Scammed Big Time

[heybruce]

I don't doubt the OP although the location I find a bit strange. It is normal practise for the kareoke bars along Chang Klan road to scam first time visitors. The scam includes the tuk tuk drivers and the local police who are all in on the scam. The tourist comes in and orders one drink, but is immediately surrounded by women who order everything under the sun and put it on the poor guy's tab. Then when he tries to leave he is presented with a bill of 20,000 baht. If he refuses to pay he is surrounded by thugs and the local police who are in on the scam. It's happened many times. I'm just surprised it happened on the moat road near Thai Pei gate. I've only had good experiences at the Blue Sky, Maddog, Johns and a bar that is open to the lane as well as the moat road. It's near Loi Kroh road. But, I seldom have more than one beer and then leave. I seldom order food.

From the description given, "come out of walking street through the gate, look to your right and walk approx 200 mtres it is on your left", I gather it is on the opposite side of the moat from the area of John's Bar.

[hellodolly]

I don't doubt the OP although the location I find a bit strange. It is normal practise for the kareoke bars along Chang Klan road to scam first time visitors. The scam includes the tuk tuk drivers and the local police who are all in on the scam. The tourist comes in and orders one drink, but is immediately surrounded by women who order everything under the sun and put it on the poor guy's tab. Then when he tries to leave he is presented with a bill of 20,000 baht. If he refuses to pay he is surrounded by thugs and the local police who are in on the scam. It's happened many times. I'm just surprised it happened on the moat road near Thai Pei gate. I've only had good experiences at the Blue Sky, Maddog, Johns and a bar that is open to the lane as well as the moat road. It's near Loi Kroh road. But, I seldom have more than one beer and then leave. I seldom order food.

From the description given, "come out of walking street through the gate, look to your right and walk approx 200 mtres it is on your left", I gather it is on the opposite side of the moat from the area of John's Bar.

Sounds right to me.

Can't really see it being any other way.

[dickyknee]

I don't doubt the OP although the location I find a bit strange. It is normal practise for the kareoke bars along Chang Klan road to scam first time visitors. The scam includes the tuk tuk drivers and the local police who are all in on the scam. The tourist comes in and orders one drink, but is immediately surrounded by women who order everything under the sun and put it on the poor guy's tab. Then when he tries to leave he is presented with a bill of 20,000 baht. If he refuses to pay he is surrounded by thugs and the local police who are in on the scam. It's happened many times. I'm just surprised it happened on the moat road near Thai Pei gate. I've only had good experiences at the Blue Sky, Maddog, Johns and a bar that is open to the lane as well as the moat road. It's near Loi Kroh road. But, I seldom have more than one beer and then leave. I seldom order food.

though you post some good observations about our town, on this instance you are full of shit.

I was talking to a young bloke tonight about the *scam* of the karaoke bars along Chang Klan tonight. he got done.

they are not a scam, they are though a huge trap for new players for those who dont understand the pricing structure. they are very open about how much what costs if you ask beforehand. easy to get sucked in with all the pretty ladies out the front, they'll cost you about 400baht each for 1 hour just to be in the room.

the pricing actually works out not too bad if you are in a group looking for a private function, though the cheap charlies won't get their 3 big changs happy hour there.

you cannot go into those joints alone and drink a beer and leave just paying for the beer. no scam, just ignorance.

[Thighlander]

I recall 5000 being the magic number to walk away from a piss test. Could always be a problem for fresh arrivals from the West, as it's legal in a lot of places (only weed).

[Throatwobbler]

The amount of slander that has been said against a long standing person of these pages is incredible.

If I ever get as old and sad as most of you on here please take me outside and shoot me.

The sad lives most of you live on here is incredible.

Is this what you really hoped you would turn out to be when you were younger.

Hulking around a computer screen waiting to slag everybody off and hoping it makes your life is better. Hey i showed that person what to do, He should know by know I am the saddest man in town and he better not challenge that.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

^ I would agree, if that was what happened.

Instead he was politely asked to clarify several things that didn't make sense (or seemed incomplete) in the original post, but instead wasn't able to do so, and hasn't been back since. (Just how vague and incomplete it was may not be readily apparent to forum members who don't go to bars regularly.)

End result: he wasted everyone's time. I still don't truly believe that was just a troll for his own amusement (or other purposes), but it ended up riling people up and wasting their time regardless. He could still come back and add more information of course; then we would actually have something to discuss other than the OP himself. In his position I would do that, possibly making a fresh start in a new topic, then ask the mods to close this one, which hasn't been productive.

Edited April 18, 2013 by WinnieTheKhwai

[Saan]

There seem to be a lot of Inspector Clouseaus on Thai Visa.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Ideally a topic wouldn't require any detective work (Clouseau-level or otherwise) to try and make sense of the topic content itself. People would just say "Wow, that sucks, thanks for the warning!! Here's what you could do in cases like this: ... etc. "

[Sharp]

Why would the brits be going into a french run place on their first night in Thailand, anyway? I thought they hated each other. Can't see the Bib coming to the rescue of a foreign bar owner, either. Blue Sky Bar? Rife with prossies.....No prices posted, I'm bailing, period.

I don't think anyone here will deny that there are loads of scams in LOS, but this was not one of them. Three barfines, perhaps? I know someone that had a 4000 THB bar bill, during a two hour layover at JFK, and that was 20 years ago.

What a totally ridiculous and unfounded comment

1.Blue Sky is a THAI run bar and have very well respected owners,no barfines allowed.

2.Certainly not full of "Prossies",very rare for a girl to come in on her own,mostly expats come in to play pool and drink cheap beer (Large Leo and Chang 60b all day!!!)

3.Me and many of my friends have been coming here most days for 4 years or so,and ran up bills that always tallied up.

4.Prices are shown on a Menu at the entrance to the bar,and menus are also behind the bar.

5.Im a Brit and have many french expat friends,most of the french i know like to associate with us rather than their occasional stuck up fellow countrymen in CM.

Get your facts straight

+1

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa app

[saakura]

Give the op some slack. Maybe he has taken ill and will be back to clarify his posting with some details. Being online could just mean that he is logged-in (like on a smart phone in wifi range), not necessarily reading the forum.

[Songhua]

Why would the brits be going into a french run place on their first night in Thailand, anyway? I thought they hated each other. Can't see the Bib coming to the rescue of a foreign bar owner, either. Blue Sky Bar? Rife with prossies.....No prices posted, I'm bailing, period.

I don't think anyone here will deny that there are loads of scams in LOS, but this was not one of them. Three barfines, perhaps? I know someone that had a 4000 THB bar bill, during a two hour layover at JFK, and that was 20 years ago.

What a totally ridiculous and unfounded comment

1.Blue Sky is a THAI run bar and have very well respected owners,no barfines allowed.

2.Certainly not full of "Prossies",very rare for a girl to come in on her own,mostly expats come in to play pool and drink cheap beer (Large Leo and Chang 60b all day!!!)

3.Me and many of my friends have been coming here most days for 4 years or so,and ran up bills that always tallied up.

4.Prices are shown on a Menu at the entrance to the bar,and menus are also behind the bar.

5.Im a Brit and have many french expat friends,most of the french i know like to associate with us rather than their occasional stuck up fellow countrymen in CM.

Get your facts straight

+1

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa app

They were Aussies, not Brits. But no difference - we're all just as scammable and probably all look the same to the French.

[rsokolowski]

I saw a scam like this in one of the bars in Phuket. The bar insists on a tab, and by the time it comes to pay the bill you will hopefully be too drunk to remember exactly how much you consumed, or what the prices were supposed to be. NEVER put your drinks on a tab in Thailand, ALWAYS pay as you go in a bar.

You just got a 5,675 baht lesson.

Edited April 19, 2013 by rsokolowski

[canman]

the 8th time mention.

can you please tell us what is written on the bill ???

What is this obssesion with some on here about what was written on the bar bill? What the hell differance does it make. The guy got ripped off and the BIB appear to be in on the scam, he has come on here to warn fellow board members and all he gets is a bunch of whingers asking BS questions and calling him a troll. <deleted> you lot behave like a bunch of old women.

[canman]

Is it possible that Chooka rang the bell?

That would answer a lot of questions.

Indeed and with friends from Australia who are not familiar with the customs in a Thai bar, I wouldn't be surprised that they rang the bell after a winning pool game without knowing what it actually means .

Every Aussie knows what it means to ring the bell.

[BookMan]

Is it possible that Chooka rang the bell?

That would answer a lot of questions.

Indeed and with friends from Australia who are not familiar with the customs in a Thai bar, I wouldn't be surprised that they rang the bell after a winning pool game without knowing what it actually means .

Every Aussie knows what it means to ring the bell.

Not true canman. I'm an Aussie and I have never heard of that term before.

[rsokolowski]

So what did the bill show? Surely they had a bill to present or they would have had no leg to stand on.

From the OP "My bill was 5,675 baht."

Seems pretty clear to me what was on the bill, not sure where the confusion is?

[canman]

Ideally a topic wouldn't require any detective work (Clouseau-level or otherwise) to try and make sense of the topic content itself. People would just say "Wow, that sucks, thanks for the warning!! Here's what you could do in cases like this: ... etc. "

A guy and his Aussie mates who were visiting town bought a few beers, played some pool, were presented with an outrageous bill were then carted of to the police station and extorted for the money. What more info do you need?? The op was crystal clear about what happened, what more do you need?? You eaither accept what the ops said as truth or you don't, he has no obligation to feed the idiot gossip hounds.

[daoyai]

The confusion is that the op didn't specify the items listed on the bill, why the charges, when asked, he ignores the question as well as most all questions on the topic.

[daoyai]

Idiot gossip hounds? How about concerned CM expats? All the questions posted were ignored leading to the troll speculation. Also the op in a later post reveals a crude cofrontational nature leading to further speculation on his character.

[canman]

Not true canman. I'm an Aussie and I have never heard of that term before.

Seriously?? I am guessing you are fairly young or never drank in a 'local' in Aus??

I guess that I stand corrected, I lived 20 years in Aus and I am fairly sure that every bar I have ever been in has a bell. Possibly it is a dying tradition and newer bars have dispensed with the tradition. Come to think of it, with the price of a drink in Aus these days I could understand the bells being taken down for lack of use.

[2unique]

Bought 2 girls behind the bar a drink one for a friend and one for the owner in a bar on Soi 20 a little while back when walking home at 2am.

Cheerfully tipsy the bill when it came sobered me up.

Beer was up from 90 baht to 120, whisky 110 to 170 and somehow one girl had made and consumed a cocktail w/out anyone noticing. I queried the prices and they were adamant that they were right despite being a regular in that bar.

I said, ok, I'm happy to pay once you tell me how comes there are 5 of us here and you've charged me for 6 drinks... silence.

I picked up the bill, handed it to the owner (who had said nothing throughout and was trying to ignore the whole mess) and said, that's yours now fella, see ya later.

He knew, I knew, nothing was said, I walked away....

Sent from Android please excuse errors in type or judgement

Edited April 19, 2013 by 2unique

[worgeordie]

So the lesson is pay as you go,buy the drinks ,pay for them, Never run a tab.

Regards Worgeordie.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Ideally a topic wouldn't require any detective work (Clouseau-level or otherwise) to try and make sense of the topic content itself. People would just say "Wow, that sucks, thanks for the warning!! Here's what you could do in cases like this: ... etc. "

A guy and his Aussie mates who were visiting town bought a few beers, played some pool, were presented with an outrageous bill were then carted of to the police station and extorted for the money. What more info do you need?? The op was crystal clear about what happened, what more do you need?? You eaither accept what the ops said as truth or you don't, he has no obligation to feed the idiot gossip hounds.

I strongly suspect there was more to it than that. It's not that people here want to see a photocopy of the bill, they want to know *what the charge was for*.

You may have never seen a bar in Thailand from the inside, but when the bill shows up, it shows everything that you consumed. It's not a blank piece of paper with a number written on it. OP has spent three hours on the forum yesterday without answering this obvious question, but did however find time for insults. He said they had 9 beers. That would take some doing to get to 5000+ baht, either the charge per drink would have to be ludicrous, or there would have to be additional charges for things they didn't consume, or charges for whatever else. All of that remains Clouseau-speculation, because the OP so far hasn't bothered to respond.

The bar in question is long running,and on a main road. The OP was smart enough not to name it directly, but provided enough information to defame the place. There will always be some people taking any anonymous forum post at face value, but I've seen enough of this forum, and enough Farangs in bars, to be a little more cautious.

And yes, I still think there is a fair chance that the OP is mostly right, and the bar was playing dirty. So far I haven't heard enough information to tell which it is. Sorry for not being ready to bring out the tar and feathers immediately, based on a vague original post on a forum, and subsequent ignoring of relevant questions and concerns.

Edited April 19, 2013 by WinnieTheKhwai

[VillageIdiot]

You and your mates sound like rough trade.

Maybe you got a lesson in what it's like on the seedy side of town.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

So the lesson is pay as you go,buy the drinks ,pay for them, Never run a tab.

Regards Worgeordie.

I dislike bars that don't run a tab for their customers though. Mostly places that get a lot of backpacker types. Also the tab is right in front of you in a cup; yes, do check it, but I don't see any harm in the concept. One thing I would say is that if you're with a group then run separate tabs per person. It can quickly get difficult to see who ordered what, especially when drinks for the staff are involved.

Edited April 19, 2013 by WinnieTheKhwai

[WinnieTheKhwai]

You and your mates sound like rough trade.

Maybe you got a lesson in what it's like on the seedy side of town.

Yes, this would never happen in a respectable area like Chang Klan, Chiang Mai Land or near the Chedi Hotel.

(Hint: the reason this raises so much doubt and discussion is because it's so uncommon in the tourist bars, especially for the large discrepancy alleged here. If the OP had been about some karaoke on Chiang Mai Land then more people would have accepted it. )

Edited April 19, 2013 by WinnieTheKhwai

[xen]

I have no reason to doubt the OP. He's normally a genuine poster and anyone who's followed his posts will be well aware of his personal background/career.

This is a nasty type of scam - anyone remember the days when the rule was 'do not go to upstairs bars in Patpong'? Bills of 3,000 baht for a beer or two were common and they locked you in until you paid up (or, if you didn't, they simply took everything out of your wallet and threw you out the back door).

I also don't doubt Chooka. It does happen . It also happened to me first to Thailand and i think it was the last time i went to Patpong when a very friendly thai chappie asked me if i had everseen a ping pong show . Noooo money, Freeeeeee show he said . Being natually curious why they would be playing table tennis at 12.30 in the morning and upstairs too , i accepted his invitation. It was not what this country boy expected to see i can tell you and then when i said i have had enough stories to tell my mates back home they suddenly weren't so friendly and demanded 1500 bath to go back down the stairs without falling. After a quick evaluation of the situation and doing a brief risk assesment i found my last two thousand baht in my wallet. I still can't understand why they took the attitude they did when i asked for the change and a receipt.

[uptheos]

Since the OP says it's true, why doesn't someone there visit the place, name the place and ask about their friend from a day or two ago that paid a lot for a couple of beers. No slander, no libel, just the facts.

The OP is smart in not specifically naming the place, if he did the moderator would have to delete the name or the post. In Thailand even the facts can be prosecuted as libel if someone takes offense at the implications.

Yes, I keep reading this and find it intriguing.

Any chance of a link that shows someone being prosecuted for libel, by a foreign bar owner?

Or something / anything similar?

How about someone being prosecuted for reporting evidence of migrant labor abuses?

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/624318-british-activist-fighting-to-avoid-thai-jail-term/?hl=%20activist

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/thailand/9900745/British-human-rights-activist-faces-Thai-jail-threat.html

Here's an older one about a woman charged after reporting the obvious, that Thaksin affiliated companies enjoyed huge profit growth after he became Prime Minister:

http://www.humanrights.asia/news/urgent-appeals/UA-73-2004

And an interesting story in the Bangkok Post about Thailands' libel laws:

Makes a mockery of the cliche "The truth will set you free."

Migrant labour abuses, Aung San Suu Kyi. Thaksin etc.!!

I was hoping for a local bar owner that has successfully sued someone for naming and shaming them, or something similar like a local restaurant for calling its food <deleted>.

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

I don't think troll because a troll would be in fanning the flames.

Maybe OP sobered up or was informed about some details overlooked.

No big deal... Should come back and fill us in.

No need to abandon a well cultivated username/account

[rixalex]

No need to abandon a well cultivated username/account

What better way to cultivate than with some fertilizer...