Laptop Safety In Los/lao

[BusyB]

I’ll be in Thailand in a month or so for the (European) winter. It’s not my first time, I’m fairly savvy, been around a wee bit. But this time for the first time I’ll be carrying a Macbook Air.

Got a few questions:

What’s the best way to connect to mobile internet with a laptop on a pay as you go basis? (Is there such a possibility?)

Same question for mobiles: I’ve always used 12call for my mobile in the past, but this time I’ll have an i4S. Any suggestions? I’ll be in and around country for 3 months – mostly in LOS, partly in Lao.

And what’s the word on street smarts – are laptop snatches/robberies regular things? Are there does and don’ts about showing/using them that go beyond the usual discretion and street smarts. And no, you’re not going to find me on Pattaya Beach Road at 2 in the morning – more of a day and evening man nowadays. And don’t wear gold chains or bling either.

Is it ok to leave something like an MBA in a hotel room locked in back-pack? Or do I have to carry it around in my day pack like a ball and chain the whole time? Looking for experience please. Staying mostly decent budget/GH 600-1200THB with the occasional 5star. (The laptop is insured and it’ll be lo-jacked as well but that’s not the point.)

What about wifi security – is it better to do my banking from an internet café for instance?

I’m also travelling around a bit, including Laos, so I’d just like to hear some experiences and tips if anyone’s got the time and inclination to.

It’d be really great if anyone who’s had a laptop stolen shared their story for me and others to perhaps learn from.

Many thanks for considered replies.

(Mods: I put this in general because a lot more people carry laptops than are likely to read the computer forum.)

[Rob8891]

You'd be better off in TV's Internet forum. Maybe a mod will move your post for you, although the guys here will give you the benefit of their experience too! Good lucj.

[NeverSure]

I have always cloned my hard disk before I left the country so at the very worst, I could recover with a new laptop and some effort.

I am a certified internet engineer but I'm getting rusty. I believe that any time you see https:\ instead of http\, you're using a secured and encrypted transmission on a whole different port than http and I don't believe it can be intercepted and read. If any site ever wants my really personal data including a credit card, and I don't see https, I back right out and delete all of my cookies.

One other thing I do is create a virtual encrypted drive on another partition on my hard disk, and store any data which needs to be secure on that drive. The CIA can't crack that. A thief can't either. You should see my stash of kiddie por... Oops, just kidding.

[GreenSnapper]

Don't do banking in a internet cafe. Don't enter any password there. They have keyloggers everwhere. Use your own devices.

[NeverSure]

Don't do banking in a internet cafe. Don't enter any password there. They have keyloggers everwhere. Use your own devices.

Well, as I said I'm rusty, but I don't at the moment know of any keylogger which works with a wired keyboard without installing software or hardware on the acutal computer. That would be unless the hacker had sophisticated enough equipment, and knew how to use it, to capture electromagnetic emissions from the keyboard.

If someone had that, he could capture your keystrokes from the hotel room next door.

Maybe there's something out there now I don't know about.

[CharlieH]

If you have an i-phone or any smart phone, tether that to your laptop and internet is solved, you can get a sim for your i-phone here easy enough and pay as you go is no problem either.

DONT use an internet cafe, far too risky for personal stuff, as suggested above always use your own devices.

As for the MBA well a lot of places have room safes that you can leave it in, you are going to have to judge for yourself. Alternatively, ask reception, give it directly to them for safe keeping, that shouldnt be a problem. and then you both know exactly where it is and who is responsible.

Have fun, dont leave your common sense in the departure lounge.

Edited October 17, 2012 by CharlieH

[chrisinth]

Street smarts just about cover it on the security front, nothing special in Thailand that you won't encounter anywhere else. NeverSure has made some valid points earlier, but my personal preference would be to use your own notebook before an internet cafe if using online banking.

[NeverSure]

DONT use an internet cafe, far too risky for personal stuff, as suggested above always use your own devices.

You're right. I went brain dead. I was thinking like using my own laptop at Starbucks, which I would with https:\. He talked about carrying his laptop around. I guess technically and IC is where you rent a computer and you're dead right on.

[Vale Tudo]

AIS do a variety of dongles you can use which go from fast to very fast,up to 21 Meg!

http://www.ais.co.th/mobileinternet/aircard/Double_Surf.html

And a pocket WiFi router also:

http://www.ais.co.th/mobileinternet/aircard/Pocket_Wifi.html

I have an older one for about 3 Meg which at times is as fast as broadband but it seems they don't even sell that anymore!

You can purchase monthly unlimited interent packages to go with any of these dongles,not sure about the WiFi packages though.

As for security,you won't need any as all these devices will be tied to your laptop specifically,job done!

[Vale Tudo]

Oh and most hotels in your price range will have a mini safe to leave your laptop in.I've never had a laptop stolen from any hotel room after many years travelling in Thailand and Laos,Cambodia and The Philippines are a different matter!

[WebBangkok]

https site can be hacked. It is just much harder. But a less chance of sh1t happening to you on them.

I agree, NEVER do any internet banking on public computers.

[GreenSnapper]

Don't do banking in a internet cafe. Don't enter any password there. They have keyloggers everwhere. Use your own devices.

Well, as I said I'm rusty, but I don't at the moment know of any keylogger which works with a wired keyboard without installing software or hardware on the acutal computer. That would be unless the hacker had sophisticated enough equipment, and knew how to use it, to capture electromagnetic emissions from the keyboard.

If someone had that, he could capture your keystrokes from the hotel room next door.

Maybe there's something out there now I don't know about.

After years of fraud, i hoped people would be a bit more aware what is going on.

Some keyloggers already come with the illegal Copies of Windows they use at the internet cafes. Then all kind of viruses, trojans etc. Internet cafes are to be avoided at all costs.

Use your own devices, with https which all banks use, you are quite on the safe side, even with Wifi. Don't enter passwords at any unencrypted site, even for email and such.

[akspace]

You can even go a couple steps further, use two stage authentication, and print out a short list of revokable one time keys for when you are traveling. Then if you lose your laptop you can still access your accounts from a web cafe and it will be safe

I've traveled with my MBP, my issue is it doesn't always fit in room safes. So I also bring a cable lock and attach it to something in the room if I'm going out. Or I bring my smaller netbook (if I don't need to work at all).

[Vale Tudo]

You can even go a couple steps further, use two stage authentication, and print out a short list of revokable one time keys for when you are traveling. Then if you lose your laptop you can still access your accounts from a web cafe and it will be safe

I've traveled with my MBP, my issue is it doesn't always fit in room safes. So I also bring a cable lock and attach it to something in the room if I'm going out. Or I bring my smaller netbook (if I don't need to work at all).

My answer is a Samsonite suitcase with combination lock,my travelling extra-large safety deposit box!

[nietzche]

I think everyone's missing the point!

The OP bought a MacBook air. The real question is why?

Half the RAM capacity, SSD limitations, 1 USB port, and only 50% more expensive than the far more powerful MacBook Pro

What a horrible decision

[smokie36]

Your laptop is likely safe enough in most hotel rooms. Only you can judge this at each place though.

If you feel its not then leave it at reception.

The samsonite box would be handy for a thief!

[Vale Tudo]

I think everyone's missing the point!

The OP bought a MacBook air. The real question is why?

Half the RAM capacity, SSD limitations, 1 USB port, and only 50% more expensive than the far more powerful MacBook Pro

What a horrible decision

Maybe it's a bluff and he's looking to do an insurance job?Sussing out the lie of the land?

OP get yourself to Manila,make sure your health insurance is up to date mind as you'll probably get shot as well!

[BusyB]

Many thanks for all the replies.

A few are a bit technical for me but everything’s bursting with lots of good experience. Fortunately I can use the cloud and don’t need to clone the hard drive.

I was actually wondering whether wi-fi in Starbucks might not be even more compromised than an internet café. But whatever – in the past I used Explorer cafe on Beach Rd. in Pattaya and never had any kind of security problem, perhaps because they can’t access TANs?. But it’s also fairly upmarket as far as Internet cafes are concerned. I do appreciate the risks, but since a hacker in a cafe didn’t have access to my TAN lists then, or my Chip-Tan generator now, then there’s not much anyone can do with the banking info I input except view (not much money there anyway!). I also have very tight parameters on my security settings for bank and credit cards. Maybe someone can spot an error in my thinking - I'd be grateful if so!

I have also cultivated a whole variety of passwords, (literally dozens) each different for even the most mundane log-in, each encoded on a list which no one could possibly understand except myself.

Vale Tudo – great post, thanks, that’s exactly some of the info I was after – I’ll touch base with AIS when I get there.

It looks like the 3G/mobile phone route is the best. I AM very cagey about wi-fi nets.

Thanks Smokie, that's also the kind of experienced tip I was hoping for - helps enormously.

Nietzche thanks for the chuckle - but it's great for my digital needs, and the weight is right too.

I’ll keep an eye on the thread as long as it’s on the front page, but with work commitments that may not be every day.

Once again, many thanks to all - gives me a flying start.

[NeverSure]

You can even go a couple steps further, use two stage authentication, and print out a short list of revokable one time keys for when you are traveling. Then if you lose your laptop you can still access your accounts from a web cafe and it will be safe

I've traveled with my MBP, my issue is it doesn't always fit in room safes. So I also bring a cable lock and attach it to something in the room if I'm going out. Or I bring my smaller netbook (if I don't need to work at all).

I use a free proggy called LastPass. It stores all of my web sites and user/pass's in the cloud, encrypted. They leave my computer encryped, and even the cloud doesn't know what they are.

Then, in order to access, say, my bank accounts, I go to the site and ask LastPass to log in for me, using my mouse. LastPass pops up a dialogue box and wants a master password which works for it, but not for the bank. I type in that master password and then LastPass fills the user/pass info for the bank, I hit enter and I'm in. My computer has the key for the encryption, but LastPass doesn't. Everything travels encrypted and https. In a way it's double encrypted - first by LastPass and then https.

It won't stop a keylogger, but they won't get much. They then have to get my computer with the key, know I have LastPass, and know how to use it.

Two major benefits are that LastPass will show me all of my sites I have passwords for if I need them on a replacement computer, and it will know the user/pass for each. All I'd have to do is download and install LastPass on the new box, and then know my user/pass for LastPass. Then everything is in the cloud for me.

I have no personal financial interest in that proggy.

[draftvader]

What happens when LastPass is compromised?

Sent from my HTC Desire using Thaivisa Connect App

[NeverSure]

What happens when LastPass is compromised?

Sent from my HTC Desire using Thaivisa Connect App

How is LastPass compromised? All of the data is stored in the cloud with 256 encryption. It leaves and arrives at my computer encrypted. None of the passwords are stored on my computer, not even encrypted. All a keystroke logger would get is my master user/pass for LastPass, but they don't work on the actual sites. The sites that need to be secure are https.

BTW, with LastPass, I have the option of auto-login. Sites like this that aren't critical will get logged into with no input from me the moment I arrive at the site. I can change that for any site at any time, and require instead that I "find" LastPass and enter my master user/pass. LastPass doesn't show itself as a dialogue box until I ask for it.

Another nice thing is that if I start with a new computer and install LastPass, I enter my existing user/pass for the first time and it generates the same 256 encryption key and stores it on my computer. That way all of my computers or a new one will access the sites and passwords on the same LastPass account.

Someone would have to steal my computer and then know I have LastPass and what the user/pass is. They might get the user/pass from a keylogger, and then steal my computer. Even then if they thought my password for my bank account was what I entered into LastPass, they'd lose.

I don't even have all of those password protected sites bookmarked. I can just open LastPass and they are there. That means that those bookmarks are in the cloud and available on a new computer as soon as I install LastPass and log in.

Nothing is perfect. I suppose anything can be broken. This just makes it a ton harder for someone. It also allows me to never lose track of a site or its user/pass, even if I lose my computer.

If I lost my computer, I'd soon log into LastPass and change my master password.

Edit: When I use LastPass to log into a site, I enter only my master password and not my user name. A keystroke logger would get only half of what he needed to log into my LassPass account.

Edited October 17, 2012 by NeverSure

[akspace]

I was actually wondering whether wi-fi in Starbucks might not be even more compromised than an internet café. But whatever – in the past I used Explorer cafe on Beach Rd. in Pattaya and never had any kind of security problem, perhaps because they can’t access TANs?. But it’s also fairly upmarket as far as Internet cafes are concerned. I do appreciate the risks, but since a hacker in a cafe didn’t have access to my TAN lists then, or my Chip-Tan generator now, then there’s not much anyone can do with the banking info I input except view (not much money there anyway!). I also have very tight parameters on my security settings for bank and credit cards. Maybe someone can spot an error in my thinking - I'd be grateful if so!

Every wifi access point is equally un-secure, but so is 3G, anyone can see the network traffic. Anything going over an un-encrypted channel is free game. Since most banks and email providers realize this their traffic goes over encrypted channels (https), a hacker can see the network traffic but they need the correct keys to see the contents. In this case the service providers private key.

Using TANs are a good idea, two-stage authentication is more secure then just a password. You do need to be aware sometimes the TAN dongles are hacked, which means an outsider can access your account, this is completely un-related to visiting Thailand because the hack does not require access to your computer or TAN dongle

Edited October 17, 2012 by akspace

[Kimera]

Many thanks for all the replies.

A few are a bit technical for me but everything’s bursting with lots of good experience. Fortunately I can use the cloud and don’t need to clone the hard drive.

I was actually wondering whether wi-fi in Starbucks might not be even more compromised than an internet café. But whatever – in the past I used Explorer cafe on Beach Rd. in Pattaya and never had any kind of security problem, perhaps because they can’t access TANs?. But it’s also fairly upmarket as far as Internet cafes are concerned. I do appreciate the risks, but since a hacker in a cafe didn’t have access to my TAN lists then, or my Chip-Tan generator now, then there’s not much anyone can do with the banking info I input except view (not much money there anyway!). I also have very tight parameters on my security settings for bank and credit cards. Maybe someone can spot an error in my thinking - I'd be grateful if so!

I have also cultivated a whole variety of passwords, (literally dozens) each different for even the most mundane log-in, each encoded on a list which no one could possibly understand except myself.

Vale Tudo – great post, thanks, that’s exactly some of the info I was after – I’ll touch base with AIS when I get there.

It looks like the 3G/mobile phone route is the best. I AM very cagey about wi-fi nets.

Thanks Smokie, that's also the kind of experienced tip I was hoping for - helps enormously.

Nietzche thanks for the chuckle - but it's great for my digital needs, and the weight is right too.

I’ll keep an eye on the thread as long as it’s on the front page, but with work commitments that may not be every day.

Once again, many thanks to all - gives me a flying start.

I see you are coming here for a Month or so, is it a holiday? I'm sorry but with all the problems you feel you my have with the Mac. why not leave it at home and enjoy yourself

[BusyB]

I was actually wondering whether wi-fi in Starbucks might not be even more compromised than an internet café. But whatever – in the past I used Explorer cafe on Beach Rd. in Pattaya and never had any kind of security problem, perhaps because they can’t access TANs?. But it’s also fairly upmarket as far as Internet cafes are concerned. I do appreciate the risks, but since a hacker in a cafe didn’t have access to my TAN lists then, or my Chip-Tan generator now, then there’s not much anyone can do with the banking info I input except view (not much money there anyway!). I also have very tight parameters on my security settings for bank and credit cards. Maybe someone can spot an error in my thinking - I'd be grateful if so!

Every wifi access point is equally un-secure, but so is 3G, anyone can see the network traffic. Anything going over an un-encrypted channel is free game. Since most banks and email providers realize this their traffic goes over encrypted channels (https), a hacker can see the network traffic but they need the correct keys to see the contents. In this case the service providers private key.

Using TANs are a good idea, two-stage authentication is more secure then just a password. You do need to be aware sometimes the TAN dongles are hacked, which means an outsider can access your account, this is completely un-related to visiting Thailand because the hack does not require access to your computer or TAN dongle

Thanks for the input - there's always an element of risk, but that's restricted by my account parameters, and anyway like I said I generate my own TANs for each transaction nowadays and anything untowards would be retrieved quickly - the banks here have a high level of accountability and as long as I can prove I wasn't crassly negligent, the cash gets replaced.

Edited October 18, 2012 by BusyB

[BusyB]

Many thanks for all the replies.

A few are a bit technical for me but everything’s bursting with lots of good experience. Fortunately I can use the cloud and don’t need to clone the hard drive.

I was actually wondering whether wi-fi in Starbucks might not be even more compromised than an internet café. But whatever – in the past I used Explorer cafe on Beach Rd. in Pattaya and never had any kind of security problem, perhaps because they can’t access TANs?. But it’s also fairly upmarket as far as Internet cafes are concerned. I do appreciate the risks, but since a hacker in a cafe didn’t have access to my TAN lists then, or my Chip-Tan generator now, then there’s not much anyone can do with the banking info I input except view (not much money there anyway!). I also have very tight parameters on my security settings for bank and credit cards. Maybe someone can spot an error in my thinking - I'd be grateful if so!

I have also cultivated a whole variety of passwords, (literally dozens) each different for even the most mundane log-in, each encoded on a list which no one could possibly understand except myself.

Vale Tudo – great post, thanks, that’s exactly some of the info I was after – I’ll touch base with AIS when I get there.

It looks like the 3G/mobile phone route is the best. I AM very cagey about wi-fi nets.

Thanks Smokie, that's also the kind of experienced tip I was hoping for - helps enormously.

Nietzche thanks for the chuckle - but it's great for my digital needs, and the weight is right too.

I’ll keep an eye on the thread as long as it’s on the front page, but with work commitments that may not be every day.

Once again, many thanks to all - gives me a flying start.

I see you are coming here for a Month or so, is it a holiday? I'm sorry but with all the problems you feel you my have with the Mac. why not leave it at home and enjoy yourself

I'm gonna have a whale of a time even if it gets stolen

Edited October 18, 2012 by BusyB

[BigJohnnyBKK]

Use a VPN service if you're that concerned.

[phuturatica]

When you get to Bangkok, head to Phanthip Plaza and buy yourself a wifi router dongle. AIS have monthly plans and you can connect any device which has wifi to the dongle if it is in your pocket/bag - quite handy I think.