ggt Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 I read on this forum about a year ago in an interview of high ranking members of immigration and labor office that if you don't get any income from Thailand, working here is not really legal but "acceptable". I don't really know what it means but if you don't talk about it, don't give your business cards all around, nothing will happen. Remember that most of the farangs who had problems here were denounced by other jalous farangs! "Don't ask...Don't tell"...used the internet to increase my income abroad...no thai transactions...never opened that bucket of worms about a work permit...worked for me...No one knew...but me...best not to include gf or friends in your personal business... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phuketboy Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Since you are working online (obviously from home/where you will be staying), nobody would ever know unless you told them. Many people run overseas businesses from here online, via emails and cloud based software. The money spent here is from overseas accounts accessed via ATM machines, you could even set up a bank account here and transfer money, no problem at all. Unless you go around telling people what you do, you don't have anything to worry about. I'm sure people here on holidays still run their business while they are enjoying the land of smiles, making and receiving business phone calls and emails (therefore working in Thailand). If anyone asks what you do, simply tell them you have a company or business overseas and that you have managers running it for you. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DGIE Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 (edited) That is my next step. I thought best to clear my way with the permit question first as it would be a deal breaker to not be able to run business and make a living. I can qualify for the retirement visa but I'm not sure if it's the best option. Other questions arise. Suppose I deposit funds as required into a Thai bank. Suppose then by some chance of fate, my work activity is discovered and made an issue of. Could my bank funds be seized and me sent packing on the next flight out of BKK? 90-day visa runs wouldn't hurt, so a lesser status of visa might do to start and I can upgrade after I've assimilated and learned the native ways. Just not your activity is a kind of scam in the internet. What is your online business then that is not tangible as you said? Edited February 9, 2014 by DGIE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DGIE Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Yes, if you tell immigration about it you need WP. BTW, if you not tell anybody, nobody knows. Exactly, but he already told it. Anyway, for sure nobody will come to you and say you are working illegally if you are not working for a company. Unless the nature of your work is illegal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveB2 Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Okay Tiger, if you re-read all of the above, your question has been comprehensively answered. To summarise other peoples postings: 1. ANY kind of work whilst in Thailand without the requisite permit is illegal. No fancy lawyer is going to change that - no matter how much you get charged! 2. If you get caught then "You potentially face jail (communal Thai cell/'TOILET'), heavy court fine & being kicked out of the country for up to 1/2 a decade." 3. They (probably) wouldn't confiscate your assets. 4. If there are no on-shore consequences (bank accounts, money trails, etc.) you're on pretty safe ground. 5. If you keep absolutely quiet about it - especially to the delightful GF(s) you're sure to find - there is only a minuscule chance of getting into trouble. Go for it :-) Agreed on all points, especially the statement that 'ANY kind of work whilst in Thailand without the requisite permit is illegal' However, here is some detail on how to stay low on points 4 and 5... 6. No business cards showing your local Thai street address and Thai telephone contact number(s). This is a big no-no. 7. Do not use your local SIM card for any normal landline/mobile non-VOIP business conversations or SMS whatsoever. 7. Use communal Wi-Fi for business comms via a 'paid for' VPN or secure https web access proxy such as https://proxify.com/ (all comms up/down are secure encrypted as per banking ATM comms) 8. Use 'Skype out' with registered overseas telephone number (say in Singapore) for all business calls in/out. (You can do this on an iphone easy-peasy) 9. Make no mention of being located in Thailand during any business comms - your are currently travelling if anyone asks. Obfuscate. 10. Don't mouth off to other XPATs after a few drinks about what you are doing - there are some very vindictive and jealous folks out there. Keep quite - your continuing existence here depends on it. Also, be aware that:- The Thai labor offices often have nice big wall posters (I have read them) offering rewards to folk who give information to the authorities about foreigners working here without a work permit... Big rewards All internet comms in Thailand go through one big proxy server in Bangkok - this makes DSI monitoring all internet comms extremely easy Finally - do not assume Thai people are technologically bereft - there are many skilled web monkeys at DSI looking out for this kind of stuff on a full time basis. I had a mate locked up in the Hilton for a while over this. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nithisa78 Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Thank you. This is what I had been thinking but was not entirely sure. As I would be investing a whole lot to move there, would living there and skirting the law be a wise move? The authorities could get very nasty at any moment and cause me big trouble. Should this be a real concern or, am I being obsessive about it and should not worry? Tim, Great question. If it is in fact illegal, skirting the law is rarely if ever wise move. Speak with business lawyer and see if there are ways in which to be in compliance. In BKK you'll find Attorneys from your home Country. Best of luck and God speed. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Globeman Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Think of the guys in the pub or other places - the sort of guy who is only too happy to tell you, "Oh, you don't want to do that, mate. You'll get locked up, see? Communal toilets, raped by ladyboys, etc. etc." It makes the fellow feel very important indeed to share their intimate knowledge, regardless of whether they are talking out of their backside. Yes, it is technically illegal, though it is an area of the legal code that should have been addressed ages ago. The police, immigration and labour just don't give a damn, and they don't have units to investigate such "crimes". You get the occasional raid on a company that is employing illegals, more often than not acting on a tip-off from a disgruntled local employee... in two different companies I worked at during my illegal employee days, the company got tipped off about the impending raid and we got sent out for a second lunch hour. But these were companies with more than 100 employees. I know numerous people who have worked online for years - especially on Ebay - without work permits. None of them have ever been caught or questioned. Of course, avoid broadcasting it because there is no benefit in telling others your personal business - there are plenty of people living here who are living off savings or investments, so that is all you say - if they actually ask. You are far more likely to get hit by a bus (especially in Bangkok) than get caught working at home online. The authorities just DON'T CARE. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thrilled Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 If your doing something small,then you'll probably be fine.If it's huge,cover your A-_ _, and get A work permit.I mean if your making quite A bit of baht then your best off not breaking the law. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HooHaa Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 I read on this forum about a year ago in an interview of high ranking members of immigration and labor office that if you don't get any income from Thailand, working here is not really legal but "acceptable". I don't really know what it means but if you don't talk about it, don't give your business cards all around, nothing will happen. Remember that most of the farangs who had problems here were denounced by other jalous farangs! yes, i read the interview as well, just cant remember where 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poweratradio Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Gee Tim. You are already busted by virtue of your confession of your intentions on this site and your IP address. The Thai authorities are very serious about what passes through their cyber space IE: slandering the flag and or monarch as well as scams/terrorists/money laundering /drugs et al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakweb Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 done it for 10 years, no problem.. just like everyone says low profile also the money I make is not from within Thailand, it's paid to me from overseas I should note I know several others doing the same, stock traders, online technical support people, website designers..etc 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaiger Tim Posted February 9, 2014 Author Share Posted February 9, 2014 I suppose it best to not further disclose my business, lest some vindictive and jealous ex-pat is in bed with a local official. As it is, I'm already busted and headed to a Thai prison camp by virtue of my IP address and the starting of this thread. But in the end the whole question from this guy doesn't make sense. I know thousands of guys working online in Thailand not one of them are "investing a lot to come to Thailand" if you work online ain't nothing to invest so I kinda think your full of s^&* Sorry, but I thought the question made perfect sense. When I say "a lot to invest", I mean selling possessions, leaving family and friends, the financial cost, plus going through the logistics of moving to another continent. Correct me if I'm wrong, but that to me seems like a lot to invest.Thanks for the many intelligent replies. Thanks especially - johnopolo, HOOD Robin, MaksimMislavsky, ukrules and others. I just wanted some inside perspective from those people that have already made the move.It's not like I'll be hanging a big neon sign on the front of my house advertising my products and I know not to do anything blatant like hand out business cards. Sure, my online traffic could be monitored but I'm not selling guns or counterfeit stuff, or running a gambling site. You are far more likely to get hit by a bus (especially in Bangkok) than get caught working at home online. The authorities just DON'T CARE. I like that one! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wayned Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 If all of the posts by people that were working illegally in Thailand without a work permit were removed from this thread, you certainly would not have 43 responses! Good luck. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobo42 Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Technically, it is illegal. However, I have always been perfectly honest with immigration - if they ask, I tell them the truth - and nobody's ever given me any hint of a problem. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrHammer Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 As the OP has now for sure found out, the law is not in the best interest of Thailand and therefore it doesn't really apply if you keep to the 'dont ask dont tell' doctrine, which is not only in the american army but immigration officers as well. They know full well what you're doing and don't give a cr*p. You're bringing money in from abroad and spend it locally. It is an macro-economic dream come true, everything goes for local consumption, which in turn gets taxed. You see, you are paying tax even if you're not doing it directly. I still think Thailand is hopelessly behind and really should consider some kind of internet work visa, since so many people are bringing foreign cash into Thailand exactly by doing that. Perhaps somewhere there is a bright public employee with the same kind of thought process. If you were to be asked eventually what you do for a living: "I own a couple of websites which bring me some modest - passive - income". 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exsexyman Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 My question is of the 195 countries in the world where one could potentially live and work, why did you Thailand? This is especially so as if you go the route you are planning, you will be breaking the law and subject to arrest, fines, and/or imprisonment. Oh, let me guess, you love Thai food. Perhaps he likes Ladyboys! This is probably one of the few contributions you have made on here where you haven't informed us all that you like them, regardless of the relevance to the topic under discussion.! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaiger Tim Posted February 9, 2014 Author Share Posted February 9, 2014 Perhaps he likes Ladyboys! This is probably one of the few contributions you have made on here where you haven't informed us all that you like them, regardless of the relevance to the topic under discussion.! I post a question about work permits...... and you wonder why it is that I haven't informed you all if I like ladyboys. Since you obviously desire to know, I'm very straight and love women. But what's the connection? Why would you make the suggestion that I like ladyboys? Are they what you are into? I don't see the point of your question. Are you trying to be sarcastic? Please explain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sustento Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 "Work online. Do I need a work permit?" You do now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaiger Tim Posted February 9, 2014 Author Share Posted February 9, 2014 "Work online. Do I need a work permit?" You do now Why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sustento Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 "Work online. Do I need a work permit?" You do now Why? Because you'd just admitted you're working whilst being in Thailand. Doh! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaiger Tim Posted February 9, 2014 Author Share Posted February 9, 2014 Did I say I was working in Thailand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingdoc Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 I agree! No business people would come to Thailand if they are not even allowed to send e-mails back home if they relate to business. Just don't be seen to be working in Thailand with a Thai company or issue out business cards with a Thai address, unless you have a W.P. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sustento Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Did I say I was working in Thailand? "I would be 'working', going online to do my work, and I would be 'in Thailand', therefore, 'working in Thailand'. Will I need a Thai work permit?" 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sustento Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Best not to ask questions that you may not want to hear the answer to... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ukrules Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 (edited) Did I say I was working in Thailand? "I would be 'working', going online to do my work, and I would be 'in Thailand', therefore, 'working in Thailand'. Will I need a Thai work permit?" If you work for a Thai company, get paid by a Thai company and are in Thailand then you're going to need a work permit. If you're doing some work like answering emails, making phone calls, etc for a foreign company and get paid by that foreign company then you don't work for a Thai company so it's not possible to get a work permit and as such it's not regarded as working. Just go and apply for a work permit for doing some work for your foreign company back home. You will probably realise your mistake before they stop laughing at you. Edited February 9, 2014 by ukrules 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjchaos Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 (edited) If the company and all the work is outside Thailand, sending instructions from Thailand is not classed as working anymore than managing an overseas bank and living off the interest is. You would never need a work permit for living off interest in a foreign bank account though. Surely if you passed instructions on through a relative and have them manage profit that is distributed as your wage, all you have to do is monitor your Thai bank account, you wont need a permit for that. You should probably ask an employment lawyer to be sure. Edited February 9, 2014 by cjchaos 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaiger Tim Posted February 9, 2014 Author Share Posted February 9, 2014 Best not to ask questions that you may not want to hear the answer to... If you read my post, you would see that I said 'would be', clearly implying future intent, not 'currently', as in working there at this moment, but you instead infer that I am working in Thailand and claim that I now need a work permit, in spite of all the other posts to the contrary. By the very act of asking the question here, I now must procure a permit because I've given the game away to the Thai government. So the definitive answer is YES! I positively DO need a Thai work permit. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JLCrab Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 One thing someone in your position might do is to just travel to neighboring countries often enough such that one could say -- in the unlikely event of any query -- that any and all work has been conducted ex-Thailand and your time in Thailand is strictly on a leisure basis. This could be especially true if one secured an extension of stay based upon retirement with a multiple-entry re-entry permit for 3900 baht. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OMGImInPattaya Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 My question is of the 195 countries in the world where one could potentially live and work, why did you Thailand? This is especially so as if you go the route you are planning, you will be breaking the law and subject to arrest, fines, and/or imprisonment. Oh, let me guess, you love Thai food. Perhaps he likes Ladyboys! This is probably one of the few contributions you have made on here where you haven't informed us all that you like them, regardless of the relevance to the topic under discussion.! What's your problem? If one was to survey my posting history, 90% or more of my posts don't mention them. Maybe the posts that do just stick in your mind because you fantasize about trying one, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaiger Tim Posted February 10, 2014 Author Share Posted February 10, 2014 My question is of the 195 countries in the world where one could potentially live and work, why did you Thailand? This is especially so as if you go the route you are planning, you will be breaking the law and subject to arrest, fines, and/or imprisonment. Oh, let me guess, you love Thai food. Perhaps he likes Ladyboys! This is probably one of the few contributions you have made on here where you haven't informed us all that you like them, regardless of the relevance to the topic under discussion.! What's your problem? If one was to survey my posting history, 90% or more of my posts don't mention them. Maybe the posts that do just stick in your mind because you fantasize about trying one, no? My reply wasn't for you. I replied to someone else who for some reason quoted you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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