Son And Further Education What A Laugh

[ajarnpot]

There is nothing wrong with the kid finding his feet, its a tough old world out there being made more difficult by the old people who will drain the coffers,

[giddyup]

There is nothing wrong with the kid finding his feet, its a tough old world out there being made more difficult by the old people who will drain the coffers,

Is this another ageist dig? Are you suggesting everyone over 60 should vacate this world because they're too much of a burden?

[SteeleJoe]

There is nothing wrong with the kid finding his feet, its a tough old world out there being made more difficult by the old people who will drain the coffers,

Yes, but he has to start doing so.

I was a bit of a nightmare as a teenager and it took me years to find my feet. But I left my folks home at 17 and looked after myself one way or another ever since. My parents were far from perfect and at one point the relationship was not great but I guess they did manage to both show love and instill some spirit of independence and self-reliance.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

[edwardandtubs]

Why not get a girlfriend who isn't the mother to some other guy's children?

Usually, they aren't interested in most farangs, unless of course its me.

Too many western guys here set their sights too low. There are enough normal Thai women not carrying the baggage of some other guy's children. No need to settle for the rejects of Thai society.

You're calling girls/teenagers that have been dumped by their thai boy friends that impregnated them the rejects of Thai society ?

You need to get a life !

I didn't design Thai society that way but rejects of society is exactly what they are. You have to accept Thai society for what it is, not for what you think it should be. No self-respecting Thai man would marry the mother of some other guy's kids. Why do some farangs think it's a great idea?

Edited January 3, 2013 by edwardandtubs

[Trembly]

I didn't design Thai society that way but rejects of society is exactly what they are. You have to accept Thai society for what it is, not for what you think it should be. No self-respecting Thai man would marry the mother of some other guy's kids. Why do some farangs think it's a great idea?

I have actually come across a few Thai men who have done that, one of whom is very wealthy. OK, granted, I can count them on one hand but I think it's more a case of supply and demand than prohibitive stigma; there are simply loads and loads of eligible childless women around.

I reckon that the farang + Thai women with children in tow proportions are so skewed because those women make more of a conscious and deliberate effort to secure their futures and farang tend to make easier catches (for various reasons), generally speaking.

Edited January 3, 2013 by Trembly

[SteeleJoe]

I didn't design Thai society that way but rejects of society is exactly what they are. You have to accept Thai society for what it is, not for what you think it should be. No self-respecting Thai man would marry the mother of some other guy's kids. Why do some farangs think it's a great idea?

I have actually come across a few Thai men who have done that, one of whom is very wealthy. OK, granted, I can count them on one hand but I think it's more a case of supply and demand than prohibitive stigma; there are simply loads and loads of eligible childless women around.

I reckon that the farang + Thai women with children in tow proportions are so skewed because those women make more of a conscious and deliberate effort to secure their futures and farang tend to make easier catches (for various reasons), generally speaking.

Spot on, IMO.

And I too can say for a fact that to claim that NO Thai man would marry a woman with kids is ridiculously and self-evidently false (I've known perhaps 2 or 3? Maybe more. It's safe to say that statistically speaking, there has to be a few more than just the ones I and Trembly know/knew...).

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

[loong]

There is nothing wrong with the kid finding his feet, its a tough old world out there being made more difficult by the old people who will drain the coffers,

Exactly how do old people drain the coffers in Thailand any more than a lazy kid who tries to drain the coffers of his (aging) parents?

[JaiLai]

I didn't design Thai society that way but rejects of society is exactly what they are. You have to accept Thai society for what it is, not for what you think it should be. No self-respecting Thai man would marry the mother of some other guy's kids. Why do some farangs think it's a great idea?

I have actually come across a few Thai men who have done that, one of whom is very wealthy. OK, granted, I can count them on one hand but I think it's more a case of supply and demand than prohibitive stigma; there are simply loads and loads of eligible childless women around.

I reckon that the farang + Thai women with children in tow proportions are so skewed because those women make more of a conscious and deliberate effort to secure their futures and farang tend to make easier catches (for various reasons), generally speaking.

Spot on, IMO.

And I too can say for a fact that to claim that NO Thai man would marry a woman with kids is ridiculously and self-evidently false (I've known perhaps 2 or 3? Maybe more. It's safe to say that statistically speaking, there has to be a few more than just the ones I and Trembly know/knew...).

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

Of course a few people with know a couple of instances of Thai men marrying Thai women with kids from a previous relationship but as stated there are considered " damaged goods" - no getting away from that, won't change anytime soon!

[loong]

I didn't design Thai society that way but rejects of society is exactly what they are. You have to accept Thai society for what it is, not for what you think it should be. No self-respecting Thai man would marry the mother of some other guy's kids. Why do some farangs think it's a great idea?

Probably half the Thai men that I know are married to women that had some other guy's kids already.

[JaiLai]

I didn't design Thai society that way but rejects of society is exactly what they are. You have to accept Thai society for what it is, not for what you think it should be. No self-respecting Thai man would marry the mother of some other guy's kids. Why do some farangs think it's a great idea?

Probably half the Thai men that I know are married to women that had some other guy's kids already.

WOW - that really surprise me.

[lovelomsak]

It appears to me most thai men marry the second time to women with kids. I have often seen thai guys leave their wife and go live with a woman with 2 or 3 kids.. My wife's (got married yesterday) ex has a new Gf with kids,a good thai friend of mine married a woman with kids (his second marriage) and put them through university,I could go on. Maybe Thai men lower their sites also on second time around.

Also I would like to address farang men marrying women with kids. An old saying from where I come from is A woman works harder to keep the second marriage together. Thai women with kids offer more than most single women.I know generalization.Young women getting married to a farang can be quite demanding.A middle aged woman with kids will usually put more effort into keeping a man who can take care of her and her children. Perhaps if nothing else out of pure necessity.

[harryfrompattaya]

It appears to me most thai men marry the second time to women with kids. I have often seen thai guys leave their wife and go live with a woman with 2 or 3 kids.. My wife's (got married yesterday) ex has a new Gf with kids,a good thai friend of mine married a woman with kids (his second marriage) and put them through university,I could go on. Maybe Thai men lower their sites also on second time around.

Also I would like to address farang men marrying women with kids. An old saying from where I come from is A woman works harder to keep the second marriage together. Thai women with kids offer more than most single women.I know generalization.Young women getting married to a farang can be quite demanding.A middle aged woman with kids will usually put more effort into keeping a man who can take care of her and her children. Perhaps if nothing else out of pure necessity.

All it means the kids are older and will have babies soon, and guess what Farangs have more Thais to support. Even the In laws of the kids will try to get from the Farang Run Run Run

[maprao]

Is is too late to get him into the local tech school. There he will learn a trade. Every town has them.

Make it clear now that the option of becoming an adult dependent is not an option.

Getting into the military as an officer there requires a fairly good thai education and some connections.. Google the Thai navy and army officer academies. They get to choose who they want.

Above all tread carefully about giving him allowances etc. In certain parts of Thailand once you down this road you will have made a "rod" for your own back!

[edwardandtubs]

I didn't design Thai society that way but rejects of society is exactly what they are. You have to accept Thai society for what it is, not for what you think it should be. No self-respecting Thai man would marry the mother of some other guy's kids. Why do some farangs think it's a great idea?

I have actually come across a few Thai men who have done that, one of whom is very wealthy. OK, granted, I can count them on one hand but I think it's more a case of supply and demand than prohibitive stigma; there are simply loads and loads of eligible childless women around.

I reckon that the farang + Thai women with children in tow proportions are so skewed because those women make more of a conscious and deliberate effort to secure their futures and farang tend to make easier catches (for various reasons), generally speaking.

There are always going to be exceptions and I'm sure plenty of Thai men are bottom feeders as well, but there's no need for any man in Thailand with the income to support (rather than leech off) a woman to marry a woman carrying the baggage of some other guy's children and all the problems that causes. Thai men understand that, too many farangs don't.

[loong]

I didn't design Thai society that way but rejects of society is exactly what they are. You have to accept Thai society for what it is, not for what you think it should be. No self-respecting Thai man would marry the mother of some other guy's kids. Why do some farangs think it's a great idea?

I have actually come across a few Thai men who have done that, one of whom is very wealthy. OK, granted, I can count them on one hand but I think it's more a case of supply and demand than prohibitive stigma; there are simply loads and loads of eligible childless women around.

I reckon that the farang + Thai women with children in tow proportions are so skewed because those women make more of a conscious and deliberate effort to secure their futures and farang tend to make easier catches (for various reasons), generally speaking.

There are always going to be exceptions and I'm sure plenty of Thai men are bottom feeders as well, but there's no need for any man in Thailand with the income to support (rather than leech off) a woman to marry a woman carrying the baggage of some other guy's children and all the problems that causes. Thai men understand that, too many farangs don't.

I am trying to stay polite here.

I am sure that you realise that most of the people that post here are not spring chickens.

When the relationship between myself and the Missus started, I had already turned 50.

At that time, it may have been very nice to walk around with an 18 or 20 year old on my arm, great for my ego.

The thing is, you may have noticed that Thai people seem to mature very slowly. A 20 year old Thai girl is about as mature as a 13 year old westerner girl with her 'Hello Kitty" underwear, bags etc.

When I was a 30 year old in the UK, I could form relationships with 20 year old girls because they were all woman.

When 50 years old in Thailand, going out with a 20 year old seems the same to me, and I'm sure many others, as going out with a child.

At that time, I found all women under 30 unsuitable for a relationship because I required a certain level of maturity.

Guess what, practically all women aged 30 plus had children.

As I saw it, there were very few women available at the maturity level that I wanted that didn't have children already. I had a choice of forming a relationship with a child or a woman and I had no desire to form a relationship with a child no matter how old she actually was.

I am sure that many posters here will agree with me.

When we form a relationship with a Thai woman, we want a woman, not someone with the maturity of a child.

I was not bottom feeding when getting into a relationship, it was simply a case that I was only interested in real women, not girls with the maturity of a child.

[chiangmaikelly]

I didn't design Thai society that way but rejects of society is exactly what they are. You have to accept Thai society for what it is, not for what you think it should be. No self-respecting Thai man would marry the mother of some other guy's kids. Why do some farangs think it's a great idea?

I have actually come across a few Thai men who have done that, one of whom is very wealthy. OK, granted, I can count them on one hand but I think it's more a case of supply and demand than prohibitive stigma; there are simply loads and loads of eligible childless women around.

I reckon that the farang + Thai women with children in tow proportions are so skewed because those women make more of a conscious and deliberate effort to secure their futures and farang tend to make easier catches (for various reasons), generally speaking.

There are always going to be exceptions and I'm sure plenty of Thai men are bottom feeders as well, but there's no need for any man in Thailand with the income to support (rather than leech off) a woman to marry a woman carrying the baggage of some other guy's children and all the problems that causes. Thai men understand that, too many farangs don't.

I am trying to stay polite here.

I am sure that you realise that most of the people that post here are not spring chickens.

When the relationship between myself and the Missus started, I had already turned 50.

At that time, it may have been very nice to walk around with an 18 or 20 year old on my arm, great for my ego.

The thing is, you may have noticed that Thai people seem to mature very slowly. A 20 year old Thai girl is about as mature as a 13 year old westerner girl with her 'Hello Kitty" underwear, bags etc.

When I was a 30 year old in the UK, I could form relationships with 20 year old girls because they were all woman.

When 50 years old in Thailand, going out with a 20 year old seems the same to me, and I'm sure many others, as going out with a child.

At that time, I found all women under 30 unsuitable for a relationship because I required a certain level of maturity.

Guess what, practically all women aged 30 plus had children.

As I saw it, there were very few women available at the maturity level that I wanted that didn't have children already. I had a choice of forming a relationship with a child or a woman and I had no desire to form a relationship with a child no matter how old she actually was.

I am sure that many posters here will agree with me.

When we form a relationship with a Thai woman, we want a woman, not someone with the maturity of a child.

I was not bottom feeding when getting into a relationship, it was simply a case that I was only interested in real women, not girls with the maturity of a child.

I know you think you are trying to stay polite but your statement is one of the most narrow and value laden towards a particular direction that I have read all day. I would imagine there are also a number of men on Thai Visa who don't think that 25 to 29 year old women have the maturity of children. I only post because you said we. I wanted you to know not to include me in that number. I look at women as individuals and don't generalize all Thai women because they happen to be a particular age.

[DLock]

Interesting thread, and I feel for you guys. It really is a no-win situation.

My wife's nephew stayed with us for a while as she wanted him to go to a better school away from Sukhothai.

It was not a good experience and the kid just was not motivated. No matter what we did, what extra schooling we provided, he just did not want to apply himself. He just wanted to go back to the farm and catch frogs and rats and work on the farm. I was pretty glad to see the back of him to be honest.

It is discouraging to see opportunities wasted, especially when you can see where his life will end up. Meanwhile, some kid who is desperate to stay in school and become something does not have the money or opportunity. I find this situation very sad.

Tough situation and the stress it must put on the relationship must be intense.

Good Luck fellas. I'd be seriously looking at the military or a construction job in Saudi.

[SteeleJoe]

Nice one CMK. The whole "child" thing over and over indicates to me some bitterness and an issue from past experience (perhaps like many Farangs, he succumbed top the physical attraction of a young woman without enough regard for character and said young woman or women proceeded to act i a way not suited to a man his age -- partly becasue he was that age). And while, seeing as they have the world at their feet, there's little occasion or inclination to defend young women, as someone who was young here and - because of my work and my habit - who knew a LOT of young women, I find this blanket and excessive condemnation of them unpalatable.

I lived here at 19 - 20 and then 26 on, so it was normal for me to spend time with women in their 20s (not that it isn't "normal to do so when you are older)and I'd definitely disagree that all 20 year olds act like children (any more than 20 year olds do anywhere). Once again it about CHOICES; It's about who you choose to put up with: a lot of guys consistently choose to put up with women who behave like spoiled brats - because it works for them, thanks to guys that reward it - but there are women in their 20's who know how to behave properly (perhaps not so easily found, especially in a bar or pub) and are as mature as an adult should be. I married one (after years of living together) - and now she's 39 - but I knew others.

Edited January 3, 2013 by SteeleJoe

[SteeleJoe]

I'm going to go ahead and quickly open one more can of worms that I was initially hesitant to (I want top preface that I should probably work out how to say this first but I'm not going to): the whole "Thai women/Thai men are like children" that I see a lot of on TVF is really offensive to me and it smacks of paternalism, ignorance and personal issues.

I'm not unaware of why it's said, and why people think that it's so but it's so often WAY overstated and is more about the sort of people one associates with. And, it has to be said - there's the issue of cultural difference. I abhor cultural or moral relativists and I am not one. But there are undeniable cultural differences about which it is ridiculously simplistic, chauvinistic and uninformed to put down as immaturity.

Edited January 3, 2013 by SteeleJoe

[loong]

I know you think you are trying to stay polite but your statement is one of the most narrow and value laden towards a particular direction that I have read all day. I would imagine there are also a number of men on Thai Visa who don't think that 25 to 29 year old women have the maturity of children. I only post because you said we. I wanted you to know not to include me in that number. I look at women as individuals and don't generalize all Thai women because they happen to be a particular age.

I was trying to stay polite regarding the poster's attitude to Thai women with children in tow being the dregs of society.

Fair enough that you don't believe that females under the age of 30 seem to have the mentality of children. Your experiences are different to mine.

Actually I shouldn't just refer to females.

Most of the Thais, male or female seem to mature slowly. That may be why they churn out kids of their own and leave their children in the care of grandparents. They are not mature enough to take responsibility for their actions.

[chiangmaikelly]

I know you think you are trying to stay polite but your statement is one of the most narrow and value laden towards a particular direction that I have read all day. I would imagine there are also a number of men on Thai Visa who don't think that 25 to 29 year old women have the maturity of children. I only post because you said we. I wanted you to know not to include me in that number. I look at women as individuals and don't generalize all Thai women because they happen to be a particular age.

I was trying to stay polite regarding the poster's attitude to Thai women with children in tow being the dregs of society.

Fair enough that you don't believe that females under the age of 30 seem to have the mentality of children. Your experiences are different to mine.

Actually I shouldn't just refer to females.

Most of the Thais, male or female seem to mature slowly. That may be why they churn out kids of their own and leave their children in the care of grandparents. They are not mature enough to take responsibility for their actions.

I have a number of daughters. They are all different. Some mature some not. Nationality didn't make any difference. I would imagine you don't have much experience with women. Or maybe just bad luck. However your experience is not the same as mine. Having a number of children and wives is not really something to brag about. It has been rather expensive and emotionally trying but it does give one a wide perspective.

[loong]

I know you think you are trying to stay polite but your statement is one of the most narrow and value laden towards a particular direction that I have read all day. I would imagine there are also a number of men on Thai Visa who don't think that 25 to 29 year old women have the maturity of children. I only post because you said we. I wanted you to know not to include me in that number. I look at women as individuals and don't generalize all Thai women because they happen to be a particular age.

I was trying to stay polite regarding the poster's attitude to Thai women with children in tow being the dregs of society.

Fair enough that you don't believe that females under the age of 30 seem to have the mentality of children. Your experiences are different to mine.

Actually I shouldn't just refer to females.

Most of the Thais, male or female seem to mature slowly. That may be why they churn out kids of their own and leave their children in the care of grandparents. They are not mature enough to take responsibility for their actions.

I have a number of daughters. They are all different. Some mature some not. Nationality didn't make any difference. I would imagine you don't have much experience with women. Or maybe just bad luck. However your experience is not the same as mine. Having a number of children and wives is not really something to brag about. It has been rather expensive and emotionally trying but it does give one a wide perspective.

And your children have a westerner for a father, they would have had different influences during their upbringing

[rene123]

I hate to say this as a generality, but It's been my experience that poor parenting at an early age is responsible for most of the problems that children have changing into responsible adults.

[DLock]

I hate to say this as a generality, but It's been my experience that poor parenting at an early age is responsible for most of the problems that children have changing into responsible adults.

I would not be so harsh.

Many parents themselves are the product of poor education, limited opportunities and varying motivations.

Some kids don't break out of that cycle for many reasons. Why do more than what is absolutely necessary?

But some kids do, despite financial barriers, peer pressure, limited education and opportunities.

I admire those that don't take the easy way out.

[harryfrompattaya]

I hate to say this as a generality, but It's been my experience that poor parenting at an early age is responsible for most of the problems that children have changing into responsible adults.

The real question is can Farangs be a Parent to Thai teenagers? I believe they look at Farangs as a walking ATM machines. Only spent on that and given what thier real Dad will do. Maybe they then respect you

Remember you do want support their children also

[tomjerry]

My brother in law has 3 children.He died a year ago. I attended his widows wedding yesterday. The new man was there and the children. There are several other second marries that involve Children that I am aware of and yes the men are respectable. What a truly ignorant comment.

Sent from my stupid phone galaxy 2

[DocN]

"My question is doe anyone else have issues such as this arise in their home life?"

That was the question in the OP. Good to know, that the "holier than though"- party is out again, telling

what he shouldn't have done and that all Thai- women with children are just scum, best to be avoided!

That really helps a lot, I assume!

[Semper]

You must choose the validity of this equation

gf + feckless son = happy married life

It's not a path I would choose.

At least he's not married = no obligations, he can walk away anytime.

[scorecard]

Think long term my friend. Don't give up just yet.

There are a number of excellent Rajabut Universities across Thailand which have excellent hotel and tourist courses (usually bachelor dergree level but maybe also certificate level), some even have small working / training hotels on campus (open to the public, very reasonable rates, farang very welcome - but the downside is that these hotels are not advertised very well).

The graduates from these programs are highly sort after, and these courses generally have a good track record in real English language conversation development.

From my understanding the tuition costs are fairly low. And Rajabut institutes are not all that difficult to enter.

Perhaps one of these unis is close enough to wherever you are.

In terms of the English, check his text books / work books every evening and turn it into a fun activity as much as possible to give him lots of practice* at home, give him time to respond, don't be impatient, don't push him past whatever his current lessons are, but do continously go back to yesterdays lessson focus etc. Get your wife into the fun also if she can speak English (perhaps this could even have some value for her English capabilities?).

Give it a shot - good luck !

*I believe this is one of the main keys to actual language development. My granddaughter (now 8 yrs old) goes to a private school in a full English stream, all subjects are taught by excellent farang teachers except Thai langauge (obviously taught by a Thai person). There is deliberately a lot pushing to gets the kids to speak English in the class room.

Here's the real point. Ninety nine percent of the kids in this class come from Thai families where:

- Both parents cannot speak any English but can read English but don't understand most of the words..

- Both parents cannot read or speak English past 'good morning' etc.

Real conversation ability is not happening with these kids because their is no immersion, and no practice and no reinforcement.

Most of these kids never do their homework (English, Science, etc) because the parents can't get specific to help the kids.

My granddaughter and about 3 other kids in her class have a foreign English speaking father or mother or grandparent at home. Their english development is excellent and pretty much equivalent to kids their own age living in a western house in a western country.

The immersion and therefore the continuous practice and reinforcement at home is clearly the key to success.

_________________________________________

Some of these Rajabut institutes also have 'remedial' programs where older kids can do a 'crash rerun of high school' to get a better GPA before they start their uni program. I'm aware of one kid who did this - 6 years in 6 months, apparently the teachers are good, push hard and do get good results'.

There are also other ways to do this. There's a network of properly accredited 'Adult High Schools' across Thailand (Adult Primary Schools also). These places are usually crash / intensive programs all day Saturday and Sunday). The students are adults, all ages, who never got the chance to attend primary or high school. Not free but very small fees.

If your in Bangkok, one of these schools operates outdoors in Lumpini Park, all day Sat. & Sun. you can easily find it, and I know (three extended family youngsters) who completed 6 years of high school at this school (6 months I think - sounds crazy but it seems to get good results), and near the end several employers came to interview the students. My three relatives all got jobs immedialely and all three have had good work promotions.

Edited January 4, 2013 by scorecard

[jikjik66]

This is a horrible situation.

Red flaggs for farang to see regarding wife-hope he sees it. Who trys to get a kid into medical school after the government system gives up on him. Med school is usually reserved for those who excel in school.

And then who is made to pay substantial baht in the futile attempts......the fraang of course.

If mother made farang pay for remedial school we can give her benefit of the doubt, but med. school. Youve got to be kidding.

Mother must think she hit the lottery with this guy!!!!!!!!!!!11

Edited January 4, 2013 by jikjik66