Mixed Couples Mixing In Thailand

[SaamBaht]

A good friend says he's having trouble forming relationships with other families here in Thailand. He's the father of two, both girls four and six. While neighbors are friendly enough, he hasn't really been able to get them to accept invitations for BBQs or casual play dates with the other families and their kids. He's an average fellow with a modestly successful online business. His wife is a village girl with high school credentials. They're not fat, ugly or drunks and their kids are surprisingly well behaved.

He's had an even worse time of it mixing with foreigner men who have Thai wives and mixed children. He says it mostly comes down to the women not getting on because of differences in status, or jealously and comparisons regarding the kids. His girls are really bright and really beautiful and some of the other Thai wives and mothers seem a bit uncomfortable with that. He's says he's also witnessed a lot of ineffectual fathers who have little to no relationship with their children, many of which can't speak the father's native tongue.

What has been your experience in like situations? I'd love to pass along this thread to him.

Edited May 23, 2012 by SaamBaht

[Beetlejuice]

Firstly, forget about forming friendly relationships with other farang ex-pats. Many are simply just plain ole nasty, unapproachable and unsocialible. I tried all that several years ago and it just doesn’t work. Trust me on that one.

As for the Thais, I find it difficult to believe that they are reluctant guests at party invitations. Down our way, any hint of a party happening where there maybe a chance of grabbing some free nosh and booze, than everyone turns up, including all their families and friends, even those who don’t even know the host.

So my guess is that there are two reasons why the friend is having no success forming relationships with his neighbors and other families. First that your friend’s wife is a complete snob and dislikes associating with other neighbors and families whom she considers as peasants, are below her and has an hostile attitude, also I guess that your friend is placing too much emphasis on the farang neighbors that doesn’t work for reasons mentioned above.

In the past I have had the unfortunate experience of meeting people like them and it`s been, hate at first sight and would no way wish to be associated with those sorts.

[Exsexyman]

Firstly, forget about forming friendly relationships with other farang ex-pats. Many are simply just plain ole nasty, unapproachable and unsocialible. I tried all that several years ago and it just doesn’t work. Trust me on that one.

As for the Thais, I find it difficult to believe that they are reluctant guests at party invitations. Down our way, any hint of a party happening where there maybe a chance of grabbing some free nosh and booze, than everyone turns up, including all their families and friends, even those who don’t even know the host.

So my guess is that there are two reasons why the friend is having no success forming relationships with his neighbors and other families. First that your friend’s wife is a complete snob and dislikes associating with other neighbors and families whom she considers as peasants, are below her and has an hostile attitude, also I guess that your friend is placing too much emphasis on the farang neighbors that doesn’t work for reasons mentioned above.

In the past I have had the unfortunate experience of meeting people like them and it`s been, hate at first sight and would no way wish to be associated with those sorts.

"Firstly forget about forming relationships with other farang expats" "In the past i have had the unfortunate experience of meeting 'people like them'! Has it ever crossed your mind that you could be the snob here?

[transam]

Firstly, forget about forming friendly relationships with other farang ex-pats. Many are simply just plain ole nasty, unapproachable and unsocialible. I tried all that several years ago and it just doesn’t work. Trust me on that one.

As for the Thais, I find it difficult to believe that they are reluctant guests at party invitations. Down our way, any hint of a party happening where there maybe a chance of grabbing some free nosh and booze, than everyone turns up, including all their families and friends, even those who don’t even know the host.

So my guess is that there are two reasons why the friend is having no success forming relationships with his neighbors and other families. First that your friend’s wife is a complete snob and dislikes associating with other neighbors and families whom she considers as peasants, are below her and has an hostile attitude, also I guess that your friend is placing too much emphasis on the farang neighbors that doesn’t work for reasons mentioned above.

In the past I have had the unfortunate experience of meeting people like them and it`s been, hate at first sight and would no way wish to be associated with those sorts.

100% agree. Sadly.

[TommoPhysicist]

He's had an even worse time of it mixing with foreigner men who have Thai wives and mixed children. He says it mostly comes down to the women not getting on because of differences in status, or jealously and comparisons regarding the kids.

You know this is the problem.

Sex workers and respectable Thais don't mix. Farm girls and city girls don't mix.

Ladies with new cars and ladies with old cars don't mix. Ladies with ugly kids and ladies with attractive kids don't mix, ad infinitum.

It's all about status, in the end Thai women only seem to mix successfully with family members.

And I agree it's a total pain in the arse that the women can't get on together.

Lucky for me we live in a small village where everyone is related to my wife, introducing my wife to any of my 'foreigner mates' wives was always total disaster.

Edited May 23, 2012 by TommoPhysicist

[arthurwait]

It could be for any number of reasons:

Like Beetlejuice says so many Farangs here are beyond socially arkward and just do not socialise with any other farangs. They look at the floor if they ever have to cross anothers path or at best force a smile before looking away as quickly as possible. Going round to someones house they don't know won't happen.

There's also some that has come here and find just due to their race they are suddenly the big cheese in the cracker factory and want to keep it that way in their heads and don't mix with other farangs. Some with the same thing finding they are the big cheese seem to believe all other farangs are beneath them.

Then it comes to the Thais, this depends on where you live, as in the prices of the houses and peoples social standing or their social standing in their own heads.

There is a pecking order in Thailand and many want to keep it. A farang and village/country girl married are at the very bottom of the Thais pecking order and most above it don't want to know them. I sure you can guess the reasons behind they're thinking.

In this country you (farang and Thai I suppose) are judged entirely on your Thai families social standing and many people in this country only want to know people as wealthy or wealthier than them. This also goes for many ex-bar girls who have been suddenly thrust into a middle class or expensive neighbourhood. Suddenly they are middle class in their minds and don't want to know other people who got there the same way they did.

If she's a village girl and they live in a village I expect everyone to be round at the offer of a free party unless she's done something to upset people in the past that she's not telling your friend about.

If she's a village girl living with a farang in a middle class neighbourhood many people just won't want to socialise with them.

Also if it's a middle class neighbourhood most Thais will run their own business and run it for most days of the week for 10-12 hours a day and are just too tired to socialise and the last thing they want when trying to relax is to listen to someone elses party.

There's also the laguage barrier that makes people afraid to talk and maybe the worry of not having anything in common.

Edited May 23, 2012 by arthurwait

[ripstanley]

Where do they live? Did the wife and husband meet in a tourist area and then returned to where she lived? What work did the wife do before they met?

Edited May 23, 2012 by ripstanley

[Rsquared]

Is this the friend you see in the mirror every day????

[StreetCowboy]

Firstly, forget about forming friendly relationships with other farang ex-pats. Many are simply just plain ole nasty, unapproachable and unsocialible. [sC: My bold] I tried all that several years ago and it just doesn’t work. Trust me on that one.

As for the Thais, I find it difficult to believe that they are reluctant guests at party invitations. Down our way, any hint of a party happening where there maybe a chance of grabbing some free nosh and booze, than everyone turns up, including all their families and friends, even those who don’t even know the host.

So my guess is that there are two reasons why the friend is having no success forming relationships with his neighbors and other families. First that your friend’s wife is a complete snob [sC: My bold] and dislikes associating with other neighbors and families whom she considers as peasants, are below her and has an hostile attitude, also I guess that your friend is placing too much emphasis on the farang neighbors that doesn’t work for reasons mentioned above.

In the past I have had the unfortunate experience of meeting people like them and it`s been, hate at first sight and would no way wish to be associated with those sorts.

And wont to generalisations

and jumping to snap judgements based on opinionated preconceptions.

Why not ask your friend about it, so that he can figure it out for himself; he's the one with the experience, the knowledge.

Challenge his perceptions and opinions.

My experience is that you can't tell anyone anything, but if you ask the right questions, they'll tell you things that they didn't know they knew.

SC

[BigJohnnyBKK]

PM me to set up playdates, my kids the same age would love others to play with, no judgmental BS here.

What a bunch of dickheads some of you lot are really, and yes I realize I'm being judgmental myself, don't have much tolerance for intolerance.

[fletchsmile]

Thais do not mix well (other than superficially) across different groups in society - due to a variety of levels and social factors. I suspect it is more down to his wife being shy with new people/ Thais she doesn't know rather than a snob. Sure throw a party with free drinks and food and everyone will come and enjoy, particularly if up country. Throw that party a dozen times though and while the Thais will enjoy themselves, and you may too, many of them are still telling you you can speak good Thai and asking if you can eat spicy food, i.e the relationship hasn't gone much beyond superficial level. I suspect OP's friend is looking for something deeper in friendships and relationships though.

On the other hand many of the expats you meet here, from a wide range of countries mix well. For guys with Thai wives, you'll find what some refer to as an "integration group" being created, where Thai women who would never normally have become friends meet and socialize. I find I have friends from many backgrounds, and largely it's the guys (initially at least) that drive social occasions and who we socialise with. After a while the ladies sometimes develop friendships among themselves. The key is they would never have gone out of their way to meet these "new" people their husband introduced them to.

At the school our kids go to many of the Thai parents initially stick to their own cliques. After time the barriers break down though.

So my tips:

1) The husband needs to drive it - also likely his wife is quite shy with new people. Thais are brought up with a place in society, expected to know it and have their comfort zones.

2) He'll probably have better luck with foreigners married to Thais, than Thai-Thai couples. The guys will get on, and after a while the women get to know each other. Not to say that he won't have friendships with Thai-Thai couples, just people like himself in mixed relationships will be easier

Edited May 23, 2012 by fletchsmile

[fletchsmile]

PM me to set up playdates, my kids the same age would love others to play with, no judgmental BS here.

....

To OP,

Tell your mate to organise a BBQ or something and I'd be happy to join BigJohnny + family. Our girls are a little younger but probably in the same school year = K1 and K3. My wife is often a bit shy with new people as well.

Edited May 23, 2012 by fletchsmile

[tinfoilhat]

i have the same issues, but largely because i am a single father and not a typical soccer mom. the yummy japanese and korean mommies just dont want to play.

Fortunately the friends i had before kids and family are still friends now and adore the kid

[Beetlejuice]

Firstly, forget about forming friendly relationships with other farang ex-pats. Many are simply just plain ole nasty, unapproachable and unsocialible. [sC: My bold] I tried all that several years ago and it just doesn’t work. Trust me on that one.

As for the Thais, I find it difficult to believe that they are reluctant guests at party invitations. Down our way, any hint of a party happening where there maybe a chance of grabbing some free nosh and booze, than everyone turns up, including all their families and friends, even those who don’t even know the host.

So my guess is that there are two reasons why the friend is having no success forming relationships with his neighbors and other families. First that your friend’s wife is a complete snob [sC: My bold] and dislikes associating with other neighbors and families whom she considers as peasants, are below her and has an hostile attitude, also I guess that your friend is placing too much emphasis on the farang neighbors that doesn’t work for reasons mentioned above.

In the past I have had the unfortunate experience of meeting people like them and it`s been, hate at first sight and would no way wish to be associated with those sorts.

And wont to generalisations

and jumping to snap judgements based on opinionated preconceptions.

Why not ask your friend about it, so that he can figure it out for himself; he's the one with the experience, the knowledge.

Challenge his perceptions and opinions.

My experience is that you can't tell anyone anything, but if you ask the right questions, they'll tell you things that they didn't know they knew.

SC

Perhaps so, but without further postings from the OP, whatever is said from now on is going to be speculation, because he is the only person who know`s these people and can confirm whether what is being said is fact or not and the reasons why?

So without anymore intervention from the OP, I can see no point for anymore comments on this thread, as this has become a rather one sided discussion.

Edited May 23, 2012 by Beetlejuice

[BigJohnnyBKK]

i have the same issues, but largely because i am a single father and not a typical soccer mom. the yummy japanese and korean mommies just dont want to play.

Fortunately the friends i had before kids and family are still friends now and adore the kid

Where are you so all you have is Japanese and Korean families around you?

I thought you were on KPN?

If BKK feel free to come along, PM me and the OP. . .

[SaamBaht]

First, it really is my friend. He's up north and not able to socialize with the kind folks who have responded from Bangkok. He lives in a middle class moo ban. Some of the Thais are quite successful. They drive nice cars and have prospering businesses. One interesting thing he has told me is that none of the neighbors allow people to cross their gates into their yards, even the kids! Rarely does he see friends go in and out of the homes, only family members.

With regard to the mixed couples, he's found it's more the women who thwart these social engagements not the men, though their are some foreigners who are anti-social. It's class divisions I guess. His wife is not of high origin, nor does she have any college level education. But interestingly, he's said that she is also snobby when they encounter Thai women of lower origin married to foreign men. He tries to reason with her but to no avail.

[BigJohnnyBKK]

The isolated nuclear family is a terrible social model for psychological/social development for children. You might not agree with other Clintonisms, but Hillary was right in that "it takes a village".

If he goes to the effort required he will be able to find other like-minded families in the area. In the early stages might be as much effort as a part-time job, but will pay off for the socialization of the kids.

The ideal situation would be a group intentionally moving to a moobahn with shared yards between them.

Don't let the Thai women involved have much say, the whole point is to prevent your kids adopting those idiotic ideas, do your best to raise them as liberal-minded farang even while they're here.