Speaking Thai in Thailand is Useless

[JSixpack]

I ve experienced such things so many times that I say something in thai and they act like they dont understand. It is simply because thais do not like seeing foreigners trying to integrate into the society and speaking the language is a clear sign of that.

No. Thais are pleasantly surprised, even amazed, and charmed if a foreigner speaks their language well. And they love to joke around a bit. Speaking some Thai is the greatest social lubricant for farang-Thai interactions apart from handing out cash. This is evident from Thais' always trying to help foreigners in their speaking Thai.

Try Japanese for a total contrast.

Edited September 20, 2013 by JSixpack

[JSixpack]

Craig: when you get back we will sit down with your wife and get her to ask me to say certain things and she what she thinks 5555555 If she says "good" then you drink, If she says "no good" then I drink ok? Have a feeling that we will be equally drunk by the end of it 555555

Waste of time, proving nothing, and just putting Craig's wife in an awkward position. Just shows you're still in denial.

Gone, why don't you just go to a Thai language school and formally study with a Thai teacher and learn properly so that you won't be further embarrassing yourself and annoying Thais trying to understand you.

[Murf]

OP please post a video of you speaking "perfect" Thai.

We can then deduce who is at fault.

[EvilDrSomkid]

OP please post a video of you speaking "perfect" Thai.

We can then deduce who is at fault.

Good idea, but violate his anonymity/privacy. Or, a video without his face.

But would have to make a separate channel if he has one... Never mind.

[tingtong]

speaking Thai is most definately not useless!

but is it worth the effore till one get to the level when truely can say he speaks good ( and not in his, or polite Thai standards)?

in my opinion, it probably doesnt worth it!

i am for one sure gave up on the serious effort, and realised that i might just not have the ear for the tones to get right, or more than that, maybe the paitience, the willingness, or the motivation.

also, i dont really have the need.

so, useless? not.

worth the effort to learn it? not.

[richard_smith237]

An example:

Yesterday while in a pharmacy with my Wife I didn't think much about it. I ordered what I needed in Thai which involved a number of items... we paid and walked out. I didn't even think about the fact that I was the one who'd done all the talking in Thai.

Shortly afterwards we were in a restaurant for lunch. Again I did the ordering in Thai, I saw the split second hesitation and asked the waiter to repeat the order, he'd got it wrong. So instead my Wife took over and ordered, again the split second hesitation and so my Wife asked the waiter to repeat the order, again he'd got it wrong and we had to go through the 4 item order step by step and have the waiter repeat it, step by step to get it right.

Now, this could have been a language issue, but it wasn't... my Wife (who is from BKK) could clearly understand the waiter, his accent wasn't a strong dialect....

The point: Intelligence and attention - The girl in the pharmacy was smart and paid attention. The waiter was simply absent... he didnt want to be there.

And it is here where I suspect many people fall foul when attempting to speak Thai... In many cases is simply down to the intelligence of the listener and the attention they pay.

In many many cases in Thailand I witness situations whereby people hear what they expect to hear not what is actually mentioned - Extra time and care has to be taken to ensure and double check mutual understanding. Some issues are down to the vague nature of the language, most are down to dealing with numpties who are not paying attention !...

[JSixpack]

so, useless? not.

worth the effort to learn it? not.

Yes. If you're living in Thailand for an extended period, it's certainly worth the effort to learn basic Thai. No need to become fluent, I agree, unless you have some particular interest.

It's not so difficult, over time. BUT, as illustrated here, one had best learn it correctly from a real teacher. Point being, that what little you do speak, you speak well and understandably. You'll get compliments when you do! Nice reinforcement, that.

Otherwise, you're annoying. Of course. I know a guy whom Thais can't stand to be around because he thinks he can speak Thai, and always insists on doing so, but really he mangles every word. He's extremely intelligent and well-educated--but partly for that reason, I suppose, he's totally convinced he can do it on his own, when in fact he never learned to distinguish the tones (among other things) properly.

A little goes such a long way in making Thais feel comfortable and getting basic meanings across to Thais who know no English.

Edited September 20, 2013 by JSixpack

[DavidMavec]

If you want to make your accent clear, the way is to spend an hour a day reading Thai out loud to a Thai person and have them correct you. Do this for a year and it will become clear.

[monkeycountry]

I have a feeling the OP and Thais have different opinions reg. what constitutes "perfect Thai".

I have heard foreigners speak funny Thai so many times I can't remember, but it makes me smile every time. Foreigners who speak "perfect Thai" are still quite rare, but I am impressed whenever I hear it - and a bit jealous :-)

[brummiebob]

I have experienced this with my staff, they are expecting what comes out of the white man's mouth to be English, and are unprepared for the Thai that comes out of your mouth, I would repeat what my customers just asked the staff in Thai and their eyes would widen, yes deer, he was asking you in Thai.

And sorry if I reply back to you in English, but really, there are some of you who would be better to stick to English, sometimes you dumb down the language to the level of 'me tarzan, you jane' and it is unbearable to decipher.

I had a similar experience when I went to Australia (I look Thai) I went into a McDonald's in some redneck part of the country and ask for a McChicken, the staff keep insisting that they only sell burgers and not Mexican Foods, may be they thought I'm a lost Japanese tourist or something. When I'm on the phone usually there would be no problem, but in person when for some, when they see me speak perfect English, would have some reaction, some would condescendingly comment on 'oh, you speak pretty good English' as if I am a speaking dog or something.

[EvilDrSomkid]

I had a similar experience when I went to Australia (I look Thai) I went into a McDonald's in some redneck part of the country and ask for a McChicken, the staff keep insisting that they only sell burgers and not Mexican Foods, may be they thought I'm a lost Japanese tourist or something. When I'm on the phone usually there would be no problem, but in person when for some, when they see me speak perfect English, would have some reaction, some would condescendingly comment on 'oh, you speak pretty good English' as if I am a speaking dog or something.

Sounds familiar. When I was in Oz I was in a little hick town called Dowerin in WA. I ordered some food at the servo.

The girl said in a thick Ozzie drawl: "You have a bit of an accent there." I speak with a slight US accent.

Thought to myself, I have an accent?

Then she asked where I was from. I said: Norway. Where's that? She said.

Oh boy...

Edited September 21, 2013 by EvilDrSomkid

[xoxman]

I didn't know Thais had an accent.I speak according to the consonants and vowels (long, short) using tones; mids,highs,lows,falling,rising,open endings, closed endings,risings etc.

You mean we should speak with the nasal Asian sounds as well? 555555555

อ๋อ คุณพูดจัดเหรอ ก็ทำวิดีโอพูดจัดให้เราฟังดีกว่านะ 555+

Sent from my GT-N8000 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[DavidMavec]

ผูดชัด ไม่ใช่ผูดจัด

[xoxman]

โอเค ผิดเป็นครู 555+

[WitawatWatawit]

I landed at Swampy, said in what I considered to be quite clear Thai: "Yak by thanon Petchburi laa Ekamai." (I want to go to Petchburi and Ekamai.) The driver looked at me and stated emphatically - :I DON'T SPEAK ENGLISH!"

That is NOT clear Thai

Yeah, but funny, though.

[craigt3365]

Sorry. New to these tablets and struggling...I miss my laptop!

Sent from my GT-N8013 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[tzthib]

I have found that speaking Thai beyond a basic level isn't worth the extra time it would take to achieve a higher level of fluency. While daily interactions require some Thai, how many of us have really benefited in any tangible way from being able to speak Thai well? Did speaking Thai make the bureaucrats at immigration any easier to deal with? Did the shopkeepers give you a discount because you were able to converse with them in their native language? Did the guards at Wat Po let you in for free because you could read the Thai signs? How many of those conversations with taxi drivers, security guards, or street vendors were actually insightful?

I have found that most businessmen in Thailand were educated abroad and speak English very well. So, unless you are dealing with "mom and pop" types (why would you?) or your Thai is nearing native level fluency, chances are English will be used in and around the office. Unless you are working in certain industries (political analysis?), your Thai will not take you very far professionally. From my limited experience, Thai language skills seem to carry almost no worth professionally once the Thai border is crossed. I highly doubt Thai language fluency will be viewed by employers as anything other than a novelty; barring certain specific industries, of course. If you wish to study language for professional reasons, pick up Chinese.

I assume we all can agree that the literary scene in Thailand is, uh, wanting. Walk into any Thai bookstore and chances are the majority of the books there are translations. Sadly, print journalism is no better. I certainly believe it is possible to keep abreast of business and political developments through English language sources only.

Keep in mind, though, that all of this is my experience as a Bangkokian. If I lived upcountry perhaps I would worry more about social isolation, but here in Bangkok that is not an issue.

[zeichen]

What I find ironic in the OP is the gender role reversa..So many guys move to Thailand and grow a vagina. NO where in the western world does a man ever ask his wife to get directions. The wife is usually yelling at the husband to stop being stubborn and ask for help.

I too at times have had trouble when I speak Thai but it is usually from more rural workers. The trick is if you speak Thai on a phone and the person thinks that you are a native Thai speaker. I do doubt that the OP has perfect fluency(as opposed to accuracy) in Thai though. I am certain that the issues that he faces are due to close proximation of sounds and not exact sounds.

I also find it interesting that guys who first move to Thailand become quite good at spoken Thai until they get in a relationship. Then they just rely on their partner to do the work for them. That doesn't happen to foreign women dating Thai men as often.

My spoken ability is mediocre but able to accomplish most tasks and needs. My comprehension is about 80% as I have a stronger passive vocabulary but cannot always think of the words but do know their meaning and english equivalent.

Personally, I think that anyone who says they don't need to speak the native language in a country where they chose to live is a cop out for laziness. I also think that it is a sign of disrespect to your partner and his/her family.

I know in my own experiences the fact that I am culturally connected to many Thai people through food and music that I build much deeper connection and respect from them. When you know their parables, superstitions and traditiojnal beliefs they are just amazed that someone cares about their culture. I know that my wife loves Thailand more and learned more about her own culture because of my enthusiasm and adoration.

[Fookhaht]

It hasnt really helped at all as when I am in a restaurant or venue and order in what I think is perfect Thai, they just look at me with the look of a Phnom Phenn Motorcycle Taxi driver, then look at the Thai I am with for confirmation. She/he says exactly the same thing as I just said then everything is ok.

Lived in Thailand 11 years, and this has happened to me uncountable times.

Showed a Japanese friend around Thailand for a week (who didn't speak Thai), and it was hilarious to watch the service sector people ignore me and look at him, although I was obviously the one asking for service. I would continue to talk in Thai, they would continue to stare at my Japanese friend (ignoring me), until he would shake his head "no" and point at me. Even then, some would refuse to turn their attention to the non-asian foreigner. After a couple of instances like this, we decided to get up and leave the premises because of this rude behavior. As we would start to get up to leave, suddenly, the service-person could understand my Thai.

A good number of Thais just cannot imagine that Thai words would come out of a farang face. So, they take the easy way out: ignore the farang and stare at the Asian until they talk. In many, many cases, it's just a lazy, xenophobic, or paranoid reaction vs. really trying to make an effort to communicate.

NOTE: My long-time Thai friends tell me that my Thai is understandable. That's after I press them to be direct (some of them already are), and take into consideration my long vowels & tones, and accent. When I speak over the phone to strangers, I am often mistaken for a Thai. When my Thai companion, at a service venue, repeats the exact same thing I do, to the service person, and they are understood--I ask my Thai friend, "Did I not say it exactly like you did? Tones, vowels, and all?" Most of the time the answer is in the affirmative.

The problem is just as much in the listener as the speaker, I contend.

Edited September 28, 2013 by Fookhaht

[Aforek]

There are some very touristic places, like Krabi, where staff in restaurant refuse to speak thai with tourists ; I know a thai woman who lives in a foreign country, she must speak english with the staff, even if she speaks to a thai person: ridiculous ! ; but, for the staff, she is a tourist, which is true

as for me, I like to speak thai with thai people, they answer me in thai ( but in administrations ) ; I don't even understand how farangs who live in Thailand don't make the effort to speak the language ; I understand many things people tell me and I can read almost all the signs in the streest ( just for pleasure and sometimes it's useful )

people who can't , lose 80 % of their stay in Thailand ; if I lived in China, I would learn the language.

[Riverman63]

Basically it boils down to decoding. Language is like a computer code. Broken English can be understood fairly easily by filling in the gaps because of the structure of the language. Thai is very different, intonation, context etc being the decoder. Broken Thai is not the same as broken English, it cannot be pieced together. One word of a sentence won't give anyone a clue. The subtleties of the language are very hard to pick up by ear.

As for Thais not even bothering to try to understand, it's fear of looking stupid. You know when someone you've just met at a party says something and you don't understand? You ask them to repeat it 3 times and you still don't know what the hell they're on about. Embarrassing isn't it. So we all just nod and try to get away. Imagine if you knew that it was going to happen in advance, you'd avoid those situations.

It has to be said, though it seems obvious to anyone with half a brain cell. When you are in Thailand you are in a foreign land, a different culture, language, concepts... They are not the same as you. It seems many people just cannot understand this point at all. Thais are not just like you with different faces and accents, they are very different.

[Johpa]

I have found that speaking Thai beyond a basic level isn't worth the extra time it would take to achieve a higher level of fluency. While daily interactions require some Thai, how many of us have really benefited in any tangible way from being able to speak Thai well? Did speaking Thai make the bureaucrats at immigration any easier to deal with? Did the shopkeepers give you a discount because you were able to converse with them in their native language? Did the guards at Wat Po let you in for free because you could read the Thai signs? How many of those conversations with taxi drivers, security guards, or street vendors were actually insightful?

Keep in mind, though, that all of this is my experience as a Bangkokian. If I lived upcountry perhaps I would worry more about social isolation, but here in Bangkok that is not an issue.

I believe my life has been greatly enhanced by being able to speak something better than very basic, heavily accented Thai. Speaking Thai has, in the past, been immensely helpful at immigration. I have had countless shopkeepers give me the local price because not only did I speak decent Thai, but I was willing to take my time and engage them in respectful conversation. Can't speak for Wat Po, but I have many times been allowed in at "local prices" after reading the entry fees posted in Thai, including the reading of Thai numerals. There are many westerners these days who speak far better Thai than do I as I have not lived full time in the Kingdom for over 20 years now and my language skils have greatly suffered. But I daresay that my countless conversation with taxi drivers, street vendors, and countless other ordinary Thais over the past 30 years has given me far greater insight into the culture than do many who now speak better Thai than myself. But then again I don't spend any time in Bangkok,a metropolis that is far more Chinese than it is Thai.

[nzvic]

My son was serious about learning Thai from day 1, and worked hard at it, though can't read/write it all that well. He's approached regularly for well-paid positions because of this bi-lingual attribute, but already has an interesting job. Serious knowledge and skills have intrinsic worth and are never useless. It helped he did a post-grad degree awarded by aThai Uni, tho he could've had it awarded more wellknown linked American or London uni's. as he's committed to this country..

Edited September 28, 2013 by nzvic

[zeichen]

I wonder if this was a Spanish forum for Mexicans living in the US. How would those posters claiming the uselessness of learning the local language feel reading that from immigrants of their own country?

[brummiebob]

Maybe if you speak but aren't understood, you should adjust your attitude and expectation when speaking to locals a bit.

You can't get worked up with them not understanding you on the first try, repeat s l o w l y and make sure to add that ผม พูด ไทย (Pom Phood Thai) and let it sinks in to their head; if after the fourth attempt they still don't understand, go back for a refund from wherever you studied your Thai.

[tingtong]

I wonder if this was a Spanish forum for Mexicans living in the US. How would those posters claiming the uselessness of learning the local language feel reading that from immigrants of their own country?

Yet you go to the US, and find that many places Spanish spoken more than English it seems, and Mexican workers often has trouble understanding English, or speak it comprehensively and without heavy accent.

And wonder if they have to report every 90 days or have to go on visa runs, can own something on their name there, or become a citizen after marry a local, are they punished because they choose that country as their living place with double standards and double pricing from nothing less then the government down....

Unfortunate, English is a lot easier language to get to a certain fluency. And a lot more useful than Thai, at that, or beyond that fluency.

Telling me, a non-native speaker

[zeichen]

I had to read your post 3 times to make sense of it.

MY point plain and simple was that most Americans resent and look down on anyone living in the US that cannot speak English after living there for a long period of time. However those that are posting on this thread don't seem to use the same glasses when judging themselves.

As for English being easier, that is funny. Perhaps it was easier for you to learn English because you come from a country that has a langauge that has similar roots. For most Asian languages it is just as hard for them to learn English as it is for you to learn their language. English is a very convuluted language that has a lot more contradictions than it does set rules. English has many verb tenses 12 if I remember right without looking it up, vocabulary often has many different meanings for one word, homonyms, homophones, etc. All of these make it a very difficult language to learn.

As for English being more useful than Thai. NOT IN THAILAND. We are not comparing languages on an international scale. We are purely talking about being able to communicate and comprehend a language of the country that you are living in.

The rest of your argument doesn't make sense at all. None of what you stated has anything to do with language. But go on and make some more excuses why you feel that being fluent in the language of the country you live in isn't important unless it is an English speaking country. Sounds like a lot of Ethnocentric garbage.

child: mom, why doesn't dad speak Thai?

mom: Thai is a useless language and anyone other than Ethnic Thai's don't need to speak it.

child: ok mom, so mom, why did you marry and have children with a man that has no respect for your culture?

mom: because I am just another ignorant woman married to a foreign man that doesn't care about anything but money.

ok, sarcasm intended.

But to be blunt. Don't bother to learn the language of the country you live in, speak the language that your spouse and her family speaks= disrespect, arrogance and a level of nationalism that many posters on this forum claim that Thais have.

overall I think most posters on this thread should feel ashamed.

[richard_smith237]

Maybe if you speak but aren't understood, you should adjust your attitude and expectation when speaking to locals a bit.

You can't get worked up with them not understanding you on the first try, repeat s l o w l y and make sure to add that ผม พูด ไทย (Pom Phood Thai) and let it sinks in to their head; if after the fourth attempt they still don't understand, go back for a refund from wherever you studied your Thai.

I used to question the quality of my Thai when I wasn't understood - A fair enough explanation as I'm far from fluent.

I then started questioning the 'levels of attention' of the listener - Who sometimes expect English from a Western Face (a case of the ears confusing the eyes).

Now, in most cases I have learnt not to question myself, I frequently Witness my Wife (Thai) having to repeat herself - As frequently the case those in a service industry (i.e. waitresses etc) are not from Bangkok, are usually mind-numbingly bored and mentally somewhere else or simply not very smart...

It's not difficult to be understood in Thailand when speaking Thai - But comprehension requires some basic skills from both sides of the conversation, this is often lacking.

[Loaderfamily]

Arrived here in Pattaya about a month ago fresh off the boat from Blighty and been trying to master the language with 3 lessons a week, not easy, found most Thais are very pleased I am trying and they generally help me get it right by saying it slowly and getting me to repeat it. Of course don't expect or get this as much in the city centre but in the outer areas everyone seems very helpful and friendly when I go in smiling and cheery.

[JSixpack]

Case in point. True story.

I canceled my land line phone service three years ago. Now, a couple months ago, out of the blue, I received a threatening letter that I hadn't paid for my last month's service, B700 (roughly); the matter had been turned over to lawyers to collect the amount in full! I should pay NOW.

Well, I'd never got any refund for my B3000 deposit. I'd assumed they'd take the final bill from the deposit and refund the balance. But I didn't much care if I got the refund if it meant I didn't have to go to the TOT office. The boredom there is just excruciating!

My authority on all things Thai assured me it'd just be a lot easier on everybody, notably myself, if I'd just go to TOT and pay up.

So I went to TOT and paid the amount due. But now, since they made me go there, I also wanted my B3000 deposit back! Hell yeah.

After much confusion at this odd request, I was finally directed to the 2nd floor of the TOT building. I walked in, saw a bunch of ladies working in their cubicles, and was totally ignored by all of them.

I stood around awhile then chose one at random and showed my papers and asked for my deposit. But I asked in basic Thai. This quickly led to the right person to handle the situation and she was most helpful and cooperative. I signed some papers and was told to wait for a call in a month or so.

A week ago I got the call, in rapid Thai, and learned my check was waiting for me.

Now back at the TOT office I went to the right lady, and she was so friendly and several ladies in the nearby cubicles were also quite friendly and made a point of smiling and talking. They loved it that I spoke Thai, and they complained that they had such a hard time understanding the other farang coming up there. One lady imitated some yammering. I could just hear something like, "I doy mek these calls. Me fookin' bill's all wrong!" in Brummie. I sympathized and we all joked around a bit. Another lady asked me how to say, Mai mee marayaat ("Bad manners") in English.

We left each other all smiles. A nice experience at the TOT office, believe it or not. I feel totally different about the place now.

Actually I've had this kind of experience many times. Learning basic Thai really has paid big dividends.

Edited October 4, 2013 by JSixpack