Why Are So Many Here Intent On Thailand's Economy Collapsing ?

[kennedy]

That's it! May I suggest we conduct a undercover investigation and flush these malcontents out,before they destroy the entire country!! Well, maybe it would be easier just to ignore them.

Edited March 24, 2013 by kennedy

[terryp]

To answer the OP because many are not wearing rose glass's and are not fooled by the hub of idiotic corrupt ministers saying all is fine no need to panic, Thalland will not be affected by "...." insert any major event here.

Thailand is still very much a developing 3rd World Country whatever some people believe, the Baht is subjected to massive Currency inflows from Country’s that are about to experience financial mayhem (whatever some believe)

Thailand has one of the highest interest rates in Asia ...hence money looking for a home with reasonable return is flooding into Thailand...if you think this is not going to go bang well good for you; I know where My money will be and it is not sitting in the Thai stock market or Thai banks.

Too many people living here a couple of months/years view Thailand as a 1st World state, all I will say is yes it’s a state in fact it’s a mess

You are entitled to your views, as I am so lets see how it plays out, it will be very clear in the next couple of years

[fasteddie]

It's simple, the worse off they are, the better off we are.

[samran]

^^ Right - Im not an economist but what Ive read by for example NeverSure, sure makes sense to me.in an objective way.

You mean Mr Conspiracy Theory himself?

[el jefe]

To answer the OP because many are not wearing rose glass's and are not fooled by the hub of idiotic corrupt ministers saying all is fine no need to panic, Thalland will not be affected by "...." insert any major event here.

Thailand is still very much a developing 3rd World Country whatever some people believe, the Baht is subjected to massive Currency inflows from Country’s that are about to experience financial mayhem (whatever some believe)

Thailand has one of the highest interest rates in Asia ...hence money looking for a home with reasonable return is flooding into Thailand...if you think this is not going to go bang well good for you; I know where My money will be and it is not sitting in the Thai stock market or Thai banks.

Too many people living here a couple of months/years view Thailand as a 1st World state, all I will say is yes it’s a state in fact it’s a mess

You are entitled to your views, as I am so lets see how it plays out, it will be very clear in the next couple of years

My rose colored glasses have a wide angle lense. One needs to look at Thai's politics, economy, and policies not in a vacuum, but compared to other countries in the region. Vietnam, China, Pakistan, Malaysia, Indonesia, Myanmar. One or two of those may be equally good places to invest (and live). The others are all run by the same "idiotic corrupt ministers" (your words) and they have equal political/social/economic problems. If Thailand collapses, the rest of Asia is going down with it.

[baboon]

Why are so many on here intent on western economies collapsing? We came from there, they educated us and gave us the chance to be here. Now some seem to be gleeful our friends and families are suffering.

As long as I'm alright, eh?

[USNret]

My rose colored glasses have a wide angle lense. One needs to look at Thai's politics, economy, and policies not in a vacuum, but compared to other countries in the region. Vietnam, China, Pakistan, Malaysia, Indonesia, Myanmar. One or two of those may be equally good places to invest (and live). The others are all run by the same "idiotic corrupt ministers" (your words) and they have equal political/social/economic problems. If Thailand collapses, the rest of Asia is going down with it.

This makes utterly no sense. Are you using the surrounding 3rd world/emerging nations at the measure of solvency & stability for Thailand? Or are you saying it's ok if the Thai economy collapses because at least the rest of Asia will too? Either way, you don't promote either side of this discussion on this thread.

[djayz]

I think you'll find that many of we longer foreign residents here in Thailand, retired, working or bushiness operators are concerned when we see the same group of names and people who were closely involved in the 1997 meltdown involved in this current financial scene.

We lived through some challenging times, although for many of us it didn't hurt us, however we who have family ties here ( no pun intended) did see suffering in our family network and in fact around us in general.

Remember also that a number of us had and no doubt in many case also have recently experienced tumultuous financial tempests in our countries of origin or the countries where our investments and banking was or is carried out. hence the concern shown.

It is not a desire to see a failure of the financial system but a desire to see a properly regulated financial system in place, when one views the events elsewhere in the world of finance you can realise why there are fears regarding the current financial situation here.

We see the current situation in Cyprus which proves yet again in reality no sovereign state is in reality in control of its financial destiny, bankers, insurance companies and wealthy individuals etc control the movements of currency not governments.

We all want a settled stable economy, the current situation is in my view and many others too not as stable as one would wish to see, old experiences come back to haunt us, hence the ringing of those alarm bells.

There is no such thing as a "properly regulated financial system in place" as the current situation in the EU and USA proves... I think that's just utopian... I might be wrong, but the situation in the West tells me I'm not too far off the mark...

I've lived in Thailand for a few years now and I make my money in THB... so I really couldn't care about the exchange rates...

[yoshiwara]

I think you'll find that many of we longer foreign residents here in Thailand, retired, working or bushiness operators are concerned when we see the same group of names and people who were closely involved in the 1997 meltdown involved in this current financial scene.

We lived through some challenging times, although for many of us it didn't hurt us, however we who have family ties here ( no pun intended) did see suffering in our family network and in fact around us in general.

Remember also that a number of us had and no doubt in many case also have recently experienced tumultuous financial tempests in our countries of origin or the countries where our investments and banking was or is carried out. hence the concern shown.

It is not a desire to see a failure of the financial system but a desire to see a properly regulated financial system in place, when one views the events elsewhere in the world of finance you can realise why there are fears regarding the current financial situation here.

We see the current situation in Cyprus which proves yet again in reality no sovereign state is in reality in control of its financial destiny, bankers, insurance companies and wealthy individuals etc control the movements of currency not governments.

We all want a settled stable economy, the current situation is in my view and many others too not as stable as one would wish to see, old experiences come back to haunt us, hence the ringing of those alarm bells.

Both in Cyprus and Greece there was a state conspiracy to cheat their way into the EU and continue that cheating to this day. The suggestion that the sovereign state is 'innocent' is a complete nonsense.

[Thailand1977]

Why are so many on here intent on western economies collapsing? We came from there, they educated us and gave us the chance to be here. Now some seem to be gleeful our friends and families are suffering.

As long as I'm alright, eh?

Lots of boomers who cashed in during the property bubble and bought in Thailand when the THB was weak, thus this shear stroke of luck fills one with an enormous sense of smugness, and an ability to claim they're some kind of financial genius.

I used to own a property agency up until about 7 years ago i had the privilege of meeting many of this ilk on the way up.

[chiang mai]

Why are so many on here intent on western economies collapsing? We came from there, they educated us and gave us the chance to be here. Now some seem to be gleeful our friends and families are suffering.

As long as I'm alright, eh?

Lots of boomers who cashed in during the property bubble and bought in Thailand when the THB was weak, thus this shear stroke of luck fills one with an enormous sense of smugness, and an ability to claim they're some kind of financial genius.

I used to own a property agency up until about 7 years ago i had the privilege of meeting many of this ilk on the way up.

Oh I get the picture, anything that a so called "boomer" has ever done that worked out well is a reason to make them appear smug and they are to be critisized as a result. Past governments are responsible for todays mistakes, the boomers voted them in so blame them, get a life <deleted>!

[MrWorldwide]

To answer the OP because many are not wearing rose glass's and are not fooled by the hub of idiotic corrupt ministers saying all is fine no need to panic, Thalland will not be affected by "...." insert any major event here.

Thailand is still very much a developing 3rd World Country whatever some people believe, the Baht is subjected to massive Currency inflows from Country’s that are about to experience financial mayhem (whatever some believe)

Thailand has one of the highest interest rates in Asia ...hence money looking for a home with reasonable return is flooding into Thailand...if you think this is not going to go bang well good for you; I know where My money will be and it is not sitting in the Thai stock market or Thai banks.

Too many people living here a couple of months/years view Thailand as a 1st World state, all I will say is yes it’s a state in fact it’s a mess

You are entitled to your views, as I am so lets see how it plays out, it will be very clear in the next couple of years

Terry, I'm not going to argue with anything you have raised, and it's not about rose-colored glasses at all. I dont deny that many aspects of the way Thailand is run should be different, but they aren't - moreover, nothing I do or say will make a sliver of difference to the way the game is going to play out. As for your timeline, the posts I've seen dont want it to happen over a 'couple of years' - they want it to happen within the next two months !

Let's look at major impacts on the Thai economy over the last 20 or so years

- Thailand recovered from the '91 coup and subsequent instability, including the Red Shirt protest

- Thailand recovered from the tsunami and the bird flu

- Thailand recovered from devastating floods in the North

- Thailand, admittedly with help from the World Bank, recovered from the last currency crisis

If I see a problem with any of the above trashing the Thai economy in 2013, it's the capacity of the West to loan money or provide financial aid in the event of another disaster, but how many corporations are going to walk away from Thailand's infrastructure, location and manpower advantages ? Would China ignore such an opportunity ? They are pouring billions into complete banana republics all over the Pacific - why not a few more billion into Thailand ?

Even if they did, and left Thailand a basketcase similar to Cambodia, do we really want to holiday in a country where a large proportion of the population has to resort to begging or crime to survive ? Worse, how many want to live in such a country ? Thailand may not be perfect, but spend a week in Cambo and you soon realise how much you took for granted in a city like Bangkok or even Pattaya. For those who do want Cambo, last time I checked there were still several flights a day to PP - no need to leave Thailand a smouldering ruin in the wake of your departure.

[kblaze]

I think a large group of the fear-mongerers, doomsday preppers, and those completely convinced of "the end" do so because it removes responsibility.

They believe that if sh** hits the fan and the world becomes something from the Road Warrior, then things get a lot simpler and the worries and stresses of today's life will fall to the wayside. A steadfast belief in impending doom and gloom takes their future off their hands and removes them from the driver seat of their respective lives. For a lot of people, resigning to a belief that someone or something nefarious is truly in control and that all hope is lost, relieves them of any need to try to be "successful".

Then there are doom and gloomers who just have huge short positions

[GazR]

I think you'll find that many of we longer foreign residents here in Thailand, retired, working or bushiness operators are concerned when we see the same group of names and people who were closely involved in the 1997 meltdown involved in this current financial scene.

We lived through some challenging times, although for many of us it didn't hurt us, however we who have family ties here ( no pun intended) did see suffering in our family network and in fact around us in general.

Remember also that a number of us had and no doubt in many case also have recently experienced tumultuous financial tempests in our countries of origin or the countries where our investments and banking was or is carried out. hence the concern shown.

It is not a desire to see a failure of the financial system but a desire to see a properly regulated financial system in place, when one views the events elsewhere in the world of finance you can realise why there are fears regarding the current financial situation here.

We see the current situation in Cyprus which proves yet again in reality no sovereign state is in reality in control of its financial destiny, bankers, insurance companies and wealthy individuals etc control the movements of currency not governments.

We all want a settled stable economy, the current situation is in my view and many others too not as stable as one would wish to see, old experiences come back to haunt us, hence the ringing of those alarm bells.

What definitely seems UNSUSTAINABLE in the longer run here is an economy based on cheap labour and cheap exports.

[el jefe]

My rose colored glasses have a wide angle lense. One needs to look at Thai's politics, economy, and policies not in a vacuum, but compared to other countries in the region. Vietnam, China, Pakistan, Malaysia, Indonesia, Myanmar. One or two of those may be equally good places to invest (and live). The others are all run by the same "idiotic corrupt ministers" (your words) and they have equal political/social/economic problems. If Thailand collapses, the rest of Asia is going down with it.

This makes utterly no sense. Are you using the surrounding 3rd world/emerging nations at the measure of solvency & stability for Thailand? Or are you saying it's ok if the Thai economy collapses because at least the rest of Asia will too? Either way, you don't promote either side of this discussion on this thread.

If you don't understand how investment flows are determined, I can't help you.

I never said the Thai economy would collapse. Anything but.

But IF it did, it would not be the first Asian nation to go, and the west would be in even worse shape.

Is that easier to understand?

[yoshiwara]

Why are so many on here intent on western economies collapsing? We came from there, they educated us and gave us the chance to be here. Now some seem to be gleeful our friends and families are suffering.

As long as I'm alright, eh?

Lots of boomers who cashed in during the property bubble and bought in Thailand when the THB was weak, thus this shear stroke of luck fills one with an enormous sense of smugness, and an ability to claim they're some kind of financial genius.

I used to own a property agency up until about 7 years ago i had the privilege of meeting many of this ilk on the way up.

And so they were. They took a position. It paid off. That's it.

[davejones]

They are mostly unsuccessful people who came to Thailand to feel superior. If Thailand grows economically, it will kill them. They will be losers at home and even bigger losers in Thailand. They only place they can make themselves look good (in their own minds) is in a relatively poor country. They really can't bear to see the locals doing better than they are themselves. Some are already poorer than many Thais. They are just haters and losers. There is something seriously wrong with someone who actively wants a country like Thailand to fail.

[fasteddie]

Does it come natural or did you take lessons to talk such rubbish? It's got nothing to do with being hateful or feeling superior, it's just plain economics. I've been coming here since 1966 and love the place and have spent a lot of money here over the years. I'm just an ordinary working guy so the stronger the baht gets combined with the weakening pound the harder things get for me, and incidentally the small businesses, bars, guesthouses etc who depend on people like me. Ask the ordinary Thais what they think of it, believe me they're struggling with the lack of westerners here these days.

[yoshiwara]

They are mostly unsuccessful people who came to Thailand to feel superior. If Thailand grows economically, it will kill them. They will be losers at home and even bigger losers in Thailand. They only place they can make themselves look good (in their own minds) is in a relatively poor country. They really can't bear to see the locals doing better than they are themselves. Some are already poorer than many Thais. They are just haters and losers. There is something seriously wrong with someone who actively wants a country like Thailand to fail.

That reads a bit hateful and superior, no?

[MrWorldwide]

Does it come natural or did you take lessons to talk such rubbish? It's got nothing to do with being hateful or feeling superior, it's just plain economics. I've been coming here since 1966 and love the place and have spent a lot of money here over the years. I'm just an ordinary working guy so the stronger the baht gets combined with the weakening pound the harder things get for me, and incidentally the small businesses, bars, guesthouses etc who depend on people like me. Ask the ordinary Thais what they think of it, believe me they're struggling with the lack of westerners here these days.

Really ? The Thais working in factories around Chonburi or offices above Suk are struggling due to a lack of Westerners ?

[Naam]

Does it come natural or did you take lessons to talk such rubbish? It's got nothing to do with being hateful or feeling superior, it's just plain economics. I've been coming here since 1966 and love the place and have spent a lot of money here over the years. I'm just an ordinary working guy so the stronger the baht gets combined with the weakening pound the harder things get for me, and incidentally the small businesses, bars, guesthouses etc who depend on people like me. Ask the ordinary Thais what they think of it, believe me they're struggling with the lack of westerners here these days.

Really ? The Thais working in factories around Chonburi or offices above Suk are struggling due to a lack of Westerners ?

let's be fair. this is what FastEddie is referring to:

...the small businesses, bars, guesthouses etc who depend on people like me

[MrWorldwide]

OK - apologies - I retract my earlier comment.

[el jefe]

Does it come natural or did you take lessons to talk such rubbish? It's got nothing to do with being hateful or feeling superior, it's just plain economics. I've been coming here since 1966 and love the place and have spent a lot of money here over the years. I'm just an ordinary working guy so the stronger the baht gets combined with the weakening pound the harder things get for me, and incidentally the small businesses, bars, guesthouses etc who depend on people like me. Ask the ordinary Thais what they think of it, believe me they're struggling with the lack of westerners here these days.

Really ? The Thais working in factories around Chonburi or offices above Suk are struggling due to a lack of Westerners ?

let's be fair. this is what FastEddie is referring to:

>...the small businesses, bars, guesthouses etc who depend on people like me

no need for a retraction. fast eddie only deals with a small portion of the Thai population (and some of those bar and guesthouse owners are farang). The remaining 90% of the Thai population are happy with a strong baht. it's bizarre to think otherwise. Wouldn't you be happy with a strong pound/euro/$ ??

Thailand's economy is based on exports. While a weak baht would help the exporters, the average Thai wants a strong baht so his purchases are cheaper, just like you want your currency to be stronger. Govt's all want weaker currencies to help their exports. Unfortunately for most of us, the US, UK, and euro zone are doing a much better job at devaluing their currencies than the Thai govt is at devaluing theirs.

[MrWorldwide]

Disagree - I absolutely want the Australian dollar to drop back to parity with the USD. We lose jobs every time one of your exporters goes down the gurgler courtesy of the strong Aussie dollar, and for what ? So a few tourists can buy more fake Prada bags in Kuta and MBK ? For a 'success story', plenty of people in Oz are hurting ATM, and a lot of it is courtesy of our exchange rate. Anyone here who is doing cartwheels at the prospect of it going higher needs to remember the 80s in Oz, the first time we had a million unemployed - things were so bad I joined the Army. Unless they reinstate 'Dad's Army', I wont have that option this time around

[CMTourist]

When people are surveyed and offered the choice of earning 100 dollars and their neighbor earning 90, or earning 110 dollars and their neighbor earning 120, people overwhelmingly choose to earn 100 dollars rather than 110, just so long as they have more than their neighbor.

I too am surprised at the seeming hatred espoused by so many at every opportunity that the Thais are corrupt, lazy, can't do anything right and everything is about to collapse at every moment as its all built on lies or built wrong because it was built by stupid lazy corrupt Thais.

I think a lot of these people want to feel superior to their Thai neighbors, but as Thailand develops (and they get relatively and possibly absolutely poorer) that sense of superiority they used to feel is lost and they're desperate to have it back so they hope and pray for a Thai economic collapse and see signs of its impending arrival everywhere they look.

[PCA]

When people are surveyed and offered the choice of earning 100 dollars and their neighbor earning 90, or earning 110 dollars and their neighbor earning 120, people overwhelmingly choose to earn 100 dollars rather than 110, just so long as they have more than their neighbor.

I too am surprised at the seeming hatred espoused by so many at every opportunity that the Thais are corrupt, lazy, can't do anything right and everything is about to collapse at every moment as its all built on lies or built wrong because it was built by stupid lazy corrupt Thais.

I think a lot of these people want to feel superior to their Thai neighbors, but as Thailand develops (and they get relatively and possibly absolutely poorer) that sense of superiority they used to feel is lost and they're desperate to have it back so they hope and pray for a Thai economic collapse and see signs of its impending arrival everywhere they look.

I don't think anyone is interested to see a collapse as the consequences for anybody would be dire. I'ts all about the exchange rate as it hurts tourists, expats and the very majority of the Thais and their economy. This whole thread is just a joke in itself and should be listed under chit chat since it purely consists of provocation, miscommunication and nostalgia. Amen

[fasteddie]

el jefe, Actually none of the businesses I refer to are farang, and as there are
many less farang frequenting them, the baht can be as strong as it
likes, the Thais are just not earning them. Combined with the rising
prices, especially of food, things are not as Rosie for the ordinary
Thai as you would have us believe.

[MrWorldwide]

Ask anyone in the tourism industry here in Oz what a strong currency has done to their business .... the difference is that we were an expensive destination before our dollar shot up above parity with the USD - Thailand was much cheaper. I don't blame anyone in Asia or Eastern Russia for choosing Thailand over Oz - from the airfare to hotels to food, it's so much cheaper. I lived in Cairns for 8 months in 2008 and even back then tourism operators were constantly bitching about the drop in tourism numbers : I just cant imagine why any sane Japanese family would choose Cairns over Guam or Phuket / Langkawi / Singapore unless they had a burning desire to see a coral reef and go to a small casino. Big woop.

[copa8]

To answer the OP because many are not wearing rose glass's and are not fooled by the hub of idiotic corrupt ministers saying all is fine no need to panic, Thalland will not be affected by "...." insert any major event here.

Thailand is still very much a developing 3rd World Country whatever some people believe, the Baht is subjected to massive Currency inflows from Country’s that are about to experience financial mayhem (whatever some believe)

Thailand has one of the highest interest rates in Asia ...hence money looking for a home with reasonable return is flooding into Thailand...if you think this is not going to go bang well good for you; I know where My money will be and it is not sitting in the Thai stock market or Thai banks.

Too many people living here a couple of months/years view Thailand as a 1st World state, all I will say is yes it’s a state in fact it’s a mess

You are entitled to your views, as I am so lets see how it plays out, it will be very clear in the next couple of years

My rose colored glasses have a wide angle lense. One needs to look at Thai's politics, economy, and policies not in a vacuum, but compared to other countries in the region. Vietnam, China, Pakistan, Malaysia, Indonesia, Myanmar. One or two of those may be equally good places to invest (and live). The others are all run by the same "idiotic corrupt ministers" (your words) and they have equal political/social/economic problems. If Thailand collapses, the rest of Asia is going down with it.

that's putting too much weight on thailand. if asia goes down, then the rest of the world would too.

[allalong]

I'm not talking about a 'correction' - I'm talking about a full-blown '97 style collapse. I have seen several in this forum predicting that it will happen, and soon, and they clearly relish the prospect. Lets ignore the fact that the goalposts have moved 90 degrees since 1997, and that a very large chunk of the West is now dealing with its own 'crisis' - much easier to predict doom and gloom for Thailand.

If you want a cheap holiday amidst millions of unemployed people with little hope for the future, go to Spain. I'm mystified as to why the current prosperity in Thailand wounds some of us so deeply that we seem to want to see the place go down in flames - <deleted> is going on here ? Even if you were getting 100 baht to the pound or whatever post-collapse, would your quality of life in a bankrupt country be worth the hollow 'victory' of having been a faceless fortune teller on an internet forum.

Personally, I'm all for a correction and a stable baht somewhere around 30-31 US cents, but either way nothing I type here is going to amount to a hill of beans when the economists sit down each quarter to evaluate Thailand's performance. If the US gets it act together, inevitably the exchange rate will improve, but that has been lost in the hysteria around the 'impossibly strong' baht.

I understand the bitching about the visa system and the frustrations of life in someone else's country, but wanting to see that country fail economically is just self-defeating, IMO. I just dont know how anyone can look at this chart and tell me the 'problem' lies with Thailand, unless you know something about the US economy that Washington is clearly unaware of. Maybe the Thais who are responsible for the fact that the city of Detroit is completely bankrupt ? Cant wait to hear the haters' spin on that one ...

http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=USD&to=THB&view=10Y

If California can turn it around, surely there are enough smart people in the US to do the same in their own states ?

A rant with anecdotal info.fits in well with the thai visa posters you are attacking