Aussies a drain on Phuket hospitals

[oldsailor35]

I have a bill owing to a Thai private hospital for emergency treatment that saved my life. It was in the region of 1.4 million Baht when I left the hospital to transfer to a local hospital which covered me under the Thai social system as I work and pay tax here. Every month 50K from my salary goes to the hospital having been guaranteed by my employer. This leaves me with a very tight budget to live on BUT there is no way I could consider not paying this back.

Maybe the leading tourist nations could each pay an amount each year into the Thai system (accessible by Private and Govt Hospitals) and with the full details of each of their citizens (that don't have full travel insurance) being recorded at each admission simply add the cost onto their future tax bills?

Admittedly there way be certain elements that might profit from this locally however the threat of tax impositions may well encourage people to arrange insurance cover prior to travelling which then benefits that govt through taxes on the companies doing normal business.

I would have thought that any intelligent person working in Thailand, for what obviously must be a foreign company, would have negotiated for health insurance in his salary package .

Why would it 'obviously be a foreign company'?

OK! any company then. However i think that the op must have some very special talent to be holding a Thai job at 50K rather than a Thai doing the same job. And with that talent, he should have been able to negotiate health insurance as the Thai company would know that he will need it working here.

[GAZZPA]

If you go abroad for whatever reason you should cover yourself with medical insurance. If you can't afford to pay the medical insurance premiums then perhaps people should not be going abroad as they clearly don't have enough money for any emergencies. I think it is wrong to point out the Australians if they account for the largest proportion of tourists in Phuket but it is right to say that tourists should not put a strain on local services when a guest in the country.

I think compulsory medical insurance as part of your visa application for anyone staying over 2 weeks is sensible as long as you are free to chose the insurance company. Anyone staying under 2 weeks or under for a holiday should cover it in their travel insurance.

[MaxYakov]

In Chiang Mai, they have a unique way of insuring payment or at least some modicum of restitution. I had a solo motorbike accident here and was bang up pretty good. I was transported to a local hospital but before that, the license tag on my motorbike (which I own and was pick up by some friends) was taken off and provided to hospital staff when I was checked in. It was given back to me when I paid my bill in cash later.

I heard one story where an injured farang was refused admittance to a hospital and he died in route to an alternate - a credit card (and passport?) was required. I often wonder if I should carry my passport and credit card at all times so they can pry them from my cold, (almost?) dead fingers.

Edited August 9, 2013 by MaxYakov

[oldsailor35]

I would not call this a drain on the local hospital system. Going by the figures in the news article, over a 12 month period there are 360,000 Aussie visitors to Phuket. The total drain on the hospitals over one year is 4m baht. So even if it was only Aussies needing medical attention, that only equates to 110 baht per person. Include all the other foreign visitors http://www.phuketland.com/phuket_links/touristinfo.htm - 2.5 million in 2005 and we are looking at about 15 baht per person. Add a 20 baht levy onto every visa and the problem is solved with a tidy profit to the hospitals.

By the way, if each of those tourists only used the ATM once while on holiday the return to Thailand would be around 375 million baht. Go figure ...

Excellent ! that shoots them all down in flames !

[SOTIRIOS]

.......I don't see anything based on actual figures...statistics....

...seems like foreigner-bashing again....

....maybe the hospital should be investigated for misappropriation of funds...which, it seems, is very common in Thailand....

....not to mention...falling from a hotel balcony...seems to me the hotel should be held liable and cover it with their insurance......

....30,000 tourists in any given month....that's a lot of hotel rooms....a lot of cash being dished out.....isn't that enough......

...are there 30,000 Thais in Phuket that spend as much as the tourists....on any given month....I doubt it.....

.........hypocrits.....bigots.....

.....rob the foreigners.........not to mention...drug them...or kill them......then blame them...insult them...if something goes wrong....get rid of them..

....Thais are so perfect....blameless.......and responsible for nothing bad.......just look at the government as a prime example...

[stevenl]

I have a bill owing to a Thai private hospital for emergency treatment that saved my life. It was in the region of 1.4 million Baht when I left the hospital to transfer to a local hospital which covered me under the Thai social system as I work and pay tax here. Every month 50K from my salary goes to the hospital having been guaranteed by my employer. This leaves me with a very tight budget to live on BUT there is no way I could consider not paying this back.

Maybe the leading tourist nations could each pay an amount each year into the Thai system (accessible by Private and Govt Hospitals) and with the full details of each of their citizens (that don't have full travel insurance) being recorded at each admission simply add the cost onto their future tax bills?

Admittedly there way be certain elements that might profit from this locally however the threat of tax impositions may well encourage people to arrange insurance cover prior to travelling which then benefits that govt through taxes on the companies doing normal business.

I would have thought that any intelligent person working in Thailand, for what obviously must be a foreign company, would have negotiated for health insurance in his salary package .

Why would it 'obviously be a foreign company'?

OK! any company then. However i think that the op must have some very special talent to be holding a Thai job at 50K rather than a Thai doing the same job. And with that talent, he should have been able to negotiate health insurance as the Thai company would know that he will need it working here.

A deduction of 50k from his salary, obviously not a 50k salary. Edited August 9, 2013 by LivinginKata
insult removed

[stevenl]

If you go abroad for whatever reason you should cover yourself with medical insurance. If you can't afford to pay the medical insurance premiums then perhaps people should not be going abroad as they clearly don't have enough money for any emergencies. I think it is wrong to point out the Australians if they account for the largest proportion of tourists in Phuket but it is right to say that tourists should not put a strain on local services when a guest in the country.

I think compulsory medical insurance as part of your visa application for anyone staying over 2 weeks is sensible as long as you are free to chose the insurance company. Anyone staying under 2 weeks or under for a holiday should cover it in their travel insurance.

Australians are pointed out because it is an article in an Australian paper.

[biplanebluey]

Wow! 58,500 seems like a lot for one day and night in a hospital. That's nearly $2,000 US.

YEA------ For a small problem????

[dunque]

I would not call this a drain on the local hospital system. Going by the figures in the news article, over a 12 month period there are 360,000 Aussie visitors to Phuket. The total drain on the hospitals over one year is 4m baht. So even if it was only Aussies needing medical attention, that only equates to 110 baht per person. Include all the other foreign visitors http://www.phuketland.com/phuket_links/touristinfo.htm - 2.5 million in 2005 and we are looking at about 15 baht per person. Add a 20 baht levy onto every visa and the problem is solved with a tidy profit to the hospitals.

By the way, if each of those tourists only used the ATM once while on holiday the return to Thailand would be around 375 million baht. Go figure ...

Does it cost more than baht 1000 to use an ATM now?

[alant]

Wow! 58,500 seems like a lot for one day and night in a hospital. That's nearly $2,000 US.

not a lot at all I think, I too have just had keyhole surgery, 1 night stay about the same price. what I want to know is how do people actually find places that don't want money, is this a special gift the Ausies have?

[harrry]

Simple solution - no insurance no Visa, like Europe

Not so simple.

What about the expats over 65 or 70 years of age, and those expats with a pre-existing condition? No insurance for them, means no visa for them, means no money into the Thai economy from them.

An idea might be that those without insurance, pay an extra levy attached to their visa. This levy, or medical fee, goes to the Thai Government to ensure older uninsured expats receive medical care, should they need it.

Seems to me this idea should be explored, and if managed properly (no corruption) my guess is that it would not be all that expensive:

- One quick calculation ... 30,000 Aussies in any given month X say a visa add-on of 1,000Baht per person = 30,000,000 (30million) Baht per month (just Aussies).

= A$35.00 per Aussie, IMHO quite attractive.

But of course it should be applied to all visitors or perhaps exempting those folks, from any country, who can prove they have independent health insurance.

And of course there would need to be some time limit (maximum of 60 days cover or something like that), etc.

How did you pick the 1000baht.

The public hospitals provide full health cover for thais based on 3000 baht per head a year.

[rosst]

Recently Western Ausstralian health reported that each year foreign visitors cost them 4 Million dollars a year in unpaid hospital bills. THey said they were not worried as undoubtedly the tourists bought income into Australia with their spending. THey said the only worry would be if people seemed to be using Australia for health tourism and that was not the case.

They have to think where a large part of the islands revenue comes and it is from those Australian tourists.

Yes well, I could not have said it better myself, you must take the swings with the roundabouts, I do believe there is a huge nett gain to the Thai economy, I will only concern myself at this kind of comment when we are non contributors to the economy apart from that, the Australian government could set up a reciprocal agreement with Thailand.

[marell]

Wow! 58,500 seems like a lot for one day and night in a hospital. That's nearly $2,000 US.

Depends on what needs done.

[HerbalEd]

I Guess thats why they want 800K in a bank account for retirement visa, something happens to you without insurance, at least some costs are covered, i could be wrong...

Does anyone here know if the 800K baht deposit has ever been taken to pay for a farang's medical bills ... or for any other reason?

[stevenl]

I Guess thats why they want 800K in a bank account for retirement visa, something happens to you without insurance, at least some costs are covered, i could be wrong...

Does anyone here know if the 800K baht deposit has ever been taken to pay for a farang's medical bills ... or for any other reason?

It is not a deposit, and it can not be taken by anybody but the account holder.

[HerbalEd]

Interesting logic by some ... i.e., if you are a tourist spending money then you deserve free medical care.

[LivinginKata]

I Guess thats why they want 800K in a bank account for retirement visa, something happens to you without insurance, at least some costs are covered, i could be wrong...

Does anyone here know if the 800K baht deposit has ever been taken to pay for a farang's medical bills ... or for any other reason?

The 800K for retirement visa is a proof of wealth to cover the year visa's living expenses. Medical costs included, but the government cannot usually seize your bank funds.

[harrry]

In Chiang Mai, they have a unique way of insuring payment or at least some modicum of restitution. I had a solo motorbike accident here and was bang up pretty good. I was transported to a local hospital but before that, the license tag on my motorbike (which I own and was pick up by some friends) was taken off and provided to hospital staff when I was checked in. It was given back to me when I paid my bill in cash later.

I heard one story where an injured farang was refused admittance to a hospital and he died in route to an alternate - a credit card (and passport?) was required. I often wonder if I should carry my passport and credit card at all times so they can pry them from my cold, (almost?) dead fingers.

You did of course have 10500baht deducted from your bill for por ror bor which applied to the bike.

[moe666]

Cannot blame the Thai hospitals for complaining about the dead beats getting care and unable to pay. The hospitals must wait months for the Thai government to reimburse them for the Thais they take care of and then the full cost isn't covered, then add a young drunk hurt falang to the bottom line and it is no wonder that the majority of government hospitals operate in the red.

The tone of a few of the responses here seem to even condone shafting the hospitals of what is owned to them

[Raybo]

I bought an insurance policy for me and the wife for our October visit to LOS.

It covers $100,000 for each of us.

It cost $98 for each of us for 30 days.

ChuLai6768

[Old Croc]

I'm a 65 yo uninsured expat.

Since arrival my health has taken a turn for the worse, resulting in 4 days in hospital and ongoing treatment.

I don't (wouldn't dream of) using the public hospitals here, and so far this year have spend in the vicinity of 250,000 baht at a large private hospital on the Island. Much more has also been spent on specialized medical equipment and medicines, injecting considerable funds into the economy.

I allowed for this eventuality when I decided to retire here.

I would be really pissed if I also had to pay a special fee to some corrupt Govt entity at the airport!

Edited August 9, 2013 by Old Croc

[Tomtomtom69]

In Chiang Mai, they have a unique way of insuring payment or at least some modicum of restitution. I had a solo motorbike accident here and was bang up pretty good. I was transported to a local hospital but before that, the license tag on my motorbike (which I own and was pick up by some friends) was taken off and provided to hospital staff when I was checked in. It was given back to me when I paid my bill in cash later.

I heard one story where an injured farang was refused admittance to a hospital and he died in route to an alternate - a credit card (and passport?) was required. I often wonder if I should carry my passport and credit card at all times so they can pry them from my cold, (almost?) dead fingers.

That doesn't sound like Thailand to me. A passport is useless for guaranteeing payment, it could always be claimed as stolen if someone prevented returning it for you. I know Thailand has a strange obsession with foreigner's passports, but money is what counts here as a stolen passport is only valuable for a would be criminal.

Anyway, I went to a hospital in Chiang Mai back in May for kidney stones, was in great pain but I was treated first THEN payment was asked for (I have insurance, so no problem). I can't imagine that payment would be asked for straight away - besides, how would they know how much to charge? The final charges depend entirely on the nature of the problem, which first needs to be assessed and then fixed, before a bill can be written up. And while I have heard of other countries demanding cash payment or insurance confirmation for all persons they treat, local or foreign, even before administering emergency treatment, I have never heard of that happening in THailand. At least private hospitals treat you first, then they ask for the bill. They could always prevent you from leaving the hospital if you can't pay the bill but that should only be done once you are well enough to be discharged.

[Tomtomtom69]

Cannot blame the Thai hospitals for complaining about the dead beats getting care and unable to pay. The hospitals must wait months for the Thai government to reimburse them for the Thais they take care of and then the full cost isn't covered, then add a young drunk hurt falang to the bottom line and it is no wonder that the majority of government hospitals operate in the red.

The tone of a few of the responses here seem to even condone shafting the hospitals of what is owned to them

However, unless a local has an appropriate private insurance policy the most basic insurance only covers the necessities - most Thai patients nearly always have to pay something on a doctor's visit too. Whether it's the medicine or in the case of a private hospital, a whole host of other charges, it's never free or only 30 Baht as they claim. Also, someone paying cash or with a good insurance policy that can pay the hospital almost immediately will receive priority compared to a poor local with just a 30 Baht policy. I know this as fact.

Edited August 9, 2013 by Tomtomtom69

[moe666]

I would not call this a drain on the local hospital system. Going by the figures in the news article, over a 12 month period there are 360,000 Aussie visitors to Phuket. The total drain on the hospitals over one year is 4m baht. So even if it was only Aussies needing medical attention, that only equates to 110 baht per person. Include all the other foreign visitors http://www.phuketland.com/phuket_links/touristinfo.htm - 2.5 million in 2005 and we are looking at about 15 baht per person. Add a 20 baht levy onto every visa and the problem is solved with a tidy profit to the hospitals.

By the way, if each of those tourists only used the ATM once while on holiday the return to Thailand would be around 375 million baht. Go figure ...

Its not just the falangs who do not pay, the hospital has to trat the Thais under the 30 baht program for which they are not reimbursed fully by the government added altogether it is a drain on the system.

Even with the total amount of spending that tourist do how does that equate back to funding the hospitals for there loss, doubtful that there budgets are based on how much money tourist spend a year in Thailand or Phuket

[watcharacters]

What about a "beer tax" to fund hospitals?

Nah... forget it.

[unanimosity]

Possibly because Australians enjoy a good free health care system at home they don't think about insurance.

It's also possible that they are a bunch of knuckleheads that end up hurting themselves all the time as well.....

So what is the problem? Just send Thais to Australia without insurance to balance it out. Oh wait, that is already happening and not only in Oz, but in America as well.

Aussie tourists get stabbed walking down the street, murdered, and otherwise set upon by Thais and the gov blames the Aussies for using their hospitals. Isn't there a word for that?

[AlphMichaels]

It's quite simple actually. If you're a citizen of a country that handles ALL your healthcare needs, you're covered at home...., possibly abroad too..., but there are usually even restrictions there (Many APAC & EMEA countries are often excluded). If your country does not cover you abroad, you need to get private coverage before you travel AND for the country or countries in which you will be staying OR show legitimate proof of financial responsibility should a catastrophic health event befall you. 800K THB under a retirement visa should not even be considered as reasonable coverage. A catastrophic health event will gobble that up in a week or two.

Last note...., expat healthcare plans are QUITE reasonable here. There's no excuse for any foreigner coming to Thailand and then relying on the Thai government to handle their healthcare needs..., no exceptions. GO HOME. IMHO

[ironhorse10]

As a US citizen retired in Thailand, all it would take to help would be for the Medicare system we have, to pay while you are living overseas, I draw a Social Sucerity check from the US and pay taxes on every penny, why do I have to go back to the states for Medical care when I feel like I've already paid for it in my Taxes? No thanks, I will keep seeing my Dr. in Chiang Mai and paying out of my pocket. Ofcourse if I got real sick I would have to go back to the states.

[Old Croc]

It's quite simple actually. If you're a citizen of a country that handles ALL your healthcare needs, you're covered at home...., possibly abroad too..., but there are usually even restrictions there (Many APAC & EMEA countries are often excluded). If your country does not cover you abroad, you need to get private coverage before you travel AND for the country or countries in which you will be staying OR show legitimate proof of financial responsibility should a catastrophic health event befall you. 800K THB under a retirement visa should not even be considered as reasonable coverage. A catastrophic health event will gobble that up in a week or two.

Last note...., expat healthcare plans are QUITE reasonable here. There's no excuse for any foreigner coming to Thailand and then relying on the Thai government to handle their healthcare needs..., no exceptions. GO HOME. IMHO

As long as you are young and healthy.

[GAZZPA]

If you go abroad for whatever reason you should cover yourself with medical insurance. If you can't afford to pay the medical insurance premiums then perhaps people should not be going abroad as they clearly don't have enough money for any emergencies. I think it is wrong to point out the Australians if they account for the largest proportion of tourists in Phuket but it is right to say that tourists should not put a strain on local services when a guest in the country.

I think compulsory medical insurance as part of your visa application for anyone staying over 2 weeks is sensible as long as you are free to chose the insurance company. Anyone staying under 2 weeks or under for a holiday should cover it in their travel insurance.

Australians are pointed out because it is an article in an Australian paper.

I see it now, thanks.