Mid Night Closing

[rbrb]

According to a news report in the Pattaya Mail of 30th January 2004 all bars etc have been told that the mid night closing of these establishments will apply very soon.

Any body have any news on this?

[PvtDick]

Pattaya Mail Report

[george]

They are waiting for the nationwide policy in Pattaya as well, as we are informed:

http://www.thaivisa.com/index.php?514&backPID=10&tt_news=670

[markt]

According to a news report in the Pattaya Mail of 30th January 2004 all bars etc have been told that the mid night closing of these establishments will apply very soon.

Any body have any news on this?

Hmmmm....

[bartender100]

Great I would like to get home by 1am

[george]

One night in Bangkok ... but it ends at midnight

Thai clean-up campaign threatens mainstream tourism as well as sex bars with 'Cinderella curfew'

BANGKOK: A mixture of lust and jaded experience marks the faces peering from the darkness in the Queen's Castle II club in Patpong. Under harsh stage lights six

women gyrate in bikinis or less, one doing a trick with a ping-pong ball without using her hands.

Other smiling young women sit beside male tourists, ask to be a bought a drink and wait to be taken to a hotel in exchange for cash. It is a well-rehearsed, centuries-old performance in the red light districts of Bangkok -but within weeks it may be a dying trade.

Thailand's government has dared to think the unthinkable by proposing a midnight curfew on the go-go bars, massage parlours and nightclubs to help rebrand the country as a land of beaches, temples and sunshine. But critics warn the 'Cinderella rule' would cost a million jobs, devastate tourism and 'take the Bang out of Bangkok'.

'If we have to close at midnight it will cut my staff in half - and my salary,' said Somsak, manager of Queen's Castle II, one of more than 100 neon-lit Patpong bars. 'The club might not even be able to stay open. I have been here for 26 years and I don't know what I would do with my life.

'The government is being stupid. Tourists want to spend here and the girls are desperate for the money to take care of their children and mothers.'

Somsak is among the owners of 36,000 establishments awaiting the government ruling, expected on 1 March. They currently have a curfew of 2am and insist that anything earlier will send sex tourists seeking their kicks elsewhere. Some clubs are already planning to relocate to rival party cities in Malaysia and Singapore.

There are fears that mainstream tourism, which attracts 600,000 Britons a year, will also be hit. Discos in beach resorts such as Phuket and Koh Samui often do not open until midnight and run until dawn. Internet cafes, karaoke bars, restaurants, snooker halls and video game arcades are dreading the anti-vice backlash whose seeds were sown in Asia's 1997 economic crisis and the rise of conservatives with hardline ideas for recovery. Among their targets are Thais who habitually stop off at massage parlours for a 'quickie' after work when they 'should go back home to their families'.

It is Thai men rather than tourists who keep the sex industry alive. Surveys have found that between 75 and 96 per cent admit to having had sex with a prostitute, and half lost their virginity to one.

The domestic market concentrates on high turnover. In 'tea-houses' women are expected to service 15 or more clients a day for a few pounds each. They wear everyday clothes and plastic discs, colour-coded to indicate their price. Few Thai men willingly wear condoms and the government has been fighting to prevent an explosion of HIV/Aids, with some success. Keen to keep up the pressure, it claims that a poll of academics, housewives and women's groups supports the midnight curfew.

Furious opposition from club owners forced a temporary reprieve earlier this month from Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra but the issue will be back on the agenda again this week. Somyos Suthangkura, of the Entertainment Places Operators' Association of Thailand, said: 'We are already suffering for closing at 2am. If we have to close at midnight, we will be out of business.'

Customers are also dismayed. Brian Rudik, 30, a British computer programmer in the Queen's Castle bar with a Thai girl at his side, said: 'The go-go bar scene was one of the things that brought me here and keeps me here as an ex-pat worker. The owners employ a lot of people to take a lot of money, which then gets sent up-country. There are usually 60 girls at a club, so what would they all do?'

Respectable Bangkok is also in jeopardy. Andrew Clark, co-owner of the Q Bar, a fashionable venue which has been held up as a test case during Thai cabinet discussions, said: 'We might have to shut down. A new curfew would drive everything underground where police cannot control it. They're trying to attract a better class of tourist but repeat tourism is based on the hotels, restaurants and night-time entertainment.'

Tourism officials are left in a difficult position. Suraphon Svetasreni, deputy governor of the Tourism Authority of Thailand, said: 'The government wants to change Thailand's image. It might have a knock-on effect but only on a certain type of tourist, not the mainstream we're looking for. We promote tourism here on the basis of beaches, sunshine, history and culture more than entertainments. It does need to be regulated for the benefit of society.'

--The Guardian, UK 2004-01-31

[marquess]

Thanks George! That article was very informative and reasonably balanced.

[markt]

This is all well and good if the people employed in the sex-trade can get other type of work elsewhere.

Blimey, you've got patpong, Nana, Cowboy, Hat Yai, Patong and Pattaya. That's an awful lot of people.

Taksin wanting to change his countries image is admirable but so many people are involved in the sex-trade that it is part of Thailand, love it or loathe it.

[Jeepz]

<sarcasm>

I think it is a great idea. At least it is not being instituted at the demand of NGO, but by the government. Not some supposedly altrustic christian do-gooders this time.

New jobs will be found. The country will be better. Fewer farangs wandering around. Maybe more asian tourists, who spend more and party during normal hours, not late at night.

Manufacturers can start competing with other countries again when flood of unemployed bar girls/women become available for jobs at lower wages. They will be back in the lower paid labor pool, but working where they can be taxed.

</sarcasm>

Okay, actually between shutting down the nightlife at midnight and the Avian Flu fiasco, the government might just manage to put Thailand into a recession. What do you think?

Jeepz

[markt]

According to a news report in the Pattaya Mail of 30th January 2004 all bars etc have been told that the mid night closing of these establishments will apply very soon.

Any body have any news on this?

Even Penang's bars stay open later than that!

[yellowbudgy]

This was taken/stolen off soc.culture and is probably the reality of the future.

YB

-----------------------------------------------------

I was visiting Thailand after a

break

of about three years. I walked down Soi 4 Nanatai past what was N.E.P,

it had become a shopping centre.There were pictures of Premier Thaksin

everywhere, Thailand had become a Republic. The open bar in front of

the

Nana Hotel had become a fast pizza franchise. I then caught the

Skytrain

and Subway to Soi Cowboy. The bars and Go-go's had gone and except for

a couple of restaurants it was a pedestrian street full of ladies

clothes

and shoe shops. Another trip on the Subway and Sky train with their

warnings

of heavy fines for dropping chewing gum and cigarettes brought me to

what

was Chatuchak Market, it had become a large bus station. Undeterred I

travelled to Patpong in the evening to look for some designer copies

and

cheap CD's. Patpong had become a couple of streets with expensive

shops

and the market stalls had disappeared. A fading sign said 'Fight

Piracy!'

The shops had closed at 6pm and there was not a cheap CD or cheap

anything

in sight. Everywhere the Thais looked wary and glanced away not

wanting to

return eye contact. Cowed and serious the smiles had gone. I took some

money

from an ATM with retinal recognition, the money exchange shop next

door

quoted Euro's, the pound sterling had disappeared. As in Hong Kong the

Thais

mostly used electronic cards instead of money. Bangkok had become as

expensive as Europe. The streets were spotlessly clean and the beggers

and

stray dogs had disappeared.

A smartly dressed policeman seemed to be on every street corner,

they were checking bags as there had been an alleged terrorist alert.

CCTV

cameras were beginning to sprout like mushrooms and monitored the

progress

of cars digitally. Cars were charged to drive in Bangkok, their

journeys

tracked electronically. In the dream I watched a policeman fine a

pedestrian

for dropping a cigarette end. On the way back to my hotel I past a

book shop

the newspapers outside had full front page coverage of European

Federation

President Blair meeting Premier Thaksin to discuss the Asian Union,

big smiles

all round.

My hotel was quiet and the staff appeared polite but subdued as if

frightened

of something. A sign in the almost empty hotel bar said 'Closes at

10pm' the

staff looked bored or sad.

The next day I took a luxury aircon bus to Pattaya to look up an old

friend.

I walked through Soi Diamond to get to Walking Street. The Go-go's and

bars

that were left were closed and boarded up. A sign outside my friend's

Go-go

had faded with age. It stated that he had gone back to 'NZ' and then

gave a

barely readable address. Walking Street had become a fashion shopping

precinct

rather like Bond Street in London. Again pictures of Premier Thaksin

dominated

public areas,they had replaced Rama V, echoes of North Korea. There

was not a

Farang in sight. The bars had gone.

Where the Thai Boxing ring and 'Dolls House' Go-go had been there was

now a shopping mall. The escalator that led to the 'Peppermint A-Go

go' now

led to a designer shoe shop and a Macdonalds. Stone faced security

guards stood

where once there were 'service girls'. The ladyboy disco now sold

ice-cream.

I saw shops offering 'Traditional Massage Only'. The word 'only' was

made to

stand out. No girl asked if I wanted to come in. Just like Bangkok the

Thais

looked serious and cowed, afraid to make eye-contact with a Farang, I

felt like

an outcast. A group of neatly dressed school children scurried past,

they wore

badges on their uniforms which said 'Young Pioneers' in English and

Thai.

Suspicious eyes flicked in my direction. I awaited denouncement.

Beach road was full of families from India, Australia and what looked

like Malays

or Indonesians with their muslim attire. At least there were a few

Australian

farangs, I couldn't miss the accent. A large sign invited you to

'DisneyAsia'-Pattaya

only 10kms away. Accompanying that sign was another triumphanting Thai

rice

production for the 'Asian Union'. Most of the bars on Beach Road and

the Soi's

had gone, the girlie bars had been replaced by either hotels or

expensive shops

run by Indians. There were a few Swiss and Belgian restaurants but few

Farangs

in them. Other bars had become fashionable ice-cream parlours all

fighting for

trade. Like Bangkok everywhere looked spotlessly clean. One bar had a

sign saying

No singing, No dancing. There wasn't any music and the televisions

showed endless

football matches or programmes on farming. It reminded me of Greece

under the

Colonels. Dismayed and with a heavy heart I returned to Bangkok and

then to the

airport cutting my holiday short. Arriving at Don Muang another sign

proclaimed

that the new airport 'Thaksin International' was due to open on time

in 2010, they

were now using the western calendar.

I awoke in a cold sweat, it was after all just a dream.

Strange dreams and nightmares are made of unusual things.

[markt]

Sounds like Singers to me.

[rbrb]

Thanks all the replies to my intitial posting.

The latest news seems to be as reported in the Phuket Gazette:

http://www.phuketgazette.net/news/index.asp?id=3295

[The Gentleman Scamp]

Regarding Yellow Budgies 'bad dream', I was just wondering, as a fellow newbie how long he's lived here...because if, like me, it's been just under two years, he must surely be feeling like he's arrived at the party just as it's winding down and people are going home.

Cause that's how I'm feeling, I wish I'd lived here 15 years ago, but at 16 I had no desire to travel.

Shame.

[chucky66]

This article fails to mention the specifics of the zoning that is being put forward to be introduced (see below). Until next Tuesday this is all just proposition but the social crackdown is still maintaining momentum in thai politics at the moment. This news is my second worst fear. The plan is not well though out, ambiguous and if enforced would lead to the ultimate demise of Thailands unique hedonistic nightlife:

Purachai's night vision:

Entertainment venues with female escorts: 9pm to 2am in designated zones; 9pm to midnight in other areas.

--thats 9pm opening folks. Only three hours opening time???..I dont even go out eating until 9pm when Im on vacation!!!!!!!!!!!

Teahouses with female escorts: 6pm to midnight in all areas.

---how many teahouses are there in patong???

Massage parlours: 4pm to midnight in designated zones; 6pm to midnight elsewhere.

Karaoke lounges, pubs and discotheques: 6pm to 1am in designated zones; 6pm to midnight elsewhere

Ultimately though my feeling is that these laws if passed will be used as a whip cracking measure if the entertainment venues flout the rules. However I dont think anyone (thai or tourist) should be told to stop enjoying themselves at midnight. Bars that are located in the zones would have to pay higher rents etc and this would ultimately be passed on to the customer in higher drinks prices,food prices, bar fines etc etc. Entertainment venues outside the zones would be squeezed out of business and with that would come less competition and the justification of venues within the zones to charge higher prices.

WHY CHANGE WHAT IS LARGELY WORKING WELL ALREADY IN TOURIST AREAS?

[marquess]

WHY CHANGE WHAT IS LARGELY WORKING WELL ALREADY IN TOURIST AREAS?

Because Purachi, who has probably never had any fun in his life, is determined that no one else should too.

The hotch potch proposels for opening times, says it all. I just hope that someone in the cabinet can see sense or will see sense!

[Noodles]

Over the last few years koh Samui has been getting

quieter and quieter. If these new laws are put in place

it will destroy tourism and alot of business here.

It's a fact that when people come away on holiday they

like to have the option of drinking., if they want, into the early

hours.

Thailand seems to be in SELF DESTRUCT MODE.

[chucky66]

self destruct mode with regards to killing off tourists....maybe! After all Thailands hedonistic nightlife is a big reason why tourists (sex tourists and normal tourists) come to Thailand. If europeans wanted nice beaches they could go to Spain, Greece, Italy etc, if Australians wanted nice beaches then they could go their own. Frankly, a large proportion of Thailands tourists come from the rest of asia who dont drink as much or go to entertainment venues as late as many farangs. These proposed ideas would not affect them as much and Thailand cares more for these tourists I feel that farangs and sex tourists are at the bottom of their wish list for tourism. But tourists may be only marginally affected by the move in comparison to the thais...this all depends upon how things are acted upon and regulated in the coming months.

Time will tell if the Thai Rak Thai party wish to add themselves to the list of govt regimes which oppress its people. In doing so Thailand would lose a big part of what it is popular for and in already troubled times the TRT party would increase the divide that is already growing between thai people and its policies. If the TRT party really did love its people then it would stop this stupidity and think things out before jumping to hasty destructive decisions.

[marquess]

Frankly, a large proportion of Thailands tourists come from the rest of asia who dont drink as much or go to entertainment venues as late as many farangs. These proposed ideas would not affect them as much and Thailand cares more for these tourists I feel that farangs and sex tourists are at the bottom of their wish list for tourism.

Yes, but I wonder who spends the most money? Tourism is mainly about economics, especially here.

[george]

2 am fun zones for adults?

BANGKOK: Entertainment venues in designated areas across the country will be allowed to stay open an hour or two longer than those outside the zones if the Cabinet endorses a decision arrived at yesterday by a high-level government committee.

Deputy Prime Minister Purachai Piumsombun's committee in charge of combating vice at entertainment venues agreed yesterday to set different closing hours for night spots in different zones, according a source who attended the meeting.

Some areas would be zoned for adult-oriented entertainment.

Purachai's panel decided that, in designated zones, entertainment places with hostesses should be allowed to stay open until 2am, while those outside would have to close by midnight.

It was also agreed that massage parlours inside the zones should be allowed to operate from 4pm to midnight, opening two hours earlier than those outside the zones.

In Bangkok, the zones would cover the Patpong area and New Phetchaburi and Ratchadaphisek roads.

The panel believes that longer operating hours would encourage owners to shift their nightspots into the designated zones, said the source.

Yesterday's decision will be forwarded to the Cabinet for consideration on Tuesday (February 10).

The new rules, if endorsed, would be included in an Interior Ministry regulation to be imposed under the Entertainment Venue Act, which came into effect early last month. The new law sets no specific hours for entertainment venues.

Yesterday's decision appeared to be a compromise between the Interior Ministry, which previously proposed a midnight closure, and entertainment-venue operators, who want their businesses to stay open after the current closing time of 2am.

At a meeting early last month, the Cabinet resolved that the midnight-closure proposal submitted by Deputy Interior Minister Pracha Maleenont be referred to Purachai's panel for review.

Pracha cited the need to keep young people away from drugs and other vices as a reason for shutting bars at midnight.

Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra at the time questioned the rationale of a blanket closing time.

Purachai reportedly told those who attended yesterday's meeting not to speak about the decision. Pracha was absent from the session. He is on a trip to Europe and sent one of his advisers, Surapol Kiatchaiyakorn, on his behalf.

--The Nation

[sabaijai]

The police will love it, more opportunity to kin baeng ...

[chucky66]

George ..you missed the important part at the bottom of the article:

Purachai's night vision:

Entertainment venues with female escorts: 9pm to 2am in designated zones; 9pm to midnight in other areas.

Teahouses with female escorts: 6pm to midnight in all areas.

Massage parlours: 4pm to midnight in designated zones; 6pm to midnight elsewhere.

Karaoke lounges, pubs and discotheques: 6pm to 1am in designated zones; 6pm to midnight elsewhere

THIS IS ALL JUST PROPOSITION UNTIL TOMORROW WHEN THE OUTCOME WILL BE DECIDED...

[yellowbudgy]

Gentleman Scamp Posted:

Regarding Yellow Budgies 'bad dream', I was just wondering, as a fellow newbie how long he's lived here...because if, like me, it's been just under two years, he must surely be feeling like he's arrived at the party just as it's winding down and people are going home.

Cause that's how I'm feeling, I wish I'd lived here 15 years ago, but at 16 I had no desire to travel.

-------------------------------

'It wasn't my bad dream' but I understand what the origional writer is trying to say.

how long he's lived here:

I don't live in Th but have been going there often 3 times a year for up to 16 years with stays lasting sometimes 6 weeks.

feeling like he's arrived at the party just as it's winding down:

Well I have to agree with you that it does seem to be winding down for anyone that isn't fairly well aquainted with Thailand nightlife.

There have always been plenty of places to go that the average tourist wont have a clue exists both in Pattaya and BKK. The thais are masters at late, unlawful activities. The sort of places they go to after they finish their 'work' or rather got shot of the punter, had his money and want to go to meet the boyfriend (or girlfriend!). I believe these will continue as indeed they would in any country that starts to impose the sort of mentality that young Mr Chiang Mai seems determined to do.Which is exactly the mentality the origional author of 'that dream' was suggesting

I actually feel sorry for any newbie tourists as they will be more prone to being ripped off on the street.Drugging, drinking,attacks and pimping will become more widespread among their own. Similar to prohibition.

In some ways it will get better for the regulars or long term residents in my view. But will become a waste of time for the first,second or infrequent tourist.

I always knew the mobile would be handy in TH but hey what about the possibilities of the internet. Apart from the language barrier of course.

No Mr Chiang Mai has made a very bad error of judgement in my view, which is likely to rebound back on him sooner or later. Does he really think being ripped off at the monkey show or walking the urine trail at the beach is anything to encourage tourists.......wait and see!!!

Regards

yb