Should Thailand tax junk food to help fight obesity?

[chrisinth]

 

Based on current international trends, I would start on SUGAR but I would also closely monitor the effectiveness, no point in doing something that doesn't work. I would make all transfats in packaged products illegal and require all packaged products in stores have warning label icons understandable by all.

 

Presumably only white sugar that makes people fat, and not demerara sugar that posh people like you and I put in our tea and coffee

Demerara sugar is good for rum as well. Lets be careful where we draw the line in the sand here..................

[Naam]

this thread is a stillborn baby.

-how many of Thailand's 65 million inhabitants can afford to eat junk food regularly?

-the poll's questions "Farangs supporting or not supporting idea" is plain ridiculous.

p.s. looking forward to see 1% of Pattaya's Farang population marching on Beach Road, waving banners and chanting "we support" or "we don't support".

[Jingthing]

this thread is a stillborn baby.

-how many of Thailand's 65 million inhabitants can afford to eat junk food regularly?

-the poll's questions "Farangs supporting or not supporting idea" is plain ridiculous.

p.s. looking forward to see 1% of Pattaya's Farang population marching on Beach Road, waving banners and chanting "we support" or "we don't support".

Again, yet again, the scope of this thread has gone WELL beyond only junk food which I assume you mean as highly processed commercial food like in 7-11 and fast food chain food.

Yes foreigners (of all colors) are not going to change anything but be aware these kinds of issues are being discussed by some Thai academics/politicians as well. Not a priority right now though!

Edited January 10, 2014 by Jingthing

[JesseFrank]

Should Thailand tax junk food to help fight obesity?

No they should tax the people who don't have the courage to cut back on their eating habits and always feel the need to blame their obesity on something else than themselves.

[transam]

this thread is a stillborn baby.

-how many of Thailand's 65 million inhabitants can afford to eat junk food regularly?

-the poll's questions "Farangs supporting or not supporting idea" is plain ridiculous.

p.s. looking forward to see 1% of Pattaya's Farang population marching on Beach Road, waving banners and chanting "we support" or "we don't support".

Again, yet again, the scope of this thread has gone WELL beyond only junk food which I assume you mean as highly processed commercial food like in 7-11 and fast food chain food.

Your posts are very one sided regarding YOUR belief , instead of sitting back and thinking about other posts. Yeh, it is hard being shown different directions but in life we all learn stuff.

[Showbags]

 

Based on current international trends, I would start on SUGAR but I would also closely monitor the effectiveness, no point in doing something that doesn't work. I would make all transfats in packaged products illegal and require all packaged products in stores have warning label icons understandable by all.

 

Presumably only white sugar that makes people fat, and not demerara sugar that posh people like you and I put in our tea and coffee

Back in the days when I was a youngster ... it was the sugar cubes that made the tea drinking all fancy like.

Plus the Stirling silver tongs used to politely drop in ... was that one lump or two Khun SC ?

Then, if you could sneak in a nick a cube or two and feel it melt away in your mouth ... and your teeth melted at the same time ... ah ... the good old days.

I know they weren't demerara sugar but thanks for transporting me back there for a wee minute ...

.

David you're were spoilt, I only got sugar in my tea if I was sick:) I still do it to this day if I'm sick.

Taxing the poor will work as well as the luxury tax on the rich.

My horse used to love sugar cubes.

He got fat and died one day.

[Jingthing]

Should Thailand tax junk food to help fight obesity?

No they should tax the people who don't have the courage to cut back on their eating habits and always feel the need to blame their obesity on something else than themselves.

But JF, this really isn't about blaming anyone. It's about potential social policies that can make it less likely for Thai people to become obese in the first place (especially the youth), which sadly, usually translates to a lifetime problem. Who you blame is irrelevant really. Effective ways to help more people not have this problem makes much more sense. It is known less sugar, less obesity, perhaps social policies can help societies as whole do LESS SUGAR (for one example).

Edited January 10, 2014 by Jingthing

[Somsrisonphimai]

It doesn't really mean much tax or not tax. Unless the price is outraged, people will eat what they like to eat. You can tax white rice to death, I will still eat it because I cannot live without it. Alcohol and cigarette taxes did not stope people from drinking alcohol or smoking cigarette. To solve the issue, people need to change their eating habit and lifestyle. Eating healthy and exercise regularly are the key to a long and healthy life, so they say. Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

You raise a very reasonable objection. Will such taxes work to help with the goal of preventing and reversing a significant amount of obesity in populations? Prevention is the easier goal as those who are already obese, especially if it starts in childhood, face very difficult odds of finding a long term solution for that (but losing even some weight and keeping it off is better than nothing). Anyway, don't fret, MEXICO, a very large and very obese nation will help the world get some good data on whether this kind of tax helps or not. Eventually.

The big question researchers have is whether such taxes will actually reduce consumption of these foods — which lead to hypertension, high triglycerides and insulin resistance, diabetes and have been shown to accelerate aging. Reducing their consumption would improve our country’s overall health. If they don’t then the taxes are merely another source of revenue for governments.Now scientists will have a chance to test whether such a tax affects a large, and comparatively obese, marketplace.

http://blog.chron.com/sciguy/2014/01/mexico-dares-do-what-the-united-states-has-not-tax-sugar/comment-page-1/

I think obesity is a combination of things including generic, life style, and poverty. If there is going to be a tax on junk good, it would make junk food more expensive and so is healthy food, which one do you think people would spend money on? Of course, obesity prevention is needed but taxing junk food is not the it. I am 5.6 feet and weight 51 kilos. I eat rice everyday and I love sweet and junk food. However, I don't drink alcohol, I don't smoke cigarette, and I exercise regularly, so there is a balance there. Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[David48]

Should Thailand tax junk food to help fight obesity?

No they should tax the people who don't have the courage to cut back on their eating habits and always feel the need to blame their obesity on something else than themselves.

Well, that's an opinion that will curry good support from many following this thread.

It seems like good old common sense.

Eat less, exercise more ... stay a lean mean loving machine ...

.

[Jingthing]

Again, Thailand won't be the first to test this. Other countries like Mexico will. Some years later some evidence will be in and if Mexico's policies helped a lot there, then lots of other countries will pay attention. If not, they'll see that too. Mexico is really a big deal in this globesity story as it is the most obese large nation in the world and also going aggressive on fighting it.

Edited January 10, 2014 by Jingthing

[David48]

Back in the days when I was a youngster ... it was the sugar cubes that made the tea drinking all fancy like.

Plus the Stirling silver tongs used to politely drop in ... was that one lump or two Khun SC ?

Then, if you could sneak in a nick a cube or two and feel it melt away in your mouth ... and your teeth melted at the same time ... ah ... the good old days.

I know they weren't demerara sugar but thanks for transporting me back there for a wee minute ...

David you're were spoilt, I only got sugar in my tea if I was sick:) I still do it to this day if I'm sick.

Taxing the poor will work as well as the luxury tax on the rich.

My horse used to love sugar cubes.

He got fat and died one day.

Did he get fat from the sugar cubes?

Would a tax on Thai Junk Food saved your Horse?

Was your horse in Thailand?

[ToddWeston]

Actually, I am thinking more a tax on SUGAR as a substance is better. I think fake corn syrup needs to be included as well as artificial sweeteners as both been linked with obesity.

Are there any Food Scientists following this debate?

What is 'fake corn syrup' ?

Is this some sort of Alchemy trick?

Maybe they could use this to avoid the proposed Sugar Tax?

It isn't "fake" corn syrup it's high fructose corn syrup, it is being used as "fake" sugar, it is produced from genetically modified corn.

HFCS along with beet root sugar are now used in many processed foods not only as a sweetener but also as a preservative and it is a major cause of obesity, more so than sugar cane some studies show.

It is used in some countries more than others, Coke in the US is mostly HFCS because of their high tax on refined sugar cane whereas in Mexico it's refined sugar cane in Coke, other countries limit it's use, I don't know how much is used here in Thailand as I don't drink pop but I'll see what I can find out.

To your point, there have been many sweeteners used in the past , JT mentioned a sugar tax, not a sugar(s) tax. Big Agra and their GM corn by products do not want it classified as a sugar rather a sweetener or food additive. Same as the stevia farmers don't want to be classified as a sugar producers.

You also have a good point if sugar cane or any sweetener is taxed they'll simply use something else that's dirt cheap most likely chemical based.

[Jingthing]

I already corrected the corn syrup detail. Yes I think it's obvious a substance tax on sugar would need to include all kinds of sugars (yes corn syrup!), and I think fake ones as in "Diet" soda as well because oddly they are also linked to obesity. Do it big or don't do it at all!

Edited January 10, 2014 by Jingthing

[David48]

Actually, I am thinking more a tax on SUGAR as a substance is better. I think fake corn syrup needs to be included as well as artificial sweeteners as both been linked with obesity.

Are there any Food Scientists following this debate?

What is 'fake corn syrup' ?

Is this some sort of Alchemy trick?

Maybe they could use this to avoid the proposed Sugar Tax?

It isn't "fake" corn syrup it's high fructose corn syrup, it is being used as "fake" sugar, it is produced from genetically modified corn.

HFCS along with beet root sugar are now used in many processed foods not only as a sweetener but also as a preservative and it is a major cause of obesity, more so than sugar cane some studies show.

It is used in some countries more than others, Coke in the US is mostly HFCS because of their high tax on refined sugar cane whereas in Mexico it's refined sugar cane in Coke, other countries limit it's use, I don't know how much is used here in Thailand as I don't drink pop but I'll see what I can find out.

To your point, there have been many sweeteners used in the past , JT mentioned a sugar tax, not a sugar(s) tax. Big Agra and their GM corn by products do not want it classified as a sugar rather a sweetener or food additive. Same as the stevia farmers don't want to be classified as a sugar producers.

You also have a good point if sugar cane or any sweetener is taxed they'll simply use something else that's dirt cheap most likely chemical based.

Dbl post ... sorry ... greasy fingers from the KFC ...

Edited January 10, 2014 by David48

[Somsrisonphimai]

Again, Thailand won't be the first to test this. Other countries like Mexico will. Some years later some evidence will be in and if Mexico's policies helped a lot there, then lots of other countries will pay attention. If not, they'll see that too. Mexico is really a big deal in this globesity story as it is the most obese large nation in the world and also going aggressive on fighting it.

I am afraid it is going to be more of the same nothing change except more money for the government to spend.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[Jingthing]

Again, Thailand won't be the first to test this. Other countries like Mexico will. Some years later some evidence will be in and if Mexico's policies helped a lot there, then lots of other countries will pay attention. If not, they'll see that too. Mexico is really a big deal in this globesity story as it is the most obese large nation in the world and also going aggressive on fighting it.

I am afraid it is going to be more of the same nothing change except more money for the government to spend.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

A very, very valid concern. Previously mentioned by others and I agreed as well. My arguments in favor are only in the case that there is good evidence of effectiveness.

[transam]

Again, Thailand won't be the first to test this. Other countries like Mexico will. Some years later some evidence will be in and if Mexico's policies helped a lot there, then lots of other countries will pay attention. If not, they'll see that too. Mexico is really a big deal in this globesity story as it is the most obese large nation in the world and also going aggressive on fighting it.

I am afraid it is going to be more of the same nothing change except more money for the government to spend.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

A very, very valid concern. Previously mentioned by others and I agreed as well. My arguments in favor are only in the case that there is good evidence of effectiveness.

Daft or what................ ..........This is LOS...........Nobody cares about anything.....................

[Jingthing]

Daft or what................ ..........This is LOS...........Nobody cares about anything.....................

Maybe later. They care about some things but the general public welfare, not so much, agreed. Anyway, some visionary Thais have already talked about such things. Not impossible, but not soon.

[transam]

Daft or what................ ..........This is LOS...........Nobody cares about anything.....................

Maybe later. They care about some things but the general public welfare, not so much, agreed. Anyway, some visionary Thais have already talked about such things. Not impossible, but not soon.

First they must tackle young kids being given keys to motor bikes, then make sure kids wear crash hats, then stop the fingers in pies that make money from drugs given to kids, then stop corruption to allow kids to go to a nice school, THEN YOU can worry about if kids reaching 80 instead of 60.

[BookMan]

Thailand should start with a tax on sugar. Add ten percent tax to white sugar.

As an incentive for better health make raw sugar cheaper.

Raw sugar is better for u than white sugar.

[Somsrisonphimai]

Again, Thailand won't be the first to test this. Other countries like Mexico will. Some years later some evidence will be in and if Mexico's policies helped a lot there, then lots of other countries will pay attention. If not, they'll see that too. Mexico is really a big deal in this globesity story as it is the most obese large nation in the world and also going aggressive on fighting it.

I am afraid it is going to be more of the same nothing change except more money for the government to spend.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

A very, very valid concern. Previously mentioned by others and I agreed as well. My arguments in favor are only in the case that there is good evidence of effectiveness.

Daft or what................ ..........This is LOS...........Nobody cares about anything.....................

You are right, I don't think the majority of them care or even know the difference. They'll eat what they like. I am curious to know how effective alcohol and cigarette taxes are and what is the data of before and after taxes?

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[David48]

then stop the fingers in pies ..

Khun transam .. please don't say that.

I used to put my finger in the pie to test if it was hot enough.

Will Meat Pies also attract the Thailand Tax on Junk Food that Jingthing is introducing suggesting?

[David48]

Dbl Post ... sorry.

Edited January 10, 2014 by David48

[Somsrisonphimai]

I have another proposal for obesity prevention, how about tax people by the scale? Each year there should be a requirement for physical examination. They should set up the weight limitation base on age and height. If people weight more than their limitation, they should be taxed on their extra weight.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[transam]

I have another proposal for obesity prevention, how about tax people by the scale? Each year there should be a requirement for physical examination. They should set up the weight limitation base on age and height. If people weight more than their limitation, they should be taxed on their extra weight. Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

, so folk with a perhaps thyroid problem are financially doomed.........

[Somsrisonphimai]

I have another proposal for obesity prevention, how about tax people by the scale? Each year there should be a requirement for physical examination. They should set up the weight limitation base on age and height. If people weight more than their limitation, they should be taxed on their extra weight. Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

, so folk with a perhaps thyroid problem are financially doomed.........

Well, then there should be some exceptional for those who have medical issues.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[Thai at Heart]

But that belies the fact that smoking is today, skewed towards the lower economic classes.

It is a strange effect, but the economics of taxing cigarettes is not as simple as saying its a tax on the poor. At the end of the day, people are smoking less and the total amount of smokers is falling in the developed world.

Yes when poor people are addicted to ciggies, in high ciggie tax countries, that is a very regressive tax for them. I'm not saying that's good. But overall raising the ciggie taxes does directly lower overall ciggie usage, on all classes. So it's a tradeoff.

Yes I agree. Thing is, taxes alone don't force the breaking point to get people to quit with tobacco. It is a combination because with tobacco there us a range of prices of products.

Marlboro down to cheaper fags,,down to roll ur own etc.

Maybe with sugar the uk effect would be quicker. At the end of it, sugar isn't addictive in the same way as nicotine. Reductions in consumption should be relatively quick. Plus they will jig recipes to flavour them another way.

[StreetCowboy]

then stop the fingers in pies ..

Khun transam .. please don't say that.

I used to put my finger in the pie to test if it was hot enough.

Will Meat Pies also attract the Thailand Tax on Junk Food that Jingthing is introducing suggesting?

Only pork pies

[StreetCowboy]

Should Thailand tax junk food to help fight obesity?

No they should tax the people who don't have the courage to cut back on their eating habits and always feel the need to blame their obesity on something else than themselves.

But JF, this really isn't about blaming anyone. It's about potential social policies that can make it less likely for Thai people to become obese in the first place (especially the youth), which sadly, usually translates to a lifetime problem. Who you blame is irrelevant really. Effective ways to help more people not have this problem makes much more sense. It is known less sugar, less obesity, perhaps social policies can help societies as whole do LESS SUGAR (for one example).

I like your approach to social engineering. It seems like a good first step...

Will we go for a full actuarial approach to taxation, according to who we think will cost the most to support, or according to our social ideals? I'd like to tax ugly people, as well. Other ugly people, not me, obviously. Anyway, I'm hansum.

SC

[Somsrisonphimai]

Should Thailand tax junk food to help fight obesity?

No they should tax the people who don't have the courage to cut back on their eating habits and always feel the need to blame their obesity on something else than themselves.

But JF, this really isn't about blaming anyone. It's about potential social policies that can make it less likely for Thai people to become obese in the first place (especially the youth), which sadly, usually translates to a lifetime problem. Who you blame is irrelevant really. Effective ways to help more people not have this problem makes much more sense. It is known less sugar, less obesity, perhaps social policies can help societies as whole do LESS SUGAR (for one example).

I like your approach to social engineering. It seems like a good first step...

Will we go for a full actuarial approach to taxation, according to who we think will cost the most to support, or according to our social ideals? I'd like to tax ugly people, as well. Other ugly people, not me, obviously. Anyway, I'm hansum.

SC

Oh gosh, I'll go broke if that what you are proposing!

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand