New Visa Rules For Fathers Of Thai Children

[harrycallahan]

Sounds OK to me, consistent with many western nations. Don't have kids if you aren't going to fully commit to the relationship and their upbringing.

[Martinpeter]

Hi there/.

I am a little bit confused now? with this change?

I am currently on a visa for supporting my Thai daughter (living in Thailand) and i am the legal father after going to court and obtaining the paperwork and amphurs registration afterwards. (section 3)http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/381917-how-to-gain-parental-rights-as-a-father/

My visa extension is due shortly again in a couple of months.

Does this mean i can get another extension or not (we are not married)

Thanks for your help!

[jacko45k]

"Can you also please inform your readers that they must never post their passport from Thailand to any other country for any reason because there will not be any evidence in their passport to show that they exited Thailand."

Poorly worded. I suspect they are talking about not sending a passport out to get a Thai Visa.

If they actually meant what they wrote, they are over stepping their job description.

There are other reasons that someone might send a passport out of the country.

Nice of them to pass on the info, though.

Yes like renewing the passport (gets sent to Hong Kong - comes back from UK). Whatabout mothers then? Or is this another sexist Thai immigration law? What about divorced men? Married at time of birth? Since birth? or have to be curently married?

You are supposed to send a copy.

[TimTang]

Hi there/.

I am a little bit confused now? with this change?

I am currently on a visa for supporting my Thai daughter (living in Thailand) and i am the legal father after going to court and obtaining the paperwork and amphurs registration afterwards. (section 3)http://www.thaivisa....ts-as-a-father/

My visa extension is due shortly again in a couple of months.

Does this mean i can get another extension or not (we are not married)

Thanks for your help!

No one has been able to confirm that one way or the other. You should probably contact immigration to determine if this is an amendment to the existing law or just an issuance at a particular consulate.

[jacko45k]

Sounds OK to me, consistent with many western nations. Don't have kids if you aren't going to fully commit to the relationship and their upbringing.

Note the being married part.....see 5 posts above yours.

I suspect they uncovered the visa issuance based on a Thai child was being abused and haven't really thought out this 'correction'.

[notmyself]

What about if you are divorced???

You are divorced from the kid also????

This just increases Thailand's ongoing Violations of the "Universal Declaration of Human Rights":

The family is the natural and fundamental group unit of society and is entitled to protection by society and the State.

— Article 16(3) of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights

The Discrimination and Human Rights Violations in Thailand are making them akin to the Worst of the Worst!

CS

I was just about to post along this line when I got called away.

I don't think there is enough information as yet but if it is true then it 100% violates the UDHR of which Thailand is a signatory.

[chrisinth]

"Can you also please inform your readers that they must never post their passport from Thailand to any other country for any reason because there will not be any evidence in their passport to show that they exited Thailand."

Poorly worded. I suspect they are talking about not sending a passport out to get a Thai Visa.

If they actually meant what they wrote, they are over stepping their job description.

There are other reasons that someone might send a passport out of the country.

Nice of them to pass on the info, though.

Yes like renewing the passport (gets sent to Hong Kong - comes back from UK). Whatabout mothers then? Or is this another sexist Thai immigration law? What about divorced men? Married at time of birth? Since birth? or have to be curently married?

Point 1 You don't have to send your passport to Hong Kong to get it renewed, a photocopy of the information page will suffice.

Point 2 Very valid point; if the father was married and has been officially divorced where does that leave him. Good point about mothers as well!

[LivinLOS]

Can you also please inform your readers that they must never post their passport from Thailand to any other country for any reason because there will not be any evidence in their passport to show that they exited Thailand.

So you can explicitly send your passport from a country other than Thailand for any reason you choose, such as the renewing of a Thai visa.

Yes always have been able to.

[chrisinth]

The children are the real victims. The father has to explain to his child that the government has decided that they are not entitled to have a father. But then the children are considered "Lube koong", so their undesirables anyway.

No one is denying you parental rights if you are truly the natural father. But the Thai legal system no more trusts the word of an unmarried Thai women that gives birth than you should and therefor more precise tests as in DNA are required to prove you are the father. You'd think for most fathers this would be a blessing as the government is taking the heat for requiring the DNA test off of the fathers.

Would you be happier if unmarried women could just go claiming that anyone they saw fit was the father of their child and the courts took their word for it?

Also, nothing is stopping you from adopting a thai child even if you are not the natural father. Stop being such a drama queen and trying to blame the government for women having babies out of wedlock and take some of the responsibility yourself and marry the women if you intend to have a baby.

I was just thinking about your last paragraph there Jayman; if married and you adopt a Thai child and something happens to the marriage (death of wife or divorce), where would that leave the child? Or rather where would that leave the father with support for the child if the child wanted to stay in Thailand?

I would have to imagine that special cases would be considered

[Jayman]

The children are the real victims. The father has to explain to his child that the government has decided that they are not entitled to have a father. But then the children are considered "Lube koong", so their undesirables anyway.

No one is denying you parental rights if you are truly the natural father. But the Thai legal system no more trusts the word of an unmarried Thai women that gives birth than you should and therefor more precise tests as in DNA are required to prove you are the father. You'd think for most fathers this would be a blessing as the government is taking the heat for requiring the DNA test off of the fathers.

Would you be happier if unmarried women could just go claiming that anyone they saw fit was the father of their child and the courts took their word for it?

Also, nothing is stopping you from adopting a thai child even if you are not the natural father. Stop being such a drama queen and trying to blame the government for women having babies out of wedlock and take some of the responsibility yourself and marry the women if you intend to have a baby.

I was just thinking about your last paragraph there Jayman; if married and you adopt a Thai child and something happens to the marriage (death of wife or divorce), where would that leave the child? Or rather where would that leave the father with support for the child if the child wanted to stay in Thailand?

I would have to imagine that special cases would be considered

I'm no Thai lawyer so I cannot say with certainty but it would seem if you adopted a child then this means you have legally become the child's parent and this is not just taken from you if the marriage is dissolved. It's not as if you are the legal parent only while married. I have never heard of any adoptions like that. Also, we are talking about legitimizing the parentage to the Thai courts and using this as a basis for a thai visa to support said child.

[motorcrazy]

Sorry i not understand this,wy only in the uk you ghet that non O Visa.

And what its about laos there we go out from country to.

Ans about suporting your wife ore child,when i here that bulschit again!!!

We suporting here i think the most of the farang when they come fisit the child ore the wife more that 120000 for 2 months.

[AngryParent]

Does this glowing example of racism and xenophobia have anything to do with Thailand being placed on the Anti Money Laundering list (some hiso finding his financial operations are affected)?

[Brewsta]

Why?

because TIT

Yip.

[AngryParent]

I would have to imagine that special cases would be considered

This is Thailand, special cases are not considered and mercy and kindness is not offered to foreigners (unless you have piles of cash).

[Brewsta]

Sorry i not understand this,wy only in the uk you ghet that non O Visa.

And what its about laos there we go out from country to.

Ans about suporting your wife ore child,when i here that bulschit again!!!

We suporting here i think the most of the farang when they come fisit the child ore the wife more that 120000 for 2 months.

err......what?

[chrisinth]

Won't this rule make the entire concept of 'getting a visa on the basis of having a Thai child' completely redundant?

If you have to be married to get one, then you'd just as easily get a visa on that basis (being married) alone. Or have I missed something?

That is my understanding as well.

I have a an Extension of Stay based on support of a Thai Child. I am married to the child's mother but switched about 4 years ago for various reasons. When I first applied for the extension based on a Thai child there was no financial requirement for this type of extension but the Immigration Office in Korat insisted I showed the same money in the bank as for an extension based on a Thai wife which I did and have done on each subsequent extension.

So in reality I was issued an Extension of Stay based on my Thai child but only by satisfying the rules for an extension based on marriage.

I did my 90 day report last week and was reminded that my Extension of Stay is due for renewal next month. I asked what paperwork was needed and was told same same as last year.

I will post again if I experience any difficulties in getting my extension of stay this time around.

As you are still married and already have a dependancy visa to support the child, this should not affect you dereklev as you are already in the system.

My understanding of the article is that the rule change will affect males applying for a non-o visa (single or multi) on the basis of supporting a child out of wedlock

[tobesurenow]

"Can you also please inform your readers that they must never post their passport from Thailand to any other country for any reason because there will not be any evidence in their passport to show that they exited Thailand."

Poorly worded. I suspect they are talking about not sending a passport out to get a Thai Visa.

If they actually meant what they wrote, they are over stepping their job description.

There are other reasons that someone might send a passport out of the country.

Nice of them to pass on the info, though.

Yes like renewing the passport (gets sent to Hong Kong - comes back from UK). Whatabout mothers then? Or is this another sexist Thai immigration law? What about divorced men? Married at time of birth? Since birth? or have to be curently married?

you dont actually send your passport to Hong Kong only the application form. You jkeep your old passport with you here in Thailand.

[softgeorge]

Well that is just wonderful news. I have just finished jumping through all the hoops, dancing on comand and paying all the kickbacks. Hired a lawyer, lodged applications at the court, had interviews with psychs and social workers and had the final court hearing (15/02/12) to be legaly recognised as the father of my son. Flying out to K.L tomorrow morning to get another non imm visa which would have allowed me to get a one year extention. I have just totally wasted 3 months of my time doing the silly little jigs and my money. They must have known along whilst I was standing on my head whistling dixie that this was going to happen. They don't just get up one morning and change things. My lawyer must have known also as in she would have been informed in advance of any changes to the immigration act surely.

What about the children have they even considered what impact this would have on them and the bonds they have with thier fathers? What impact is this going to have on thier social development? Why doesn't my dad love me anymore, he is always leaving me now what have I done wrong to split up the family?

[Jayman]

Well that is just wonderful news. I have just finished jumping through all the hoops, dancing on comand and paying all the kickbacks. Hired a lawyer, lodged applications at the court, had interviews with psychs and social workers and had the final court hearing (15/02/12) to be legaly recognised as the father of my son. Flying out to K.L tomorrow morning to get another non imm visa which would have allowed me to get a one year extention. I have just totally wasted 3 months of my time doing the silly little jigs and my money. They must have known along whilst I was standing on my head whistling dixie that this was going to happen. They don't just get up one morning and change things. My lawyer must have known also as in she would have been informed in advance of any changes to the immigration act surely.

What about the children have they even considered what impact this would have on them and the bonds they have with thier fathers? What impact is this going to have on thier social development? Why doesn't my dad love me anymore, he is always leaving me now what have I done wrong to split up the family?

I'm not sure why you feel it was all in vain. If you have the letter from the thai courts legitimizing you as the father of the child then I don't see why you would have any issues getting a visa to support said child. This new change really only effects the guys out there that were not legitimized as the father by the Thai courts which it sounds like you are.

This is NOT a crackdown to keep legit fathers from getting visas to stay in thailand to support their children but rather to stop non-legit fathers that are using the name on the birth cert (not recognized in thai court) as the evidence that they are the true father. As it's been stated many times before, ANYONE can have their name submitted to be the "father" on the birth cert when it is first registered and no proof is required by the city office to put said name on the birth cert. That is always been why the Thai courts don't recognize the birth cert on it's own but will accept it if you are married or do marry the Mother of the child.

Edited February 21, 2012 by Jayman

[chrisinth]

The children are the real victims. The father has to explain to his child that the government has decided that they are not entitled to have a father. But then the children are considered "Lube koong", so their undesirables anyway.

No one is denying you parental rights if you are truly the natural father. But the Thai legal system no more trusts the word of an unmarried Thai women that gives birth than you should and therefor more precise tests as in DNA are required to prove you are the father. You'd think for most fathers this would be a blessing as the government is taking the heat for requiring the DNA test off of the fathers.

Would you be happier if unmarried women could just go claiming that anyone they saw fit was the father of their child and the courts took their word for it?

Also, nothing is stopping you from adopting a thai child even if you are not the natural father. Stop being such a drama queen and trying to blame the government for women having babies out of wedlock and take some of the responsibility yourself and marry the women if you intend to have a baby.

I was just thinking about your last paragraph there Jayman; if married and you adopt a Thai child and something happens to the marriage (death of wife or divorce), where would that leave the child? Or rather where would that leave the father with support for the child if the child wanted to stay in Thailand?

I would have to imagine that special cases would be considered

I'm no Thai lawyer so I cannot say with certainty but it would seem if you adopted a child then this means you have legally become the child's parent and this is not just taken from you if the marriage is dissolved. It's not as if you are the legal parent only while married. I have never heard of any adoptions like that. Also, we are talking about legitimizing the parentage to the Thai courts and using this as a basis for a thai visa to support said child.

Yep, makes sense. I am not in that position myself and don't know anyone that is; it was just another scenario that I could see for people that are there and may need to think about it. I am certain this situation exists.

[AngryParent]

Well that is just wonderful news. I have just finished jumping through all the hoops, dancing on comand and paying all the kickbacks. Hired a lawyer, lodged applications at the court, had interviews with psychs and social workers and had the final court hearing (15/02/12) to be legaly recognised as the father of my son. Flying out to K.L tomorrow morning to get another non imm visa which would have allowed me to get a one year extention. I have just totally wasted 3 months of my time doing the silly little jigs and my money. They must have known along whilst I was standing on my head whistling dixie that this was going to happen. They don't just get up one morning and change things. My lawyer must have known also as in she would have been informed in advance of any changes to the immigration act surely.

What about the children have they even considered what impact this would have on them and the bonds they have with thier fathers? What impact is this going to have on thier social development? Why doesn't my dad love me anymore, he is always leaving me now what have I done wrong to split up the family?

As a parent I fully understand you.

They don't care. You and your son are foreign in their eyes and thus unwanted in Thailand.

The avergage thai on the street is Ok. But the selfish racists in the decision making chairs are just pure evil.

[AngryParent]

Well that is just wonderful news. I have just finished jumping through all the hoops, dancing on comand and paying all the kickbacks. Hired a lawyer, lodged applications at the court, had interviews with psychs and social workers and had the final court hearing (15/02/12) to be legaly recognised as the father of my son. Flying out to K.L tomorrow morning to get another non imm visa which would have allowed me to get a one year extention. I have just totally wasted 3 months of my time doing the silly little jigs and my money. They must have known along whilst I was standing on my head whistling dixie that this was going to happen. They don't just get up one morning and change things. My lawyer must have known also as in she would have been informed in advance of any changes to the immigration act surely.

What about the children have they even considered what impact this would have on them and the bonds they have with thier fathers? What impact is this going to have on thier social development? Why doesn't my dad love me anymore, he is always leaving me now what have I done wrong to split up the family?

I'm not sure why you feel it was all in vain. If you have the letter from the thai courts legitimizing you as the father of the child then I don't see why you would have any issues getting a visa to support said child. This new change really only effects the guys out there that were not legitimized as the father by the Thai courts which it sounds like you are.

Kindly supply proof that this is for non-legitimized kids and not a blanket operation against parents without a Thai spouse (beit dead, divorced, or never married).

[softgeorge]

Hi there/.

I am a little bit confused now? with this change?

I am currently on a visa for supporting my Thai daughter (living in Thailand) and i am the legal father after going to court and obtaining the paperwork and amphurs registration afterwards. (section 3)http://www.thaivisa....ts-as-a-father/

My visa extension is due shortly again in a couple of months.

Does this mean i can get another extension or not (we are not married)

Thanks for your help!

No one has been able to confirm that one way or the other. You should probably contact immigration to determine if this is an amendment to the existing law or just an issuance at a particular consulate.

I will be doing that today. Will be working overtime on it as I am in exactly the same boat and due to fly to K.L tomorrow for a visa. My wife and I have been in a defacto relationship for 8 yrs and it suits us just fine and never saw the need to get legaly married until now and we don't like being told that we have to marry just to be a family.

[Jayman]

Well that is just wonderful news. I have just finished jumping through all the hoops, dancing on comand and paying all the kickbacks. Hired a lawyer, lodged applications at the court, had interviews with psychs and social workers and had the final court hearing (15/02/12) to be legaly recognised as the father of my son. Flying out to K.L tomorrow morning to get another non imm visa which would have allowed me to get a one year extention. I have just totally wasted 3 months of my time doing the silly little jigs and my money. They must have known along whilst I was standing on my head whistling dixie that this was going to happen. They don't just get up one morning and change things. My lawyer must have known also as in she would have been informed in advance of any changes to the immigration act surely.

What about the children have they even considered what impact this would have on them and the bonds they have with thier fathers? What impact is this going to have on thier social development? Why doesn't my dad love me anymore, he is always leaving me now what have I done wrong to split up the family?

I'm not sure why you feel it was all in vain. If you have the letter from the thai courts legitimizing you as the father of the child then I don't see why you would have any issues getting a visa to support said child. This new change really only effects the guys out there that were not legitimized as the father by the Thai courts which it sounds like you are.

Kindly supply proof that this is for non-legitimized kids and not a blanket operation against parents without a Thai spouse (beit dead, divorced, or never married).

You are asking me to supply proof that the legitimized parent of a Thai child "can" get a visa based on that fact? It's written into the immigration law. Why don't you supply proof that a legit father cannot get a visa. Is the only proof this poor'y written letter posted in the OP signed by an official that is no longer working at the consulate?

[Redhawk]

Hi

Does that means a birth certificate hold in conjunction with paternity certificate ruled by a thai court does not apply for a Non-O- anymore like it did before?

Posted with Thaivisa App http://apps.thaivisa.com

[AngryParent]

Well that is just wonderful news. I have just finished jumping through all the hoops, dancing on comand and paying all the kickbacks. Hired a lawyer, lodged applications at the court, had interviews with psychs and social workers and had the final court hearing (15/02/12) to be legaly recognised as the father of my son. Flying out to K.L tomorrow morning to get another non imm visa which would have allowed me to get a one year extention. I have just totally wasted 3 months of my time doing the silly little jigs and my money. They must have known along whilst I was standing on my head whistling dixie that this was going to happen. They don't just get up one morning and change things. My lawyer must have known also as in she would have been informed in advance of any changes to the immigration act surely.

What about the children have they even considered what impact this would have on them and the bonds they have with thier fathers? What impact is this going to have on thier social development? Why doesn't my dad love me anymore, he is always leaving me now what have I done wrong to split up the family?

I'm not sure why you feel it was all in vain. If you have the letter from the thai courts legitimizing you as the father of the child then I don't see why you would have any issues getting a visa to support said child. This new change really only effects the guys out there that were not legitimized as the father by the Thai courts which it sounds like you are.

Kindly supply proof that this is for non-legitimized kids and not a blanket operation against parents without a Thai spouse (beit dead, divorced, or never married).

You are asking me to supply proof that the legitimized parent of a Thai child "can" get a visa based on that fact? It's written into the immigration law. Why don't you supply proof that a legit father cannot get a visa. Is the only proof this poor'y written letter posted in the OP signed by an official that is no longer working at the consulate?

I will have to say that you are assuming for the best based on an assumption that the letter is of bad quality by somebody who is not working there. Your assumption is completely wrong as he is the Consul and the letter is real. http://www.thaiconsul-uk.com/ You will see his name on the front page!

[LivinLOS]

Sounds OK to me, consistent with many western nations. Don't have kids if you aren't going to fully commit to the relationship and their upbringing.

My first Thai wife died.

We didnt have children, but if I had how does your poorly thought out and attacking comment fit that situation ??

[Jayman]

Honestly we'll need to wait and get more confirmation on this cause I don't see any changes posted on any of the Thai consulate sites from around the world. I'm sure other TV members that are more effected by this will get emails off to the consuls ASAP and have some more answers for us shortly.

[tom21]

"Can you also please inform your readers that they must never post their passport from Thailand to any other country for any reason because there will not be any evidence in their passport to show that they exited Thailand."

Poorly worded. I suspect they are talking about not sending a passport out to get a Thai Visa.

If they actually meant what they wrote, they are over stepping their job description.

There are other reasons that someone might send a passport out of the country.

Nice of them to pass on the info, though.

must be the joke of the day

[jaingor]

so what happens if my wife dies in a car accident on these shitty roads? i lose my kid too?

Exactly what happened to me. But for 8 yrs i never bothered to get a visa on the basis of my son. Luckily i work and the company handles my visa and WP. So i wonder if i stop working, then what will the so called "Authorities" say about my visa application ? i imagine a lomg these lines

Me: Well she died

Them: Well you will have to re-marry then

Me: But I dont want to

Them: The computer says NO