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No problem Joe, the price of palm oil varies between 2.5 to 3 bath/kg depending on many factors (similar to rubber price), but it 's more stable than rubber price. However, I am not sure about planting palm tree on Isaan area cuz palm tree kindda like water (I think you need more research on this, or some experts on your area might have some techniques). Another thing is to yield 4.8 tons per rai per year requires intensive maintenance and enough fertilization.

Thanks a lot.

I know Isaan is dry land. I realise my first job to be done is make boreholes and get enough supply of water. This goes also for rubber trees, they will grow anyway but if you like a nice yield water housekeeping is extremely important.

Thanks again for your input.

Joe

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Joe, if I can make a suggestion regarding palm oil and rubber . . . stick to rubber. Palm oil in Thailand is pretty much a controlled product and if it is converted into bio-fuel the government has already proposed a price limit which makes it close to unprofitable for manufacturers. Added to this you have the three large companies pretty much arranging the CPO market, never mind RBD or Olein.

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Joe Oil Palm is one of the hungriest Thirstiest plants you will find. If you satisfy that hunger and thirst the production is quite amazing. One of the things I think people forget about Oil Palm is that there are zellions of bi-products. If you have lots of relatives to find work for or like to set up small buinesses oil palm has a lot of potential. Bio-diesel, soap, skin oil, wine and many others. Something like the coconut. It is hard not to just sell the fruit, but the bi-prcducts are unlimited. There are lots of bi-products that aren't too hard to make and doubles your money.

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Wow...

what a great forum. Just stumbled on it after a lot of googling thinking (rather short sightedly !) that I was the only expat living in the south thinking of getting in to rubber (tree's). My wife's family have been on at me for 5 years to do this, I wish I'd found this earlier. Thanks again and I look forward to sharing my experiences with you. We are looking at 30 Rai initially, 10 year old trees just north of Surat thani, I'll post the price after i get it from the wife. Cheers

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Joe, if I can make a suggestion regarding palm oil and rubber . . . stick to rubber. Palm oil in Thailand is pretty much a controlled product and if it is converted into bio-fuel the government has already proposed a price limit which makes it close to unprofitable for manufacturers. Added to this you have the three large companies pretty much arranging the CPO market, never mind RBD or Olein.

Thanks for your input, very valuable information!

But the decision is getting more difficult now :o , I think I stick to my original plan of having 50% rubber and 50% eucalypt, rubber for later (8 years) and Euc for over 3-5 years. On top I will put some sugar and I will do intercropping with Papaya, Chili and Makua. Added to the cattle and pigs we should have a nice income and spreaded risks.

I worry if I can get good rubber trees. Ramses mentioned an interesting website and I wrote for quotes. I realise there is a LOT difference in yield depending on the tree, like the RRIT251 has about 50% more yield the usual trees, the 600 has already substantial more yield. So as always, a good start is the main thing.

Joe

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http://www.fao.org/docrep/005/AC781E/AC781E09.htm

A piece on an article from the above site on research in Malaysia

By the end of 1999 a total of 1,700 ha of pilot plantation had been established in various locations. Among the promising clones tested include RRIM623, RRIM900's series, PM10, PB235, PB260, and the newly launched RRIM2000's clones. Potential clones recommended by RRIM are categorized into two groups. Group I refers to clones that have proven tract records, tested and yield performance of five years in large scale clone trials recorded. Some of these clones are projected to yield between 1,500 to 2,000 kg of latex annually, and wood volume per tree between 0.75 m3 to 1.3 m3 per tree at age 15. These figures are more that 200 to 300% higher as compared to the old clones which now being harvested by the industry. Group II refers to clones which are selected in small scale clones trials based on five years yield record and the secondary characters available. These include clones from RRIM900 series and RRIM2000 series. The projected latex yields are between 2,000 to 3,000 kg per year and total timber per tree between 1.0 to 1.3 m3. at year 15. The performance of these clones in different climate, soil and disease environment are not available. Therefore these clones are only recommended for planting under close monitoring.

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I just returned from Kuala Lumpur yesterday - had two days of meetings with the MRB (Malaysian Rubber Board) and one of their subsidiaries and an agent for a particular product I mentioned previously, and I managed to get an exclusive contract for Thailand . . . quite amazing, really, though dealing with Malays is tough.

According to their research the rubber/latex price will continue to rise for the nest few years, as long as oil prices keep a 'steady' course.

Around 2012 a lot of rubber from newly-planted trees in China and India will hit the market and bring about a 'correction'.

Still, I believe the oil price will rise dramatically due to another venture in the Middle East by our US brethren or Iran deciding to limit their exports.

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http://www.fao.org/docrep/005/AC781E/AC781E09.htm

A piece on an article from the above site on research in Malaysia

By the end of 1999 a total of 1,700 ha of pilot plantation had been established in various locations. Among the promising clones tested include RRIM623, RRIM900's series, PM10, PB235, PB260, and the newly launched RRIM2000's clones. Potential clones recommended by RRIM are categorized into two groups. Group I refers to clones that have proven tract records, tested and yield performance of five years in large scale clone trials recorded. Some of these clones are projected to yield between 1,500 to 2,000 kg of latex annually, and wood volume per tree between 0.75 m3 to 1.3 m3 per tree at age 15. These figures are more that 200 to 300% higher as compared to the old clones which now being harvested by the industry. Group II refers to clones which are selected in small scale clones trials based on five years yield record and the secondary characters available. These include clones from RRIM900 series and RRIM2000 series. The projected latex yields are between 2,000 to 3,000 kg per year and total timber per tree between 1.0 to 1.3 m3. at year 15. The performance of these clones in different climate, soil and disease environment are not available. Therefore these clones are only recommended for planting under close monitoring.

Thanks Timber, great information.

Again it expresses how important it is to not just buy trees, but to buy the trees that are further developed to get high yields. The differences are so huge, sometimes double, that one has to go for special trees. I just worry if those special trees are available everywhere, to everyone and if so what prices we talk about. As Ramses gave a website already I wrote them an email but sofar no news.

Any more ideas where to get "high yield" trees?

Thanks

Joe

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http://www.fao.org/docrep/005/AC781E/AC781E09.htm

A piece on an article from the above site on research in Malaysia

By the end of 1999 a total of 1,700 ha of pilot plantation had been established in various locations. Among the promising clones tested include RRIM623, RRIM900's series, PM10, PB235, PB260, and the newly launched RRIM2000's clones. Potential clones recommended by RRIM are categorized into two groups. Group I refers to clones that have proven tract records, tested and yield performance of five years in large scale clone trials recorded. Some of these clones are projected to yield between 1,500 to 2,000 kg of latex annually, and wood volume per tree between 0.75 m3 to 1.3 m3 per tree at age 15. These figures are more that 200 to 300% higher as compared to the old clones which now being harvested by the industry. Group II refers to clones which are selected in small scale clones trials based on five years yield record and the secondary characters available. These include clones from RRIM900 series and RRIM2000 series. The projected latex yields are between 2,000 to 3,000 kg per year and total timber per tree between 1.0 to 1.3 m3. at year 15. The performance of these clones in different climate, soil and disease environment are not available. Therefore these clones are only recommended for planting under close monitoring.

Thanks Timber, great information.

Again it expresses how important it is to not just buy trees, but to buy the trees that are further developed to get high yields. The differences are so huge, sometimes double, that one has to go for special trees. I just worry if those special trees are available everywhere, to everyone and if so what prices we talk about. As Ramses gave a website already I wrote them an email but sofar no news.

Any more ideas where to get "high yield" trees?

Thanks

Joe

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I just returned from Kuala Lumpur yesterday - had two days of meetings with the MRB (Malaysian Rubber Board) and one of their subsidiaries and an agent for a particular product I mentioned previously, and I managed to get an exclusive contract for Thailand . . . quite amazing, really, though dealing with Malays is tough.

According to their research the rubber/latex price will continue to rise for the nest few years, as long as oil prices keep a 'steady' course.

Around 2012 a lot of rubber from newly-planted trees in China and India will hit the market and bring about a 'correction'.

Still, I believe the oil price will rise dramatically due to another venture in the Middle East by our US brethren or Iran deciding to limit their exports.

Thanks Sing_Sling, again valuable info.

I was going to ask if someone knew about a lot of rubber coming from India and China, as I read about India where huge plantations have been established in the past years. That should have an influence on the rubber prices.

On the other hand India and China have a fast growing demand for natural rubber as their automotive industry needs more and more rubber for tyres.

Joe

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I guess high yield trees depend a bit on putting them into the right environment, and giving them the tools to maximize their potential. There sure are a lot of things you can do. I guess the bottom line is getting a return on your investment. One thing a lot of people ignore is to go down to the forestry or agricultural office and find some guy who knows something about growing rubber or oil palm and ask him what he thinks. I used to do this back in Canada and it is amazing how happy they are to have someone to talk to. They generally have a wealth of good information or are quite willing to get it for you. Not many people do this.

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Hi Joe.

I guess you wrote your mail in Englisch. As you know, the most Thai-People

are speaking a very poor english. So maybe your mail in english went direct into

the trash for spammail ;-). Let some thaipeople (maybe your wife) call to the

phone number. Or do you have a the chance to write a mail in thailetters?

I think this is the reason. When I have to conect Thaipeople, I never do it by mail.

I almost never get an answer back. When I try it by phone, it works almost every time.

I.E. happened to me, when I tried to get some information from Thai Kubota about the

Ricetransplanter. My mails were ignored. Only phonecalls in thai worked.

Regards

Ramses

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • 4 weeks later...

Any comments of the following? Seems to be a bit different that anything I have seen before.

The Bangkok Post carried an article with the following processing of oil to bio-diesel:

1. Filter oil to get rid of the food particles (if cooking oil.)

2. Boil at 60 degrees Celsius for about 10 minutes.

3. Add to every 75 liters of refined oil

• 15 liters of methyl alcohol

• 500 grammes of baking soda

4. Stir for one to two minutes

5. Leave mixture over night

6. When the top layer solidifies remove and add water.

7. Let the mixture sit in the sun for a few days and then is ready for use.

The team said they had used for four years and no problems to date.

They buy cooking oil for 4.5 baht per litre and say that their costs are 18 baht per litre.

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  • 3 weeks later...
My wife purchased 100 rai in Nakhon Si Thammarat last year. The land price was 15,000 baht per rai (title has been changed to her name at ampur). It is being turned into an oil palm plantation. We are not going to be living in Nakhon Si Thammart but nearby around Songkhla and were worried about not being able to keep an eye on a rubber crop so we decided on palm. It seems that a lot of rubber production goes missing when the owner is not around to watch it.

Palm is harvested twice a month and we can be onsite during the harvest. It has been a bit of a worrying start with the recent heavy flooding down here. About 100 trees were lost of the 2,000 planted. We are now having to go in and raise a low patch on the property which can be done for about 1,200 per rai.

The prices I have seen for existing palm and rubber plantations is over the top. It seems much better to buy raw land and do it yourself if you have the time. Palm will take 3-4 years to start producing and rubber will take about 7.

With the current prices for palm and rubber it seems land can be a good earner in the future. I'm betting commodity prices continue to rise though. I am hoping with the advent of bio-diesel that the palm price can be at least stabalized where it is now and hopefully move higher.

Feel free to PM me if I might be of help.

Hi

Myself and my gf are thinking of doing something similar.

We are both very surprised at how cheap you bought your land.

Without giving away too much personal info. can you tell us where you purchased the land ?

Where my gf lives it costs about 250,000 baht for 1 rai !!!!!

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The land is for agriculture use in Nakhon Si Thammarat. We purchased it a few years ago. Land prices have increased a-lot since then. 40,000 baht a rai is still a standard rate on basic agriculture land though. Your wife might be looking at land too close to a city or town?

For 35,000-50,000 baht you should still be able to get decent agriculture land with a good title these days. I just passed on 30 rai chanote in Chiang Yai for 40,000 baht per rai.

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The land is for agriculture use in Nakhon Si Thammarat. We purchased it a few years ago. Land prices have increased a-lot since then. 40,000 baht a rai is still a standard rate on basic agriculture land though. Your wife might be looking at land too close to a city or town?

For 35,000-50,000 baht you should still be able to get decent agriculture land with a good title these days. I just passed on 30 rai chanote in Chiang Yai for 40,000 baht per rai.

There seems to be a big difference in prices.

My gf's land has mature fruit trees and is approx 8km from the city.Amphur Muang.

Where is your land situated ?

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Palm "wood" does not really have any value. It's not really a wood, more a large plant stock. Rubber wood is quite valuable. The numbers you have on production starting times are correct. Keep in mind that though they do start producing at those ages (3-4 years for palm, 7 for rubber) the production is not high when that young.

There are a lot of good figures on palm from Malaysia (in English) that you can find on the internet.

As for land price. 35-40,000 thousand baht per rai barely makes sense to me for exclusively agriculture land. You will still turn a decent proffit in the long run at current crude palm and rubber prices but there is always risk in owning a farm/plantation - floods,fire,insects etc.

If you're paying anything over 40,000 baht per rai for agriculture land, it makes much more sense to me to just put the money in a cd earning 6-7% per year. Way less risk (depending on the currency - I'm not a US Dollar fan!).

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Palm "wood" does not really have any value. It's not really a wood, more a large plant stock. Rubber wood is quite valuable. The numbers you have on production starting times are correct. Keep in mind that though they do start producing at those ages (3-4 years for palm, 7 for rubber) the production is not high when that young.

There are a lot of good figures on palm from Malaysia (in English) that you can find on the internet.

As for land price. 35-40,000 thousand baht per rai barely makes sense to me for exclusively agriculture land. You will still turn a decent proffit in the long run at current crude palm and rubber prices but there is always risk in owning a farm/plantation - floods,fire,insects etc.

If you're paying anything over 40,000 baht per rai for agriculture land, it makes much more sense to me to just put the money in a cd earning 6-7% per year. Way less risk (depending on the currency - I'm not a US Dollar fan!).

Many thanks for the info.

I don't suppose you can approximate the return on 1 rai of land per year for both palm and rubber at current prices ?

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martaway not sure of your background so I speak of things you may know about.

There are so many variables involved in what you are asking that no one can answer that question for

your situation, and the variables may cause a 200% difference or more. Whether you water, fertilize etc. The stock

you use, how often you tap or harvest, etc. Prices can change 100% in a given year. You just have to do lots of surfing and make your own assessment. Can take someone from an university or government to your site and have them assess it. Bottom lines is, what you decide on doing will have a major effect on the outcome. If you want to make money there are better crops to grow, but may need more attention. A

pretty good investment is to surf this and the farming forum. Much of the information you need is there. Be careful about relying too much on

what someone else says.

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Just a few personal experiences.

I purchased some of my land @ 10,000 Baht per Rai for larger plots and I purchased small plots and paid 50,000 per Rai in the village.

My brother in law (Thai) purchased land close to Chian Yai town for 300,000 Baht for 1 room (5 by 15 meters), so it just depends where in the area you are.

Palm. I had 9 rai plot of palm planted last year and it all got eaten and died from rats. It is a major problem in the early stages, if I had the time or the thought, I could of got the family to look after it, but I didnt..........

Timber or one of the other posters might have posted regarding this already :o

good luck with it all martaway.

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  • 4 months later...

HI ALL JUST FOUND THIS FORUM ON A GOOGLE SEARCH, SO SORRY FOR BUTTING IN. QUICK HISTORY MARRIED A THAI GIRL 2 YEARS AGO, WHO COMES FROM SURRAT THANNI SHE HAD 100 RAI OF RUBBER (2 YEARS OLD) ALTOGETHER THE FAMMILY HAVE ABOUT 260 RAI MOST ALREADY BEING CUT. THEY HAVE BEEN GROWING RUBBER FOR OVER 40 YEARS AND THE PRICE HAS STEADILY INCREASED, AND WILL DO FOR YERAS TO COME, HOWEVER MANY RUBBER FARMERS ARE NOW CUTTING AND CLEARING THERE OLD RUBBER AND PLANTING PALM, AS THIS IS A MUCH QUICKER CROP A MORE LUCRATIVE CROP AND REQUIRES MUCH LESS CARE.

HOWEVER IF YOU WANT TO KEEP GROWING RUBBER DEMAND WILL OUTWAY SUPPLY FOR MANY MANY YEARS TO COME AS SYNTHETIC RUBBER ALBEIT EXCELLENT CANT REPLACE NATURAL RUBBER.

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'RUGBYPAUL2'

Not bad comments. The history of oil palm and rubber seems to be that they each have ups and downs. I think you have to make a decision and go with it. Both will do well in the long term for different reasons. If you look over your shoulder you won't do a good job at either. If rubber is down it will probably bounce back. hehe

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  • 1 year later...
My wife purchased 100 rai in Nakhon Si Thammarat last year. The land price was 15,000 baht per rai (title has been changed to her name at ampur). It is being turned into an oil palm plantation. We are not going to be living in Nakhon Si Thammart but nearby around Songkhla and were worried about not being able to keep an eye on a rubber crop so we decided on palm. It seems that a lot of rubber production goes missing when the owner is not around to watch it.

Palm is harvested twice a month and we can be onsite during the harvest. It has been a bit of a worrying start with the recent heavy flooding down here. About 100 trees were lost of the 2,000 planted. We are now having to go in and raise a low patch on the property which can be done for about 1,200 per rai.

The prices I have seen for existing palm and rubber plantations is over the top. It seems much better to buy raw land and do it yourself if you have the time. Palm will take 3-4 years to start producing and rubber will take about 7.

With the current prices for palm and rubber it seems land can be a good earner in the future. I'm betting commodity prices continue to rise though. I am hoping with the advent of bio-diesel that the palm price can be at least stabalized where it is now and hopefully move higher.

Feel free to PM me if I might be of help.

Hi there, I'm Jeffrey Man from Malaysia. I agree with you that palm and rubber will have a bright future. We are a company specialise in research for palm and rubber production, that is why we produced fine nutrient for both trees, to double the yield and to also protect the trees. Research done after using the nutrient, it is able to increase 50% to 300% of the production of yield. The nutrient is safe to use, cost saving and effective. Want to know more email to [email protected]

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Hi Azul,

My wife has about 10 rai of land up coast aways and she has oil palm on it. Is only three years old and just getting ready to produce. She has a lot of family in the area so haven't done much except fetilize.

I was wondering about buying more land and growing some more, but I don't have the slightest clue on how much reture their is on oil palm production. I can figure it out from research information, but I was wondering what they are really getting from a practical sense. Just want to figure out the return on investment. Can you help me?

Thanks

Hi Azul,

As you know price of Oil Palm is going up and african's countries is now planting a lot of Oil Palm trees because of the demand. With this demand, we have produced a nutrient for Oil Palm trees to enable it to produce double the yield and promote health. Plants exhibit stronger growth with increased resistance againts diseases, have higher rate of flowering and fruit setting and improves the quality of fruits. The nutrient is easy to use, save and cost saving. We are now exporting to India, Indonesia, Sri Lanka and a few more. Please do not hesitate to write to me for further question, thank you.

Regards,

Jeffrey Man

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