for the best.In Australia all the leaders of the fabian society are leaders of the labor party.We have hardly any out door activities because they have been banned 1 at a time .It all starts like this,some fabians want to stop your sonklan .OK ,then what's next.I warn people.DON"T give them the power.These are fabians.We all die at the end anyway,but at least you can die with freedom.

It's not our country if you don't love it leave it,stop the spread of the fabian society it's right through the western world.Thailand is 1 of the last few free countries left.Nothings perfect,but live and let live.Look up the term fabian and learn it's meaning learn there ideas for a perfect society and then be very aware.

[Ulysses G.]

it was designed to get other members views on Songkran that is all and nothing sinister intended,or forcing people to do anything,the choice was always up to the member/voter.

Sorry, but it was designed to allow other people to agree with your views and make anyone who doesn't look bad.

"So the main question on this:..... is having fun worth dying for? or losing a family member,friend etc?"

Edited February 6, 2012 by Ulysses G.

[cobbler]

Legislate !! What a bloody stupid thing for a foreigner to say in Thailand for one of many.

We have few problems in the Songkran festival it's great to see people enjoying themselves.

Funny my Thai teacher friend was here while I opened this, after explaining a bit about what the OP was on about, he just said " He is not Thai why does he want to interfere in what Thais do ", unable to post the reply.

You and your Thai Teacher friend should learn the difference between: having an "Opinion" and "Interference"we all know nothing we say on TV will make any difference. As for "We have few problems in the Songkran Festival" do carry on deluding yourself.

I am always learning in Thailand and probably always will, it appears I am not so clever as some of the alien people think that are living here or part time already.

Delusion, that's a bit strong !!

No not at all I am just embarrassed trying to explain the idiot things said on thaivisa by foreigners who live in Thailand and start talking about legislation.

What goes on in Songkran Festival is for the Thai people to decide, not some foreign person who think they are so bloody clever and spouting on about safety when Thai sites have already warned of some of the dangers.

Fabians,thats what they are.They want to come to a free country cause they like it and then change it to be like home ,but with bananas and coconuts.Don't let fabians creep into your society.Google the term fabian society and learn about it and then be very very aware of these type of people.

[cobbler]

it was designed to get other members views on Songkran that is all and nothing sinister intended,or forcing people to do anything,the choice was always up to the member/voter.

Sorry, but it was designed to allow other people to agree with your views and make anyone who doesn't look bad.

"So the main question on this:..... is having fun worth dying for? or losing a family member,friend etc?"

Yes you are so right,so ban cars cause people die in them ,ban every activety cause people die doing it,Actually ban people cause people kill each other.Ban planes boats,ban cliffs cause people jump off them.BAn knives cause people kill each other with them.Don't have any fun for fear of injury or death.

Ok are you happy now??

[Ulysses G.]

Fabians,thats what they are.They want to come to a free country cause they like it and then change it to be like home ,but with bananas and coconuts.Don't let fabians creep into your society.

Do you think that George Soros could be funding this poll?

[meatboy]

the thing thats lacking with thai's is common sense,none of them got any,like one goverment official said to me let it happen first.

[nocturn]

so to summarise, songkran good, pattaya bad.

well there is a surprise result.

[MAJIC]

Fabians,thats what they are.They want to come to a free country cause they like it and then change it to be like home ,but with bananas and coconuts.Don't let fabians creep into your society.

Do you think that George Soros could be funding this poll?

It appears you are conveniently not going to reply to my questions in Post #51 or understand the points I made in the same Post.

All this paranoid stuff from some,is becoming quite tedious,so lets just let the Poll and the members answers decide the majority of opinion.

Of course you are free to start your own Poll,and use your own "Rigged" questions,if that's what you mistakenly think!

Edited February 7, 2012 by MAJIC

[Ulysses G.]

Why bother? Anyone can plainly see that the poll is designed to make those who disagree with you look bad. Why deny something so obvious?

Edited February 7, 2012 by Ulysses G.