Caught Drink Driving In Thailand And Put In Prison

[FunFon]

My lawyer explained it slightly differently. You dont get your PP back the conditions of the PTT are quite strict as are the dates you have to be back. Holding your PP is leverage to get you to return. You do get the PTT bond back once you return back to the ountry as you say.

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You didn't address this issue:

Without your passport you simply would't be able to enter another country apart from maybe your home country. No airline would board you without having passport in.hand.

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My understanding as well, international travel is simply impossible without your passport in hand.

[Para]

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You didn't address this issue:

Without your passport you simply would't be able to enter another country apart from maybe your home country. No airline would board you without having passport in.hand.

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Easy on the attitude mate.......

You don't need a PP to return to your home country which is the only place you will be allowed to go on a PTT.

[FunFon]

You didn't address this issue:

Without your passport you simply would't be able to enter another country apart from maybe your home country. No airline would board you without having passport in.hand.

Easy on the attitude mate.......

You don't need a PP to return to your home country which is the only place you will be allowed to go on a PTT.

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Didn't mean any attitude, genuinely curious.

Hope I never need to worry about this specific situation. . .

[Para]

You didn't address this issue:

Without your passport you simply would't be able to enter another country apart from maybe your home country. No airline would board you without having passport in.hand.

Easy on the attitude mate.......

You don't need a PP to return to your home country which is the only place you will be allowed to go on a PTT.

-

Didn't mean any attitude, genuinely curious.

Hope I never need to worry about this specific situation. . .

NP all cool.

Trust me you don't want to be in the situation of needing a PTT then having the court refuse the application.......

[monty]

Actually had a friend who received a ptt while on bail, and he got his passport as well no questions asked.

Basically the pp holds no value as most embassies will simply issue a replacement, and while holding a ptt you do not even need immigration stamps in the new passport as you leave on the ptt.

But in Thailand, you have the law, and then you have the officer(s) implementing the law, and those two can differ a bit.

So what works one day in one province can be totally different the next dayvin another...

[Para]

Actually had a friend who received a ptt while on bail, and he got his passport as well no questions asked.

Basically the pp holds no value as most embassies will simply issue a replacement, and while holding a ptt you do not even need immigration stamps in the new passport as you leave on the ptt.

But in Thailand, you have the law, and then you have the officer(s) implementing the law, and those two can differ a bit.

So what works one day in one province can be totally different the next dayvin another...

I know my lawyer told me there is a lot of difference between local courts and Bangkok courts as you say if lucky and not Bangkok it seems a LOT more options are available.

The UK Embassy will not issue you with a replacement passport BUT they will certainly issue an ETD (emergency travel document) to get you back home with up to 5 stops. Problem is when arrested immigrations are always notified and you are on the no fly list.

The courts can also refuse a PTT to someone found not guilty at the criminal court but who have had judgement appealed by the public prosecutor. So proved innocent once and still cant leave the country or work!

[lemoncake]

In Australia, driving drunk is considered criminal offense and if caught you would be criminally charged.

First time, as you said loss of license, 2 year probation and $2200 fine.

Second time, you get locked up for sure, the length is determined by how much money you willing to spend on a good lawyer.

Which state/Territory are you talking about ?

NSW

[lemoncake]

OP's case is rather very strange, though very possibly his "well connected" friends made it worse or milking him

That mate is looking to be the case.

Look I told him to stay off the thread because he would simply be attacked for stupidity something he knows and looking at the volume of threads would of been destroyed.

He is FINALLY talking to a Thai/English lawyer and we are working out whats happened and whats going to happen.

Small update which answers as many questions as it generates

He was nicked and held in a police cell paid 20k to get out went to court the next day, received the 20k back and pleaded guilty to DUI.

He was sentenced to 32 day jail. By all accounts harsh but he is adamant it was a sentence not remand. Now 5 days into his 32 day sentence he gets offered 'bail' to come out. This totally loses me. He then applied to the court for his PP as he had to get back to work and the judge refused saying the PP would be held till the full 32 days are up and then he would have to wait for the clerks to find and return his PP. His 'friend' got involved again and managed to get the judge to issue a permission to travel with the condition he came back on the 15th March. He came back and went back to court (for what we have no idea yet) and was then granted another permission to travel for 6 months. He is now outside of Thailand with passport being held here.

He has no idea if he is on bail, suspended sentence or what!

He knows he was wrong and accepts as he put in his first port. He is accepting whatever decision is going to be given but we cant understand what on earth is going on. Hence his post.

1. I think the "friend" made it worse landing him jail sentence

2. The 20K to get out of jail was illegal, he should have waited the 32 days and returned to collect his passport.

I think judge was/is aware of the illegality and now making him pay for it, again i say the "friend" made it worse.

As i said, if the friend was as "high" as OP claims, he would not even end up in court, but everything would have been cleared on the spot.

Bring a lawyer from Bangkok, preferably a bigger firm to find out what exactly the "friend" has done and where its going, because its simply a mess which from experience does not go down this way and surely cost much less to what OP has already paid.

Edited March 25, 2013 by lemoncake

[arthurwait]

Once it's down on paper and in the system you may find only a very high up BIB could change things.

As someone said I imagine it's more difficult in Bangkok than in other places. It's a lot harder to be high up and connected to the right people in Bangkok than it is out in the sticks.

[jinners]

GarryP, on 22 Mar 2013 - 12:48, said:

A friend got caught in Lardprao driving under the influnce on a Saturday. He hit 260 whatever that means. It was his second offence, bail cost 20,000 Baht, and on Monday in Court he was fined 5,000 and ordered to do 30 or 35 hours community service. Told if he gets caught again it will mean time in jail.

I know a guy who was done recently driving a car drunk and stoned. He was caught with a small amount of ganja too - second offense. 20,000 baht and community service which he knows how to avoid.

I know quite a few who got 'let off' with a lot worse than this.

It's always wise to carry a decent amount of cash around with you at all times. The secret is not to let it go to court, if you know what I mean.

Now you'll get the "who on earth would carry THAT amount of money (5000/10000/20000) on you, looking for trouble". Same as the dicks on here, never had a beer and driven in my life crew. The guy said he'd just had a beer, he knows he was over the limit, he got caught. Done. Nobody got hurt. Nobody was injured so why not save all the pent up bile and aggression which seems to be plentiful for the <deleted> who can't drive when sober, for the hit and runners, for the <deleted> crusing around without a helmet on. If I want to live like a strict god fearing muslim, I'll go live in SAUDI!. Nuff said and leave the guy alone Jeez!

[Para]

Now you'll get the "who on earth would carry THAT amount of money (5000/10000/20000) on you, looking for trouble". Same as the dicks on here, never had a beer and driven in my life crew. The guy said he'd just had a beer, he knows he was over the limit, he got caught. Done. Nobody got hurt. Nobody was injured so why not save all the pent up bile and aggression which seems to be plentiful for the <deleted> who can't drive when sober, for the hit and runners, for the <deleted> crusing around without a helmet on. If I want to live like a strict god fearing muslim, I'll go live in SAUDI!. Nuff said and leave the guy alone Jeez!

+1

All the never broken a law lot feel free to flame my a$$ at this bit of advice but it may well save someone one day.

If anyone is ever nicked for ANY crime the sooner you start talking about paying the police off the better. If you can do it with only the ones that arrested you it will cost you a LOT less than if you wait till you get to the police station as more mouths to feed. If you leave it till you have your first show at court than thats it game over for a quick way out.

Most likely the BiB's wont ask directly for money as you could be recording them so they may well talk around 'different solutions' being vague if they don't talk English simply and directly ask them "how much' in Thai.

Flame away TV Saints......

[Para]

1. I think the "friend" made it worse landing him jail sentence

2. The 20K to get out of jail was illegal, he should have waited the 32 days and returned to collect his passport.

I think judge was/is aware of the illegality and now making him pay for it, again i say the "friend" made it worse.

As i said, if the friend was as "high" as OP claims, he would not even end up in court, but everything would have been cleared on the spot.

Bring a lawyer from Bangkok, preferably a bigger firm to find out what exactly the "friend" has done and where its going, because its simply a mess which from experience does not go down this way and surely cost much less to what OP has already paid.

1. I agree from lawyers I have spoken to as well as BM's that have seen this situation first hand he should of had a fine up to 10K.

2. The first 20k was to get him out of staying in the police cell which was returned. The next 30k was a court imposed bail he also had to stump up more bond for the PTT.

Everything else I agree and he is finally realizing it as well.

[FritsSikkink]

Where is the OP ?

[geriatrickid]

Where is the OP ?

Probably, he same place as Waldo.

This has become a very bizarre thread.

[Para]

Where is the OP ?

Last PM said he was off to work????

[Johnniey]

You didn't address this issue:Without your passport you simply would't be able to enter another country apart from maybe your home country. No airline would board you without having passport in.hand.Easy on the attitude mate....... You don't need a PP to return to your home country which is the only place you will be allowed to go on a PTT.-Didn't mean any attitude, genuinely curious.Hope I never need to worry about this specific situation. . .

maybe the op works in thailand.

you do usually need a PP to return to your home country esp if it is not direct because most airlinesbwont let you travel with no proof of citizenship or relevant visa.

[Para]

You didn't address this issue:Without your passport you simply would't be able to enter another country apart from maybe your home country. No airline would board you without having passport in.hand.Easy on the attitude mate....... You don't need a PP to return to your home country which is the only place you will be allowed to go on a PTT.-Didn't mean any attitude, genuinely curious.Hope I never need to worry about this specific situation. . .

maybe the op works in thailand.

you do usually need a PP to return to your home country esp if it is not direct because most airlinesbwont let you travel with no proof of citizenship or relevant visa.

He is defiantly out of Thailand.

Maybe I had it wrong when I said the court kept the PP and issued a PTT in lieu. As Monty said you get both back which kinda makes sense with the PTT having to be shown to Immigrations when you leave as your will be on the black list.

[Neeranam]

You didn't address this issue:Without your passport you simply would't be able to enter another country apart from maybe your home country. No airline would board you without having passport in.hand.Easy on the attitude mate....... You don't need a PP to return to your home country which is the only place you will be allowed to go on a PTT.-Didn't mean any attitude, genuinely curious.Hope I never need to worry about this specific situation. . .

maybe the op works in thailand.

you do usually need a PP to return to your home country esp if it is not direct because most airlinesbwont let you travel with no proof of citizenship or relevant visa.

He is defiantly out of Thailand.

Maybe I had it wrong when I said the court kept the PP and issued a PTT in lieu. As Monty said you get both back which kinda makes sense with the PTT having to be shown to Immigrations when you leave as your will be on the black list.

I thought he wanted to leave Thailand.

[FritsSikkink]

Where is the OP ?

Last PM said he was off to work????

Why does he PM you all the time and doesn't bother to react to the others on this forum?

Maybe you could ask him that in an PM, seems you have been elected as his spokesman

Edited March 25, 2013 by FritsSikkink

[Johnniey]

Where is the OP ?

Last PM said he was off to work????

Why does he PM you all the time and doesn't bother to react to the others on this forum?

Maybe you could ask him that in an PM, seems you have been elected as his spokesman

Something fishy going on here.

Para do yoy live in Pattaya too by any chance?

[Para]

Where is the OP ?

Last PM said he was off to work????

Why does he PM you all the time and doesn't bother to react to the others on this forum?

Maybe you could ask him that in an PM, seems you have been elected as his spokesman

Maybe because I offered him help and not abuse?

[Para]

Where is the OP ?

Last PM said he was off to work????

Why does he PM you all the time and doesn't bother to react to the others on this forum?

Maybe you could ask him that in an PM, seems you have been elected as his spokesman

Something fishy going on here.

Para do yoy live in Pattaya too by any chance?

I'm not allowed to post PM's but Monty the Mod has been privy to some drop him a line and ask him....

[wprime]

So if I understand correctly, they took you to court without a blood test? You must have done something seriously wrong to end up in jail, all you had to do is pay 3000 baht to get a doctor to say you suffer from acid reflux and how this can cause breath tests to read unreliably high.

[NanLaew]

wprime, on 26 Mar 2013 - 00:26, said:

So if I understand correctly, they took you to court without a blood test? You must have done something seriously wrong to end up in jail, all you had to do is pay 3000 baht to get a doctor to say you suffer from acid reflux and how this can cause breath tests to read unreliably high.

There's a secondary breath test and final blood test option in Thailand like in most other countries?

I don't think so. Here it is the alcohol-on-breath test and that's all they need to prosecute.

Some countries don't even bother with the breath test and in the US, they generally rely on such things as the rather dodgy Horizontal Gaze Nystagmus eye test, walking an imaginary line heel-to-toe and standing on one leg.

What's the SOP these days for a drink driving bust in the UK? Australia? Norway has I believe the lowest permitted blood-alcohol levels in Europe. How is that enforced? Random stop, breath test(s) and blood work?

I assume that like in the US, a blood test is the final and pretty much incontrovertible proof you were DUI and is the key to any prosecution. My opinion is Thailand's authorities are well aware there's a big DUI problem but much in the same way as they are well aware they need foreign teachers, it's mostly the cheapest and least reliable methodology that is employed. You can gargle and rinse (and not swallow) a mouthful of beer and blow positive but apart from showing their breath testing device as primary source of evidence is flawed, why one would want to do that is beyond me!

[Star Dust]

What if you refuse to blow?

[Star Dust]

And what if you refuse to blow, and demand a blood test?

[FunFon]

Star Dust, on 26 Mar 2013 - 14:57, said:

And what if you refuse to blow, and demand a blood test?

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Refusing to blow is a criminal offense.

It seems that the more accurate test should be available if the first one shows you guilty, but as with most things here the locals have a lot of discretion, remember there is no real rule of law here.

Edited March 26, 2013 by FunFon

[Star Dust]

Star Dust, on 26 Mar 2013 - 14:57, said:

And what if you refuse to blow, and demand a blood test?

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Refusing to blow is a criminal offense.

It seems that the more accurate test should be available if the first one shows you guilty, but as with most things here the locals have a lot of discretion, remember there is no real rule of law here.

Ok, so you say it's a criminal offence. But how could they proof you were drunk, if you refused to blow, and asked for a more accurate test by a professional (doctor) on your own expense.

Let's say they stopped you, you were completetly sober, but refused to blow?

I know that there is no rule of law. I experienced that first hand.

[SteeleJoe]

Star Dust, on 26 Mar 2013 - 14:57, said:

And what if you refuse to blow, and demand a blood test?

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Refusing to blow is a criminal offense.

It seems that the more accurate test should be available if the first one shows you guilty, but as with most things here the locals have a lot of discretion, remember there is no real rule of law here.

Ok, so you say it's a criminal offence. But how could they proof you were drunk, if you refused to blow, and asked for a more accurate test by a professional (doctor) on your own expense.

Let's say they stopped you, you were completetly sober, but refused to blow?

I know that there is no rule of law. I experienced that first hand.

"Rule of Law" does not mean what I think you think it does...but no, Thailand doesn't have it.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa ap

[FunFon]

Ok, so you say it's a criminal offence. But how could they proof you were drunk, if you refused to blow, and asked for a more accurate test by a professional (doctor) on your own expense.

Let's say they stopped you, you were completetly sober, but refused to blow?

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Your refusal to blow is a criminal offence completely independent of whether you are drunk or not.

If you want any chance of getting out of it, you blow, and then if you fail, claim the test isn't accurate and you want to go to a hospital and pay for a blood test.

If you are polite and respectful and they are in a good mood then they might give you that privilege.

Capiche?