Americans: Fbar Due June 30 "Final Warning"

[Jingthing]

http://bsaefiling.fi...Individual.html

Can you file this electronically with the BSA efiling system?

First time I've heard of it. Interesting.

It sounds like you can:

http://bsaefiling.fi...se_BSA_001.html

I know that you can't file through commercial e-filing applications, but this is obviously different.

Kind of an intimidating name though, Financial CRIMES Enforcement Network.

BTW, has anyone tried efile reporting using this BSA efiling system? It looks like it would be straightforward but you have to register your ID first, as expected.

Also note, this option of efiling is NOT mentioned on the FBAR instructions on the form but that doesn't mean you can't though. Its weird that they don't mention it, don't you think?

Edited June 7, 2012 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

...

Honestly, I wonder if the combined assets of all the American losers holed out in Pattaya

equals $10K.

That's rather offensive. Not to mention factually wrong. I started this thread for informational purposes. Not an invitation to bash Americans in Thailand. Thank you very much.

Jesus, lighten up. I think it was a joke. I am American and took no offense. But then I'm not holed up in Pattaya either. (-: Why is it that Pattayans are so sensitive?

Sorry, I don't think FBAR is any kind of joke. Have you checked out the PENALTIES for not reporting? The intention here is indeed a serious topic on financial matters.

[necronx99]

You seem to miss the entire point of the new LAW ..... it's to mandate reporting from forein banks , not to make them have the info if requested. ..... This is a new LAW for 2014

The US can't mandate reporting from foreign banks. They can't mandate what Thai banks have to do. Come on, there's

the little question of sovereignty. What they can mandate is what their citizens have to do - that's what would be a (US) law.

Now, if Thai banks choose to (like maybe the Swiss) to voluntarily report to the US Treasury then that's their prerogative.

You're a bit clueless here. The Evil Empire can, will and does force compliance with its laws on foreign countries and companies with respect to dealing with US citizens.

The Swiss didn't comply of their own accord, the did it under threat of massive sanctions. As did all the counties offering gaming to US citizens. They do it all the time. All in the name of a war against a mythical bad guy. The current cornerstone of US policy is if you are not with us you are against us, in all matters.

[Jingthing]

Back to the BSA efiling sytem. I had a look at the sign up page to get your BSA user id to get an account to allow efiling.

I was wondering if they support foreign addresses. It appears they do as you can select foreign countries and when you do it disables the otherwise required STATE field.

However, there is a weird thing on the form. They show both Social Security Number or Individual Taxpayer Identification Number (or ITIN) and EIN (Employer Identification Number) as REQUIRED fields. What's that about? It implies if you put in SSN or ITIN and no EIN the form won't process because you've left out a required field.

https://bsaefiling1.fincen.treas.gov/AddIndividualUser

Edited June 7, 2012 by Jingthing

[lannarebirth]

You seem to miss the entire point of the new LAW ..... it's to mandate reporting from forein banks , not to make them have the info if requested. ..... This is a new LAW for 2014

The US can't mandate reporting from foreign banks. They can't mandate what Thai banks have to do. Come on, there's

the little question of sovereignty. What they can mandate is what their citizens have to do - that's what would be a (US) law.

Now, if Thai banks choose to (like maybe the Swiss) to voluntarily report to the US Treasury then that's their prerogative.

You're a bit clueless here. The Evil Empire can, will and does force compliance with its laws on foreign countries and companies with respect to dealing with US citizens.

The Swiss didn't comply of their own accord, the did it under threat of massive sanctions. As did all the counties offering gaming to US citizens. They do it all the time. All in the name of a war against a mythical bad guy. The current cornerstone of US policy is if you are not with us you are against us, in all matters.

I don't think the US can force foreign banks to comply unless that foreign bank holds a charter or has branches in the USA. That said, many foreign banks may feel it's more trouble than it's worth to take on American depositors and refuse to open accounts for them.

Edited June 7, 2012 by lannarebirth

[Naam]

You're a bit clueless here. The Evil Empire can, will and does force compliance with its laws on foreign countries and companies with respect to dealing with US citizens.

The Swiss didn't comply of their own accord, the did it under threat of massive sanctions. As did all the counties offering gaming to US citizens. They do it all the time. All in the name of a war against a mythical bad guy. The current cornerstone of US policy is if you are not with us you are against us, in all matters.

for what it's worth... received minutes ago this mail from an old friend, former U.S. but since many years Oz citizen:

you might find this interesting. our old private banker XYZ has been chasing me like a horny hooker for over a year to re-open my account at ABC. i finally relented, with the understanding it will only be a secondary account although with substantial funding.

then he found out that any prospective clients with suspected Americano connections are persona non grata.

In addition, our compliance department requested a Certificate of Loss of Nationality of the United States (duly stamped by a U.S. embassy or consulate) since you were born in the US.

The bank is getting all the clients born in the States to provide such certificate and a few of ours got it easily from the US embassy. Do you think you can provide me this certificate?

yours truly "Singapore Bank"

[necronx99]

You seem to miss the entire point of the new LAW ..... it's to mandate reporting from forein banks , not to make them have the info if requested. ..... This is a new LAW for 2014

The US can't mandate reporting from foreign banks. They can't mandate what Thai banks have to do. Come on, there's

the little question of sovereignty. What they can mandate is what their citizens have to do - that's what would be a (US) law.

Now, if Thai banks choose to (like maybe the Swiss) to voluntarily report to the US Treasury then that's their prerogative.

You're a bit clueless here. The Evil Empire can, will and does force compliance with its laws on foreign countries and companies with respect to dealing with US citizens.

The Swiss didn't comply of their own accord, the did it under threat of massive sanctions. As did all the counties offering gaming to US citizens. They do it all the time. All in the name of a war against a mythical bad guy. The current cornerstone of US policy is if you are not with us you are against us, in all matters.

I don't think the US can force foreign banks to comply unless that foreign bank holds a charter or has branches in the USA. That said, many foreign banks may feel it's more trouble than it's worth to take on American depositors and refuse to open accounts for them.

You don't appreciate the lengths they go to to apply pressure. Assuming for one instance that your country didn't force compliance, even if you have no us branches you would get nice letters from other banks declining your business as they and all banks they deal with must be in demonstrated compliance. MasterCard, visa, ATM manufactures, the ATM network etc would all shun you. You would be reduced to and isolated local cash only bank in a heartbeat. Further, anyone on your board of directors would become a target for US prosecution and wouLd be put on watch lists the world over for arrest (google what happened to neteller ). If you blatantly defied them your bank would be doomed.

[Jingthing]

The mods may not agree with this, but this news about ONLINE FILING of FBARS is actually major news in the FBAR world and I think deserves a new thread, which I will start now. Thanks to kerryk who pointed it out.

New thread:

Edited June 7, 2012 by Jingthing

[Pib]

I have heard on good authority that the US Embassy in Bangkok already has access to see the balance of EVERY bank account in Thailand no matter the nationality of the owner.

They refer to this data mostly to verify information before issuing visitors visas to the USA.

How many bar stools down was the guy who told you this?

[Jingthing]

This story is depressing:

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-06-26/irs-says-offshore-tax-disclosures-have-yielded-5-billion.html

They're definitely out to target expats. That much is clear.

I am starting to fear that Thai banks will stop wanting to do business with Americans as these reporting by foreign banks rules kick in.

When they say they got 33,000 disclosures, what do they mean exactly?

Surely they don't mean just getting 33,000 FBAR forms, or do they?

[taxout]

If you're reading this thread today, June 27, remember that the June 30 deadline means the deadline for RECEIPT of your FBAR; unlike tax returns, postmarks don't count. Thus e-filing, discussed on the other thread, is your only option for timely filing at this point.

[flying]

I am starting to fear that Thai banks will stop wanting to do business with Americans as these reporting by foreign banks rules kick in.

When they say they got 33,000 disclosures, what do they mean exactly?

Surely they don't mean just getting 33,000 FBAR forms, or do they?

This is ultimately something that I think is a possibility...Meaning not accepting US account holders.

Then again the only banks that have something to lose to the US arm twisting are those that have a US counterpart like BKB NY

So in that regard perhaps they would not refuse because at that point what use is their US investment?

Those that have nothing to lose may be a bit more ambivalent to the regs anyway. As long as some US citizens

find a way to bring $$$$ to their bank they will accept it & ignore reporting requirements as the regs do not come from

anyone they *need* to answer to...As they have no US counterpart to be threatened with closing

I guess they could be threatened with removal of VISA/Mastercard?...Not sure

As to the possibility of 35,000 I would guess at least that many. Otherwise how did they get

the $4.4 Billion

Edited June 27, 2012 by flying

[gregb]

Be advised there is something seriously wrong with the E-filing system. I attempted twice to enter my password, both times it said it was invalid. I then attempted to reset my password. It asked me a security question. Unfortunately, this screen doesn't work with Firefox, as when I pressed the "submit" button nothing happened. I then changed to the opera browser and repeated the procedure.

I got an email with a new temporary password. I then attempted to use this by copying and pasting it into the text box to be assured there was no problem. The submit box was greyed out however.

I then reloaded the page and tried again. I received a message saying my account was now locked due to too many incorrect password attempts, and the only way to unlock it was to call a number in the US.

None of this was my fault. I know exactly what my password was. This is some kind of bug in their system, and there is no way I am spending money to call these idiots in the states. I will file the normal way until they fix their problem. And if there is a law passed that says I must use the electronic version, then I will respond in writing that their electronic system is broken and continue filing in the traditional fashion until they correct their error.

There is absolutely no way I could have fat fingered the password twice, and then successfully reset the password and and entered it incorrectly a third time when I copy and pasted exactly what was in the email. This is just a warning to everyone to be extremely cautious when using this system, as it appears unstable.

[Jingthing]

Clever of them to decide to make us e-file (yes, that is on schedule to happen), make it so hard to e-file, and to have those MASSIVE fines for not filing. I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore! (Famous last words ...) I read somewhere that the real value for the government is from those who do NOT file the forms.

Edited June 28, 2012 by Jingthing

[gregb]

Be advised there is something seriously wrong with the E-filing system. I attempted twice to enter my password, both times it said it was invalid. I then attempted to reset my password. It asked me a security question. Unfortunately, this screen doesn't work with Firefox, as when I pressed the "submit" button nothing happened. I then changed to the opera browser and repeated the procedure.

I got an email with a new temporary password. I then attempted to use this by copying and pasting it into the text box to be assured there was no problem. The submit box was greyed out however.

I then reloaded the page and tried again. I received a message saying my account was now locked due to too many incorrect password attempts, and the only way to unlock it was to call a number in the US.

None of this was my fault. I know exactly what my password was. This is some kind of bug in their system, and there is no way I am spending money to call these idiots in the states. I will file the normal way until they fix their problem. And if there is a law passed that says I must use the electronic version, then I will respond in writing that their electronic system is broken and continue filing in the traditional fashion until they correct their error.

There is absolutely no way I could have fat fingered the password twice, and then successfully reset the password and and entered it incorrectly a third time when I copy and pasted exactly what was in the email. This is just a warning to everyone to be extremely cautious when using this system, as it appears unstable.

Just a follow up. The only way to unlock your account after they have disabled it is to call the E Filing help desk, which is a toll free number in the US. Unfortunately, when I try to dial that number from here all I get is a reorder tone.

So basically, they just raped me, Due to their buggy system there is physically no way I can file my report on time. I've tried to create a new account, but it has been over 2 hours and no notice back that they approved the new account. And I'm expecting they'll deny it anyway because I already created one that is locked.

I'm pissed beyond belief right now.

[Jingthing]

Wow. I feel your pain. If I were you, I would keep calling of course, but if you can't e-file on time, I would still MAIL the form and attach a letter explaining your experience with failing to e-file. Of course, the mailed form will be technically late, but what choice do you have if you can't e-file.

[taxout]

The help desk is only open during US business hours, M-F.

As I mentioned in another post, I was having problems like this until I reset some of my security settings. For better or worse, I think it's safest to use IE and read the back posts about the proper settings. (You won't find anything about the required settings on FINCEN's website: what do they care.)