Gridlocked: The Sad History And Frightening Future Of Bangkok Traffic – Part Two

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Gridlocked: The sad history and frightening future of Bangkok traffic – Part Two

By Shane Danaher and Praj Kiatpongsan

Photo: Zanyasan Tanantpapat

This is the second part of a two-part series on traffic within Bangkok. To read part one, click here.

PART TWO – Dr. Panit Pujinda, a professor of Urban and Regional Planning at Chulalongkorn University, has a tendency to begin his sentences with exclamations when discussing a subject that excites him, and traffic definitely fits that bill.

“See!” he says, pointing to a diagram of Bangkok divided into red-shaded, concentric circles. “[bangkok] traffic moves at only 12-kilometers per hour in the morning peak. But! This number takes into account both inbound and outbound traffic. That means that if you travel inbound you travel much slower.”

He adds that inbound speeds within the city’s center sometimes descend as low as 6 kilometers per hour, only two kilometers per hour faster than walking speed.

Traffic has proven a ripe subject for Panit’s academic career. In addition to publishing widely on the topic of city planning within Bangkok, he has also traveled the region, discussing infrastructure projects with urban planners throughout Southeast Asia.

Panit’s enthusiasm for Bangkok’s infrastructure can seem remarkable when viewed in light of the fact that, to hear him tell it, pursuing an urban planner’s career in Bangkok is about as Sisyphusian a task as one can come by.

Now, as has been the case since the early ‘90s, the city in theory hews to a land use plan that dictates all aspects of its development. The product of collaboration between urban planners, bureaucrats and private interest groups, Bangkok’s land use and transportation plans aim, in the words of the 2nd Transportation Master Plan, to affect “the coordination and integration of all transport modes into a unified system.”

Were these best-laid plans followed to the letter, Bangkok would now play home to 10 rail lines, multiple expressways and a series of development sub-centers meant to push investment (and traffic) out towards the suburbs.

However, the sticky gears of Bangkok’s bureaucratic machine have persistently ground these aspirations to a pulp.

Full story: http://www.coconutsb...affic-part-two/

-- COCONUTS Bangkok 2013-02-07

PART ONE

Gridlocked: The Sad History And Frightening Future Of Bangkok Traffic

http://www.thaivisa....angkok-traffic/

[eTiMaGo]

One just has to play Sim City to realize what a pain traffic management can be

[KhunHehe]

If Thai would rescind the excessive sumptuary taxes on automobiles and other foreign imports, they'd allow citizens easier access to automobiles allowing them to leave Bangkok and work locally. Thai have never truely experienced large scale the freedom of owning an automobile, and they would quickly learn that using wise logistics coupled with freedom of movement makes ownership economical and invaluable.

More congestion if taxes are lowered? Bunk I say to you! More cars, more gas, more taxes, more tolls collected, more businesses. And people would be able to work outside Bangkok. This means more toll roads, more road improvements--instead of artificially suppressing demand with Draconian taxes that benefit...whom?

Has anyone ridden the BTS lately? The more they extend the line and build condos, the more crowded the trains are. And they fill at the fringe stations because these have the least expensive condos and attract the most people.

Freedom of movement on one's own terms is the only way to go.

Edited February 8, 2013 by KhunHehe

[sprq]

If Thai would rescind the excessive sumptuary taxes on automobiles and other foreign imports, they'd allow citizens easier access to automobiles allowing them to leave Bangkok and work locally. Thai have never truely experienced large scale the freedom of owning an automobile, and they would quickly learn that using wise logistics coupled with freedom of movement makes ownership economical and invaluable.

More congestion if taxes are lowered? Bunk I say to you! More cars, more gas, more taxes, more tolls collected, more businesses. And people would be able to work outside Bangkok. This means more toll roads, more road improvements--instead of artificially suppressing demand with Draconian taxes that benefit...whom?

Has anyone ridden the BTS lately? The more they extend the line and build condos, the more crowded the trains are. And they fill at the fringe stations because these have the least expensive condos and attract the most people.

Freedom of movement on one's own terms is the only way to go.

Absolute nonsense! You have not the faintest understanding of efficient transportation policy.

[Thaddeus]

If Thai would rescind the excessive sumptuary taxes on automobiles and other foreign imports, they'd allow citizens easier access to automobiles allowing them to leave Bangkok and work locally. Thai have never truely experienced large scale the freedom of owning an automobile, and they would quickly learn that using wise logistics coupled with freedom of movement makes ownership economical and invaluable.

More congestion if taxes are lowered? Bunk I say to you! More cars, more gas, more taxes, more tolls collected, more businesses. And people would be able to work outside Bangkok. This means more toll roads, more road improvements--instead of artificially suppressing demand with Draconian taxes that benefit...whom?

Has anyone ridden the BTS lately? The more they extend the line and build condos, the more crowded the trains are. And they fill at the fringe stations because these have the least expensive condos and attract the most people.

Freedom of movement on one's own terms is the only way to go.

Absolute nonsense! You have not the faintest understanding of efficient transportation policy.

Agreed.

That's akin to trying to reduce flood-water by diluting it.

[joedee]

If Thai would rescind the excessive sumptuary taxes on automobiles and other foreign imports, they'd allow citizens easier access to automobiles allowing them to leave Bangkok and work locally. Thai have never truely experienced large scale the freedom of owning an automobile, and they would quickly learn that using wise logistics coupled with freedom of movement makes ownership economical and invaluable.

More congestion if taxes are lowered? Bunk I say to you! More cars, more gas, more taxes, more tolls collected, more businesses. And people would be able to work outside Bangkok. This means more toll roads, more road improvements--instead of artificially suppressing demand with Draconian taxes that benefit...whom?

Has anyone ridden the BTS lately? The more they extend the line and build condos, the more crowded the trains are. And they fill at the fringe stations because these have the least expensive condos and attract the most people.

Freedom of movement on one's own terms is the only way to go.

If Thai would rescind the excessive sumptuary taxes on automobiles and other foreign imports, they'd allow citizens easier access to automobiles allowing them to leave Bangkok and work locally. Thai have never truely experienced large scale the freedom of owning an automobile, and they would quickly learn that using wise logistics coupled with freedom of movement makes ownership economical and invaluable.

More congestion if taxes are lowered? Bunk I say to you! More cars, more gas, more taxes, more tolls collected, more businesses. And people would be able to work outside Bangkok. This means more toll roads, more road improvements--instead of artificially suppressing demand with Draconian taxes that benefit...whom?

Has anyone ridden the BTS lately? The more they extend the line and build condos, the more crowded the trains are. And they fill at the fringe stations because these have the least expensive condos and attract the most people.

Freedom of movement on one's own terms is the only way to go.

Its a good job your not involved in the traffic management of Bangkok...(or anywhere for that matter!!!)

[KKvampire]

If Thai would rescind the excessive sumptuary taxes on automobiles and other foreign imports, they'd allow citizens easier access to automobiles allowing them to leave Bangkok and work locally. Thai have never truely experienced large scale the freedom of owning an automobile, and they would quickly learn that using wise logistics coupled with freedom of movement makes ownership economical and invaluable.

More congestion if taxes are lowered? Bunk I say to you! More cars, more gas, more taxes, more tolls collected, more businesses. And people would be able to work outside Bangkok. This means more toll roads, more road improvements--instead of artificially suppressing demand with Draconian taxes that benefit...whom?

Has anyone ridden the BTS lately? The more they extend the line and build condos, the more crowded the trains are. And they fill at the fringe stations because these have the least expensive condos and attract the most people.

Freedom of movement on one's own terms is the only way to go.

Absolute nonsense! You have not the faintest understanding of efficient transportation policy.

Spoken like a true socialist. You are British, no?

And the policies you support."let market forces rule " with transportation policy.aka thai planning will and has cost Bangkok and ultimately the country thousands of millions of baht in business loss

[Greenside]

London and other major cities that have bitten the bullet have seen the benefits to be gained by heavily taxing access to congested areas, ring fencing the proceeds to invest on effective and affordable public transport. Sadly, the kind of long term thinking and political courage required for such a radical approach in BKK puts it (or any other decent solution) completely out of the question (although you'd at least have the taxi operators on board).

[freedom4life]

They need a professor to explain the obvious...anyone from this forum could of explained it and provide solutions to boot.

[Fookhaht]

They need a professor to explain the obvious...anyone from this forum could of explained it and provide solutions to boot.

But that's why they pay the professors the big money: to state the obvious and take the credit.

[HaleySabai]

Back in the early 90's when I lived in BKK the going joke was - why do Thai's like to drive fancy cars ?

because they want a nice place for their kids to grow-up in !

20yrs later I live happily in Chiang Mai and can only amuse what the traffic must be like now

[dapsolapsalai]

More congestion if taxes are lowered? Bunk I say to you!

such scientific reasoning. it must be true.

[thaibeachlovers]

Back in the early 90's when I lived in BKK the going joke was - why do Thai's like to drive fancy cars ?

because they want a nice place for their kids to grow-up in !

20yrs later I live happily in Chiang Mai and can only amuse what the traffic must be like now

Probably just like in C M!

Having been in C M yesterday, I can say that it's impossible after 1600. I could have walked to my destination faster, except it's so hot now.

[rgs2001uk]

For a vision of what Bkk could and should be like, try driving round the city during Songkran.

No street side noodle stalls blocking off whole lanes, no food carts being pushed up the street in the wrong direction, no restaurants paying someone off to block off a lane so the customers can use it as a car park.

Condos should be built with enough parking, negating the need for people having to park in the street.

New moo baans should be built with adequate access roads rather than have whole lanes blocked off with people trying to enter.

[khunken]

If Thai would rescind the excessive sumptuary taxes on automobiles and other foreign imports, they'd allow citizens easier access to automobiles allowing them to leave Bangkok and work locally. Thai have never truely experienced large scale the freedom of owning an automobile, and they would quickly learn that using wise logistics coupled with freedom of movement makes ownership economical and invaluable.

More congestion if taxes are lowered? Bunk I say to you! More cars, more gas, more taxes, more tolls collected, more businesses. And people would be able to work outside Bangkok. This means more toll roads, more road improvements--instead of artificially suppressing demand with Draconian taxes that benefit...whom?

Has anyone ridden the BTS lately? The more they extend the line and build condos, the more crowded the trains are. And they fill at the fringe stations because these have the least expensive condos and attract the most people.

Freedom of movement on one's own terms is the only way to go.

Well, I want to be free to travel by helicopter which would be the only way to get around if this sort of *x**xx£ suggestion ever transpired.

[SteeleJoe]

For a vision of what Bkk could and should be like, try driving round the city during Songkran.

No street side noodle stalls blocking off whole lanes, no food carts being pushed up the street in the wrong direction, no restaurants paying someone off to block off a lane so the customers can use it as a car park.

Condos should be built with enough parking, negating the need for people having to park in the street.

New moo baans should be built with adequate access roads rather than have whole lanes blocked off with people trying to enter.

Where would the roads be?

Metropolitan areas typically have around 25-30% of the land area taken up by roadway. Bangkok? About 8%.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

[rgs2001uk]

For a vision of what Bkk could and should be like, try driving round the city during Songkran.

No street side noodle stalls blocking off whole lanes, no food carts being pushed up the street in the wrong direction, no restaurants paying someone off to block off a lane so the customers can use it as a car park.

Condos should be built with enough parking, negating the need for people having to park in the street.

New moo baans should be built with adequate access roads rather than have whole lanes blocked off with people trying to enter.

Where would the roads be?

Metropolitan areas typically have around 25-30% of the land area taken up by roadway. Bangkok? About 8%.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

The roads are already there, they are just misused.

Example, next time you go to immigration at CW, take a look at the enterance to the CAT building, cars lined up waiting to enter, blocking off a whole lane.

If the security post was moved further back, it would get cars off the street, instead because of where its positioned the cars wanting to enter have to wait in the street, thus interfering with traffic flow.

Take a look at for example the madness thats Fashion Island.

Take a look at lower Suk, turn left from Suk soi 3 onto Suk rd, whole lane blocked off with taxis touting for business.

Opposite the Mall BangKapi, outside Tesco/Lotus, whole lane blocked off, again taxis waiting for customers.

[MagicMax]

Maybe they should follow the UK and introduce a congestion charge. Think of the tea money that will earn!

[Rimmer]

Some off topic posts and quoted replies removed, the topic is about Bangkok traffic not England, British, American or Socialists

[SteeleJoe]

For a vision of what Bkk could and should be like, try driving round the city during Songkran.

No street side noodle stalls blocking off whole lanes, no food carts being pushed up the street in the wrong direction, no restaurants paying someone off to block off a lane so the customers can use it as a car park.

Condos should be built with enough parking, negating the need for people having to park in the street.

New moo baans should be built with adequate access roads rather than have whole lanes blocked off with people trying to enter.

Where would the roads be?

Metropolitan areas typically have around 25-30% of the land area taken up by roadway. Bangkok? About 8%.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

The roads are already there, they are just misused.

Example, next time you go to immigration at CW, take a look at the enterance to the CAT building, cars lined up waiting to enter, blocking off a whole lane.

If the security post was moved further back, it would get cars off the street, instead because of where its positioned the cars wanting to enter have to wait in the street, thus interfering with traffic flow.

Take a look at for example the madness thats Fashion Island.

Take a look at lower Suk, turn left from Suk soi 3 onto Suk rd, whole lane blocked off with taxis touting for business.

Opposite the Mall BangKapi, outside Tesco/Lotus, whole lane blocked off, again taxis waiting for customers.

I see.

Nonetheless, the roads that are there would appear to be insufficient if the percentages I noted are to be considered. And yet, there's no place to put more.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

[Chrisswe]

I don't understand how people's living ln Bangkok accepted this traffic mess. Ok education one thing, effective management another reason. I think effective working time in Bangkok is around 1 hour 30 minits .

[MagicMax]

Skytrain and expressways are the solution for now.

[Kevin1908]

London and other major cities that have bitten the bullet have seen the benefits to be gained by heavily taxing access to congested areas, ring fencing the proceeds to invest on effective and affordable public transport. Sadly, the kind of long term thinking and political courage required for such a radical approach in BKK puts it (or any other decent solution) completely out of the question (although you'd at least have the taxi operators on board).

What benefits. The traffic in London is still very heavy. I can't say that I have noticed any difference. Clearly London is raking in huge amounts of money from the congestion charge so where are all the new initiatives. Well we might get Crossrail in another 5 years which will be very handy if you want to go to Docklands.

[KKvampire]

I don't understand how people's living ln Bangkok accepted this traffic mess. Ok education one thing, effective management another reason. I think effective working time in Bangkok is around 1 hour 30 minits .

Sticking plaster on a major trauma wound

[Amras]

It's the population density in Bangkok that's the issue. It's quiet a bit higher in Bangkok compared to nearly all western major cities. It's even 1,500 per sq/km more dense than London and london faces much the same problem. I'd guess that those estimates of Bangkoks population is under valued too.

http://www.citymayors.com/statistics/largest-cities-density-125.html

There's no easy fix, except build much much more skytrains. There's no way around it (or secondary roads, above existing roads.)

[Tanaka]

If Thai would rescind the excessive sumptuary taxes on automobiles and other foreign imports, they'd allow citizens easier access to automobiles allowing them to leave Bangkok and work locally. Thai have never truely experienced large scale the freedom of owning an automobile, and they would quickly learn that using wise logistics coupled with freedom of movement makes ownership economical and invaluable.

More congestion if taxes are lowered? Bunk I say to you! More cars, more gas, more taxes, more tolls collected, more businesses. And people would be able to work outside Bangkok. This means more toll roads, more road improvements--instead of artificially suppressing demand with Draconian taxes that benefit...whom?

Has anyone ridden the BTS lately? The more they extend the line and build condos, the more crowded the trains are. And they fill at the fringe stations because these have the least expensive condos and attract the most people.

Freedom of movement on one's own terms is the only way to go.

There is an oxymoron here: they would quickly learn

[rattler]

If Thai would rescind the excessive sumptuary taxes on automobiles and other foreign imports, they'd allow citizens easier access to automobiles allowing them to leave Bangkok and work locally. Thai have never truely experienced large scale the freedom of owning an automobile, and they would quickly learn that using wise logistics coupled with freedom of movement makes ownership economical and invaluable.

More congestion if taxes are lowered? Bunk I say to you! More cars, more gas, more taxes, more tolls collected, more businesses. And people would be able to work outside Bangkok. This means more toll roads, more road improvements--instead of artificially suppressing demand with Draconian taxes that benefit...whom?

Has anyone ridden the BTS lately? The more they extend the line and build condos, the more crowded the trains are. And they fill at the fringe stations because these have the least expensive condos and attract the most people.

Freedom of movement on one's own terms is the only way to go.

Absolute nonsense! You have not the faintest understanding of efficient transportation policy.

Population control is the way to go, of course ALL religions will oppose this one, and yes I know about the Chinese thanks.