Bangkok Flooding: Expert Doubts City's Rainfall Claims

[webfact]

BANGKOK FLOODING

Expert doubts city's rainfall claims

CHULARAT SAENGPASSA,

ANUPAN CHANTANA

THE NATION

Blames poor drainage, not unusual downpours; BMA sticks by figures

BANGKOK: -- Flawed water-drainage management, not heavy rain, is the likely culprit in the repeated hours-long flooding of Bangkok's major roads, Hydro and Agro Infomatics Institute director Royol Jitdon hinted yesterday.

"It's not about too much rain. It's about the fact that there are no systems to push rainwater quickly into water-drainage tunnels or canals," Royol said in his capacity as a member of the Strategic Committee for Water Resources Management (SCWRM).

He also dismissed the Bangkok Metropolitan Administration's claim that the capital could deal with no more than 60 millimetres of rainfall a day.

"The water-drainage pipes in the capital clearly should be able to deal with 60 millimetres of rainfall per day," he said. "Problems should arise only if rainfall is well over 60 millimetres per hour."

And even if the rainfall exceeded 60 millimetres per hour in some spots, Royol was still convinced that the water-drainage system spanned a wide area and with the shared capacity, the system should be able to function well enough to prevent floods.

Earlier this week, the BMA called for patience and understanding from city residents, saying temporary flooding would be unavoidable in the face of hours-long cloudbursts because the capital's water-drainage system was designed to deal with up to 60 millimetres of rainwater only. Officials were quite evasive at first about whether it was 60 millimetres per day or per hour. When pressed, the BMA confirmed it meant 60 millimetres of rainfall per day.

The BMA also claimed that the capital was experiencing a historic high amount of rainfall this month. According to the BMA Drainage and Sewerage Department, the total rainfall in September this year has already reached 721 millimetres - the highest amount in three decades.

Meteorological Department deputy director-general Somchai Baimuang, however, questioned those figures. He said his department found that as of Tuesday, the total rainfall in the current month had reached just 340.7 millimetres.

"How could the rainfall nearly double within one day?" he said.

Royol did not believe the BMA rainfall figures either, saying he would compile the information himself.

He also said that the temporary flooding in Bangkok was clearly the result of flawed drainage management, pointing out that while the inbound lanes of Asoke-Din Daeng Road were not flooded, its outbound lanes were swamped.

"The inbound lanes have not had any problem because the rainwater falling on them can flow directly to the Makkasan Pond," he said.

Meanwhile, BMA spokesman Wasan Meewong said it would take time to drain rainwater in the wake of heavy downpours. He said the average rainfall in the capital was just 1,500 millimetres per year, and repeated the claim that this month, the rainfall had already reached 721 millimetres.

Making an even greater claim for the level of downpours this month, he said: "This is the biggest rainfall in 100 years."

He reckoned there were some clogged pipes and limited pumps. "But we will take fast action on major roads," he said.

When Bangkok's major roads were covered with floodwater, traffic there was almost paralysed and hundreds of thousand commuters were affected, he said.

Wasan said the flooded portions of Vibhavadi-Rangsit Road were in a very low-lying spot and that was why repeated flooding occurred.

According to Royol, heavy rain will continue in Bangkok for just two more days.

Meanwhile, heavy downpours have turned the water flow in a canal in Phang Nga into a ferocious torrent, damaging the Bang Bang Miang Bridge.

"Hundreds of people became marooned," Phang Nga Administrative Organisation deputy chair Sermpong Saridsuk said yesterday.

Phang Nga disaster prevention and mitigation officials rushed to erect a temporary bridge but the process was expected to take days.

"I think we should complete the task [tomorrow]," the office's director, Kiat Inthornkham, said.

In Ranong, flooding yesterday hit people living along the Bang Hin Canal in Kapur district.

"We will use machinery to dredge the canal and quickly drain the floodwater out of the affected areas," Tambon Ban Na Administrative Organisation chairman Sangob Jankhieo said yesterday.

-- The Nation 2012-09-28

[fareastguy]

Little white lies emanating from the BMA I think to help deflect criticism.

721mm of rainfall the highest level in 100 years as apposed to 340.7mm as stated by the meteorological department.

As we all suspected from the beginning a complete shambles & mismanagement of what is normal monsoonal rainfall for BKK

When will they get their collective backsides into gear & do something positive.

While their "ducking & weaving" the public are almost diving !!

[webfact]

RT @ChadapornLin: Heavy rain and flooding plague BKK; flooding reported in some areas after all-night rain

[Soupdragon]

The boss of the BMA destroyed his vehicle (picture above) after reading that you should drive with dipped headlights during bad weather.

[asiawatcher]

Were any of these 'experts' awake thru last night? And dumb quotes like it's not about too much rain... really? Then what else causes flooding?

The pipes and measures and the (unaccounted for) billions of baht (reportedly) spent have obviously done nothing. Yeah sure, a huge deluge can't get away through runoff channels simply 'cos most of Bangkok is at sea (see?) level. So unless you are going to pump it elsewhere and store it, or remove the illegal squatters (owners) and widen the water ways to give the rain water 'some' chance to roll out, all the analysis and verbiage is a waste of time. But hey, keep throwing money at it, that is sure to work for someone.

[canuckamuck]

It seems like a normal year for rainfall. Amazing they think they can fool everyone and say it is a record year for rain.

[whybother]

It seems like a normal year for rainfall. Amazing they think they can fool everyone and say it is a record year for rain.

I don't remember it raining this much in Bangkok last year, or for the last couple of years. Last year sticks out in my mind because there was a lot of concern about rainfall in Bangkok in addition to the water that was coming down from up country and the high tides.

[OZEMADE]

Well if you believe what everyone is saying about the rainfall and what is coming over the next few months, heavy rains, monsoons, high tides, walls not built or finished, dams about to have their levels dropped. You lot in Bangers and surrounding areas are in trouble. I would be bookinjg my room or condo in Pattaya now, as they did last year. A lot of Bangkokians last year actually bought properties in Pattaya during and after last years floods.

[1weatherman]

Ok. There has been so far this month at Sirikit Park 569mm of rainfall. That is 176% above normal. Don Muang airport 390mm which is 157% above normal. On this, my side, of town Bangna at the Met Dept 414mm has fallen. Again above normal, 150%. But from all accounts not one place in Bangkok has had 721mm of rain this month. Maybe BMA has added up a few totals together to come up with their figures to support their poor management of the drainage system.

With that said 60mm (almost 2 1/2 inches) per hour of rain would certainly task many drainage systems anywhere in the world. But when the drains are clogged up with garbage/rubbish that doesn't help matters. Roads make good jet ski areas then.

[whybother]

Well if you believe what everyone is saying about the rainfall and what is coming over the next few months, heavy rains, monsoons, high tides, walls not built or finished, dams about to have their levels dropped. You lot in Bangers and surrounding areas are in trouble. I would be bookinjg my room or condo in Pattaya now, as they did last year. A lot of Bangkokians last year actually bought properties in Pattaya during and after last years floods.

Last year, there were 3 typhoons that dumped water over the north and north east (in late July and mid September). This year that hasn't happened, and there are no typhoons on the horizon that are expected to affect Thailand as they did last year.

The water that flooded Sukothai should be getting to Bangkok soon, although I haven't heard about any major flooding in Ayutthaya yet, but it is nowhere near the same as the amount of water that was coming down from the north last year.

Edited September 28, 2012 by whybother

[RickBradford]

I haven't heard about any major flooding in Ayutthaya yet

If you were to Google "ayutthaya flood again" you would see recent stories from the paper that may not be mentioned (and others), about 6 districts of Ayutthaya being flooded with water up to a metre deep over the past few weeks, affecting 16,000 homes and the areas being designated 'flood disaster zones'.

[hellodolly]

Were any of these 'experts' awake thru last night? And dumb quotes like it's not about too much rain... really? Then what else causes flooding?

The pipes and measures and the (unaccounted for) billions of baht (reportedly) spent have obviously done nothing. Yeah sure, a huge deluge can't get away through runoff channels simply 'cos most of Bangkok is at sea (see?) level. So unless you are going to pump it elsewhere and store it, or remove the illegal squatters (owners) and widen the water ways to give the rain water 'some' chance to roll out, all the analysis and verbiage is a waste of time. But hey, keep throwing money at it, that is sure to work for someone.

Well to be honest about it when were the system's built. It is a well known fact that the city is sinking thereby leaving it harder for the drainage system to perform up to the standards it was built for.

[hellodolly]

Well if you believe what everyone is saying about the rainfall and what is coming over the next few months, heavy rains, monsoons, high tides, walls not built or finished, dams about to have their levels dropped. You lot in Bangers and surrounding areas are in trouble. I would be bookinjg my room or condo in Pattaya now, as they did last year. A lot of Bangkokians last year actually bought properties in Pattaya during and after last years floods.

Also in Chiang Mai

[lujanit]

My understanding is that the problem is not the rain that falls here in BKK (and, brother did it rain last night!!) yet it is all the rain that falls in the central region and then has to make it's way downstream via the floodplain that BKK sits in the middle of. Heavy rain here in BKK only produces localised flooding for a short while. It also causes massive traffic snarl ups, nearly 3 hours to get home last evening. Not fun!

[Pib]

Here in my rather large western Bangkok moobaan when it rained hard the sois would fill up to curb level and maybe take around 4 hours to drain off completely. Now after the drainage pipe were semi-cleaned by the correction department inmates and some pumping stations fixed, it's much harder for the water to reach curb level and when it does it drains off within 15 minutes. Big, big improvement. However, let me be clear the city had nothing to do with these improvements....the moobaan manager arranged to have the drainage pipes cleaned and paid to improve the pumping system. Of course he got a ton of heat from residents last after the flooding so he had some motivation.

[Thunder26]

It seems like a normal year for rainfall. Amazing they think they can fool everyone and say it is a record year for rain.

They don't talk about the annual average rainfall, but about the amount of rainfall in September, which is pretty impressive, exceeding 500 mm in some spots.

http://www.arcims.tmd.go.th/dailydata/MonthRain.php

[davejones]

Were any of these 'experts' awake thru last night? And dumb quotes like it's not about too much rain... really? Then what else causes flooding?

Inadequate drainage.

[zakk9]

So it rains more than "normal". Big surprise. This has been predicted by researchers for a couple of decades already, and it will increase. It's one of the most obvious results of global warming. Unfortunately, politicians and most of the bureaucrats listen mostly to their own voice, so a very predictable development almost always comes as a surprise to them. I remember when they started using areas in the central provinces as overflow reservoirs to spare Bangkok. Doing that on a grand scale happened as little as 10 years ago. Now, it's like it has happened forever. If the current weather trend continues, and I'm quite sure it will, I don't think I will live in Bangkok in 25 years from now.

[teatree]

So it rains more than "normal". Big surprise. This has been predicted by researchers for a couple of decades already, and it will increase. It's one of the most obvious results of global warming. Unfortunately, politicians and most of the bureaucrats listen mostly to their own voice, so a very predictable development almost always comes as a surprise to them. I remember when they started using areas in the central provinces as overflow reservoirs to spare Bangkok. Doing that on a grand scale happened as little as 10 years ago. Now, it's like it has happened forever. If the current weather trend continues, and I'm quite sure it will, I don't think I will live in Bangkok in 25 years from now.

I knew it wouldn't take long for someone to bring up the man made global warming/cooling/climate change nonsense.

In a few years when there's a drought, no doubt that will be blamed on AGW. And when there is a cold snap in the north that will have been caused by AGW too. And when it's hottter than normal too.

Whatever the weather - hotter, cooler, drier wetter, calmer, windier etc etc etc - the finger always points to AGW.

Unusual weather events have always happened and always will. In fact the only constant with regards to climate is CHANGE.

[jcw]

Amazing Thailand, Another day, another dollar, another white lie.

[Dr Robert]

"Expert: someone who has stopped learning"

A. Einstein, (1921)

[pointoffew]

I am not an expert in the field but dare to say that I find the numbers claimed by the BMA bizarre; the 60 mm per DAY max drainage capacity is absolutely ridiculous, and once more proves they have no idea what they are talking about. Not a single city in the would has such a low capacity.

The figure of 721 millimetres of rainfall so far this months is extremely unlikely and incredible - and it should be easy for the Met Dept to prove it's just another lie - not a white one, but an soaking wet one. Why not sack those for systematically misleading the public. They are a shame on and a danger to the country.

[SOTIRIOS]

...pitiful......pathetic.....nonsense.....criminal, at the end of the day....and a whole country to fall victim....again.....

[Pushit]

Were any of these 'experts' awake thru last night? And dumb quotes like it's not about too much rain... really? Then what else causes flooding?

Inadequate drainage.

Drainage obstructed by all the sand flushed down it from last years damaged sand bags.

[Docno]

Well, I live in one of the richest and most technologically advanced cities in the world, Singapore. We don't have to worry about run-off from other parts of the 'country' (the city IS the country). And we get floods in our central shopping district after heavy downpours. I was in Bangkok last weekend and the amount of rain (esp. on Monday) looked to be heavier and more sustained than the rains that caused the flooding you see below. There are limits... everywhere

[MaxLee]

You forget this is Thailand, where admitting fault of Phu Yais of high social status is a loss of face

[Baerboxer]

It seems like a normal year for rainfall. Amazing they think they can fool everyone and say it is a record year for rain.

Why not - they talk rubbish on most subjects and manage to get away with it - like a considerable number of politicians in other countries too.

[whybother]

Apparently, a new idea from the Plod is to lift all the klongs by a metre so that the water flows down to the sea faster.

[DocN]

This is really like a lottery, only they are not pulling numbers out of a hat, but some other place, where (very fitting to the subject) the sun doesn't shine!

[Baerboxer]

So it rains more than "normal". Big surprise. This has been predicted by researchers for a couple of decades already, and it will increase. It's one of the most obvious results of global warming. Unfortunately, politicians and most of the bureaucrats listen mostly to their own voice, so a very predictable development almost always comes as a surprise to them. I remember when they started using areas in the central provinces as overflow reservoirs to spare Bangkok. Doing that on a grand scale happened as little as 10 years ago. Now, it's like it has happened forever. If the current weather trend continues, and I'm quite sure it will, I don't think I will live in Bangkok in 25 years from now.

I knew it wouldn't take long for someone to bring up the man made global warming/cooling/climate change nonsense.

In a few years when there's a drought, no doubt that will be blamed on AGW. And when there is a cold snap in the north that will have been caused by AGW too. And when it's hottter than normal too.

Whatever the weather - hotter, cooler, drier wetter, calmer, windier etc etc etc - the finger always points to AGW.

Unusual weather events have always happened and always will. In fact the only constant with regards to climate is CHANGE.

So you don't believe all the scientific evidence that supports the fact that certain activities carried out by man contribute or influence climate change? Can provide us with the links to the research that you've read that supports your beliefs?

Edited September 28, 2012 by Baerboxer