Poll: Obama Leading Romney 49% To 46% Ahead Of Second Debate

[keemapoot]

Here's one big reason Democrats have been itching to get at Romney's tax returns, to dispel the notion that Romney has given a lot to Charities.

Romney Avoids Taxes via Loophole Cutting Mormon Donations

“The Romneys get theirs off the top and the charity gets what’s left,” he said. “So by definition, if it’s not performing as well, the charity gets harmed more.”

Nevertheless, “what’s going to go to charity is probably close to nothing,” Hesch said.

http://www.bloomberg...-donations.html

However, even with these kinds of vehicles, I still believe Romney has given at least 10% to the church, that is mandatory for a Mormon in his position.

[uptheos]

Could Hurricane Sandy, possibly become the deciding factor?

How it's handled by CIC

Politicised comments by opposition etc

[samran]

Could Hurricane Sandy, possibly become the deciding factor?

How it's handled by CIC

Politicised comments by opposition etc

Will be interesting.....

Though this election is tight, even conservative site Real Clear Politics has had Romney's lead slipping away after peaking a week or so ago.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2012/president/2012_elections_electoral_college_map_race_changes.html#previous_changes

So it will be interesting to see how the the storm impacts voting behaviours.

[koheesti]

Boy, I sure hope you're right. If so, that means most Americans will not vote for the most far left President in our history and instead cast a vote for the moderate Republican challenger. Phew!

The most far left president in the history of America....

Put the pipe down and let someone else have a drag.

Please name some that are more to the left than Obama.

FDR

That's right, he armed his friend Joseph Stalin to the teeth, gave birth to the Cold War and prolonged the Great Depression by years.

[koheesti]

During the fever of the election, both parties' extreme factions will have loud voices. However, I don't think there is any comparison of the democratic party going as far left as the Republican party has gone far right. None. Nancy Pelosi is a joke and characture of herself even among moderate democrats, yet is always the poster girl the far right holds up of excessive liberals. By and large, permeated through the party, the Republicans have gone far right much more than the democrats have gone left.

Well done. I sincerely believe this incontrovertible and wouldn't be disputed by any reasonably objective, intellectually honest person with a basic level of familiarity with US politics. (Unfortunately, there's not many on this thread who the first to phrases apply to.)

And in terms of politics in general (ie not just within the context of the US)? Calling the Democratic Party "far left" is like calling Stalin pluralist and tolerant: so far from accurate as to be nonsensical. (Do I think we should view things with an international perspective rather than US? No. I merely mean to put into some perspective -- people calling any US politician of even minor import "far Left" have no idea what the words mean.)

Just silly. It all depends on your perspective, doesn't it? If you are left of center, of course you see the far right moving further away and you see the far left as being more reasonable.

[samran]

That's right, he armed his friend Joseph Stalin to the teeth, gave birth to the Cold War and prolonged the Great Depression by years.

Interesting you say that.... You imply there was an alternative? What would you have done knowing only what FDR would have known?

[koheesti]

A sad and continuing reality of American life that electing Obama did nothing to fix. Racism against African Americans still exists. A lot. I heard one item which I can't source asserting that Obama being at least perceived as black (yes he is mixed race) costs him about FIVE percent of the popular vote, meaning of course if he was white, this election would be a total blowout landslide for Obama. But he isn't white, so we have a nail biter (in the popular vote anyway). Also probably not at all surprising to most Americans, republicans are much more likely to be explicitly racist against blacks than democrats. As Bill Maher says (paraphrase from memory): not all republicans are racist, but when I meet a racist, he is probably a republican.

http://www.washingto...pm_politics_pop

WASHINGTON — Racial attitudes have not improved in the four years since the United States elected its first black president, an Associated Press poll finds, as a slight majority of Americans now express prejudice toward blacks whether they recognize those feelings or not.

Those views could cost President Barack Obama votes as he tries for re-election, the survey found, though the effects are mitigated by some people’s more favorable views of blacks.

A BIG failure for Obama but not a surprise. I doubt he ever identified with American blacks anyway. How could he? He doesn't share a common history with 99.8% of them. African father, white mother, raised in Hawaii and Indonesia? Make that 99.99%. In any case, I was hoping 4 years ago that he would give black kids a new kind of role model as opposed to rappers and athletes. I was hoping that he would make it "cool" for inner city kids to carry a book bag home from school and study. It hasn't been a total loss, I think I read somewhere that more black kids are interested in playing golf now.

[Jingthing]

As far as the storm impacting the election, yes, quite probably so.

It is a historically severe storm so we don't yet know the storm impact but it is clear it will be big.

So it turns out this storm is the October Surprise.

As Obama is president and he is quite good at leading during domestic disasters the focus for the last week will shift to the storm impact and Obama's leadership which will be good.

Romney will play act as if he is the president but won't fool anyone.

So it's a classic power and advantage of the incumbent scenario.

Edited October 29, 2012 by Jingthing

[koheesti]

Wow. Here's Romney supporting abortion and women's rights in 1994 - and being accused of having "health care plans" but not being prepared to share the details.

Well,as long as we are going back to 1994 to show how some candidates have changed their views, let's go back to 1996 when Obama officially joined the far-left 3rd New Party. The only difference is, Obama hasn't changed his views...

On the evening of January 11, 1996, while Mitt Romney was in the final years of his run as the head of Bain Capital, Barack Obama formally joined the New Party, which was deeply hostile to the mainstream of the Democratic party and even to American capitalism.

Minutes of the meeting on January 11, 1996, of the New Party’s Chicago chapter read as follows:

Barack Obama, candidate for State Senate in the 13th Legislative District, gave a statement to the membership and answered questions. He signed the New Party “Candidate Contract” and requested an endorsement from the New Party. He also joined the New Party.

http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/302031/obamas-third-party-history-stanley-kurtz

[koheesti]

That's right, he armed his friend Joseph Stalin to the teeth, gave birth to the Cold War and prolonged the Great Depression by years.

Interesting you say that.... You imply there was an alternative? What would you have done knowing only what FDR would have known?

do you think arming Stalin against the Nazis is OK but arming Saddam against the Iranians was wrong?

[Jingthing]

A sad and continuing reality of American life that electing Obama did nothing to fix. Racism against African Americans still exists. A lot. I heard one item which I can't source asserting that Obama being at least perceived as black (yes he is mixed race) costs him about FIVE percent of the popular vote, meaning of course if he was white, this election would be a total blowout landslide for Obama. But he isn't white, so we have a nail biter (in the popular vote anyway). Also probably not at all surprising to most Americans, republicans are much more likely to be explicitly racist against blacks than democrats. As Bill Maher says (paraphrase from memory): not all republicans are racist, but when I meet a racist, he is probably a republican.

http://www.washingto...pm_politics_pop

WASHINGTON — Racial attitudes have not improved in the four years since the United States elected its first black president, an Associated Press poll finds, as a slight majority of Americans now express prejudice toward blacks whether they recognize those feelings or not.

Those views could cost President Barack Obama votes as he tries for re-election, the survey found, though the effects are mitigated by some people’s more favorable views of blacks.

A BIG failure for Obama but not a surprise. I doubt he ever identified with American blacks anyway. How could he? He doesn't share a common history with 99.8% of them. African father, white mother, raised in Hawaii and Indonesia? Make that 99.99%. In any case, I was hoping 4 years ago that he would give black kids a new kind of role model as opposed to rappers and athletes. I was hoping that he would make it "cool" for inner city kids to carry a book bag home from school and study. It hasn't been a total loss, I think I read somewhere that more black kids are interested in playing golf now.

OK, really I tried to follow your logic but I don't get it. Is Obama a typical African American? Well, no he is not. On the mixed race aspect, yes, he certainly is as probably most African Americans have some "white" blood in them from sometime in the past. What I don't get is how the racism of non-blacks towards blacks is in any imaginable way something that OBAMA can be blamed for.

[koheesti]

Americans are only voting for Obama because he is black. Americans don't vote rationally. They voted for GW Bush TWICE. Talk about stoopid. The whole election is nothing but a popularity contest.

ONCE actually.

bush 50,456,002

GORE 50,999,897

Just think, if the people of Gore's home state of Tennessee, where he and his father were political icons, had voted for him in 2000, we would have had a President Gore. But for some reason, the people who know him best, wouldn't vote for him. Maybe they remember his wife Tipper tried to get a lot of music banned in the 1980's, or that his overtly racist father fought against the Civil Rights Act of 1964. Or maybe they just know Al is a goofball.

Edited October 29, 2012 by koheesti

[samran]

That's right, he armed his friend Joseph Stalin to the teeth, gave birth to the Cold War and prolonged the Great Depression by years.

Interesting you say that.... You imply there was an alternative? What would you have done knowing only what FDR would have known?

do you think arming Stalin against the Nazis is OK but arming Saddam against the Iranians was wrong?

I really don't follow the logic of your reply....

All I'm trying to get to the bottom of is your statement "he armed his friend Joseph Stalin to the teeth, gave birth to the Cold War and prolonged the Great Depression by years."

Given the way you wrote it I got the feeling that you thought it was wrong for FDR to have helped Stalin.

My question was why you though this was wrong and what you would have done differently.

This wasn't about the Iran Iraq war last I looked (though I can see you are trying to start a side debate).

[koheesti]

Eisenhower, Johnson, Nixon.

Roosevelt, Kennedy...

Apparently everyone except Reagan and the Bushes are left of Obama (and Ford). Next question for you guys - how many stars on the American flag?

[koheesti]

As far as the storm impacting the election, yes, quite probably so.

It is a historically severe storm so we don't yet know the storm impact but it is clear it will be big.

So it turns out this storm is the October Surprise.

As Obama is president and he is quite good at leading during domestic disasters the focus for the last week will shift to the storm impact and Obama's leadership which will be good.

Romney will play act as if he is the president but won't fool anyone.

So it's a classic power and advantage of the incumbent scenario.

If Obama appears to the be the one in charge, and millions lose power for days, how will that help him? He had better stay away from fundraisers in Vegas and playing golf for a few days.

[koheesti]

That's right, he armed his friend Joseph Stalin to the teeth, gave birth to the Cold War and prolonged the Great Depression by years.

Interesting you say that.... You imply there was an alternative? What would you have done knowing only what FDR would have known?

do you think arming Stalin against the Nazis is OK but arming Saddam against the Iranians was wrong?

I really don't follow the logic of your reply....

All I'm trying to get to the bottom of is your statement "he armed his friend Joseph Stalin to the teeth, gave birth to the Cold War and prolonged the Great Depression by years."

Given the way you wrote it I got the feeling that you thought it was wrong for FDR to have helped Stalin.

My question was why you though this was wrong and what you would have done differently.

This wasn't about the Iran Iraq war last I looked (though I can see you are trying to start a side debate).

It was a fun reply to a silly response trying to show Obama as not being far left. Bottom line - FDR is not to the left of Obama. No American president has been - and hopefully never will be.

[uptheos]

He had better stay away from fundraisers in Vegas and playing golf for a few days.

Are they expecting a hurricane in Nevada too?

I think Obama has to act in such a way that the election is of secondary importance.

I'm not sure how Romney should act.

Edited October 29, 2012 by uptheos

[samran]

It was a fun reply to a silly response trying to show Obama as not being far left. Bottom line - FDR is not to the left of Obama. No American president has been - and hopefully never will be.

Well from my perspective Obama isn't far left. We had this conversation about 6000 posts ago - but by any measure anywhere else in the world - Obama would be a centre right politican.

On health care - his solution - isn't even vaguely acceptable to anyone even one milimetre to the left of the political spectrum.

But, given that there are Americans who think going metric is some sort of socialist conspiracy, then I guess viewing Obama as a far left politican make sense.

[samran]

He had better stay away from fundraisers in Vegas and playing golf for a few days.

Are they expecting a hurricane in Nevada too?

I think Obama has to act in such a way that the election is of secondary importance.

I'm not sure how Romney should act.

No need for him to go there. Nevada increasingly leaning Obama

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2012/president/nv/nevada_romney_vs_obama-1908.html

[uptheos]

It was a fun reply to a silly response trying to show Obama as not being far left. Bottom line - FDR is not to the left of Obama. No American president has been - and hopefully never will be.

Well from my perspective Obama isn't far left. We had this conversation about 6000 posts ago - but by any measure anywhere else in the world - Obama would be a centre right politican.

On health care - his solution - isn't even vaguely acceptable to anyone even one milimetre to the left of the political spectrum.

But, given that there are Americans who think going metric is some sort of socialist conspiracy, then I guess viewing Obama as a far left politican make sense.

It does help understand why there is so much communist paranoia in the USA, if someone like Obama is considered far left wing.

No wonder Cuba can never come in from the cold.

[SteeleJoe]

During the fever of the election, both parties' extreme factions will have loud voices. However, I don't think there is any comparison of the democratic party going as far left as the Republican party has gone far right. None. Nancy Pelosi is a joke and characture of herself even among moderate democrats, yet is always the poster girl the far right holds up of excessive liberals. By and large, permeated through the party, the Republicans have gone far right much more than the democrats have gone left.

Well done. I sincerely believe this incontrovertible and wouldn't be disputed by any reasonably objective, intellectually honest person with a basic level of familiarity with US politics. (Unfortunately, there's not many on this thread who the first to phrases apply to.)

And in terms of politics in general (ie not just within the context of the US)? Calling the Democratic Party "far left" is like calling Stalin pluralist and tolerant: so far from accurate as to be nonsensical. (Do I think we should view things with an international perspective rather than US? No. I merely mean to put into some perspective -- people calling any US politician of even minor import "far Left" have no idea what the words mean.)

Just silly. It all depends on your perspective, doesn't it? If you are left of center, of course you see the far right moving further away and you see the far left as being more reasonable.

Where did I say I see the far Left as more reasonable?

I don't. (Or if I do it's only by a very slight degree but that has nothing to do with my post and I've got no use for the far left -- and a certain amount of contempt in fact)

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

Edited October 29, 2012 by SteeleJoe

[Ulysses G.]

It does help understand why there is so much communist paranoia in the USA, if someone like Obama is considered far left wing.

No wonder Cuba can never come in from the cold.

It is not that Obama is perceived as having governed as far-left. He is perceived as having strong far-left sympathies, but having governed in a more moderate way in order to get a second term in order to govern as he likes without having to worry about the electorate. The first term was very ineffective as far as improving the economy, but the second term is what is more worrying.

Edited October 29, 2012 by Ulysses G.

[chuckd]

...Next question for you guys - how many stars on the American flag?

I know...I know!!!

The answer is "57". Obama told us so.

Edited October 29, 2012 by chuckd

[Ulysses G.]

Lets wait for 2 more weeks and see what the election results will be! Who cares if a Morman becomes the President! Harry Reid, Senate Majority Leader is also Morman and the Lame Duck Media never had any problem with him! Now we have an incompetant Muslim in office! We have an election every four (4) years, so we can throw the incompetants out! The system works!!! Just wait until November 7th for the results! The system works!!! God Bless America!!!

I had to grin while reading your post. You start by saying it doesn't matter what belief-system affiliation a candidate has, and then, in the middle of your post, you call Obama 'an incompetant Muslim.' Either you're trying to be funny or are a hypocrite.

He was being sarcastic to make a point.

[uptheos]

I don't know his politics but Fareed Zakaria seems optimistic for USA.

The International Monetary Fund’s latest World Economic Outlook makes for gloomy reading. Growth projections have been revised downward almost everywhere, especially in Europe and the big emerging markets such as China. And yet, when looking out over the next four years — the next presidential term — the IMF projects that the United States will be the strongest of the world’s rich economies. U.S. growth is forecast to average 3 percent, much stronger than that of Germany or France (1.2 percent) or even Canada (2.3 percent). Increasingly, the evidence suggests that the United States has come out of the financial crisis of 2008 in better shape than its peers — because of the actions of its government.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/fareed-zakaria-the-us-economy-is-recovering-well/2012/10/24/9c34df9e-1df0-11e2-ba31-3083ca97c314_story.html

The next president will reap the rewards of work already done. So it would be the ultimate irony if, having strongly criticized almost every measure that contributed to these positive tends, Mitt Romney ends up presiding over what he would surely call “the Romney recovery.”

[bendejo]

Just think, if the people of Gore's home state of Tennessee, where he and his father were political icons, had voted for him in 2000, we would have had a President Gore. But for some reason, the people who know him best, wouldn't vote for him. Maybe they remember his wife Tipper tried to get a lot of music banned in the 1980's, or that his overtly racist father fought against the Civil Rights Act of 1964. Or maybe they just know Al is a goofball.

That bs with the Tipper censorship turned off liberals, by I don't see how that would have worked against her with the "Jesus and country music" crowd, and anyway by 2000 the only thing most Americans could have told you about the 1980s was that they came before the 90s.

BTW, only two musicians had the stones to stand up to her: Frank Zappa and John Denver.

[Jingthing]

I don't know his politics but Fareed Zakaria seems optimistic for USA.

The International Monetary Fund’s latest World Economic Outlook makes for gloomy reading. Growth projections have been revised downward almost everywhere, especially in Europe and the big emerging markets such as China. And yet, when looking out over the next four years — the next presidential term — the IMF projects that the United States will be the strongest of the world’s rich economies. U.S. growth is forecast to average 3 percent, much stronger than that of Germany or France (1.2 percent) or even Canada (2.3 percent). Increasingly, the evidence suggests that the United States has come out of the financial crisis of 2008 in better shape than its peers — because of the actions of its government.

http://www.washingto...c314_story.html

The next president will reap the rewards of work already done. So it would be the ultimate irony if, having strongly criticized almost every measure that contributed to these positive tends, Mitt Romney ends up presiding over what he would surely call “the Romney recovery.”

Yes another reason to defeat Romney. He won't deserve the credit. Obama does and will. So if Romney gets elected he will get two terms based on the recovery that is happening and will continue, and he will totally trash Medicare, totally trash Obamacare and access to health care for poorer Americans not poor enough for basic Medicaid, totally trash abortion rights through his supreme court picks, totally trash any hope of doing anything about man made global climate change, totally trash any chance of comprehensive immigration reform, totally trash the movement for gay civil rights, etc. etc. Edited October 29, 2012 by Jingthing

[chuckd]

I don't know his politics but Fareed Zakaria seems optimistic for USA.

The International Monetary Fund’s latest World Economic Outlook makes for gloomy reading. Growth projections have been revised downward almost everywhere, especially in Europe and the big emerging markets such as China. And yet, when looking out over the next four years — the next presidential term — the IMF projects that the United States will be the strongest of the world’s rich economies. U.S. growth is forecast to average 3 percent, much stronger than that of Germany or France (1.2 percent) or even Canada (2.3 percent). Increasingly, the evidence suggests that the United States has come out of the financial crisis of 2008 in better shape than its peers — because of the actions of its government.

http://www.washingto...c314_story.html

The next president will reap the rewards of work already done. So it would be the ultimate irony if, having strongly criticized almost every measure that contributed to these positive tends, Mitt Romney ends up presiding over what he would surely call “the Romney recovery.”

Don't you wonder who Fareed Zakaria plagiarized this article from?

[Jingthing]

I don't know his politics but Fareed Zakaria seems optimistic for USA.

The International Monetary Fund’s latest World Economic Outlook makes for gloomy reading. Growth projections have been revised downward almost everywhere, especially in Europe and the big emerging markets such as China. And yet, when looking out over the next four years — the next presidential term — the IMF projects that the United States will be the strongest of the world’s rich economies. U.S. growth is forecast to average 3 percent, much stronger than that of Germany or France (1.2 percent) or even Canada (2.3 percent). Increasingly, the evidence suggests that the United States has come out of the financial crisis of 2008 in better shape than its peers — because of the actions of its government.

http://www.washingto...c314_story.html

The next president will reap the rewards of work already done. So it would be the ultimate irony if, having strongly criticized almost every measure that contributed to these positive tends, Mitt Romney ends up presiding over what he would surely call “the Romney recovery.”

Don't you wonder who Fareed Zakaria plagiarized this article from?

He made a mistake. That doesn't erase his past and present brilliance which is self evident. I am a great admirer of Mr. Zakaria.

[uptheos]

I don't know his politics but Fareed Zakaria seems optimistic for USA.

The International Monetary Fund’s latest World Economic Outlook makes for gloomy reading. Growth projections have been revised downward almost everywhere, especially in Europe and the big emerging markets such as China. And yet, when looking out over the next four years — the next presidential term — the IMF projects that the United States will be the strongest of the world’s rich economies. U.S. growth is forecast to average 3 percent, much stronger than that of Germany or France (1.2 percent) or even Canada (2.3 percent). Increasingly, the evidence suggests that the United States has come out of the financial crisis of 2008 in better shape than its peers — because of the actions of its government.

http://www.washingto...c314_story.html

The next president will reap the rewards of work already done. So it would be the ultimate irony if, having strongly criticized almost every measure that contributed to these positive tends, Mitt Romney ends up presiding over what he would surely call “the Romney recovery.”

Don't you wonder who Fareed Zakaria plagiarized this article from?

Jingthing?

Edited October 29, 2012 by uptheos