Alcohol Crackdown In Force: Thailand

[maidu]

Has anyone ever thought to mention to them that it is the consumption of alcohol which is the problem and not the selling of it?

So, it's ok for Somchai to buy a large bottle of rum at lunchtime, consume it during the afternoon, then drive home shitfaced, but if I want to buy a can of beer at 4:30 to enjoy when I get home that is not ok...

Are there many countries out there that don't have laws in terms of when, where, who and how alcohol can be sold?

Yes, but they usually have some sort of reasoning behind the hours allowed. The 2:00 to 5:00 ban is just stupid and outside of major supermarkets, not enforced. I'd love to see some sort of study that provides (or doesn't provide) a link between the multiple bans on the sale of alcohol and drunk driving.

Where my family lives in the US; in most of the state, the sale and purchase of alcohol is strictly illegal (and heavily enforced) any time, anywhere. No exceptions.

sounds like Utah. Interesting, because I've been pondering moving there, because I like deserts and canyons and open space. Whether or not alcoholic beverages are sold, is a non-issue for me. I stopped polluting my body with purtrified sugars and yeasts decades ago. Most of the chemicals in alcohol are either: the type yeasts use to repel other fungi, or remnants of dead yeast. If you like alcohol, you might really like drinking formaldihyde. Plus it will keep you looking younger!

[seajae]

we drove from Saraburi to Surat Thaniyesterday afternoon/ last night and saw no police checking anyone, all the roadside bars were in full swing and the only cops I saw were letting off fireworks but then there was a bit of rain and the poor dears probably didnt want to get wet.

[chris1dna]

Tell me again how it still not a disease? Pretty simple to me that it is.

dis·ease /diˈzēz/ Noun

A disorder of structure or function in a human, animal, or plant, esp. one that produces specific signs or symptoms or that affects a...

A particular quality, habit, or disposition regarded as adversely affecting a person or group of people.

Synonyms; illness - malady - sickness - ailment - complaint

With that sort of vague open-ended definition, a whole heck of a lot of things would qualify as diseases. Blowing a whistle in public, humming off-key in a car, spitting, eating a piece of fallen tofu off the floor, blowing your nose with or in your fingers, talking annoyingly on the phone. A bureaucrat at a Thai visa office making someone suffer more than he should, could be said to have a disease of bureaucrillin wastingtimeness boringass.

Not my definition. Merriam webster.

[chris1dna]

Tell me again how it still not a disease? Pretty simple to me that it is.

dis·ease /diˈzēz/ Noun

A disorder of structure or function in a human, animal, or plant, esp. one that produces specific signs or symptoms or that affects a...

A particular quality, habit, or disposition regarded as adversely affecting a person or group of people.

Synonyms; illness - malady - sickness - ailment - complaint

With that sort of vague open-ended definition, a whole heck of a lot of things would qualify as diseases. Blowing a whistle in public, humming off-key in a car, spitting, eating a piece of fallen tofu off the floor, blowing your nose with or in your fingers, talking annoyingly on the phone. A bureaucrat at a Thai visa office making someone suffer more than he should, could be said to have a disease of bureaucrillin wastingtimeness boringass.

Are there any ThaiVisaholics Anonymous meetings available? Lol!!

[Arkady]

How many times have you seen uniformed Thai police red faced and pie eyed at some venue they are forcing the owner to feed and water them free of charge and at the end of the session they jump in their car or hop on their motor bike and drive off?

[Arkady]

Where my family lives in the US; in most of the state, the sale and purchase of alcohol is strictly illegal (and heavily enforced) any time, anywhere. No exceptions.

Sounds like your family is living in the state of Iran.

[Nisa]

Where my family lives in the US; in most of the state, the sale and purchase of alcohol is strictly illegal (and heavily enforced) any time, anywhere. No exceptions.

Sounds like your family is living in the state of Iran.

Not going to argue with you on the US turning into a bit of a police state but for a long time now alcohol is sold differently in different cities, counties and states. Some states you can only buy alcohol from state stores and other places serving alcohol is only permitted if 50% of the revenue the shop makes comes from non-alcohol while other places don't allow sales at all or ban them on Sundays and so on and so on. Trying to make sense of alcohol laws, especially when it can be sold it pointless but common sense dictates that less availability will equal less sales and less consumption.

[maidu]

Where my family lives in the US; in most of the state, the sale and purchase of alcohol is strictly illegal (and heavily enforced) any time, anywhere. No exceptions.

Sounds like your family is living in the state of Iran.

Not going to argue with you on the US turning into a bit of a police state but for a long time now alcohol is sold differently in different cities, counties and states. Some states you can only buy alcohol from state stores and other places serving alcohol is only permitted if 50% of the revenue the shop makes comes from non-alcohol while other places don't allow sales at all or ban them on Sundays and so on and so on. Trying to make sense of alcohol laws, especially when it can be sold it pointless but common sense dictates that less availability will equal less sales and less consumption.

Trying to control alcohol sales never works. When I resided in Maryland during High School, me and my buddies would drive every night across the Wash.D.C. border to buy a bottle of wine. Similarly in Thailand, buying alcohol or moonshine is as easy as pie. What might work is educating the public on what drinking fermented sugars does to a person's mind and body. Another thing, would be parents/elders showing a good example, instead of just dictating how youngsters should be - elders should show an example, but are incapable of being honest or real.

[Thai at Heart]

Where my family lives in the US; in most of the state, the sale and purchase of alcohol is strictly illegal (and heavily enforced) any time, anywhere. No exceptions.

Sounds like your family is living in the state of Iran.

Not going to argue with you on the US turning into a bit of a police state but for a long time now alcohol is sold differently in different cities, counties and states. Some states you can only buy alcohol from state stores and other places serving alcohol is only permitted if 50% of the revenue the shop makes comes from non-alcohol while other places don't allow sales at all or ban them on Sundays and so on and so on. Trying to make sense of alcohol laws, especially when it can be sold it pointless but common sense dictates that less availability will equal less sales and less consumption.

Trying to control alcohol sales never works. When I resided in Maryland during High School, me and my buddies would drive every night across the Wash.D.C. border to buy a bottle of wine. Similarly in Thailand, buying alcohol or moonshine is as easy as pie. What might work is educating the public on what drinking fermented sugars does to a person's mind and body. Another thing, would be parents/elders showing a good example, instead of just dictating how youngsters should be - elders should show an example, but are incapable of being honest or real.

Well, one of the most interesting educational stats was in the UK where they came up with 21 units of alcohol per week as some kind of a limit. I saw a TV show where they tried to quantify the effects of drinking alcohol every day versus abstinence. quite astonishing effect. However, they interviewed one of the committee that came up with the 21 unit measurement, and he admitted there was absolutely no basis in science for the 21 units any more than 25 or 15. They simply came up with the average of what they tended to drink in a normal week.

And quite amazingly, on the front page of the paper in the UK

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/healthnews/9774223/Alcohol-guidelines-too-high-say-doctors.html

Dr Michael Mosley, who looked into the matter for the radio documentary, found the guidelines were based on limited data on the harms of low to moderate level drinking.

They were formulated in 1987 by a Royal College of Physicians working party. In 2007 Richard Smith, one of the members of the group and a former editor of the British Medical Journal, was quoted as saying they could not say what a safe limit was, because of this lack of data.

“Those limits were really plucked out of the air,” he said.

“They were not based on any firm evidence at all. It was a sort of intelligent guess by a committee.”

Dr Mosley said the Government had “presented these guidelines as if they are about health, but they’re really not”.

Edited January 2, 2013 by Thai at Heart

[DocN]

Alcohol Crackdown In Force: Thailand

Of course I have no intelligent sources to quote, but...is this an <deleted> joke?

Crackdown?

I spent 3 days with the missus in her home village, near Korat.

We reached there a 1 pm on the 30th and left at 2 pm on the 1st.

I have NEVER seen so many CONSTANTLY drunk people in such a small place at the same time!

And EVERYBODY was going around on scooters or in cars!

Crackdown? Or better someone needs to put the CRACKpipe DOWN?

[partington]

Well, one of the most interesting educational stats was in the UK where they came up with 21 units of alcohol per week as some kind of a limit. I saw a TV show where they tried to quantify the effects of drinking alcohol every day versus abstinence. quite astonishing effect. However, they interviewed one of the committee that came up with the 21 unit measurement, and he admitted there was absolutely no basis in science for the 21 units any more than 25 or 15. They simply came up with the average of what they tended to drink in a normal week.

And quite amazingly, on the front page of the paper in the UK

http://www.telegraph...ay-doctors.html

Dr Michael Mosley, who looked into the matter for the radio documentary, found the guidelines were based on limited data on the harms of low to moderate level drinking.

They were formulated in 1987 by a Royal College of Physicians working party. In 2007 Richard Smith, one of the members of the group and a former editor of the British Medical Journal, was quoted as saying they could not say what a safe limit was, because of this lack of data.

“Those limits were really plucked out of the air,” he said.

“They were not based on any firm evidence at all. It was a sort of intelligent guess by a committee.”

Dr Mosley said the Government had “presented these guidelines as if they are about health, but they’re really not”.

This is kind of scary. I actually knew the UK guidelines were pulled out of thin air, so I assumed they erred on the side of being set too low. Been aiming for around 30 units a week,and enjoying it.

Now it appears that a quarter of a pint of beer a day is being touted as the new safe limit....and having half a bottle of wine a day is dangerous. Unfortunately it seems to be mostly cancer risk that is significantly raised at these low levels.

Well I can't drink a quarter of a pint of beer a day and still have any quality of life so I guess it's cancer for me...

[Thai at Heart]

Well, one of the most interesting educational stats was in the UK where they came up with 21 units of alcohol per week as some kind of a limit. I saw a TV show where they tried to quantify the effects of drinking alcohol every day versus abstinence. quite astonishing effect. However, they interviewed one of the committee that came up with the 21 unit measurement, and he admitted there was absolutely no basis in science for the 21 units any more than 25 or 15. They simply came up with the average of what they tended to drink in a normal week.

And quite amazingly, on the front page of the paper in the UK

http://www.telegraph...ay-doctors.html

Dr Michael Mosley, who looked into the matter for the radio documentary, found the guidelines were based on limited data on the harms of low to moderate level drinking.

They were formulated in 1987 by a Royal College of Physicians working party. In 2007 Richard Smith, one of the members of the group and a former editor of the British Medical Journal, was quoted as saying they could not say what a safe limit was, because of this lack of data.

“Those limits were really plucked out of the air,” he said.

“They were not based on any firm evidence at all. It was a sort of intelligent guess by a committee.”

Dr Mosley said the Government had “presented these guidelines as if they are about health, but they’re really not”.

This is kind of scary. I actually knew the UK guidelines were pulled out of thin air, so I assumed they erred on the side of being set too low. Been aiming for around 30 units a week,and enjoying it.

Now it appears that a quarter of a pint of beer a day is being touted as the new safe limit....and having half a bottle of wine a day is dangerous. Unfortunately it seems to be mostly cancer risk that is significantly raised at these low levels.

Well I can't drink a quarter of a pint of beer a day and still have any quality of life so I guess it's cancer for me...

I am genuinely on the side of believing that moderate consumption of alcohol isn't harmful.

Look at the longevity stats for various countries. The japs live forever and have chronically high levels of booze and cigarette consumption as do the greeks.

Moderation is the only reasonable strategy.

living life probably increases duration better than abstention.

Edited January 2, 2013 by Thai at Heart

[maidu]

Crackdown?

I spent 3 days with the missus in her home village, near Korat.

We reached there a 1 pm on the 30th and left at 2 pm on the 1st.

I have NEVER seen so many CONSTANTLY drunk people in such a small place at the same time!

And EVERYBODY was going around on scooters or in cars!

If you want to see the full harm of alcoholism, try volunteering at a health clinic near an Indian reservation in the US. Premie babies, killings, wife beatings, vehicle wreck victims on a weekly basis, and that's from a small population base. Some say the reason Indians and Asians make such sloppy drunks is because they're metabolism isn't as adapted to drinking fermented sugars as westerners. Yet, westerners and all others who imbibe - they all make sloppy drunks. Drinking alcohol actually makes a person's cells crave water (it starves cells of water), which is one reason alcohol drinkers often have bloated and reddish skin.

Well I can't drink a quarter of a pint of beer a day and still have any quality of life so I guess it's cancer for me...

Moderation is the only reasonable strategy.

Moderation is ok if you only want to get moderately debilitated. However, if you want to give your body and brain a healthy option, abstenation is a better alternative.

When you're 15 and getting sloshed with your ever-giggling buddies, getting smashed on alcohol can be funny. As we get a bit older, it becomes less funny. Some, not all of us.

Edited January 2, 2013 by maidu

[partington]

Well, one of the most interesting educational stats was in the UK where they came up with 21 units of alcohol per week as some kind of a limit. I saw a TV show where they tried to quantify the effects of drinking alcohol every day versus abstinence. quite astonishing effect. However, they interviewed one of the committee that came up with the 21 unit measurement, and he admitted there was absolutely no basis in science for the 21 units any more than 25 or 15. They simply came up with the average of what they tended to drink in a normal week.

And quite amazingly, on the front page of the paper in the UK

http://www.telegraph...ay-doctors.html

Dr Michael Mosley, who looked into the matter for the radio documentary, found the guidelines were based on limited data on the harms of low to moderate level drinking.

They were formulated in 1987 by a Royal College of Physicians working party. In 2007 Richard Smith, one of the members of the group and a former editor of the British Medical Journal, was quoted as saying they could not say what a safe limit was, because of this lack of data.

"Those limits were really plucked out of the air," he said.

"They were not based on any firm evidence at all. It was a sort of intelligent guess by a committee."

Dr Mosley said the Government had "presented these guidelines as if they are about health, but they're really not".

This is kind of scary. I actually knew the UK guidelines were pulled out of thin air, so I assumed they erred on the side of being set too low. Been aiming for around 30 units a week,and enjoying it.

Now it appears that a quarter of a pint of beer a day is being touted as the new safe limit....and having half a bottle of wine a day is dangerous. Unfortunately it seems to be mostly cancer risk that is significantly raised at these low levels.

Well I can't drink a quarter of a pint of beer a day and still have any quality of life so I guess it's cancer for me...

I am genuinely on the side of believing that moderate consumption of alcohol isn't harmful.

Look at the longevity stats for various countries. The japs live forever and have chronically high levels of booze and cigarette consumption as do the greeks.

Moderation is the only reasonable strategy.

living life probably increases duration better than abstention.

I wish that were true, but unfortunately genuine belief doesn't alter facts!

If the research is correct, (I haven't read the scientific papers the Telegraph article refers to, so I can't tell yet, but they were published in very reputable journals so are unlikely to be rubbish) then low level alcohol consumption produces a statistically measurable increase in risks for certain cancers.

Longevity statistics are the end result of the entire lifestyle and can't be used to pick out one behaviour (e.g alcohol consumption) and conclude it's not important. Japanese also eat much more fish and much less saturated fat and sugar than westerners, and have a very advanced health-care system. There are likely to be many. many other differences too.

PS In any case your point about the Japanese isn't actually correct. According to a WHO report they consume 8.03 litres of alcohol per person per year, way way down on the list of countries, at about number seventy. Far ahead of them are, for example, France, UK, Ireland, Denmark, and Spain all around numbers 15 -17, with consumption at about 12-13 litres per year. Greece is at number 30 with 8.95 litres per year, not really that much either compared to the top countries, and behind even Nepal and Switzerland!

source: http://en.wikipedia....hol_consumption

[Thai at Heart]

Crackdown?

I spent 3 days with the missus in her home village, near Korat.

We reached there a 1 pm on the 30th and left at 2 pm on the 1st.

I have NEVER seen so many CONSTANTLY drunk people in such a small place at the same time!

And EVERYBODY was going around on scooters or in cars!

If you want to see the full harm of alcoholism, try volunteering at a health clinic near an Indian reservation in the US. Premie babies, killings, wife beatings, vehicle wreck victims on a weekly basis, and that's from a small population base. Some say the reason Indians and Asians make such sloppy drunks is because they're metabolism isn't as adapted to drinking fermented sugars as westerners. Yet, westerners and all others who imbibe - they all make sloppy drunks. Drinking alcohol actually makes a person's cells crave water (it starves cells of water), which is one reason alcohol drinkers often have bloated and reddish skin.

Well I can't drink a quarter of a pint of beer a day and still have any quality of life so I guess it's cancer for me...

Moderation is the only reasonable strategy.

Moderation is ok if you only want to get moderately debilitated. However, if you want to give your body and brain a healthy option, abstenation is a better alternative.

When you're 15 and getting sloshed with your ever-giggling buddies, getting smashed on alcohol can be funny. As we get a bit older, it becomes less funny. Some, not all of us.

Who is the royal "we".

Drinking for social enjoyment is a very different escapade from getting smashed.

As for mental impairment, i await the stats, because having worked in one very controversial industry, i would love for them to wallop the booze industry.

Edited January 2, 2013 by Thai at Heart

[ThaiTrav]

DUIs in The U.S. are FELONY PERIOD. I presume its the same in the U.K., Canada, Australia as well and more often than not requires the retainer of an Attorney which are not cheap, which can argue the finer points of how breathalizer the test were given by a policeman at the scene & a host of other legal finer points used in the defense of his or her client.

DUIs are not always clear cut and dry..but no way in hell are any of the judges bribed, policemen also...those in themselves are felonies as well.

Hmmm ...so your assuming these fellow contrymen will have intelligence enough to read the reading let alone point the speed gun correctly, least of all will be wanting to copy our countries ...they have it all under control was the understats only 2884 accidents 340 or 50 dead ! Haaaah!

[maidu]

If you want to see the full harm of alcoholism, try volunteering at a health clinic near an Indian reservation in the US. Premie babies, killings, wife beatings, vehicle wreck victims on a weekly basis, and that's from a small population base. Some say the reason Indians and Asians make such sloppy drunks is because they're metabolism isn't as adapted to drinking fermented sugars as westerners. Yet, westerners and all others who imbibe - they all make sloppy drunks. Drinking alcohol actually makes a person's cells crave water (it starves cells of water), which is one reason alcohol drinkers often have bloated and reddish skin.

Well I can't drink a quarter of a pint of beer a day and still have any quality of life so I guess it's cancer for me...

Moderation is the only reasonable strategy.

Moderation is ok if you only want to get moderately debilitated. However, if you want to give your body and brain a healthy option, abstenation is a better alternative.

When you're 15 and getting sloshed with your ever-giggling buddies, getting smashed on alcohol can be funny. As we get a bit older, it becomes less funny. Some, not all of us.

Who is the royal "we".

Drinking for social enjoyment is a very different escapade from getting smashed.

As for mental impairment, i await the stats, because having worked in one very controversial industry, i would love for them to wallop the booze industry.

The 'we' I referred to are those of us who don't drink and therefore don't harm others (while intoxicated) and make problems for everyone else (such as running up insurance costs, hospital costs, safety costs, etc).

"Drinking for social enjoyment is a very different escapade from getting smashed." Oh yea? How different? Where do you draw the line between drinking 'for social enjoyment' and 'getting smashed'? Tell that to the wives/g.f's who get beat up on a daily basis, or the parents of the kids who get killed every day by drunk drivers. I'm sure they'll appreciate hearing about the finer points between sophisticated drinking and getting sloshed."

And what about illegal drugs? Cops and incarceration industry don't discern between doing a little bit of heroin/crack/speed or doing a lot of it. Why should drinkers of Seagrams or Chivas or Johnny Walker be treated differently? Alcohol drinkers cause a whole heck of a lot more damage and suffering than all illegal drugs combined.

Then there are the hundreds of Thai women doing ten, twenty years or life imprisonment in Asian jails for not even using drugs (just caught trafficking one time). If purveyors of alcoholic drinks were treated similarly, 20% of the population would be rotting in prisons.

Edited January 3, 2013 by maidu