Senate may kill Thai amnesty bill

[Magenta2013]

<snip>

Not many people oppose the amnesty bill - so far less than 0.01% of the Thai population is protesting............. and with 99.99% not protesting - says the majorty are quite ok with it.

Given that statistic, it would mean that a 99.99% supported the Abhisit government, given that the red shirts only got 100,000 out at their protests.

Fair point - and the red protests got crushed and all their demands were not met. So it failed.

And in the same way the present protests should be crushed and all their demands should not be met. Simple.

[whybother]

<snip>

Not many people oppose the amnesty bill - so far less than 0.01% of the Thai population is protesting............. and with 99.99% not protesting - says the majorty are quite ok with it.

Given that statistic, it would mean that a 99.99% supported the Abhisit government, given that the red shirts only got 100,000 out at their protests.

Fair point - and the red protests got crushed and all their demands were not met. So it failed.

And in the same way the present protests should be crushed and all their demands should not be met. Simple.

The red shirts won't like the idea of being crushed a second time.

I'm not sure Yingluck would really cope being charged with murder either.

[Magenta2013]

It is just incredible that a PM refuses to commit publicly whether she supports the bill or not. Those crocodile tears on TV asking people to forgive and forget does not count. Forget? Might as well try to forget the Floods of 2011.

Instead, Cinderella keeps running away and occupying herself with fluff.

Does she have to, by law, commit to public declaration of support or not.

And if not then she is quite within her rights to not publicly make any declaration.

So whats your point ? You appear to have none.

[SICHONSTEVE]

It is just incredible that a PM refuses to commit publicly whether she supports the bill or not. Those crocodile tears on TV asking people to forgive and forget does not count. Forget? Might as well try to forget the Floods of 2011.

Instead, Cinderella keeps running away and occupying herself with fluff.

Does she have to, by law, commit to public declaration of support or not.

And if not then she is quite within her rights to not publicly make any declaration.

So whats your point ? You appear to have none.

Whether she has to by law is besides the point.

It is her moral duty to declare this as she is head of this government for christ's sake!! Unless of course HE is, and he is fully behind it unsurprisingly, In fact, it is all his work and doing and is NOT designed to achieve reconcilliation but to allow him to come back to Thailand scot free!!!

[simple1]

Has been reported elsewhere that Thaksin has used a phrase in Thai that is used in gambling that apparently translates to 'bet everything on this card or throw of the dice'

It seems however he has the back up position of calling a new election to try to get another 4 years but with reports of his support slipping, even in his heartland a win may not be assured.

A few days ago the newspaper that cannot be named claimed some of the PTP MPs are only polling at 15% voter support. To counter this it is alleged he is planning to establish/fund two new parties that will be coalition partners at the next election in an attempt to ensure re-election for Yingluck.

The other newspaper website says Yingluck is going to make a special urgent announcement later today.

[Baerboxer]

I wonder if it is a revelation to the PM just how many millions of people detest her brother. To suggest that bringing her brother home, clear of all convictions, is helping the country is ridiculous and disgusting.

Much as I would like to see Thaksin permanently off the scene. I would have to agree that amnesty for all involved since 2006 be given.

Giving Thaksin amnesty for his instigating the turmoil in the red shirt attempted coup in 2010 goes against my grain but if that is what it takes so be it.

In no way should he be given amnesty for his crimes while in the PM office. Those he must face or it would just make the rule of law meaningless.

It would send the message that the Prime Minister is above the law. The PTPredshirts must learn that they also are subject to the law. the Amnesty would only concern the actions since 2006.

I believe it to be the only way and yet I want to throw up at the thought of that piece of-----------getting away with his actions in 2010.

I tend to agree with you. Amnesty has to be for all the political actions since 2006, including Thaksin's involvement in the 2010 insurgency.

However, this should not included the criminal offence for which he has been convicted and sentenced or the other outstanding criminal charges which he should still face. He lost the right of appeal against the conviction once he chose to jump bail and become a fugitive, albeit a high profile one, welcomed by many other countries.

The PM, ministers and government must not be, or be seen to be, above the law. Unfortunately this regime have demonstrated they do not respect laws and don't consider they apply to their own actions. Reconciliation, amnesty, move forward - all nice ideals that the PTP regime will compromise for the their leader. Despite months of denials everyone can see their true agenda now. The strength, depth and source variety of feeling against this appalling attempt at whitewashing a criminal's crimes seems to have caught them a little by surprise.

Hopefully the senators will listen to the people, show some mettle and send the bill back.

[Stradavarius37]

Many TV posters have understandably expressed hopes that Mr. T's government will pull back from this potentially destructive bill but he has he has one foot in the door and is supposed to have said last week he doesn't know how to spell ' lose '.

The importance of face in Thai culture makes it difficult for the simplest of U-turns as even a ' for the good of the country ' excuse will be seen as defeat and that's not something he will be able to take. I am afraid that DL has staked too much on this and will happily let the country descend into all sorts of chaos no matter the disasterous effect on the people that he professes to love so much, well if they support and vote for him that is.

No matter what happens here he is above it all, he can sit in Dubai and enjoy his money, travel at will and deny stiff that it had anything to do with him.

Difficult to U Turn? Do you actually follow Thailand news? Every day there is a politician or bureaucrat doing a U turn from a previous days statement or program proposal. Thailand is the HUB of U turns...lol

Thaksin do a U-turn ? Do you follow the news ?

I follow enough to know that you don't...

[Gonzo the Face]

It is just incredible that a PM refuses to commit publicly whether she supports the bill or not. Those crocodile tears on TV asking people to forgive and forget does not count. Forget? Might as well try to forget the Floods of 2011.

Instead, Cinderella keeps running away and occupying herself with fluff.

Does she have to, by law, commit to public declaration of support or not.

And if not then she is quite within her rights to not publicly make any declaration.

So whats your point ? You appear to have none.

I think, to most not wearing rose colored glasses, the point is obvious. The Prime Minister is supposed to be the leader. How many real leaders do not take a position on an instance and make that posistion known?

In Yinglucks case its all too obvious. She has to be told what her position is to be and that is not the way of a leader.

There is no law that says she must be in the parliamentary sessions, but people do expect their so called leader to lead by example, not run away to some make up meeting elsewhere, or to go on a shopping excursion.

This leader cannot serve two masters, her brother or her country.

[khunken]

The headline is not really accurate as the senate don't have the ability to kill the bill. What they can do is reject it & send it back to parliament. It wouldn't surprise me if Thaksin's party would be quite happy with that because it would cause a delay and a postponement of the protests.

However I have no doubt that they will carry on with DL's amnesty as so many of them owe their positions to his patronage & money. It will all come down to the CC but the damage done to the country will be felt for years to come.

Edited November 5, 2013 by khunken

[Benmart]

Many TV posters have understandably expressed hopes that Mr. T's government will pull back from this potentially destructive bill but he has he has one foot in the door and is supposed to have said last week he doesn't know how to spell ' lose '.

The importance of face in Thai culture makes it difficult for the simplest of U-turns as even a ' for the good of the country ' excuse will be seen as defeat and that's not something he will be able to take. I am afraid that DL has staked too much on this and will happily let the country descend into all sorts of chaos no matter the disasterous effect on the people that he professes to love so much, well if they support and vote for him that is.

No matter what happens here he is above it all, he can sit in Dubai and enjoy his money, travel at will and deny stiff that it had anything to do with him.

Difficult to U Turn? Do you actually follow Thailand news? Every day there is a politician or bureaucrat doing a U turn from a previous days statement or program proposal. Thailand is the HUB of U turns...lol

U-turns are not unique tto Thailand my dear chap. Very common in my home turf, the USA.

[Brevity]

Again, I'll admit that I am a rookie with the Thailand political situation, but here's my 2 cents.

"We must lend our hands in helping the country. The first thing to be done is to forgive one another so we can move forward," she said.

I'm sure it's been said by other people here, but I think this way of thinking (passing the amnesty bill) will prevent the country from moving forward. It will also send the wrong message to the young people of Thailand. It will tell them that the old ways of corruption, nepotism, and cronyism are good. A better message would be to tell the young in Thailand that accountability for crimes is the only way to go, and we will be happy to forgive these people ONCE THEY HAVE PAID FOR THEIR CRIMES but not before that.

[kimamey]

This is by far the best story to have been posted in the news section for the past year.

Come on people of Thailand, protest until your last breath and keep the heat turned up. Because if this bill fails, then Thaksin has nothing left.

If this can all be done with peaceful protest and no violence then I think that will be a positive thing for the country.

[Chao Lao Beach]

Has been reported elsewhere that Thaksin has used a phrase in Thai that is used in gambling that apparently translates to 'bet everything on this card or throw of the dice'

It seems however he has the back up position of calling a new election to try to get another 4 years but with reports of his support slipping, even in his heartland a win may not be assured.

Hi Robby,

When you think about it, it is not a bad bet really.

Put your self in his shoes, after you have made a large investment already.....

You Win:

Get a 2 Billion+ USD check

No criminal history

Very likely the top job again where you can get revenge and make more big bucks

People close to you cleared as well

You Lose:

Just buy another election and give your self 4 more years to win in, only 1000B a pop.

Not bad odds when you think about it, I think many underestimate Mr T.

Edited November 5, 2013 by Chao Lao Beach

[hawker9000]

'Think the topic title is overstated and the senatorial support count just somebody's numbers. I also think the weight of public protest would have to swell CONSIDERABLY to drive this: there was always BOUND to be SOME protest. That's already "factored in" to the PTP campaign plan for this bill I'm sure. The bill will pass in the Senate. I don't have a feel for what might or might not happen in the Constitutional Court.

[Benmart]

Again, I'll admit that I am a rookie with the Thailand political situation, but here's my 2 cents.

"We must lend our hands in helping the country. The first thing to be done is to forgive one another so we can move forward," she said.

I'm sure it's been said by other people here, but I think this way of thinking (passing the amnesty bill) will prevent the country from moving forward. It will also send the wrong message to the young people of Thailand. It will tell them that the old ways of corruption, nepotism, and cronyism are good. A better message would be to tell the young in Thailand that accountability for crimes is the only way to go, and we will be happy to forgive these people ONCE THEY HAVE PAID FOR THEIR CRIMES but not before that.

You may call yourself a rookie, but your words ring true as a wise sage and purveyor of reason. Keep on posting my friend.

[SantiSuk]

This being Thailand I'm surprised that a revolving amnesty law, that automatically kicks in a general amnesty for all corruption and fraud by politicians every 5 years, isn't built into the constitution

[ratcatcher]

'Think the topic title is overstated and the senatorial support count just somebody's numbers. I also think the weight of public protest would have to swell CONSIDERABLY to drive this: there was always BOUND to be SOME protest. That's already "factored in" to the PTP campaign plan for this bill I'm sure. The bill will pass in the Senate. I don't have a feel for what might or might not happen in the Constitutional Court.

"The bill will pass in the Senate."

Perhaps you can PM me the winning lottery numbers for next weeks draw?

[GeorgeO]

We are at a point where, in any other country, there would be a vote of no confidence in the government, leading to dissolution of Parliament and a new General Election.

However, this is not any other country, and this stubborn, misguided government seems to be prepared to allow the country to sink into a period of extreme civil unrest, all for the sake of that cowardly fugitive criminal...!

He has indeed put everything on this "one throw of the dice", but I believe this will prove to be his biggest mistake ever. He will not see this Bill pushed through as there are too many of the Senators who are now running scared of what may transpire if it is passed.

The defeat of this Bill will also underline the huge gap that has emerged between Khun T and his government and the support that they previously enjoyed from their up-country faithful.

I suspect there may be a new political party emerging very soon comprising of those former PTP supporters who have now become disillusioned with the leadership. One can only hope that Jatuporn and the like don't force themselves into strong positions within such a party...!

Feeling really happy today...!

[Thai at Heart]

It is just incredible that a PM refuses to commit publicly whether she supports the bill or not. Those crocodile tears on TV asking people to forgive and forget does not count. Forget? Might as well try to forget the Floods of 2011.

Instead, Cinderella keeps running away and occupying herself with fluff.

Does she have to, by law, commit to public declaration of support or not.

And if not then she is quite within her rights to not publicly make any declaration.

So whats your point ? You appear to have none.

Isn't it a bill proposed by her party?

[SICHONSTEVE]

It is just incredible that a PM refuses to commit publicly whether she supports the bill or not. Those crocodile tears on TV asking people to forgive and forget does not count. Forget? Might as well try to forget the Floods of 2011.

Instead, Cinderella keeps running away and occupying herself with fluff.

Does she have to, by law, commit to public declaration of support or not.

And if not then she is quite within her rights to not publicly make any declaration.

So whats your point ? You appear to have none.

Isn't it a bill proposed by her party?

No!!! Its a bill proposed by Thaksin FOR the benefit of Thaksin and other corrupt members of Thaksin's previous parties!!!

After all, as she keeps on spouting - "she has nothing to do with it".