Thai Immigration Cracks Down On Hotels

[XINLOI]

Although I'm a farang I'm legally here, and the Immigration are already notified every 90 days, of my main home address. So they do already know where I, and hundreds of thousands of others like me, are. Should they ever need to locate me in an emergency.

But if I happen to pop up to Pai or Mae Salong, for a few nights away, the guesthouse is expected to report my presence again, and pay some extra taxes, even though I'm not an overseas-tourist at all ? Never happen ... they think too mut.

But anyway how many GHs & condos will, for an appropriate 'Chinese New Year cultural-gift', be informed that they don't need to report us, after all ? And isn't that perhaps the real reason for this crackdown ?

A thought. The Immigration officials know where the legal farangs are as well as the others. The problem is, is that Thailand does not grasp the concept of computers and what networks can do. They remind me of the VA in the US. The VA (veterans administration), is an organization with three distinct parts, that reside in the SAME building,using the same network and computers, yet do not communticate with each other.

This is why we have a constant paper trail here to do, for the most mundane things. If you have ever gotten a Thai drivers license or a yellow book, you will understand what I mean. No connection between Immigration and DMV but your paper chase is between those two offices. Networking the different bureaus together might stop much of this stupid chase, but then they would lose their tea money too....

[Thai at Heart]

Although I'm a farang I'm legally here, and the Immigration are already notified every 90 days, of my main home address. So they do already know where I, and hundreds of thousands of others like me, are. Should they ever need to locate me in an emergency.

But if I happen to pop up to Pai or Mae Salong, for a few nights away, the guesthouse is expected to report my presence again, and pay some extra taxes, even though I'm not an overseas-tourist at all ? Never happen ... they think too mut.

But anyway how many GHs & condos will, for an appropriate 'Chinese New Year cultural-gift', be informed that they don't need to report us, after all ? And isn't that perhaps the real reason for this crackdown ?

A thought. The Immigration officials know where the legal farangs are as well as the others. The problem is, is that Thailand does not grasp the concept of computers and what networks can do. They remind me of the VA in the US. The VA (veterans administration), is an organization with three distinct parts, that reside in the SAME building,using the same network and computers, yet do not communticate with each other.

This is why we have a constant paper trail here to do, for the most mundane things. If you have ever gotten a Thai drivers license or a yellow book, you will understand what I mean. No connection between Immigration and DMV but your paper chase is between those two offices. Networking the different bureaus together might stop much of this stupid chase, but then they would lose their tea money too....

They don't network it because it would mean they would end up catching Thais much more easily.

[Bagwan]

What a feel good story this is, the bib, worried about tracing travelers, good work boys

.How about doing some tracing in Dubai?

Or even Bang Saen?

[SABloke]

By Coconuts Bangkok

A slew of unregistered tourists on Khaosan Road.

.

Is that the proper collective noun for tourists?

I thought it was either a gaggle or a herd.

.

In Pattaya it's known as a 'rash'

Not an 'infestation' ?

[khaowong1]

Police State. Report the whereabouts of those evil foreigners if you see them. Are there any other countries that do this besides North Korea?

I was thinking the same thing.. here in the US you check into a hotel, they want to see an ID.. Mostly in case you trash the room they know who to charge or sue.. In a lot of smaller hotels, cash is the King.. The only photo ID they want to see is Ben Franklin. The hotels assume if immigration didn't want you in the country you wouldn't be here. If you slipped by them, it's not their problem..

[Nisa]

Police State. Report the whereabouts of those evil foreigners if you see them. Are there any other countries that do this besides North Korea?

I was thinking the same thing.. here in the US you check into a hotel, they want to see an ID.. Mostly in case you trash the room they know who to charge or sue.. In a lot of smaller hotels, cash is the King.. The only photo ID they want to see is Ben Franklin. The hotels assume if immigration didn't want you in the country you wouldn't be here. If you slipped by them, it's not their problem..

The US, UK and Canada (and probably many other countries) have laws about recording guest (ID) information and at least in the US, this information can be checked by the police at anytime. So, maybe they just trust foreigners here as much as they do in their own country.

Edited February 27, 2013 by Nisa

[lemoncake]

Police State. Report the whereabouts of those evil foreigners if you see them. Are there any other countries that do this besides North Korea?

I was thinking the same thing.. here in the US you check into a hotel, they want to see an ID.. Mostly in case you trash the room they know who to charge or sue.. In a lot of smaller hotels, cash is the King.. The only photo ID they want to see is Ben Franklin. The hotels assume if immigration didn't want you in the country you wouldn't be here. If you slipped by them, it's not their problem..

The US, UK and Canada (and probably many other countries) have laws about recording guest (ID) information and at least in the US, this information can be checked by the police at anytime. So, maybe they just foreigners here as much as they do in their own country.

In most countries guests must provide valid ID, however hotels do not need to report the guests to immigration.

Might be different in US or UK, but in Oz hotel does not have to report to immigration.

I can understand the reason for having this law, as it is then easier to locate the guest should anything go wrong.HOWEVER their (Thai immigration) reporting system on line is to complex and unpredictable, it often crashes, passwords not accepted, compatible ONLY with IE.

Then you can spend a few hours updating all the guests and when its time to submit, system crash and all the info is gone.

When you contact immigration technical department, no one seems to have a clue on what is happening or what to do.

They should first employ skilled programmers, make the reporting fast and easy and perhaps more hotels would follow the law and make the reports

[bangon04]

I if I ring up lady up country she goes over and books hotel for me 500 baht a night,walk in price about 1200 baht I think.I pay her the 5000,10 nights when I get there.Never been about for my passport etc they just give the key to room am I doing anything wrong

No, you are not....and saving money is an added bonus.

,

Just register the room in the gf name. Problem solved.

Someone has already asked the very obvious question regarding what happens to all the visitors (not residents) who rent condos, rooms, apartments for houses for long term stays. or who stay with family members of acquaintances for a few nights. If you have a condo in bngkok and a condo in chiangmai and you spend the weekdays in one and the weekends in the other each week, just think how much more paperwork you could create.............

[Tomtomtom69]

Surely, nearly every hotel has a computerised reservation system which would include all guest's personal details, ie. name, address, passport number etc.

It should be a simple process to provided required information at any time.

Nope - many rural hotels don't ask for ID from any guests, local or foreign. They simply want your cash - once you pay you get your room key. It's fast, efficient and convenient. I hope it stays that way but for rural hotels I'm pretty sure it will.

At all other hotels that demand ID (which would be like practically every hotel in the cities and larger towns) I always check-in with my Thai driver's license and never my passport (even if I have it on me).

[kriswillems]

My wife was fined 800B, because she didn't report to immigration within 24 hours after I arrived in the country that I stayed in our house (although I had already filled my address in on the arrival card and it's on every 90 day report and on the visa extention application form).

This law is a joke. It has only one purpose : extorting money (fines).

Edited February 27, 2013 by kriswillems

[diehard60]

What a feel good story this is, the bib, worried about tracing travelers, good work boys

.How about doing some tracing in Dubai?

Why would the BiB want to do that? They have enough work right here.

[Suroo]

By Coconuts BangkokA slew of unregistered tourists on Khaosan Road.

.Is that the proper collective noun for tourists?I thought it was either a gaggle or a herd..

Given the frequent horizontal position of the farang on Cosan Rd I think "fall" is better as in "fall of woodcock".

[alstaxi]

I wonder how long it would take the plods to trace a foreign, if his or her family phoned up and said they had to contact them urgently.

How long is a piece of string.

[Tatsujin]

I wonder how long it would take the plods to trace a foreign, if his or her family phoned up and said they had to contact them urgently.

How long is a piece of string.

Would be quicker and easier to post a picture and info on here and ask all the foreigners if they've seen someone . . .

[Fookhaht]

Been here 10 years. This is hotel-guest-registration crackdown #4. Yet, nothing changes.

[asiaexpat]

Why is this news. Reporting alien guests by hotels has been a standard practice throughout the world for many years. I suspect non-reporting is also practiced worldwide if income is impacted. The EU may have reduced this somewhat, but most countries try to tack aliens.

[asiaexpat]

How about all the Farangs that holiday in Condo blocks and villas?

Many condo owners in Jomtien, Pratumnak, Naklua & Pattaya, for instance, rent their condo's...Many purchase multiple condo's for this purpose.

Some are held in Foreign name others under Company name.

Most visitors go unreported..

The issue is about hotels and guest houses that don't report. Condo owners and villa owners aren't subject to the same regulations, they don't pay hotel tax.

Actually, home owners of any sort must report alien guests under the same law. Just because the law is ignored by the vast majority of private home owners does not mean they are exempt.

[laislica]

How about all the Farangs that holiday in Condo blocks and villas?

Many condo owners in Jomtien, Pratumnak, Naklua & Pattaya, for instance, rent their condo's...Many purchase multiple condo's for this purpose.

Some are held in Foreign name others under Company name.

Most visitors go unreported..

The issue is about hotels and guest houses that don't report. Condo owners and villa owners aren't subject to the same regulations, they don't pay hotel tax.

Actually, home owners of any sort must report alien guests under the same law. Just because the law is ignored by the vast majority of private home owners does not mean they are exempt.

Indeed, but as the great man said:

Nota lota people know that!

[asiasurfer]

You'd think they can do all that by simply starting from the momet the tourist is

entering Thailand at the airport or other entry points, why wait for the hotels

to forward lists of guests? and what about people entering the kingdom and

do not go to a hotel?? like, Duh...

>How about all the Farangs that holiday in Condo blocks and villas?

Many condo owners in Jomtien, Pratumnak, Naklua & Pattaya, for instance, rent their condo's...Many purchase multiple condo's for this purpose.

Some are held in Foreign name others under Company name.

Most visitors go unreported..

Actually private house owners must report to immigrations or the local police if a foreigner stays there within 24 hrs.

Download form here.

http://www.immigration.go.th/nov2004/download/tm30.doc

Reporting my granny to stay in my own home?!

<deleted>?????

[laislica]

You'd think they can do all that by simply starting from the momet the tourist is

entering Thailand at the airport or other entry points, why wait for the hotels

to forward lists of guests? and what about people entering the kingdom and

do not go to a hotel?? like, Duh...

>How about all the Farangs that holiday in Condo blocks and villas?

Many condo owners in Jomtien, Pratumnak, Naklua & Pattaya, for instance, rent their condo's...Many purchase multiple condo's for this purpose.

Some are held in Foreign name others under Company name.

Most visitors go unreported..

trong>

Actually private house owners must report to immigrations or the local police if a foreigner stays there within 24 hrs.

Download form here.

http://www.immigration.go.th/nov2004/download/tm30.doc

Reporting my granny to stay in my own home?!

<deleted>?????

Er, well, it's the law.......

[slipperx]

Nothing to do with tax - this is a police initiative doing what they do best by using an archaic broken system of law with which it is nigh impossible to comply in order to provide them with a face saving reason for their corrupt 'help'. It must be obvious to even the most stupid that the police nor immigration hav either the will or the way to process the whereabouts of every traveller every day. It is just pure nonsense - they have trouble doing it for the farcical 90 day reporting for the much smaller number of people staying here. It is brazen police corruption and I detest it.

[lockman]

So ya mean if a friend and his family come visit and spend the night I have to report that? Someone who is NOT a tourist but lives here?

[PoodMaiDai]

must.... know... where... every... farang... is... at... all... times!!!!!!!!!!!!!

This place needs to get a grip.

How long until we are randomly stopped on the streets for our passport and visa? How long until random room and home inspections? How long before we get a curfew?

[Ricardo]

Of course Immigration needs to know, where we all are at every moment, I mean we might be smugglers-of-furbies, bent on destroying the country !

But in this case, when my passport is inspected at a police check-point stopping my overnight-bus, why do they never write down my details for passing to their Immigration-Police colleagues ? Perhaps scope for another crackdown, amongst their own, here ?

[Buchholz]

So ya mean if a friend and his family come visit and spend the night I have to report that? Someone who is NOT a tourist but lives here?

.

I believe in that situation it is required for your friend to file a TM 28, and not necessarily for you to file a TM 30.

Either way, someone needs to be filing something.

Such suspicious actions like a friend's visitation can not just simply pass by without proper monitoring and documentation.

.

On the subject of personal individual responsibility, it's worth noting that in addition to the aforementioned hotels, etc. using TM.30's, the individual has the TM.28 to comply with.

Form for Aliens to Notify Their Change of Address or Their Stay in the Province over 24 Hours (TM.28)

Wonder when the "crackdown" for that one is coming.

Edited March 1, 2013 by Buchholz

[laislica]

must.... know... where... every... farang... is... at... all... times!!!!!!!!!!!!!

This place needs to get a grip.

How long until we are randomly stopped on the streets for our passport and visa? How long until random room and home inspections? How long before we get a curfew?

What, do you mean like it used to be in Taiwan 45 years ago?

Edited March 1, 2013 by laislica

[Nisa]

How does reporting where foreigners stay have anything to do with taxes? Do they also need to report what the foreigner pays per day? Good or bad this is simply a law designed to "attempt" keep track of foreigners in the country. Something I would best many here wished could be accomplished in their own country.

[Thai at Heart]

How does reporting where foreigners stay have anything to do with taxes? Do they also need to report what the foreigner pays per day? Good or bad this is simply a law designed to "attempt" keep track of foreigners in the country. Something I would best many here wished could be accomplished in their own country.

Many resorts have local tax levied on occupied roomd. Undereport occupancy, pay less tax.

[Time Traveller]

Police State. Report the whereabouts of those evil foreigners if you see them. Are there any other countries that do this besides North Korea?

I was thinking the same thing.. here in the US you check into a hotel, they want to see an ID.. Mostly in case you trash the room they know who to charge or sue.. In a lot of smaller hotels, cash is the King.. The only photo ID they want to see is Ben Franklin. The hotels assume if immigration didn't want you in the country you wouldn't be here. If you slipped by them, it's not their problem..

The US, UK and Canada (and probably many other countries) have laws about recording guest (ID) information and at least in the US, this information can be checked by the police at anytime. So, maybe they just foreigners here as much as they do in their own country.

In most countries guests must provide valid ID, however hotels do not need to report the guests to immigration.

Might be different in US or UK, but in Oz hotel does not have to report to immigration.

I can understand the reason for having this law, as it is then easier to locate the guest should anything go wrong.HOWEVER their (Thai immigration) reporting system on line is to complex and unpredictable, it often crashes, passwords not accepted, compatible ONLY with IE.

Then you can spend a few hours updating all the guests and when its time to submit, system crash and all the info is gone.

When you contact immigration technical department, no one seems to have a clue on what is happening or what to do.

They should first employ skilled programmers, make the reporting fast and easy and perhaps more hotels would follow the law and make the reports

The law is not used to locate people when something goes wrong as you say. It's used to fine people for non-compliance. That's it's only purpose. Why else would they fine people for 1 day late in reporting?

Edited March 1, 2013 by Time Traveller

[judokrab]

To Thai staff working in Immigration etc, the attraction to paperwork is similar to the attraction of flies to a shit.

It seems to me that the main attraction is the joy of using the rubber stamps.