At What Point Do You Toss In The Towel?

[gazmat]

When I've finally made sweet, sweet love to every woman, or woman-shaped being, in this glorious kingdom.

Almost there...

[lumply]

One tosses in the towel when common sense prevails I suppose, but then where do you go? Anywhere in Europe at the moment is a backward step. The Middle East (Dubai) is getting as pricey as Europe and you have tougher residency laws. And so it goes on......maybe Cambodia or Vietnam? Tough it out in LOS I say until a cast iron (better) opportunity arises somewhere else. Good luck whatever you decide to do.

[Hedghog]

"I reckon the writing's on the wall ..."

"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but not their own facts." said the late US Senator and Harvard Professor Daniel Patrick Moynihan.

Other than placing bets on the cockroaches and rats, what is one to do? (although I'm guessing buying gold-related instruments would be high on the list).

Gold's gone uop so much lately its bound to go up a bit more. YOu'd be mad to miss out

You obviously don't follow the gold market.

[rubberduck]

Girls and pawnshops rule the goldmarket.

Edited March 27, 2013 by rubberduck

[MrWorldwide]

Originally, there were four main gold shops on the 'Golden Road': Seng Heng Li, Hua Seng Heng, Tung Jin Aeng and Tang To Kang . Now there are more than 130 gold shops with new ones starting up continually on both sides of the road. Most shops are members of the Gold Merchants Association. Gold products here are of high standard and quality; many are hand-made and of beautiful intricacy.

2 shops where you will never be cheated are:

Hua Seng Heng - to find your way to this shop print out this map, and give it to the taxi driver.

Tang To Kang - the oldest gold shop in Bangkok. It was founded by Tohkang Saetang, a Chinese immigrant, in the 1880s. It was the only gold shop in the Sampheng areas during the reign of Rama VI to be granted a royal appointment to use the Garuda emblem in 1921.

The shop has a high reputation for quality and craftsmanship and will repurchase any piece for not more than 1% lower than the prevailing market price of gold. Some shops maintain a margin of up to 5% on repurchased items.

This shop is to shortly start franchising its business. It should be noted that at the moment there is only one shop and other shops using the Tang To Kang name are doing so illegally.

The best way to get to Yaowarat to take the subway to Hualampong and then get a taxi to Yaowarat (pronounced Yaowaraat). A motorcyle is faster but more dangerous.

You can have jewelry custom made for you. The cost will depend very much on your bargaining skills and the amount of work involved.

Virtually all the gold shops in Thailand are Chinese owned. To find traditional Thai gold designs, you will have to go to the town of Petchburi. One visitor to this site writes: "If your looking for high quality hand made gold, beautiful workmanship, some pieces with enameling, or even dragon bracelets go to Petchaburi. Lots of shops near the market. Well known to Thais, who come shopping here on the weekends from Bangkok. Jae Ju 1 & 2 are my personal favorite shops."

http://gold.yabz.com/where_to_buy_gold.htm

I've only ever seen Yaowarat Road when gold was in high demand, and both of those shops resembled scenes from Slumdog Millionaire. Have no idea what they are like in the current market, but I would choose one of those two over the dodgy gold shops I've seen in other parts of BKK.

[Stradavarius37]

I toss in the towel when its wet or dirty, and then I get a new towel.

[chiang mai]

I toss in the towel when its wet or dirty, and then I get a new towel.

Seven pages, over 150 posts, nineteen posts about male masturbation and still they keep comming!

[Nowhereman60]

When all three bank accounts have a balance of 0 or the heart monitor shows 0.

[FunFon]

Not gloom and doom at all, only if you identify with the losing side of global trends, my point would be to do your best to place your bets on the winning side.

And trying to point out to people that think the current trends are anomalies and sometime soon things will "return to normal", that these are possibly long-term systemic trends.

Globalization and concentration of wealth is favoring only certain sectors of farang country populations, certainly not the welfare of most citizens.

I think long term the trend is for conditions to equalize more and more, and the way some regions and countries are accelerating their development the whole we-are-superior mindset is becoming more and more laughable, we're going to have to compete fair and square like everyone else by working hard and saving and being smart. Those societies that don't and aren't will continue to decline.

As they should, that's a good thing, not bad.

Spoken like a true loser. (Not saying you are, but that's what a loser who couldn't find a piece of the pie would say.)

Did you see in the US news the "Occupy Wall Street" losers? Yes they were. They were losers wanting something for nothing. They didn't want to be a winner, they wanted handouts from winners.

It never works that way. There are people who make it happen, and then there are those who wonder what the hell happened, to paraphrase an old quote.

Do you realize that some of the wealthiest "corporate" winners are self-made? Do you realize that they too are globalizing? Ever heard of Bill Gates or the guys who started Google from a dorm room or Jeff Bezos of Amazon or the founders of Ebay or Michael Dell or any other of thousands of upstart guys and women who dove in, took a chance, and became billionaires?

Now I suppose they are the evil ones, and aren't entitled to enjoy their success?

-

I found this article to be fairly objective and well backed by reputable sources.

For those not interested enough to actually read it, the infographic a couple of page-clicks down gives a good visual summary of the main point.

http://www.taxanalysts.com/www/features.nsf/Articles/C52956572546624F85257B1D004DE3FC?OpenDocument

Note specifically I'm supporting my statement

-

Globalization and concentration of wealth is favoring only certain sectors of farang country populations, certainly not the welfare of most citizens.

Edited April 11, 2013 by FunFon

[JLCrab]

Actually I wouldn't be worried too much about income disparities in the USA as I read today:

As far as the USA you can as the saying goes "put a fork in it" ... Basically a total meltdown of the entire US economy is what is at hand

I read it right here on ThaiVisa.com so it must be true.

#11

[FunFon]

Actually I wouldn't be worried too much about income disparities in the USA as I read today:

As far as the USA you can as the saying goes "put a fork in it" ... Basically a total meltdown of the entire US economy is what is at hand

I read it right here on ThaiVisa.com so it must be true.

#11

-

I never said anything about the US economy itself, was just talking about the likelihood that the relative weakness of the UK/Euro/US currencies is unlikely to be a temporary aberration but rather a long-term trend resulting from systemic flaws in how those banking systems are being "managed"

Up to a certain point that issue has little to do with main street economics.

A real crash-and-burn scenario is IMO quite possible but not necessarily likely, something I myself would take steps to hedge against, even to the point of making sure the bulk of my assets were not denominated in UK/Euro/USD.

However I think the odds of a long downward slide are much higher; that scenario may in fact be very positive from the main-street POV, if the US can return to being a strong export economy and start to redress the trade imbalance issue.

Then the so-called "government" may even address its finance/deficit issues, and maybe one day they'll restore something like Glass-Steagall, fix too-big-to-fail/too-big-to-prosecute. And then maybe the Fed will return to sanity. And the US will have a currency the world can believe in on a rational basis, not just suspended disbelief.

Edited April 11, 2013 by FunFon

[JLCrab]

The link you provided at #160 was specifically about the US economy and was based upon analysis of IRS data. And all this macro-economic analysis is from someone who has problems dealing with the very micro-economic analysis of whether and how he can skip out on not paying his back-rent.

[MrWorldwide]

I keep hearing about this 'total meltdown', yet somehow am managing, ahem, several square meals a day. I wasnt here for the Great Depression of the 9130s, but I'm reasonably informed that anyone who ate that regularly was seen as extremely fortunate .....

Anyway, it's all academic now that the Great Leader has promised to punish the Great Satan. Sounds, er, great !

[Naam]

Actually I wouldn't be worried too much about income disparities in the USA as I read today:

As far as the USA you can as the saying goes "put a fork in it" ... Basically a total meltdown of the entire US economy is what is at hand

I read it right here on ThaiVisa.com so it must be true.

#11

I read it right here on ThaiVisa.com so it must be true.

[JLCrab]

I keep hearing about this 'total meltdown', yet somehow am managing, ahem, several square meals a day. I wasnt here for the Great Depression of the 9130s, but I'm reasonably informed that anyone who ate that regularly was seen as extremely fortunate .....

Anyway, it's all academic now that the Great Leader has promised to punish the Great Satan. Sounds, er, great !

The Great depression of the 9130s -- was that in a Galaxy far, far, away??

[Spaniel]

oMe I left Thailand 2 years ago after 13 years permanently living + running a succesful café in Chiangmai. While I had lots of great holidays in the years before, living there at the end made me feel like wasting my time. Increasing polution, seriously annoyed about the traffic mentality (had 3 accidents and hundreds of times nearly being killed), annoyed about garbage thrown away along the road, conflicts with internet companies, hopeless mentality regarding environment (the plastic bag terror in supermarkets), abominable quality of non-food products, lack of positive developments, stupidity in general, exhausting heat, favorite hangouts closing one by one. Simply said I have stayed in Thai too long. Back 'home' I feel relaxed, enjoy the quality of life and fresh air, the sun became my friend again. Never missed Thailand 1 day and when missing my favourite noodles at Moonmuang Road and the massages too much I get an airplane ticket and come over few weeks, enjoying the good things, meeting best friends until it's enough. Not letting things get under the skin anymore. The enjoyable Thailand like it was 20 years ago it's gone anyway and I did not find it back. Now too many farangs, too many locals taking an advantage on them, farangs of which most spending time with drinking beer and nagging, many expats who don't even speak five words Thai, neverending discussions about visa hassle, double pricing, workpermits and mucisians being arrested, expensive Baht etc. I don't wanna be a part of it anymore.

Sounds like your experiences here are quite different from mine. Many of the things you mentioned are true. I first came here in 1967 and retired here in the late '90's so probably been here around 25 years or so. I tend to keep away from the complaining expats and hang around mostly with wife and a few friends. Guess it all depends on each persons outlook on life.

[FunFon]

The link you provided at #160 was specifically about the US economy and was based upon analysis of IRS data. And all this macro-economic analysis is from someone who has problems dealing with the very micro-economic analysis of whether and how he can skip out on not paying his back-rent.

-

Actually I've made it clear at every point that the back rent will be paid, just doesn't seem possible until after I've found a job back home

And it's a pretty common phenomenon for people of general capacity and intelligence to have trouble managing the practical day-to-day realities of life, and I fully admit to having falled into that category over the past few years.

Thanks so much for your ongoing concern and the stimulating discussions. . .

[rct99q]

Not so much as "At what point do you toss in the towel?" the question should be if a slight change in the exchange rate causes you to consider tossing in the towel.....

"Should you have been here in the first place?"

[MrWorldwide]

I keep hearing about this 'total meltdown', yet somehow am managing, ahem, several square meals a day. I wasnt here for the Great Depression of the 9130s, but I'm reasonably informed that anyone who ate that regularly was seen as extremely fortunate .....

Anyway, it's all academic now that the Great Leader has promised to punish the Great Satan. Sounds, er, great !

The Great depression of the 9130s -- was that in a Galaxy far, far, away??

Damn - he's onto me - use the Farce, Luke !

(Wouldn't Jedi mind control come in handy in Thailand, eh wot ? 'No, you arent going to search me Officer - you are going to forget I was ever here, then you are going to remove your colleague's trousers and kneel in front of him while I take a photo.' )

[Imkah]

Sigh - the endless negativity and self-doubt - might be time folk gazed at a more inspiring graph or two:

http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=AUD&to=IDR&view=10Y

http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=AUD&to=MYR&view=10Y

Of course, prices have risen in both countries over the last 10 years, but I'll take what I can get. Ultimately, there's only one graph that really matters, and ironically it's the one graph where we want to see their currency getting stronger against ours:

http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=AUD&to=CNY&view=10Y

China has gone to great pains to keep the Yuan artificially weak to protect its own export markets - big flow-on impacts for everyone here when that changes.

Its worrying times for a lot of people, I see wars about to start when the S**t hits the fan, do you really think Thailand would be a good place to be when it happens here?? with their mob rule.

And before you start telling me " oh you dont have a pot to pi** in , I do and its overflowing due to my Wifes hard work, but other people are not in the same boat and I feel for them.

The world IS in a very delicate state now.

The world is in the grip of the biggest recession that the world has ever seen,it is a 10-year recession that's all!It started in 2008 and so is now reaching rock bottom,by this time next year things should look a little better and the green shoots of recovery may be poking their heads through.

Due to globalisation it doesn't matter where you go,the effects of this recession/crisis/credit crunch/depression will follow you there.You have no choice but to tighten the old belts and ride it out,Dunkirk spirit and all that,by 2018 it will be over!

Dunkirk spirit or not, over by 2018 or not; welcome to a reality-check that will last forever. If you spent your working years doing "honest work" at a reasonable or low pay, you will spend the remaining likewise. Here or there, so try to make the best out of it and do not waste your time trying to figure out in which country to throw your towels. Throw it on the bathroom floor after a maybe cold, but invigorating shower and enjoy that you are alive and breathing. For now..

[rene123]

I toss in the towel right after I step out of the shower.

[thaibeachlovers]

I'll leave when I can no longer afford to stay here, and not a satang before.

If I didn't have to front up 800,000 baht for the extension, it would be a lot longer.

I can live here on 500 bht a day, so it's still very affordable.

What makes Thailand is expensive is wanting to live a western lifestyle, and women.

[rene123]

Quote

"I can live here on 500 bht a day, so it's still very affordable.

What makes Thailand is expensive is wanting to live a western lifestyle, and women."

True, us women have ALWAYS been expensive... Everywhere. Ask my ex-husband.

[ABCer]

This is a very serious issue affecting all of us.

One thing I know for sure - I'm staying put.

I've come to Thailand to live to the very end.

Therefore, to minimize the currency fluctuations effect I have done

what is considered to be risky - put all my eggs in this one basket.

My home is here, all I need plus all the luxuries are here. Thus the only effect on me

when the $$ falls is less money in the pocket. But this is manageable.

Retirees (like me) are less affected. Besides, when I look at the prices back at home,

I'm glad I made the move. There is no way back. Sorry, mates, not for me.

[Bikkii]

Making Thai baht, so this trend just makes it that little more affordable for me to visit me mum at "home".

With you on that, makes my mum very happy!

[Rajab Al Zarahni]

There is certainly a looming crisis for retired UK expats. With state pension increases frozen from the time they move here, there are two main factors that have kept them afloat. Of these a life expectancy of about 12 years, post retirement and a strong pound to provide a favorable exchange rate.Until recently, this was against a background of relatively cheap food and consumables.The problem has been compounded because all these variables are now moving in the same unfavorable direction at the same time. There will come a tipping point and I don't think it's far away, when those relying on their state pension alone will be arriving at the embassy and asking to be repatriated! Then we will see who owns the problem!

[thaibeachlovers]

There is certainly a looming crisis for retired UK expats. With state pension increases frozen from the time they move here, there are two main factors that have kept them afloat. Of these a life expectancy of about 12 years, post retirement and a strong pound to provide a favorable exchange rate.Until recently, this was against a background of relatively cheap food and consumables.The problem has been compounded because all these variables are now moving in the same unfavorable direction at the same time. There will come a tipping point and I don't think it's far away, when those relying on their state pension alone will be arriving at the embassy and asking to be repatriated! Then we will see who owns the problem!

Actually, so long as a western lifestyle, condo living, girls etc are not a necessary part of expat living in LOS, even the most meager pension would suffice to live here. What is going to make it impossible is the amount of money necessary to keep extending the visa.

If enough expats have to leave because of that, I wonder if they would reduce the amount, or even go the Malaysian route of 6 month permit to stay, at the border. Thousands of empty rooms and complaining restaurant owners may be influential, or not.

[FunFon]

Actually, so long as a western lifestyle, condo living, girls etc are not a necessary part of expat living in LOS, even the most meager pension would suffice to live here. What is going to make it impossible is the amount of money necessary to keep extending the visa.

If enough expats have to leave because of that, I wonder if they would reduce the amount, or even go the Malaysian route of 6 month permit to stay, at the border. Thousands of empty rooms and complaining restaurant owners may be influential, or not.

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IMO not.

I'm convinced that the Thai authorities genuinely feel anyone considering the financial side of their visa requirements to be an issue are simply not welcome, TPTB only want foreigners who come spend and leave.

Those that want to stay long-term need to be comfortably well off, not just struggling to make ends meet on a miserly government pension, never mind their day-to-day contributions to the Thai economy, these days a drop in the bucket and often in unwelcome directions anyway.