Honda cbr650 2014

[WingNut]

Thanks II2. Good idea to use the sliders for groceries! Yes, I agree, a 3 prong frame slider is the best. They do seem pretty strong and I bumped my leg on the left one already while riding and it hurt a bit. Ha-ha.

I have seen many single mount engine sliders like the one you mentioned and they look too weak. Even if the bolt doesn't crack, I am not sure how strong they would be in a fall with only one mount. So I think a 3 prong is really needed. The Yoshimura frame sliders on my CBR250R seem a lot stronger because they are mounted at 3 points right onto the frame. This is an engine slider and doesn't look like it has the same leverage and I am honestly not sure how well they would hold up in a hard fall. If the bike just fell when stationary they would probably protect it, but in a crash I am not sure how much protection they would really add.

Thanks also for the advice not to make the bolts too tight. I had though the same myself. The left one, which I put on myself, I made sure not to make the screws or the bolt too tight, but the right one was put on by the guy at the shop after he repaired the spacer. So when I got home I loosened the Hex screws a bit because I thought he might have put them on too tight.

The size 14 socket I had borrowed though from someone and already returned it so I don't have a size 14 socket on hand to test the tightness of the big bolt on the right side to see if he made it too tight too. But I will try to borrow a socket again and test it soon.

Every time I go somewhere to have someone put something on my bike though I always get scared they are going to damage something. I don't really want to do any more mods to this bike because I feel with many mods there is always some sacrifice even though something is gained. Even when the RSV shop shaved down the spacer they shaved it down a bit too much so it isn't snug inside the whole. It doesn't make any difference really because it is mainly for decoration to cover the bolt, but it is just knowing that things are often not done with precision that is disappointing.

A lot of the stuff I see the mechanics do here is not impressive in general. The only guys who seem professional, and know what they are doing that I have seen so far, are the Big Wing mechanics. Everywhere else I go though most of them seem somewhat like hackers. Even the smaller Honda dealer service centers I am afraid to say. And a lot of the shops doing mods can be really worrying when you got an expensive bike that they might damage. The guys are always nice, and friendly, but the work is never top notch.

Right when I got the bike I had one of the well known shops put on an aftermarket horn for me. It was bigger than the original stock horn and not so easy to mount in the place where the horn goes. So he wedged it up against the left fork. It seemed OK because it moves up and down with the fork and wasn't really rubbing against the fork, but it really bothered me that it was resting up against the fork and today I just took it out and went back to the original horn. A waste of time and money frankly.

From now on, anything I am capable of doing myself I decided I will do instead of risk having some shop do something to the bike I am not satisfied with. The only guys I want working on my bike from now on for any reason is Big Wing and that's it I think.

Attached is a photo of the aftermarket horn I removed and how it looked when it was mounted.

[ll2]

Thanks II2. Good idea to use the sliders for groceries! Yes, I agree, a 3 prong frame slider is the best. They do seem pretty strong and I bumped my leg on the left one already while riding and it hurt a bit. Ha-ha.

I have seen many single mount engine sliders like the one you mentioned and they look too weak. Even if the bolt doesn't crack, I am not sure how strong they would be in a fall with only one mount. So I think a 3 prong is really needed. The Yoshimura frame sliders on my CBR250R seem a lot stronger because they are mounted at 3 points right onto the frame. This is an engine slider and doesn't look like it has the same leverage and I am honestly not sure how well they would hold up in a hard fall. If the bike just fell when stationary they would probably protect it, but in a crash I am not sure how much protection they would really add.

Thanks also for the advice not to make the bolts too tight. I had though the same myself. The left one, which I put on myself, I made sure not to make the screws or the bolt too tight, but the right one was put on by the guy at the shop after he repaired the spacer. So when I got home I loosened the Hex screws a bit because I thought he might have put them on too tight.

The size 14 socket I had borrowed though from someone and already returned it so I don't have a size 14 socket on hand to test the tightness of the big bolt on the right side to see if he made it too tight too. But I will try to borrow a socket again and test it soon.

Every time I go somewhere to have someone put something on my bike though I always get scared they are going to damage something. I don't really want to do any more mods to this bike because I feel with many mods there is always some sacrifice even though something is gained. Even when the RSV shop shaved down the spacer they shaved it down a bit too much so it isn't snug inside the whole. It doesn't make any difference really because it is mainly for decoration to cover the bolt, but it is just knowing that things are often not done with precision that is disappointing.

A lot of the stuff I see the mechanics do here is not impressive in general. The only guys who seem professional, and know what they are doing that I have seen so far, are the Big Wing mechanics. Everywhere else I go though most of them seem somewhat like hackers. Even the smaller Honda dealer service centers I am afraid to say. And a lot of the shops doing mods can be really worrying when you got an expensive bike that they might damage. The guys are always nice, and friendly, but the work is never top notch.

Right when I got the bike I had one of the well known shops put on an aftermarket horn for me. It was bigger than the original stock horn and not so easy to mount in the place where the horn goes. So he wedged it up against the left fork. It seemed OK because it moves up and down with the fork and wasn't really rubbing against the fork, but it really bothered me that it was resting up against the fork and today I just took it out and went back to the original horn. A waste of time and money frankly.

From now on, anything I am capable of doing myself I decided I will do instead of risk having some shop do something to the bike I am not satisfied with. The only guys I want working on my bike from now on for any reason is Big Wing and that's it I think.

Attached is a photo of the aftermarket horn I removed and how it looked when it was mounted.

horn does not work there. it touches to fender somehow.

so they put mine inside up the big left front fairing. much more better.

yep, very hard to find good mechs here!

[WingNut]

Thanks II2. Good idea to use the sliders for groceries! Yes, I agree, a 3 prong frame slider is the best. They do seem pretty strong and I bumped my leg on the left one already while riding and it hurt a bit. Ha-ha.

I have seen many single mount engine sliders like the one you mentioned and they look too weak. Even if the bolt doesn't crack, I am not sure how strong they would be in a fall with only one mount. So I think a 3 prong is really needed. The Yoshimura frame sliders on my CBR250R seem a lot stronger because they are mounted at 3 points right onto the frame. This is an engine slider and doesn't look like it has the same leverage and I am honestly not sure how well they would hold up in a hard fall. If the bike just fell when stationary they would probably protect it, but in a crash I am not sure how much protection they would really add.

Thanks also for the advice not to make the bolts too tight. I had though the same myself. The left one, which I put on myself, I made sure not to make the screws or the bolt too tight, but the right one was put on by the guy at the shop after he repaired the spacer. So when I got home I loosened the Hex screws a bit because I thought he might have put them on too tight.

The size 14 socket I had borrowed though from someone and already returned it so I don't have a size 14 socket on hand to test the tightness of the big bolt on the right side to see if he made it too tight too. But I will try to borrow a socket again and test it soon.

Every time I go somewhere to have someone put something on my bike though I always get scared they are going to damage something. I don't really want to do any more mods to this bike because I feel with many mods there is always some sacrifice even though something is gained. Even when the RSV shop shaved down the spacer they shaved it down a bit too much so it isn't snug inside the whole. It doesn't make any difference really because it is mainly for decoration to cover the bolt, but it is just knowing that things are often not done with precision that is disappointing.

A lot of the stuff I see the mechanics do here is not impressive in general. The only guys who seem professional, and know what they are doing that I have seen so far, are the Big Wing mechanics. Everywhere else I go though most of them seem somewhat like hackers. Even the smaller Honda dealer service centers I am afraid to say. And a lot of the shops doing mods can be really worrying when you got an expensive bike that they might damage. The guys are always nice, and friendly, but the work is never top notch.

Right when I got the bike I had one of the well known shops put on an aftermarket horn for me. It was bigger than the original stock horn and not so easy to mount in the place where the horn goes. So he wedged it up against the left fork. It seemed OK because it moves up and down with the fork and wasn't really rubbing against the fork, but it really bothered me that it was resting up against the fork and today I just took it out and went back to the original horn. A waste of time and money frankly.

From now on, anything I am capable of doing myself I decided I will do instead of risk having some shop do something to the bike I am not satisfied with. The only guys I want working on my bike from now on for any reason is Big Wing and that's it I think.

Attached is a photo of the aftermarket horn I removed and how it looked when it was mounted.

horn does not work there. it touches to fender somehow.

so they put mine inside up the big left front fairing. much more better.

yep, very hard to find good mechs here!

Thanks. If it wouldn't be too much trouble to snap a quick photo of how you mounted yours and upload it, it would be nice to see it.

I did notice a possible place in the left fairing for it, but wasn't sure if it would fit there and was wondering about possible vibration.

[ll2]

Thanks II2. Good idea to use the sliders for groceries! Yes, I agree, a 3 prong frame slider is the best. They do seem pretty strong and I bumped my leg on the left one already while riding and it hurt a bit. Ha-ha.

I have seen many single mount engine sliders like the one you mentioned and they look too weak. Even if the bolt doesn't crack, I am not sure how strong they would be in a fall with only one mount. So I think a 3 prong is really needed. The Yoshimura frame sliders on my CBR250R seem a lot stronger because they are mounted at 3 points right onto the frame. This is an engine slider and doesn't look like it has the same leverage and I am honestly not sure how well they would hold up in a hard fall. If the bike just fell when stationary they would probably protect it, but in a crash I am not sure how much protection they would really add.

Thanks also for the advice not to make the bolts too tight. I had though the same myself. The left one, which I put on myself, I made sure not to make the screws or the bolt too tight, but the right one was put on by the guy at the shop after he repaired the spacer. So when I got home I loosened the Hex screws a bit because I thought he might have put them on too tight.

The size 14 socket I had borrowed though from someone and already returned it so I don't have a size 14 socket on hand to test the tightness of the big bolt on the right side to see if he made it too tight too. But I will try to borrow a socket again and test it soon.

Every time I go somewhere to have someone put something on my bike though I always get scared they are going to damage something. I don't really want to do any more mods to this bike because I feel with many mods there is always some sacrifice even though something is gained. Even when the RSV shop shaved down the spacer they shaved it down a bit too much so it isn't snug inside the whole. It doesn't make any difference really because it is mainly for decoration to cover the bolt, but it is just knowing that things are often not done with precision that is disappointing.

A lot of the stuff I see the mechanics do here is not impressive in general. The only guys who seem professional, and know what they are doing that I have seen so far, are the Big Wing mechanics. Everywhere else I go though most of them seem somewhat like hackers. Even the smaller Honda dealer service centers I am afraid to say. And a lot of the shops doing mods can be really worrying when you got an expensive bike that they might damage. The guys are always nice, and friendly, but the work is never top notch.

Right when I got the bike I had one of the well known shops put on an aftermarket horn for me. It was bigger than the original stock horn and not so easy to mount in the place where the horn goes. So he wedged it up against the left fork. It seemed OK because it moves up and down with the fork and wasn't really rubbing against the fork, but it really bothered me that it was resting up against the fork and today I just took it out and went back to the original horn. A waste of time and money frankly.

From now on, anything I am capable of doing myself I decided I will do instead of risk having some shop do something to the bike I am not satisfied with. The only guys I want working on my bike from now on for any reason is Big Wing and that's it I think.

Attached is a photo of the aftermarket horn I removed and how it looked when it was mounted.

horn does not work there. it touches to fender somehow.

so they put mine inside up the big left front fairing. much more better.

yep, very hard to find good mechs here!

Thanks. If it wouldn't be too much trouble to snap a quick photo of how you mounted yours and upload it, it would be nice to see it.

I did notice a possible place in the left fairing for it, but wasn't sure if it would fit there and was wondering about possible vibration.

i will do that. not a problem.

[WingNut]

Thanks. Are you using the same horn or another brand? I am just wondering about size.

I am actually not crazy about the sound of this horn I got. It is loud, but has an awkward tone.

I got a great horn on my CBR250R which sounds like a cross between a car horn and an air horn. But it has a double horn and it needed an extra power relay to wire it in. More of a headache to hook up, but sounds really cool, deep, and loud. Don't think I can hook that up on this bike without a lot of hassle though.

Edited February 13, 2015 by WingNut

[dave_boo]

Thanks. Are you using the same horn or another brand? I am just wondering about size.

I am actually not crazy about the sound of this horn I got. It is loud, but has an awkward tone.

I got a great horn on my CBR250R which sounds like a cross between a car horn and an air horn. But it has a double horn and it needed an extra power relay to wire it in. More of a headache to hook up, but sounds really cool, deep, and loud. Don't think I can hook that up on this bike without a lot of hassle though.

I have the Denali Soundbomb on my CB500X. It is claimed to be compact, but there was absolutely nowhere to mount it up front. I ended up mounting it to the inside of my panniers rack. Biggest issue is that it comes with a really short ground cable. I need to sort that out. The plus is that it's bloody loud. We're talking make a dog shit itself loud (seriously happened one time...dog was not looking and started out...I honked and he jumped back to the kerb and left a turd on the street).

[WingNut]

Thanks. Are you using the same horn or another brand? I am just wondering about size.

I am actually not crazy about the sound of this horn I got. It is loud, but has an awkward tone.

I got a great horn on my CBR250R which sounds like a cross between a car horn and an air horn. But it has a double horn and it needed an extra power relay to wire it in. More of a headache to hook up, but sounds really cool, deep, and loud. Don't think I can hook that up on this bike without a lot of hassle though.

I have the Denali Soundbomb on my CB500X. It is claimed to be compact, but there was absolutely nowhere to mount it up front. I ended up mounting it to the inside of my panniers rack. Biggest issue is that it comes with a really short ground cable. I need to sort that out. The plus is that it's bloody loud. We're talking make a dog shit itself loud (seriously happened one time...dog was not looking and started out...I honked and he jumped back to the kerb and left a turd on the street).

Haha. Nice. Maybe the manufacturer will want to use that customer case study as part of their next marketing campaign: "Our horns are so loud they can make your neighbors dog shit itself".

I think if its are too loud though I heard the BIB can make problems about it if they want.

[WingNut]

I looked at it on the site. It definitely looks cool and I'm sure it's the bomb. Maybe we can get Anthony from Revzilla to do a video on it and link in the dog shitting itself as customer testimony. Haha.

[dave_boo]

Haha. Nice. Maybe the manufacturer will want to use that customer case study as part of their next marketing campaign: "Our horns are so loud they can make your neighbors dog shit itself".

I think if its are too loud though I heard the BIB can make problems about it if they want.

Perhaps the police can; but considering the number of homemade trucks using Kubota engines that have straight though pipes (and appropriately loud note) I'm not too worried about it. If it saves me one collision it could probably pay for a whole bunch of tickets.

[WingNut]

Amen.

[WingNut]

Has anyone tried putting a larger back tire on this bike? One like the size of the neck tire on the Kawasaki Z8? I think it's a 90.

[eisfeld]

Both the Honda 650 and the Kawa Z800 have the exact same size tires.

Front: 120/70-​17

Back: 180/55-​17

[ll2]

Has anyone tried putting a larger back tire on this bike? One like the size of the neck tire on the Kawasaki Z8? I think it's a 90.

no need for that and actually it will make the bike harder to ride.

harder turn ins, less acceleration etc. bike will feel heavier.

better go one size down than one size up!

[seedy]

Has anyone tried putting a larger back tire on this bike? One like the size of the neck tire on the Kawasaki Z8? I think it's a 90.

Most tire companies post tire dimensions.

Measure your swingarm width - front and back, the distance from tire contact patch to front of swingarm. Also measure distance from tire sidewall at its widest point to the chain.

This will give you the info to decide on which tire will fit.

Just be aware of tire diameter - or tire circumference - however the companies list them.

Generally a wider tire will have more resistance to being leaned over, but will give better straight line acceleration in the case of a rear tire.

Also, a wider tire will have less weight on it per square cm, which will allow it to aquaplane sooner that a more narrow tire, all other factors like tread depth, void-to-rubber-ratio, and compound being equal.

[ll2]

Has anyone tried putting a larger back tire on this bike? One like the size of the neck tire on the Kawasaki Z8? I think it's a 90.

Most tire companies post tire dimensions.

Measure your swingarm width - front and back, the distance from tire contact patch to front of swingarm. Also measure distance from tire sidewall at its widest point to the chain.

This will give you the info to decide on which tire will fit.

Just be aware of tire diameter - or tire circumference - however the companies list them.

Generally a wider tire will have more resistance to being leaned over, but will give better straight line acceleration in the case of a rear tire.

Also, a wider tire will have less weight on it per square cm, which will allow it to aquaplane sooner that a more narrow tire, all other factors like tread depth, void-to-rubber-ratio, and compound being equal.

wider tire will never give better straight line acceleration than a thinner tire. they give better traction and grip on dry but even that is debatable for some.

[eisfeld]

Better traction translates to better acceleration (and breaking) if the engine has enough power and if the front wheel stays down.

But for these bikes I'd say the 180 tire fitted as stock is really the right choice, I think you'll likely mess up the handling with a wider tire.

[seedy]

wider tire will never give better straight line acceleration than a thinner tire.

I guess the worlds drag racers got it wrong then.

[ll2]

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Better traction translates to better acceleration (and breaking) if the engine has enough power and if the front wheel stays down.

But for these bikes I'd say the 180 tire fitted as stock is really the right choice, I think you'll likely mess up the handling with a wider tire.

a narrow tire has less contact patch on the road there fore less friction and that means better acceleration.

wider tire will never give better straight line acceleration than a thinner tire.

I guess the worlds drag racers got it wrong then.

It is true that wider tires commonly have better traction. The main reason why this is so does not relate to contact patch, however, but to composition. Soft compound tires are required to be wider in order for the side-wall to support the weight of the car. softer tires have a larger coefficient of friction, therefore better traction. A narrow, soft tire would not be strong enough, nor would it last very long. Wear in a tire is related to contact patch. Harder compound tires wear much longer, and can be narrower. They do, however have a lower coefficient of friction, therefore less traction. Among tires of the same type and composition, here is no appreciable difference in 'traction' with different widths. Wider tires, assuming all other factors are equal, commonly have stiffer side-walls and experience less roll. This gives better cornering performance.

Answered by: Daryl Garner, M.S., Physics teacher MacArthur High School, Lawton, OK


Friction is proportional to the normal force of the asphalt acting upon the car tires. This force is simply equal to the weight which is distributed to each tire when the car is on level ground. Force can be stated as Pressure X Area. For a wide tire, the area is large but the force per unit area is small and vice versa. The force of friction is therefore the same whether the tire is wide or not. However, asphalt is not a uniform surface. Even with steamrollers to flatten the asphalt, the surface is still somewhat irregular, especially over the with of a tire. Drag racers can therefore increase the probability or likelihood of making contact with the road by using a wider tire. In addition a secondary benefit is that the wider tire increased the support base and makes it hard to turn the car over in a turn or in a mishap.

Answered by: Stephen Scholla, B.A., Physics Teacher, Vienna, Virginia

Edited February 18, 2015 by ll2

[WingNut]

Thanks for all the feedback on tire size. Anyway, I think I made a mistake. Perhaps it was a Z1000 I was looking at with a larger rear tire which I believe was a 190?

[RubberSideDown]

The Z1000 has a 190/50 ZR17, the same as my bike- you're better off staying with a 55 profile.

[seedy]

Thanks for making my point in a more than one sentence reply.

[WingNut]

I like the idea of a wider back tire because it looks meaner. But if it's going to create more drag and friction and slow the bike down then I definitely wouldn't want it.

Does the Hyabusa also have a 190/50 on the back?

[WingNut]

accidental double post.

Edited February 18, 2015 by WingNut

[seedy]

I like the idea of a wider back tire because it looks meaner. But if it's going to create more drag and friction and slow the bike down then I definitely wouldn't want it.

Does the Hyabusa also have a 190/50 on the back?

'Busa - don't know. But I doubt you will get a much bigger tire on without chain clearance problems.

I have found that it is best to stay with the manufacturers decisions re: tire size. Much work - and much testing - has gone into picking the size of tire which is the best compromise between fuel economy, cornering, straight line acceleration.

You can experiment with the same size tire but a softer compound for track days, and a harder compound for touring.

Spare wheels are not that expensive here, and a second set all mounted and balanced would not take much time to swap.

And look at the bright size - with 4 tires they would last twice as long !

[RubberSideDown]

You might find this comparison interesting. I'm about due for a new rear (so far I'm liking the Pilot Power 3) so I'm researching sizes- maybe I'll go to a 55 profile from a 50- and I found this comparison chart. The +19mm height difference of going to a 55 profile would be about the equivalent of going up a tooth in the rear. I can fit a 200, but I'll likely stick with the stability of the 190/50.

[WingNut]

You might find this comparison interesting. I'm about due for a new rear (so far I'm liking the Pilot Power 3) so I'm researching sizes- maybe I'll go to a 55 profile from a 50- and I found this comparison chart. The +19mm height difference of going to a 55 profile would be about the equivalent of going up a tooth in the rear. I can fit a 200, but I'll likely stick with the stability of the 190/50.

image.jpg

Sounds good. Which bike would you be putting that tire on? And what advantages are you anticipating getting from that tire size change?

[eisfeld]

ll2: both your quoted answers make the point against you

Traction is the friction between wheel and ground, the power you can get from the engine to the asphalt and accellerate.

Low friction (narrow, hard compound): tire spinning

High friction (wide, soft compound): no spinning, accelleration

[RubberSideDown]

You might find this comparison interesting. I'm about due for a new rear (so far I'm liking the Pilot Power 3) so I'm researching sizes- maybe I'll go to a 55 profile from a 50- and I found this comparison chart. The +19mm height difference of going to a 55 profile would be about the equivalent of going up a tooth in the rear. I can fit a 200, but I'll likely stick with the stability of the 190/50.

image.jpg

Sounds good. Which bike would you be putting that tire on? And what advantages are you anticipating getting from that tire size change?

A Kawasaki ZX-14R. Going from a 50 to a 55 would give me a tire with a narrower profile, which would take less effort to lean the bike into a turn- considering how long I've been riding on a 50, I would imagine it would take some getting used to, as there would be a (perceived) lack of stability until I got a feel for it. The larger diameter of the 55, however, would have a slight change on my gearing, making it a bit taller, which would have a marginal (negative) effect on acceleration, though it wouldn't be very noticeable.

Going from a 190 to a 200 would look cool from a 'fat tire' perspective, but it would somewhat increase the effort it would take to lean the bike into a turn.

I'm still trying to find out if there would be a detrimental effect as far as traction control is concerned if I change tire sizes- probably not, but I'll likely stick with the OEM size.

Another factor worthy of consideration is weigh- something like a Pirelli Supercorsa would really be wasted on my bike from a performance perspective and I'd burn through it in 3K kilometers (and it doesn't come in a 50 profile- only 55), but it weighs over 1lb less than the other tires I'm considering- that's a not-insubstantial drop in rotating mass.

Edited February 18, 2015 by RubberSideDown

[Gweiloman]

You might find this comparison interesting. I'm about due for a new rear (so far I'm liking the Pilot Power 3) so I'm researching sizes- maybe I'll go to a 55 profile from a 50- and I found this comparison chart. The +19mm height difference of going to a 55 profile would be about the equivalent of going up a tooth in the rear. I can fit a 200, but I'll likely stick with the stability of the 190/50.

image.jpg

Going from a 190/50 to a 190/55 would, according to the chart, give an additional 3% life to the rear tire, not that it matters at all, haha.

On most of the forums on the Ninja 1000, a lot of posters advocate changing the OEM to a 190/55 as this allows the bike to turn in quicker and make it more maneuverable . I must admit that riding the N1k in Pattaya at slow speeds is a bit of a challenge as it takes quite a bit of effort to turn the bike in the city traffic.

[dave_boo]

In addition to what RSD mentioned in regards to weight and profile from having to 'squeeze' a wider tyre in, different tyres have different profiles. So going from stock Dunlops to Pirellis that are a bit wider may actually keep the same feel as the Dunlops may have a 'flatter' profile than the Pirellis.