Fear

[robblok]

First off i don't pretend to be a macho guy i think about risks and such and am a realist.

Now I have driven a lot in and around BKK even in the center and that does not really scare me on bit. I feel its quite ok to do. Now I am going to drive more and further away on my ninja. My experience with the car has taught me that a bit out of Bangkok where the traffic is not one way its quite dangerous at times with cars coming over blind corners and hills on your side of the road.

I wonder how you guys feel about that, just recently read again about an other guy getting hit. For some reason, I don't have that fear in BKK because if i wait a bit after the red lights and just take care I don't seem to have problems. Plus you can't go real fast in BKK itself. On the other roads a bit outside I can go faster 100-120 but still its one way and cars don't seem to be bad.

Is it my imagination or is it more dangerous outside of BKK.

[pokerkid]

I don't think it's more dangerous outside BKK except during the songkran festival when all the morons gone back home to Nakhon-nowhere and decide its ok to drink and drive.

I always drive as fast as road conditions allow, especially on blind corners .

Edited August 12, 2013 by pokerkid

[moe666]

When I am in a hilly area with curves and hills I tend to stay to the left especially on curves since they like your side of the road as much as theres. I have ridden from CM to Hua Hin 2,000K round trip, CM to Plok, KK, Surin, Pattaya, Bangkok, back to CM 2,600K round trip. I did have a crash but it was because of road conditions and loss of concentration on my part.

Be vigilant and you should not have any problems, avoid riding on any holiday, tons of traffic.

[villagefarang]

I am the opposite. I drove in Bangkok for many years but wouldn’t want to do so anymore. I love driving on country roads but then again I live in the far north now. As long as you have an appreciation of what it takes to remain safe on Thai roads, you should be fine. Get out there and enjoy yourself.

[mania]

Is it my imagination or is it more dangerous outside of BKK.

Risk is risk period & we all live with a certain amount whether we want to or not.

Otherwise we would all live sheltered lives indoors.

I believe many statistics show accidents occur close to home or at intersections

odd eh?

Probably the simple conclusion is you let your guard down with familiarity ( being close to home )

And for intersections it is the coming together of two roads.

All that aside it is your vigilance that will keep you safe whether on a motorcycle, driving a vehicle or

even walking or riding a bicycle.

I will say after decades of riding motorcycles I feel 100% safe on them. But I remain alert always & see

well. I also feel on a motorcycle my options of escaping impact are much better than my truck.

Some may think it odd but I know on a bike I need only xx inches to provide my escape in a crazy situation.

The truck needs way more space & has far fewer options of escape except to stop which also takes way longer than a bike.

Due to the amount of weight your trying to stop.

Yes a full sized truck will protect me better on impact but on the motorcycle I actually feel my odds of

not having an impact are better.

Edited August 12, 2013 by mania

[poanoi]

Nothing can be more frightening than coming down Sukumvit,

and see a car intending to do a U-turn into my lanes.

From bad and repeated experiences, i know they can pull out at any time, before i have passed.

To further complicate things, they will also not keep right while they speed up,

but instead cross all lanes to make it to the very left lane, in most cases.

Meaning they will cut me no matter what.

I get sick in my stomach whenever i see a car at a U-turn point.

Edited August 12, 2013 by poanoi

[mania]

.

I get sick in my stomach whenever i see a car at a U-turn point.

If I see a car at a U turn my focus is on the front wheel

It is the earliest warning you will have of their intention.

You can see it turn before you see the car move.

Which is why in the USA I hated when those silly

rapper wheels came out. The ones where the hubcaps still spin when the

car has stopped

[robblok]

.

I get sick in my stomach whenever i see a car at a U-turn point.

If I see a car at a U turn my focus is on the front wheel

It is the earliest warning you will have of their intention.

You can see it turn before you see the car move.

Which is why in the USA I hated when those silly

rapper wheels came out. The ones where the hubcaps still spin when the

car has stopped

Maybe you should start a topic about safety tips... it would be appreciated. I think we could all learn a bit from the more experienced riders. Myself I just don't drive too fast or do stupid movements like those idiots on scooters. I try to move at the same speed as the rest of the traffic (sometimes faster but not too much faster).

I think a lot of bikes have their accidents because of those stupid movements, when its heavy with traffic for instance and im splicing lanes when cars are almost standing still i wont go past them too fast as there is always a chance one will do something stupid. Though I must say in BKK most cars expect motorcycles and don't do stupid things when it so busy.. of course there are always exceptions.

[mania]

Maybe you should start a topic about safety tips... it would be appreciated. I think we could all learn a bit from the more experienced riders. Myself I just don't drive too fast or do stupid movements like those idiots on scooters. I try to move at the same speed as the rest of the traffic (sometimes faster but not too much faster).

I think a lot of bikes have their accidents because of those stupid movements, when its heavy with traffic for instance and im splicing lanes when cars are almost standing still i wont go past them too fast as there is always a chance one will do something stupid. Though I must say in BKK most cars expect motorcycles and don't do stupid things when it so busy.. of course there are always exceptions.

Thanks I would have to think about that & do something orderly.

But also there are many great writers some from even decades ago that are still valid & easily found

Books like Twist Of the Wrist 1 & 2 by Kieth Code

Or Sport Riding Techniques by Nick Ienatsch

both can probably be found free

What you say is true & it starts with vigilance & not riding beyond your abilities

or beyond what the conditions allow. Like what you said about splitting lanes etc.

But even now as a rider who has ridden for many years I constantly review in my mind

on every ride. You never stop & you always learn.

Simple things that are major things are things like in an emergency situation....meaning not likely enough

time or space for a normal stop to avoid

Look where you want to go not where you do not want to go.

Meaning do not target fixate if someone pulls in front of you or you find you have entered a turn too fast

do not fixate on the car or tree you are trying to avoid. You will only lock your brake & hit that very object.

Look thru a turn as far as you can when riding not a few feet ahead

Watch what is happening around you at all times. Have Situational Awareness

This will sharpen more & more as you ride.

You need to not have to think about these things they need to become your normal awareness.

You automatically check your 6 every few seconds. You recognize closing speed & know if something is coming up too

fast from your rear & move or adjust. You know where the cars are on your sides & overall you become better at "seeing"

Of course there are tons of other things & the list goes on & on

It is broken into basically two parts

One part is what to do to avoid ever being in a situation needing evasive action

the other is what to do if inadvertently you are now in a situation requiring evasive actions.

That second one can only come from experience in riding & handling your bike.

It helps more than words can say if folks have done time on dirt bikes.

They know what things feel like. They can slide & recover, the bike can get way out of shape & the rider not

throw the towel in as it has been done before & you recognize the feeling & automatically correct.

But most of all it is just an ongoing learning experience. You never stop learning.

Edited August 12, 2013 by mania

[robblok]

I agree its ongoing learning thing, i am reading a book but i must really get more awareness . I have noticed myself making mistakes when avoiding something is should first check my mirrors and turn my head even if its just half a meter i go sideways.

I ordered some mirror raisers for the bike so my mirrors will be even better. I like checking my mirrors but should do it even more but at times you get complacent. Anyway I am one that tries to ride defensive. I have had one accident with the bike (not this one) ages ago because I had to take a turn at the last minute.. I will never ever do that again i rather do a u turn later then do a stupid rushed movement like that. I came off without any damage (not my bike) I was lucky as I was hit by a big truck. Must have had an angel somewhere.

[poanoi]

I seem unable to forget what an old biker told me when i bought the big bike.

"If a dog get in your way, dont try to take evasive action, instead speed up a bit so you knock him back,

its Him or You"

Unfortunately this is easier said than done, i think what is really needed is a practice area to drive into

hard paper that are used to make boxes of, until the natural reaction of trying to avoid collision is overcome

[wantan]

There were a couple of threads about riding security but i do not find them now

This website offers some good information about riding security in Thailand:
http://thaisafedriver.com/mclessonone.html

I guess its normal that you feel safer riding in your home area than riding in other areas you are not familiar with. But shit can happen everywhere. Every moment of inattentiveness can be the last.

Edited August 12, 2013 by wantan

[wantan]

And yes: Ride the roads you know as carefully as those you don't know!

[ll2]

it is more dangerous to ride outside of bangkok. most bangkok drivers and riders know how to handle a bike better. most of them are also more experienced of course - apart from the new gen drivers never rode a bike in their lives!

i have been riding in central bangkok nearly for 6 years now. commute 6 days per week around 40 km round plus city rides 2000 - 2200 km per month.

i can say, it is a fun and fast commute for me but definitely dangerous. you need to be triple careful.

you need some good judgement skills, high concentration and some kind of spider sense but they come with time.

always check at least 3-4 cars ahead not only the last one, if you see front wheels of a car or bike waiting at a u turn, just press horn! other than that, do not use horn as it pisses the drivers and can even lead to a road side fight sometime!

do not forget eye contact. eye contact means they know where you are most of the time.

also, i look through rear windows of cars to see more ahead, besides, try to catch the image of the driver and riders from the side mirrors of their vehicles to see of the driver is aware of me coming or not.

mirrors are you best friends, but never forget head check - you need to do it fast. do not fold your mirrors even if it is tight. bc if they touch a car from side, you can have time to take your stance to avoid getting squeezed between cars therefore get killed.

always keep in mind which gear you are at and what speed your are going. you need to know your bike and your limits with it very well too. braking, low speed riding, leaning at times etc.

besides if i see a kid at the soi or sidewalks etc, i automatically slow down. i also slow down of i see a pedestrian trying to pass the road. sometime they act crazy! be careful with bicycles as well.

always keep your hands on front brake and clutch levers. this lowers your reaction time.

try to ride at fast lanes and be careful with the law.

i am sure there are more to say.

[mania]

But also there are many great writers some from even decades ago that are still valid & easily found

Books like Twist Of the Wrist 1 & 2 by Kieth Code

Or Sport Riding Techniques by Nick Ienatsch

both can probably be found free

I just checked & had no trouble finding these as free pdf files

For folks that may be interested....

I highly recommend these even if they are over 10 years old the information is still valid.

I think it came out originally in the early 80's

Twist Of The Wrist I

Twist Of The Wrist II

This is also good & from 2003

Sport Riding Techniques by Nick Ienatsch

Edited August 12, 2013 by mania

[BSJ]

I just go with the flow. The Thai's are often crazy. Just try and blend in.

[Indrid Cold]

I dont think its unsafer outside bkk, just different and i think that if you are able to drive in bkk without accidents you can drive any where in the world. One word though about country roads here. They are can we say a little bit more dynamic, one pice of road that was exelent one day might not be in the same shape all over a couple of days later. Plenty of dogs too.

[B1ade]

You must be mindful of your surroundings escpecially if its new territory as you suggest, if you're tired, stop, too many accidents occur because of 'letting your guard down' cos you're near home or you haven't stopped in a while etc, a quick break goes a long way. I am always on alert and thinking ahead, but, still having great fun. On single lanes I too stick to the left side and stick to reasonable speeds, I pick my spots to have a little more fun, when i know the roads.

There's no stopping idiots doing stupid things though, it happens, but if you're riding sensibly around other road users then you give yourself a better chance of avoiding incidents. Hard to avoid those damn 3 wheel salengs though, those damn things will turn any where they choose and never ever look first, i'm always over cautious with them due to an incident!

[KRS1]

I think in CNX its a little more dangerous do to all the tourist stopping in the middle of the road and driving at a snails pace.

Another weird phenomenon are other mocycs tailgating you, i dont know why but they seem to follow closer in CNX.

[moe666]

Accidents happen closer to home, yesterday one of the guys from our neighborhood was walking home.as close to the left as possible and he was hit by a bicycle from the rear, I do not believe a ladyboy, knocked him down but no major injuries. The bicycle guy went down as well and from the reports was very shocked he of course jumped on bicycle and fled as fast as possible. Just goes to show you accidents happen any and every where and can happen to you. Do not live your life in fear but do live your life.

[moe666]

Accidents happen closer to home, yesterday one of the guys from our neighborhood was walking home.as close to the left as possible and he was hit by a bicycle from the rear, I do not believe a ladyboy, knocked him down but no major injuries. The bicycle guy went down as well and from the reports was very shocked he of course jumped on bicycle and fled as fast as possible. Just goes to show you accidents happen any and every where and can happen to you. Do not live your life in fear but do live your life.

[robblok]

I am sure they happen everywhere, just thought it was more dangerous outside of BKK on the country roads. As I said I seen some pretty crazy things overtaking wise when i was in the car. In BKK in general I don't see cars on my lane coming towards me. That is actually my biggest fear idiots pushing you of the road from their side of the road.

[mania]

That is actually my biggest fear idiots pushing you of the road from their side of the road.

Yes but on a bike you have so many more options of space to occupy than in your car in that same situation.

In a car you have head on or off road.( if a shoulder even exists)

On a bike which it so much more narrow you have options

See the crack & flow into it. Don't fixate but be aware

Edited August 13, 2013 by mania

[dogpoo]

First off i don't pretend to be a macho guy i think about risks and such and am a realist.

Now I have driven a lot in and around BKK even in the center and that does not really scare me on bit. I feel its quite ok to do. Now I am going to drive more and further away on my ninja. My experience with the car has taught me that a bit out of Bangkok where the traffic is not one way its quite dangerous at times with cars coming over blind corners and hills on your side of the road.

I wonder how you guys feel about that, just recently read again about an other guy getting hit. For some reason, I don't have that fear in BKK because if i wait a bit after the red lights and just take care I don't seem to have problems. Plus you can't go real fast in BKK itself. On the other roads a bit outside I can go faster 100-120 but still its one way and cars don't seem to be bad.

Is it my imagination or is it more dangerous outside of BKK.

Speed kills especially in this lawless country, keep your speed down and you dramatically reduce the risk of serious injury or death, concentration whilst driving is also important, if you drive day dreaming, talking on the phone you risk a situation!!

[nikster]

Between Bangkok and Chiang Mai there's big differences in driving style. The lady is from BKK and in the beginning she had lots of trouble in Chiang Mai - lots of scary situation and much swearing. Then put her in a bumper-to-bumper flow in BKK where taxis pass just millimeters away and she's totally fine. In both places you have to go with the flow, but the flow is different.

To me people in BKK know how to drive. That's often not the case in the country so it can lead to many unexpected situations. I have a tall bike so I can see what's going on - most of the dangerous situations I've had were where I couldn't see past a car - van or tall pick-up - and made a wrong assumption like somebody is *not* going go sideways through stopped traffic to make a U-turn; Don't make assumptions when you can't see.

In the mountains if you can't see around a turn you pretty much have to assume that somebody is going to come at you in your lane. Either taking over another car in the turn or just swerving for no good reason. Or that somebody parks their car (!!) in the middle of the turn - I've seen that happen on one or two occasions as well. And sand, pot holes, oil slicks... go as fast as you can see and not faster.

Ride fast, but never be in a hurry.

Edited August 13, 2013 by nikster

[wantan]

I am sure they happen everywhere, just thought it was more dangerous outside of BKK on the country roads. As I said I seen some pretty crazy things overtaking wise when i was in the car. In BKK in general I don't see cars on my lane coming towards me. That is actually my biggest fear idiots pushing you of the road from their side of the road.

I often have cars and more often motorcycles coming towards me in BKK. But as i am used to this it doesn't scare me as much as on a country road. The problem outside of cities is that there is usually much less traffic. So you start dreaming and enjoying the ride and pay less attention to other vehicles. Then suddenly an idiot comes into your lane. Thats scary but normal in Thailand. You always have to be on alert.

[Lancelot]

I was on my CBR150r enrout from Pattaya to Surin. Near Surin I was on a two lane main road with many of those small trucks hauling sugar cane. One small truck at slow speed on the shoulder (as far over as possible), a bus passes the truck- then a small pick up flashes his lights at me and passes the bus!

I'm thinking I may have to go in the ditch because the pick up is going to hit me head on, I brake hard and just before I head for the ditch, the pickup cuts back into his lane. I catch a microsecond glimps of the guy, a Thai man looking totally relaxed with one hand on the wheel. He probably stopped for Som Tom 500 meters later. Grrrrrr!

When they flash their lights, they are serious and will hit you if you don't get out of the way. And yes blind corners can be deadly because some drivers think nothing of using your lane to "corner"

I've mostly stopped trying to guess what the other driver will do; now I think "This guy is trying to hit me, how can I avoid him..."

[ll2]

a nice review regarding accidents:

http://rideapart.com/2013/08/10-common-motorcycle-accidents-and-how-to-avoid-them/