Patsycat Posted September 30, 2013 Share Posted September 30, 2013 (edited) Oooh another button for Pats to press!! Where is it?!!!! I see it... Does it work on myself... Knowing my luck, and track record, won't work!!! Edited September 30, 2013 by Patsycat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbk Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Totally off topic rant removed and response to that post. As for your assumption you will be called troll. This is the Ladies forum and it has different rules. If you are unable to follow those rules you will be suspended. Those rules include respecting the fact that this forum is for WOMEN and not for you to air your baggage. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacChine Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 Hello, it's OP. I abandoned this thread a few days after I made it when I realized that I wasn't going to have a real discussion. Most of the content seems to have been generated by men protecting their privilege, men projecting their issues of women onto me and my situation, and people telling me that farang men aggressively devaluing me is part of the local culture so I should accept it. I just left and never logged back in because I got enough of that in face to face interactions. It seems like most of the Ladies Forum posts get hijacked by idiots on personal crusades. It's unfortunate for the people who do have real content to contribute, I feel sorry for the mods and posters who have to deal with it. On the plus side, if anyone tries to tell me that I'm imagining sexist attitudes, I only have to point them to this thread (or most threads) to hear men repeat everything I've heard in an office and more. I'm being totally honest when I say Thailand's given me new empathy for women from previous generations. Thanks to some of the women and men who posted empathetic advice. I left the company several months ago, as it obviously wasn't a professional work environment. I was newer to Thailand and needed to keep my work permit active while I found something better. I just felt alone and attacked. I've found some good contacts with women in the professional sphere here, so I've had outlets to discuss this. Since then I've found a better work situation with higher quality standards. Also, my boyfriend hasn't left me and I am still working in Asia. Last point I'd like to make is that when I got to know all of my female coworkers much better, I learned they hated the environment as much as I did. They just didn't speak up to defend themselves. I on the other hand did defend myself and I set clear boundaries, but the environment didn't improve. By the time I had quit, all of them had left the company and the CEO had no idea why he had such a problem holding onto staff. I'd like to see someone try to mansplain that. Sexism is a problem in Thailand, both for Thai and farang women. I wish we could have a more constructive dialogue about it, but Thaivisa just isn't the place. SNIPPET: My italics So the problem again shows its nose: do men enjoy the same leisures as ladies? answer: no, except for the odd lady achieving a golf handicap below 24 or who likes to watch naked gogo dancers, and for the odd men who like arts expositions, theater performances, etc......, ................................................,I hope I didn't bore the reader too much with that post that got much lengthier than I first wanted it to be. zzzzzzzz...Huh Whaa, .Oh No not at all. If you don't mind the wee bit snippet , very interesting. Can someone explain how this is not as chauvinistic as it gets? (Meaning gender assumptions.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manarak Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 Hello, it's OP. I abandoned this thread a few days after I made it when I realized that I wasn't going to have a real discussion. Most of the content seems to have been generated by men protecting their privilege, men projecting their issues of women onto me and my situation, and people telling me that farang men aggressively devaluing me is part of the local culture so I should accept it. I just left and never logged back in because I got enough of that in face to face interactions. It seems like most of the Ladies Forum posts get hijacked by idiots on personal crusades. It's unfortunate for the people who do have real content to contribute, I feel sorry for the mods and posters who have to deal with it. On the plus side, if anyone tries to tell me that I'm imagining sexist attitudes, I only have to point them to this thread (or most threads) to hear men repeat everything I've heard in an office and more. I'm being totally honest when I say Thailand's given me new empathy for women from previous generations. Thanks to some of the women and men who posted empathetic advice. I left the company several months ago, as it obviously wasn't a professional work environment. I was newer to Thailand and needed to keep my work permit active while I found something better. I just felt alone and attacked. I've found some good contacts with women in the professional sphere here, so I've had outlets to discuss this. Since then I've found a better work situation with higher quality standards. Also, my boyfriend hasn't left me and I am still working in Asia. Last point I'd like to make is that when I got to know all of my female coworkers much better, I learned they hated the environment as much as I did. They just didn't speak up to defend themselves. I on the other hand did defend myself and I set clear boundaries, but the environment didn't improve. By the time I had quit, all of them had left the company and the CEO had no idea why he had such a problem holding onto staff. I'd like to see someone try to mansplain that. Sexism is a problem in Thailand, both for Thai and farang women. I wish we could have a more constructive dialogue about it, but Thaivisa just isn't the place. SNIPPET: My italics So the problem again shows its nose: do men enjoy the same leisures as ladies? answer: no, except for the odd lady achieving a golf handicap below 24 or who likes to watch naked gogo dancers, and for the odd men who like arts expositions, theater performances, etc......, ................................................,I hope I didn't bore the reader too much with that post that got much lengthier than I first wanted it to be. zzzzzzzz...Huh Whaa, .Oh No not at all. If you don't mind the wee bit snippet , very interesting. Can someone explain how this is not as chauvinistic as it gets? (Meaning gender assumptions.) Well, I just said that men and women have, for the most part, different tastes. I just explain my point of view, but I don't pretend my point of view is better than a lady's point of view. What's chauvinistic in saying ladies and men enjoy different things? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacChine Posted October 6, 2013 Share Posted October 6, 2013 Because it's an assumption that fosters sexism. I use to have 1970 Mach 1 that I enjoyed drag racing with, I know a guy who likes opera. What about gay guys and their proclivilties? What is different and is never ever discussed is hormones Testosterone makes animals aggressive and violent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manarak Posted October 6, 2013 Share Posted October 6, 2013 Because it's an assumption that fosters sexism. I use to have 1970 Mach 1 that I enjoyed drag racing with, I know a guy who likes opera. What about gay guys and their proclivilties? What is different and is never ever discussed is hormones Testosterone makes animals aggressive and violent. With hormones you introduce a physiological element into the debate, which strengthens my point even more. Toms, gays, metrosexuals, etc. are small minorities with particular preferences, but they don't contradict the differences in the preferences of the majority of women and men - recognizing that fact is not fostering sexism, it's just reality. Thinking a moment about OP's complaint about meeting at a golf club... isn't that a sexist complaint too? it implies golf is off limits for ladies... I don't see sexism there, just preferences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacChine Posted October 6, 2013 Share Posted October 6, 2013 And hormones are the basis of difference, so how can they be left out of the discussion ? And I strongly disagree with your opinion that homosexuality and men preoccupied with their appearance ( metrosexuals? ) are a small minority. to get back OT Women feel excluded when men make it a sexual atmosphere. And men make it a sexual atmosphere as a matter of course.. Because it's an assumption that fosters sexism. I use to have 1970 Mach 1 that I enjoyed drag racing with, I know a guy who likes opera. What about gay guys and their proclivilties? What is different and is never ever discussed is hormones Testosterone makes animals aggressive and violent. With hormones you introduce a physiological element into the debate, which strengthens my point even more. Toms, gays, metrosexuals, etc. are small minorities with particular preferences, but they don't contradict the differences in the preferences of the majority of women and men - recognizing that fact is not fostering sexism, it's just reality. Thinking a moment about OP's complaint about meeting at a golf club... isn't that a sexist complaint too? it implies golf is off limits for ladies... I don't see sexism there, just preferences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manarak Posted October 6, 2013 Share Posted October 6, 2013 And hormones are the basis of difference, so how can they be left out of the discussion ? And I strongly disagree with your opinion that homosexuality and men preoccupied with their appearance ( metrosexuals? ) are a small minority. to get back OT Women feel excluded when men make it a sexual atmosphere. And men make it a sexual atmosphere as a matter of course.. Hormones are a factor yes, but not THE one and only basis of difference. Yes, many men are preoccupied by their appearance - among which the many narcists that do so well in modern corporate environment - but this doesn't mean that they automatically adopt other interests than the mainstream male. "Women feel excluded when men make it a sexual atmosphere. And men make it a sexual atmosphere as a matter of course..." now that's a sexist point of view coming back to the example of the golf course, can you please describe how men will make it a sexual atmosphere? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheryl Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boo Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 I think this thread has worn out it's usefulness. CLOSED Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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