"facts" About Becoming A Thai Citizen

[sbk]

I was told essentially the same thing by the US Embassy - you can renounce your citizenship but you can always ask for it back too.

Please be aware that to apply in Bangkok you must have your tabien ban in Bangkok

[Arkady]

Thanks to all that have posted so far on this thread. I have got some useful info from it. OM85: I would be interested to know how your application goes. Please post to say if you application was accepted. I will be going to the Special Branch next week to ask the same questions you asked. Lets see if I get the same answers. Its interesting to note that on the SB website it states on one document that the fee is 5,000 Baht but on another "Fees" section it states 10,000 Baht.

Doc 1: ค่าธรรมเนียมในการยื่นคาขอ ฯ มาชาระด้วย จานวน 5,000.-บาท

Doc 2: ค่าธรรมเนียม (๑) คาขอแปลงสัญชาติเป็นไทย ครั้งละ ๑๐,๐๐๐ บาท

I'm not suprised by this and I'm not going to get frustrated as I know the only thing that is consistent with government offices is their inconsistency. Just enjoy the ride.

Isn't the first the application fee and the second the fee you pay if successful? We certainly paid the 5,000 and are expecting to pay somethign around 10K for when my wife does get naturalised...

In terms of frustration, so long as they think you are eligible, the folks down at special branch are rather helpful.

The fees are governed by the Nationality Act which permits a fee of B10,000 on application and a further fee of B1,000 for the naturalisation certificate, if approved.

I paid an application fee of B5,000 and I am pretty that is still the going rate. The law sets the maximum fee that can be charged but it is up to the ministry to set fees within that maximum guideline.

Since Conquest didn't specify which documents he was quoting from SB's website, it is hard to comment in more detail.

[Time Traveller]

Thanks Beano2274. Some good info there which seems to agree with what I "think" I know to be correct. TommoPhysicist: I had never heard of the yellow book until now.(I've only just started considering Thai Nationality as I never thought I'd be here this long). I wonder if they will accept Utility Billls and Krung Thai Bank Credit Card bills in my name? I've lived at the same Condo for over seven years. I could get a letter from the Condominium Juridical Department confirming this. It may help. At least I now know about the yellow book!

They won't move on yellow book ...... you gotta have it for 3 years.

What if you recently moved? Must you be at the same address for 3 years?

[ubonjoe]

Moving is not a problem but you would have to get a new yellow book for that address and then show both house books.

[Om85]

Thanks to all that have posted so far on this thread. I have got some useful info from it. OM85: I would be interested to know how your application goes. Please post to say if you application was accepted. I will be going to the Special Branch next week to ask the same questions you asked. Lets see if I get the same answers. Its interesting to note that on the SB website it states on one document that the fee is 5,000 Baht but on another "Fees" section it states 10,000 Baht.

Doc 1: ค่าธรรมเนียมในการยื่นคาขอ ฯ มาชาระด้วย จานวน 5,000.-บาท

Doc 2: ค่าธรรมเนียม (๑) คาขอแปลงสัญชาติเป็นไทย ครั้งละ ๑๐,๐๐๐ บาท

I'm not suprised by this and I'm not going to get frustrated as I know the only thing that is consistent with government offices is their inconsistency. Just enjoy the ride.

Isn't the first the application fee and the second the fee you pay if successful? We certainly paid the 5,000 and are expecting to pay somethign around 10K for when my wife does get naturalised...

In terms of frustration, so long as they think you are eligible, the folks down at special branch are rather helpful.

The fees are governed by the Nationality Act which permits a fee of B10,000 on application and a further fee of B1,000 for the naturalisation certificate, if approved.

I paid an application fee of B5,000 and I am pretty that is still the going rate. The law sets the maximum fee that can be charged but it is up to the ministry to set fees within that maximum guideline.

Since Conquest didn't specify which documents he was quoting from SB's website, it is hard to comment in more detail.

Sure, conquest, I'll let you, regarding the fees I dont know much about it, but I will let you know after I submitmy application, in my opinion the fee is not much important I gladdly would pay it

[bkkfoxi]

I found this link on the Thai Special Branch website which gives all the information on how to apply for Thai Nationality including all the forms needed to apply (ready to download on pdf) http://www.sbpolice.go.th/page-service1.php

There is one statement that worries me a bit:

17. หนังสือรับรองของผู้ยื่นคาขอ ฯ ที่แสดงเจตนาจะสละสัญชาติเดิมจากสถานทูตหรือสถานกงสุลของประเทศที่ตนมีสัญชาติและตั้งอยู่ในประเทศไทย เมื่อได้รับอนุญาตให้แปลงสัญชาติเป็นไทย

17. Embassy certified affidavit of the applicant's intention to renounce their nationality once granted citizenship to Thailand.

I'm not too sure that I would want to actually renounce my British Nationality. I've intended to do many things in my life but not actually done them. Perhaps this could be just another thing that I had the intention to do but did not??

Hi I am Chris and started the post http://www.thaivisa....ng-for-thai-pr/ for the sake of doing exactly what you are doing, in fact seems we are both in the same position if you like send me a PM and I will give you a call and we can compare notes? I am near the stage of submitting my near 1.5 Inch pile of documents....

Cheers

Chris

[bkkfoxi]

I found this link on the Thai Special Branch website which gives all the information on how to apply for Thai Nationality including all the forms needed to apply (ready to download on pdf) http://www.sbpolice.go.th/page-service1.php

There is one statement that worries me a bit:

17. หนังสือรับรองของผู้ยื่นคาขอ ฯ ที่แสดงเจตนาจะสละสัญชาติเดิมจากสถานทูตหรือสถานกงสุลของประเทศที่ตนมีสัญชาติและตั้งอยู่ในประเทศไทย เมื่อได้รับอนุญาตให้แปลงสัญชาติเป็นไทย

17. Embassy certified affidavit of the applicant's intention to renounce their nationality once granted citizenship to Thailand.

I'm not too sure that I would want to actually renounce my British Nationality. I've intended to do many things in my life but not actually done them. Perhaps this could be just another thing that I had the intention to do but did not??

Hi I am Chris and started the post http://www.thaivisa....ng-for-thai-pr/ for the sake of doing exactly what you are doing, in fact seems we are both in the same position if you like send me a PM and I will give you a call and we can compare notes? I am near the stage of submitting my near 1.5 Inch pile of documents....

Cheers

Chris

.... I also have been to the BE to do this document and like you say it is just an intent as far as I know nobody has ever had to follow it throu...

[3 year]

Other than to buy land (which you can do with a company, of course) why on earth would you want to go through all that ballache to gain Thai citizsenship?

[lopburi3]

Why would you not if intending to live here for a lifetime? Many of us never had or will have that choice but those that do it would seem the logical path to take - much more advantageous than PR process in my opinion and really not harder it seems.

[Arkady]

Thanks Beano2274. Some good info there which seems to agree with what I "think" I know to be correct. TommoPhysicist: I had never heard of the yellow book until now.(I've only just started considering Thai Nationality as I never thought I'd be here this long). I wonder if they will accept Utility Billls and Krung Thai Bank Credit Card bills in my name? I've lived at the same Condo for over seven years. I could get a letter from the Condominium Juridical Department confirming this. It may help. At least I now know about the yellow book!

They won't move on yellow book ...... you gotta have it for 3 years.

What if you recently moved? Must you be at the same address for 3 years?

I have no idea where this notion of having to be in a yellow tabien baan for 3 years came from. It is not in the MoI guidelines and is simply not true. If you apply based on marriage to a Thai, you need to be in yellow book as evidence that you are resident in Thailand. That's all and you can apply the next day, if you are otherwise qualified. The time limits apply to how long your marriage to your Thai spouse has been registered - 3 years with no children or 1 year, if you have Thai offspring together. For those who are not married to a Thai, they need 5 years of permanent residence, i.e. 5 years in a tabien baan.

All males, whether married to Thais or not, need 3 years' of tax receipts and work permits. Women married to Thais don't need to show evidence of a profession or tax payments because they are supposed to be housewives. LoL. Their Thai hubbies have to show evidence of income instead but it is only about 15k baht a month - probably not enough to support a farang wife but never mind.

Edited March 7, 2013 by Arkady

[Arkady]

Other than to buy land (which you can do with a company, of course) why on earth would you want to go through all that ballache to gain Thai citizsenship?

Have you tried buying land lately through a company that has foreign shareholders or directors or even a whiff of a suspicion that foreigners may be involved or just a Thai director who can't explain to the Land Dept officials why he is investing all his company's capital in a seaside villa with an infinity pool? I think you are a bit out of date on that one. Since 2006 this loophole has been tightened up and is now effectively closed. Now they are planning to investigate these "man of straw" foreign nominee companies.

Of course, if you are not planning to retire in Thailand, it would probably not be worth the hassle to apply for citizenship. But, if you are, why would you want the hassle of applying for visa extensions every year and never knowing when they are going to change the rules and make it harder to qualify, remembering of course that they don't care if you have a Thai family or not. If you are a temporary resident, you have no right to stay long term and, If you no longer make the cut, you go. Simple as that.

Actually it is not a burdensome process and the fees are very low. PR is much more burdensome and more expensive. The main problem with the citizenship process is simply the frustration of the waiting and the lack of transparency. But, if you are indifferent as to whether you get it or not, that should not be a problem.

[3 year]

Why would you not if intending to live here for a lifetime? Many of us never had or will have that choice but those that do it would seem the logical path to take - much more advantageous than PR process in my opinion and really not harder it seems.

I intend to be in Thailand for a lifetime yet I still no real advantage to all the ballache when a visa will suffice.

[3 year]

Other than to buy land (which you can do with a company, of course) why on earth would you want to go through all that ballache to gain Thai citizsenship?

Have you tried buying land lately through a company that has foreign shareholders or directors or even a whiff of a suspicion that foreigners may be involved or just a Thai director who can't explain to the Land Dept officials why he is investing all his company's capital in a seaside villa with an infinity pool? I think you are a bit out of date on that one. Since 2006 this loophole has been tightened up and is now effectively closed. Now they are planning to investigate these "man of straw" foreign nominee companies.

NO, I have not tried but I have been married to my wife for nearly a lifetime and am comfortable with her owning our home in Thailand. Afterall, ive built what i have with her.

Of course, if you are not planning to retire in Thailand, it would probably not be worth the hassle to apply for citizenship. But, if you are, why would you want the hassle of applying for visa extensions every year and never knowing when they are going to change the rules and make it harder to qualify, remembering of course that they don't care if you have a Thai family or not. If you are a temporary resident, you have no right to stay long term and, If you no longer make the cut, you go. Simple as that.

Ah, they arent going to change the rules - and if they do it will only effect those living from hand to mouth.

Actually it is not a burdensome process and the fees are very low. PR is much more burdensome and more expensive. The main problem with the citizenship process is simply the frustration of the waiting and the lack of transparency. But, if you are indifferent as to whether you get it or not, that should not be a problem.

So few do get it - why even bother with all that nonsense?

[samran]

Why would you not if intending to live here for a lifetime? Many of us never had or will have that choice but those that do it would seem the logical path to take - much more advantageous than PR process in my opinion and really not harder it seems.

I intend to be in Thailand for a lifetime yet I still no real advantage to all the ballache when a visa will suffice.

Basically cause it isn't hard, you just submit the paperwork they need (house reg, marriage cert, income tax history etc) and they fill in the forms. A day of your time and then simply a waiting game.

So few get it as so few either qualify for it, or as in your case, seem to want it. Others yet seem to think that it is only for a select few with uber connections. For the rest of us, showing a bit of paperwork which in the main you already have and taking half a morning out at special branch isn't a hardship.

Edited March 7, 2013 by samran

[longway]

I have a couple of questions on this topic. Its been very informative so far.

1. How stringent are the rules on being fluent in Thai? Especially the written aspect. How do you prove it? I have at least 3 years before I can apply, my Thai is reasonable already, but I have never put in any effort to learning to write in Thai; spelling is a nightmare and I could not see the benefit, until now perhaps.

2. I work offshore, so am out of the country about 6 months a year; 4-6 weeks at a time. Is there any minimum time I must spend in Thailand in any given year to qualify? I plan on getting a work permit and pay Thai tax based on a company I will open shortly.

I cant access the special branch website for some reason.

[TommoPhysicist]

I have a couple of questions on this topic. Its been very informative so far.

1. How stringent are the rules on being fluent in Thai? Especially the written aspect. How do you prove it? I have at least 3 years before I can apply, my Thai is reasonable already, but I have never put in any effort to learning to write in Thai; spelling is a nightmare and I could not see the benefit, until now perhaps.

2. I work offshore, so am out of the country about 6 months a year; 4-6 weeks at a time. Is there any minimum time I must spend in Thailand in any given year to qualify? I plan on getting a work permit and pay Thai tax based on a company I will open shortly.

I cant access the special branch website for some reason.

There is no requirement to speak Thai for those who are married to a Thai.

Earning a pile of money gets you more points than speaking Thai.

You need to earn the money in Thailand and have a Thai work permit, I doubt any offshore workers would qualify.

[Mario2008]

1. You don't need to really write THai. But interviews and such will be in Thai, so being able to speak Thai is very important or you will make a poor impression even when you are exempt from Thai language qualifications because of being married to a Thai.

2. You don't need to be a minmum number of months per year in Thailand, but must be on continues extensions of stay and be working with a work permit in Thailand.

[3 year]

Why would you not if intending to live here for a lifetime? Many of us never had or will have that choice but those that do it would seem the logical path to take - much more advantageous than PR process in my opinion and really not harder it seems.

I intend to be in Thailand for a lifetime yet I still no real advantage to all the ballache when a visa will suffice.

Basically cause it isn't hard, you just submit the paperwork they need (house reg, marriage cert, income tax history etc) and they fill in the forms. A day of your time and then simply a waiting game.

So few get it as so few either qualify for it, or as in your case, seem to want it. Others yet seem to think that it is only for a select few with uber connections. For the rest of us, showing a bit of paperwork which in the main you already have and taking half a morning out at special branch isn't a hardship.

Still doesnt answer the question as to why bother.

Ultimately what use does the nationality of 3rd world country really amount to?

[Mario2008]

flame removed.

[Dork]

Why would you not if intending to live here for a lifetime? Many of us never had or will have that choice but those that do it would seem the logical path to take - much more advantageous than PR process in my opinion and really not harder it seems.

I intend to be in Thailand for a lifetime yet I still no real advantage to all the ballache when a visa will suffice.

Basically cause it isn't hard, you just submit the paperwork they need (house reg, marriage cert, income tax history etc) and they fill in the forms. A day of your time and then simply a waiting game.

So few get it as so few either qualify for it, or as in your case, seem to want it. Others yet seem to think that it is only for a select few with uber connections. For the rest of us, showing a bit of paperwork which in the main you already have and taking half a morning out at special branch isn't a hardship.

Still doesnt answer the question as to why bother.

Ultimately what use does the nationality of 3rd world country really amount to?

At least one use is that it would save you the ballache of applying for a 3 year visa that you're not going to get.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/623924-3-year-multiple-entry-visa/

[samran]

Why would you not if intending to live here for a lifetime? Many of us never had or will have that choice but those that do it would seem the logical path to take - much more advantageous than PR process in my opinion and really not harder it seems.

I intend to be in Thailand for a lifetime yet I still no real advantage to all the ballache when a visa will suffice.

Basically cause it isn't hard, you just submit the paperwork they need (house reg, marriage cert, income tax history etc) and they fill in the forms. A day of your time and then simply a waiting game.

So few get it as so few either qualify for it, or as in your case, seem to want it. Others yet seem to think that it is only for a select few with uber connections. For the rest of us, showing a bit of paperwork which in the main you already have and taking half a morning out at special branch isn't a hardship.

Still doesnt answer the question as to why bother.

Ultimately what use does the nationality of 3rd world country really amount to?

I get to drive a Tuk-tuk without the need of a work permit and sit on corners yelling out 'hey mister - you wan gran palat tour? 30 baht'. Slumming it with my other third world buddies I guess.

[nontabury]

Why would you not if intending to live here for a lifetime? Many of us never had or will have that choice but those that do it would seem the logical path to take - much more advantageous than PR process in my opinion and really not harder it seems.

I intend to be in Thailand for a lifetime yet I still no real advantage to all the ballache when a visa will suffice.

Basically cause it isn't hard, you just submit the paperwork they need (house reg, marriage cert, income tax history etc) and they fill in the forms. A day of your time and then simply a waiting game.

So few get it as so few either qualify for it, or as in your case, seem to want it. Others yet seem to think that it is only for a select few with uber connections. For the rest of us, showing a bit of paperwork which in the main you already have and taking half a morning out at special branch isn't a hardship.

A few years ago you said I should be banned from TV because I stated that only a handful of farangs are granted Thai passports each year,you disputed my statement,but could not prove me wrong.You then went on to tell us that your wife had applied for Thai citizenship a few years earlier,can you now inform us that your wife has finally received official notification

That her application has been successful.

[Arkady]

3 year seems to lack the imagination to see why being a citizen of his adopted homeland not subject to any immigration restrictions and able to work and own a business and land freely might be an advantage - all for a very modest fee and a moderate amount of effort.

I have been ridiculed many times for applying for applying for citizenship and before that for PR. Later several of the detractors became unemployed and regretted they had to scramble for visas to stay in the country. Then it took them them 5 years to get their PR when they finally took the plunge, whereas mine took less than a year. I have never regretted getting PR when it was easier and I am sure I will have no regrets when I eventually obtain my citizenship. I have no doubt that citizenship will get harder to obtain in future, since there must be many officials who are unhappy that the 2008 Act made it so easy for males with Thai wives.

Anyway. If you want it, don't apply. Each to his own.

Edited March 8, 2013 by Arkady

[Arkady]

I have a couple of questions on this topic. Its been very informative so far.

1. How stringent are the rules on being fluent in Thai? Especially the written aspect. How do you prove it? I have at least 3 years before I can apply, my Thai is reasonable already, but I have never put in any effort to learning to write in Thai; spelling is a nightmare and I could not see the benefit, until now perhaps.

2. I work offshore, so am out of the country about 6 months a year; 4-6 weeks at a time. Is there any minimum time I must spend in Thailand in any given year to qualify? I plan on getting a work permit and pay Thai tax based on a company I will open shortly.

I cant access the special branch website for some reason.

There is no requirement to speak Thai for those who are married to a Thai.

Earning a pile of money gets you more points than speaking Thai.

You need to earn the money in Thailand and have a Thai work permit, I doubt any offshore workers would qualify.

To clarify the language requirement. The 2008 Nationality Act provides exemptions to men married to Thais from the requirement to have knowledge of the Thai language and the requirement for 5 years' residence in the Kingdom (PR).

As you know, in Thailand's legal system acts of parliament always have some wording like "subject to relevant ministerial regulations" which allows the ministry responsible for that law to flesh it out with regulations that don't need to go before parliament. They are just signed by the minister which gives the government and bureaucrats flexibility to amend the way laws are implemented at short notice.

The ministerial regulations interpret the exemption from knowledge of the Thai language in a blindingly simple way, i.e. you don't have to sing the National and Royal Anthems. Special Branch is also not required to certify that you can speak and understand the Thai language. However, you still have to take the Thai language tests and the general knowledge test that is in Thai but the reading and writing tests are optional, even if you don't have a Thai wife, as long as you are willing to give up the points for that part. If you need more points, or just for the hell of it, you can sing the songs at Special Branch, even if you have a Thai wife but the MoI won't let you sing in that case. Everything else is the same for those with and without Thai wives. All interviews at Special Branch and the MoI are conducted in Thai and you need to be able to write your name in Thai.

If you can only communicate very poorly in Thai or not at all, you run a high risk of rejection after the MoI interview on the very reasonable grounds of inability/ unwillingness to assimilate into Thai society. I think this happens rarely because most people won't dare apply, if they don't think they can get through the interviews. However, abject failure in singing the songs for those who have to sing, is a not uncommon ground for rejection. So the exemption is really worth something. I believe you can reapply but that would add years to the process.

Edited March 8, 2013 by Arkady

[samran]

Why would you not if intending to live here for a lifetime? Many of us never had or will have that choice but those that do it would seem the logical path to take - much more advantageous than PR process in my opinion and really not harder it seems.

I intend to be in Thailand for a lifetime yet I still no real advantage to all the ballache when a visa will suffice.

Basically cause it isn't hard, you just submit the paperwork they need (house reg, marriage cert, income tax history etc) and they fill in the forms. A day of your time and then simply a waiting game.

So few get it as so few either qualify for it, or as in your case, seem to want it. Others yet seem to think that it is only for a select few with uber connections. For the rest of us, showing a bit of paperwork which in the main you already have and taking half a morning out at special branch isn't a hardship.

A few years ago you said I should be banned from TV because I stated that only a handful of farangs are granted Thai passports each year,you disputed my statement,but could not prove me wrong.You then went on to tell us that your wife had applied for Thai citizenship a few years earlier,can you now inform us that your wife has finally received official notification

That her application has been successful.

Can't remember the former, so I'd appriciate a link to where I said you should be banned. I don't think I've ever said lots of farangs get Thai citizenship on an annual basis, but I've always said there are plenty of farang's with Thai passports about. You just don't notice them as they hide in plain sight. I know around half a dozen people who do have Thai passports and are of European extraction (and have met a few more), and my humourous line is that I don't even get out very much.

So I'd appriciate a link and if a mea culpa is in order, you'll find me willing to give one.

As for my wife, we've had her application on hold for about 2 years now. We were living back in Australia due to long illness in my family and helping care for that family member, while I commuted backwards and forwards (and currently still do spending more than half my year in Thailand). The application was put on hold as my wife was not able to attend the final interview with the MOI panel on such short notice (and they only usually give you a couple of days notice...).

We sent a letter to Special Branch informing of our circumstances, and they suggested that we not put the appication back in process as we would likely be called up for interviews quite quickly (within a month or two). So we are planning to move back permaently mid year and we'll get the application back through the sausage maker then.

All I can tell you is what the SB told me, and that was if we hadn't put it on hold, my wife would have had her Thai passport by now. Which would have equated to about 3 years for processing.

Edited March 8, 2013 by samran

[longway]

I have a couple of questions on this topic. Its been very informative so far.

1. How stringent are the rules on being fluent in Thai? Especially the written aspect. How do you prove it? I have at least 3 years before I can apply, my Thai is reasonable already, but I have never put in any effort to learning to write in Thai; spelling is a nightmare and I could not see the benefit, until now perhaps.

2. I work offshore, so am out of the country about 6 months a year; 4-6 weeks at a time. Is there any minimum time I must spend in Thailand in any given year to qualify? I plan on getting a work permit and pay Thai tax based on a company I will open shortly.

I cant access the special branch website for some reason.

There is no requirement to speak Thai for those who are married to a Thai.

Earning a pile of money gets you more points than speaking Thai.

You need to earn the money in Thailand and have a Thai work permit, I doubt any offshore workers would qualify.

To clarify the language requirement. The 2008 Nationality Act provides exemptions to men married to Thais from the requirement to have knowledge of the Thai language and the requirement for 5 years' residence in the Kingdom (PR).

As you know, in Thailand's legal system acts of parliament always have some wording like "subject to relevant ministerial regulations" which allows the ministry responsible for that law to flesh it out with regulations that don't need to go before parliament. They are just signed by the minister which gives the government and bureaucrats flexibility to amend the way laws are implemented at short notice.

The ministerial regulations interpret the exemption from knowledge of the Thai language in a blindingly simple way, i.e. you don't have to sing the National and Royal Anthems. Special Branch is also not required to certify that you can speak and understand the Thai language. However, you still have to take the Thai language tests and the general knowledge test that is in Thai but the reading and writing tests are optional, even if you don't have a Thai wife, as long as you are willing to give up the points for that part. If you need more points, or just for the hell of it, you can sing the songs at Special Branch, even if you have a Thai wife but the MoI won't let you sing in that case. Everything else is the same for those with and without Thai wives. All interviews at Special Branch and the MoI are conducted in Thai and you need to be able to write your name in Thai.

If you can only communicate very poorly in Thai or not at all, you run a high risk of rejection after the MoI interview on the very reasonable grounds of inability/ unwillingness to assimilate into Thai society. I think this happens rarely because most people won't dare apply, if they don't think they can get through the interviews. However, abject failure in singing the songs for those who have to sing, is a not uncommon ground for rejection. So the exemption is really worth something. I believe you can reapply but that would add years to the process.

Great stuff. Thanks for that, and the other posters who also contributed. So basically if I want to maximise my points, then good written Thai has some benefit, and high level speaking and listening skills are, for practical purposes, essential.

I was not even aware that there was a point system or that PR was not a requirement for those married to thai women. It doesn't look as hard as I thought it would be. Its been a very informative thread.

[Time Traveller]

Why would you not if intending to live here for a lifetime? Many of us never had or will have that choice but those that do it would seem the logical path to take - much more advantageous than PR process in my opinion and really not harder it seems.

I intend to be in Thailand for a lifetime yet I still no real advantage to all the ballache when a visa will suffice.

Basically cause it isn't hard, you just submit the paperwork they need (house reg, marriage cert, income tax history etc) and they fill in the forms. A day of your time and then simply a waiting game.

So few get it as so few either qualify for it, or as in your case, seem to want it. Others yet seem to think that it is only for a select few with uber connections. For the rest of us, showing a bit of paperwork which in the main you already have and taking half a morning out at special branch isn't a hardship.

Not necessarily. The application process has no time limit nor transparency or grounds for appeal.

It's not simply a matter of submitting your documents then you're in the queue. You have to have documents prepared the way they want it go back and forth countless times between different (including foreign) bureaucracies - other posters here have mentioned things which seem to be unacceptable if documents do not match exactly with other required documents. Also obtaining witnesses and having their id's recorded and interviewed and countless pictures and singing, dancing, prostrating....well maybe not the dancing!

Then you find changing company or address becomes a problem. Sure it's easy for the simple applicant where someone just earns a salary from a Thai company and doesn't move anywhere. But there are many applicants that would be looked upon favorably in any other country and motivated by higher success that go where the money and opportunity is and don't want to be restricted and limited to Thailand for XX years it takes to be awarded the citizenship.

So in summary, there is no question that Thai citizenship is convenient for living in thailand - if you can wait long enough - but it doesn't help for anything anywhere else.

[Neeranam]

If you are male

You need a Thai wife, 3 years in a Yellow House book and 3 years tax returns for a full-time job with work permit and 3 years in Thailand on the correct VISA extension (not retirement, not something that requires VISA runs)

If you are working on some sort of temporary contract or a 1 year contract forget it, it has to be a permanent job.

If you have been on VISAs issued outside Thailand forget it, if you are on retirement extension forget it.

If you have been working as a school-teacher on less than 40k a month, forget it.

I think this is wrong. You don't 'need' 3 years in a yellow house book but you do get points for it. Sorry no facts here.

[NewlyMintedThai]

Why would you not if intending to live here for a lifetime? Many of us never had or will have that choice but those that do it would seem the logical path to take - much more advantageous than PR process in my opinion and really not harder it seems.

I intend to be in Thailand for a lifetime yet I still no real advantage to all the ballache when a visa will suffice.

Basically cause it isn't hard, you just submit the paperwork they need (house reg, marriage cert, income tax history etc) and they fill in the forms. A day of your time and then simply a waiting game.

So few get it as so few either qualify for it, or as in your case, seem to want it. Others yet seem to think that it is only for a select few with uber connections. For the rest of us, showing a bit of paperwork which in the main you already have and taking half a morning out at special branch isn't a hardship.

Still doesnt answer the question as to why bother.

Ultimately what use does the nationality of 3rd world country really amount to?

A better question might be: why would someone live the rest of their days in a place where they will never have a voice in society, never have a role in the democratic process, never be able to own land or a company in their own name, never be able to do whatever job wherever and whenever they like, never be able to take advantage of the free public health system...while being forever at the mercy of some bureaucrat with a visa stamp and a government that might change the rules on you at any time you wish?

[3 year]

I get to drive a Tuk-tuk without the need of a work permit and sit on corners yelling out 'hey mister - you wan gran palat tour? 30 baht'. Slumming it with my other third world buddies I guess.

Well, no matter how hard you try, not matter what colour your passport is you will ALWAYS be farang and not Thai. So whats the poiint?

A Thai in the US is an American, it aint the same vice versa.

So, I maintain, why bother?