koheesti Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 You know my problem? There are no moderate Republicans any more. But when Mitt tries to imitate a moderate - the public loves it. Why doesn't the lunatic center of the Republican party grasp that concept? Most Americans are not far right. They are centrist, middle of the road, want the system to work folks. Boy, I sure hope you're right. If so, that means most Americans will not vote for the most far left President in our history and instead cast a vote for the moderate Republican challenger. Phew! The most far left president in the history of America.... Put the pipe down and let someone else have a drag. Please name some that are more to the left than Obama. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 You know my problem? There are no moderate Republicans any more. But when Mitt tries to imitate a moderate - the public loves it. Why doesn't the lunatic center of the Republican party grasp that concept? Most Americans are not far right. They are centrist, middle of the road, want the system to work folks. Boy, I sure hope you're right. If so, that means most Americans will not vote for the most far left President in our history and instead cast a vote for the moderate Republican challenger. Phew! The most far left president in the history of America.... Put the pipe down and let someone else have a drag. Please name some that are more to the left than Obama. FDR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteeleJoe Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 (edited) Interesting, the US's biggest state, Alaska, has fewer delegate votes, than its smallest state; Rhode Island. Alaska is solidly for Romney and RI is solidly Obama, but the point spread will be much greater than that. I predict Obama taking delegate votes 5 to 4. Electoral college has nothing to do with size of territory. Lots of Alaska has no humans in it (the population is smaller than RI). Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap Edited October 28, 2012 by SteeleJoe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post SteeleJoe Posted October 28, 2012 Popular Post Share Posted October 28, 2012 During the fever of the election, both parties' extreme factions will have loud voices. However, I don't think there is any comparison of the democratic party going as far left as the Republican party has gone far right. None. Nancy Pelosi is a joke and characture of herself even among moderate democrats, yet is always the poster girl the far right holds up of excessive liberals. By and large, permeated through the party, the Republicans have gone far right much more than the democrats have gone left. Well done. I sincerely believe this incontrovertible and wouldn't be disputed by any reasonably objective, intellectually honest person with a basic level of familiarity with US politics. (Unfortunately, there's not many on this thread who the first to phrases apply to.) And in terms of politics in general (ie not just within the context of the US)? Calling the Democratic Party "far left" is like calling Stalin pluralist and tolerant: so far from accurate as to be nonsensical. (Do I think we should view things with an international perspective rather than US? No. I merely mean to put into some perspective -- people calling any US politician of even minor import "far Left" have no idea what the words mean.) Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 (edited) A sad and continuing reality of American life that electing Obama did nothing to fix. Racism against African Americans still exists. A lot. I heard one item which I can't source asserting that Obama being at least perceived as black (yes he is mixed race) costs him about FIVE percent of the popular vote, meaning of course if he was white, this election would be a total blowout landslide for Obama. But he isn't white, so we have a nail biter (in the popular vote anyway). Also probably not at all surprising to most Americans, republicans are much more likely to be explicitly racist against blacks than democrats. As Bill Maher says (paraphrase from memory): not all republicans are racist, but when I meet a racist, he is probably a republican. http://www.washingto...pm_politics_pop WASHINGTON — Racial attitudes have not improved in the four years since the United States elected its first black president, an Associated Press poll finds, as a slight majority of Americans now express prejudice toward blacks whether they recognize those feelings or not. Those views could cost President Barack Obama votes as he tries for re-election, the survey found, though the effects are mitigated by some people’s more favorable views of blacks. Edited October 28, 2012 by Jingthing 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rimmer Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 A baiting post has been removed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckd Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 (edited) Interesting, the US's biggest state, Alaska, has fewer delegate votes, than its smallest state; Rhode Island. Alaska is solidly for Romney and RI is solidly Obama, but the point spread will be much greater than that. I predict Obama taking delegate votes 5 to 4. Electoral college has nothing to do with size of territory. Lots of Alaska has no humans in it (the population is smaller than RI). Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap The Electoral College is based on the number of Senators and House Representatives each state has, plus three votes from the District of Columbia. It is based on Article II, Section 1, Clause 2 of the Constitution. Edited October 28, 2012 by chuckd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteeleJoe Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Interesting, the US's biggest state, Alaska, has fewer delegate votes, than its smallest state; Rhode Island. Alaska is solidly for Romney and RI is solidly Obama, but the point spread will be much greater than that. I predict Obama taking delegate votes 5 to 4. Electoral college has nothing to do with size of territory. Lots of Alaska has no humans in it (the population is smaller than RI). Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap The Electoral College is based on the number of Senators and House Representatives each state has, plus three votes from the District of Columbia. It is based on Article II, Section 1, Clause 2 of the Constitution. Yep. Don't tell me, tell the person I was replying to. Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckd Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Interesting, the US's biggest state, Alaska, has fewer delegate votes, than its smallest state; Rhode Island. Alaska is solidly for Romney and RI is solidly Obama, but the point spread will be much greater than that. I predict Obama taking delegate votes 5 to 4. Electoral college has nothing to do with size of territory. Lots of Alaska has no humans in it (the population is smaller than RI). Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap The Electoral College is based on the number of Senators and House Representatives each state has, plus three votes from the District of Columbia. It is based on Article II, Section 1, Clause 2 of the Constitution. Yep. Don't tell me, tell the person I was replying to. Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap I quoted his post as well. You're welcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neurath Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 You know my problem? There are no moderate Republicans any more. But when Mitt tries to imitate a moderate - the public loves it. Why doesn't the lunatic center of the Republican party grasp that concept? Most Americans are not far right. They are centrist, middle of the road, want the system to work folks. Boy, I sure hope you're right. If so, that means most Americans will not vote for the most far left President in our history and instead cast a vote for the moderate Republican challenger. Phew! The most far left president in the history of America.... Put the pipe down and let someone else have a drag. Please name some that are more to the left than Obama. Eisenhower, Johnson, Nixon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteeleJoe Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 I quoted his post as well. You're welcome. My mistake. ThaiVisa App doesn't show it. How shall I ever repay you? Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuckd Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 I quoted his post as well. You're welcome. My mistake. ThaiVisa App doesn't show it. How shall I ever repay you? Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap Cash is always good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicog Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 (edited) So let me get this straight, using the example of Romneycare Obamacare. Obamacare (yes the MANDATE program) was directly inspired by Massachusetts Romneycare. The inventor of Romneycare: Willard Mitt Romney. The same Willard Mitt Romney who later said Romneycare should be used as a model for a national health care system. Barack Hussein Obama followed through with that, nationalizing Romneycare with Obamacare. Now Romney says he will kill Obamacare on his first day in office. Now high information voters know that isn't actually possible to do, but they also know a President Romney can deeply attack the implementation of Obamacare even if he can never get the votes to actually abolish it, which he probably can't. So you folks who think the "real" Romney, the potential President Romney is going to be the Massachusetts moderate who invented Romneycare and actually he is LYING that he intends to attack Obamacare? I personally find that very, very hard to believe. What I do believe a President Romney would actually do which is ANYTHING but "moderate" -- he will attack Obamacare in every way possible, he will not encourage states to use expanded Medicaid which is a core of Obamacare, he will try to push the idea that health systems are the business of the states, meaning most states won't touch covering everyone, he will continue to promote the sickening concept that everyone has coverage through emergency rooms, he will defend the pre-Obamacare status quo which results in hundreds of thousands of Americans dying prematurely (mostly the poor and minorities) for lack of preventative and early disease care. Sorry, that isn't moderate. So I guess people are reading the tea leaves differently about who is the real Romney. The real Romney if president will be expected to follow the expectations of the REPUBLICAN party, which is indeed a right wing party, and nothing moderate about it. The irony is that the more I read, the more "Romneycare" appears to be based on "Kennedycare", and it was Ted that greased most of the wheels between Romney and the Dems. Bless, even back then Kennedy was accusing him of lying through his teeth and indulging in nasty, personal attacks on occasions when they actually were political foes. It seems the RomneyLeopard has not changed his spots. Edited October 28, 2012 by Chicog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteeleJoe Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 I quoted his post as well. You're welcome. My mistake. ThaiVisa App doesn't show it. How shall I ever repay you? Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap Cash is always good. Just send me your bank details. Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicog Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 (edited) Wow. Here's Romney supporting abortion and women's rights in 1994 - and being accused of having "health care plans" but not being prepared to share the details. // Foreign language removed // What a shame Ted isn't around to help him write an economic policy that actually balances the books. Edited October 28, 2012 by metisdead : This is an English language forum, use English when posting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GiHadOrange Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 I think a large portion of the democratic party base is to the left of Obama (including me) but the unfortunate reality of the U.S. political system is that we only get to choose one of two choices for president (that have a chance of winning). In my view Obama is in practice in the white house a slightly left of center moderate. So it's not a difficult choice for those to the left of Obama between Obama and Romney. On an issue like single payer health care (Canadian style system: full access, government controlled, costs contained), I personally believe Obama supports that in his heart but decided it was politically impossible to win that so he didn't even try, and I think he was probably right about that (sadly). Does that mean that the " slightly left of center moderate " Obama is not the real Obama? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maidu Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Interesting, the US's biggest state, Alaska, has fewer delegate votes, than its smallest state; Rhode Island. Alaska is solidly for Romney and RI is solidly Obama, but the point spread will be much greater than that. I predict Obama taking delegate votes 5 to 4. Electoral college has nothing to do with size of territory. Lots of Alaska has no humans in it (the population is smaller than RI). I knew that. I was just pointing out an interesting comparison. Yet, if caribou could vote, it would be a different scenario. I already voted (absentee), but now, knowing that my state is already a 'given' for a certain canditate, I would have voted Green. That's the party I mark down when asked. I heard the Green candidate state her views, and she's miles ahead of either Obama or Romney - like a breath of fresh air. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keemapoot Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 This is interesting. As it appears this race will be won or lost in Ohio. Wasn't Palin's Joe the Plumber from Ohio? She better start working the phones for Romney... "Obama has something to work with those white working-class Ohioans," Green said. "A group of voters that were pretty turned off to the president a year ago now feel better about him."An ABC/Washington Post survey out on Friday showed that Obama is polling seven to 12 points better among white men in Ohio than he does nationally. The Republican base of white voters is contracting, college-educated whites are turning increasingly Democratic, and the percentage of Americans living in socially conservative rural areas is also shrinking.The white share of the electorate – 90% in 1976 – dropped to 74% in 2008 and is due to plummet to 46% by 2050, when minorities become a majority and nearly a third of the population will be Hispanic. http://mg.co.za/arti...ide-obamas-fate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keemapoot Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 This Rabbi in Israel says that Obama has been one of the most hostile of all U.S. Presidents to Israel. Obama doesn't believe the tail should wag the dog, and has stood up to Israel - uh, a little bit. Romney is Bibi's friend. Prominent Religious Zionism Rabbi Eliezer Melamed calls on American citizens to support Republican presidential hopeful. 'Obama has proved he is not a true friend of Israel,' he states Among the president's "sins", Melamed mentioned Obama's pressure on Israel to freeze construction in Judea, Samaria and Jerusalem – a move which the rabbi believes "put a curse" on the American people and their country.[/font] http://www.ynetnews....4297707,00.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulysses G. Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 (edited) This is interesting. As it appears this race will be won or lost in Ohio. This year, it might come down to Wisconsin: In Election 2000, Florida was the decisive state in the Electoral College. In 2004, Ohio was the ultimate battleground that put George W. Bush over the top. This year, it might come down to Wisconsin. That's a state President Obama won by 14 points four years ago. But Wisconsin has gone through an amazing two years of nonstop campaigning since Gov. Scott Walker was elected in 2010. After he took on the teachers unions, there were efforts to recall several Republican state senators and then Walker himself. The governor not only survived, but he won more votes in his recall election this year than he won on Election Day in 2010. http://www.rasmussen...be_the_new_ohio Edited October 28, 2012 by Ulysses G. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meatballs Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Americans are only voting for Obama because he is black. Americans don't vote rationally. They voted for GW Bush TWICE. Talk about stoopid. The whole election is nothing but a popularity contest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GiHadOrange Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 This Rabbi in Israel says that Obama has been one of the most hostile of all U.S. Presidents to Israel. Obama doesn't believe the tail should wag the dog, and has stood up to Israel - uh, a little bit. Romney is Bibi's friend. Prominent Religious Zionism Rabbi Eliezer Melamed calls on American citizens to support Republican presidential hopeful. 'Obama has proved he is not a true friend of Israel,' he states Among the president's "sins", Melamed mentioned Obama's pressure on Israel to freeze construction in Judea, Samaria and Jerusalem – a move which the rabbi believes "put a curse" on the American people and their country.[/font] http://www.ynetnews....4297707,00.html Didn't Obama said that "Jerusalem must be the undivided capital of Israel"? How more far can you go? And Biden declared himself to a Zionist? True is that Obama as every other POTUS gives Israel plenty of support and there should be no doubt about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulysses G. Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Didn't Obama said that "Jerusalem must be the undivided capital of Israel"? He says a lot of things and then changes his mind depending on the political advantages at the time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 (edited) Americans are only voting for Obama because he is black. Americans don't vote rationally. They voted for GW Bush TWICE. Talk about stoopid. The whole election is nothing but a popularity contest. ONCE actually.bush 50,456,002 GORE 50,999,897 Edited October 28, 2012 by Jingthing 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maidu Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 This Rabbi in Israel says that Obama has been one of the most hostile of all U.S. Presidents to Israel. Obama doesn't believe the tail should wag the dog, and has stood up to Israel - uh, a little bit. Romney is Bibi's friend. Prominent Religious Zionism Rabbi Eliezer Melamed calls on American citizens to support Republican presidential hopeful. 'Obama has proved he is not a true friend of Israel,' he states Among the president's "sins", Melamed mentioned Obama's pressure on Israel to freeze construction in Judea, Samaria and Jerusalem – a move which the rabbi believes "put a curse" on the American people and their country.[/font] http://www.ynetnews....4297707,00.html Does Rabbi Melamed approve of the harassment of 14 year old Jewish girls as they walk to school? ...for wearing clothes that aren't puritanical enough for right-wing Hassidic tastes. If so, he's not someone I (or I'd venture Americans in general) care to deal with. Publicly distressing a young girl in public is despicable - nearly on a level with Taliban fanatics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keemapoot Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 i think i remember someone saying something about how it would be a good boost for romney to get powell on his side in this thread. I think that was chuckd and me speculating that Condi Rice would be a good choice at State. Yeah, Powell has gone to the dark side now (no pun intended), and but for the grace of not screwing with Cheney, Rice would also be persona non grata. She was smart to live to fight another day, and would be a good choice at State if Romney is elected. I know it's bad form to quote your own post, but I may have to walk back my hopeful comments that if Romney is elected he might appoint Condi Rice. It appears she may be yet the next victim in a long line of respected black Republican leaders being booted out of the party for being too moderate for Republicans now. Despite former Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice’s stirring speech at the Republican convention and her support of Romney, her days as loyal party player might be numbered since she refused to go along with the view that the Obama administration is engaged in a cover-up as it investigates the attack that killed the U.S. ambassador to Libya and three other Americans last month. The Republican Party — quick to accuse Democrats of playing identity politics and that old standby, the race card – insists its policies are all about individual rights and liberties. But only certain African Americans qualify as independent thinkers, Republicans such as Clarence Thomas, Allen West and Herman Cain. You earn extra points if you, as Cain did, call African Americans who vote Democratic “brainwashed,” or repeat West’s charge that those African Americans reside on a Democratic Party “plantation.” Veer from the party line, though, and respectable showings in GOP primary polls can’t save you, as Cain found out when he lightly criticized the racial epithet painted on a rock at a hunting camp used by Texas Gov. Rick Perry and faced push back from the same folks who had once lionized him. http://www.washingto...t-help-the-gop/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 (edited) I think a large portion of the democratic party base is to the left of Obama (including me) but the unfortunate reality of the U.S. political system is that we only get to choose one of two choices for president (that have a chance of winning). In my view Obama is in practice in the white house a slightly left of center moderate. So it's not a difficult choice for those to the left of Obama between Obama and Romney. On an issue like single payer health care (Canadian style system: full access, government controlled, costs contained), I personally believe Obama supports that in his heart but decided it was politically impossible to win that so he didn't even try, and I think he was probably right about that (sadly). Does that mean that the " slightly left of center moderate " Obama is not the real Obama? Correct. He is not. He governs as a slightly left of center moderate. I think in his heart and his core ideology and values he is somewhat (but not much) to the left of that. Romney on the other hand will be dealing most likely with a rabidly right wing republican controlled congress. He won't be able to lead as a moderate. He will be forced to govern as a right winger whether he likes it or not. I think he has no core, fixed political values or ideology except for Mormonism and a questionable emotional need to be president probably related to his feelings about his FATHER. If Romney wins it will prove you can lie to the American people about what you represented an hour ago and still win. So I'm expecting the argument that he will need to lead as a moderate to be reelected. Don't believe it. He'd just do another etch-a-sketch for his second term campaign. Why did Romney govern as a kind of moderate governor of Massachusetts? Do you really believe that reflects his CORE value system? I do not. I believe he governed that way because in Massachusetts, a liberal state, he had little choice. As president, a totally different situation. I say don't give him a chance to prove it. Edited October 28, 2012 by Jingthing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maidu Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Didn't Obama said that "Jerusalem must be the undivided capital of Israel"? He says a lot of things and then changes his mind depending on the political advantages at the time. That description fits Romney better than Obama. Romney will even say disparaging things about a health plan that is nearly identical to one that he himself advocated, if it might gain him a few political points. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notmyself Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 If Romney wins it will prove you can lie to the American people about what you represented an hour ago and still win. Even if Romney loses it will show that well over 40% of the entire population are happy to be lied to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
somtumlion Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Eisenhower, Johnson, Nixon. Roosevelt, Kennedy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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