Thailand's health care described as "cheap" in expat retirement overview

[Jingthing]

Well, I don't think it is really THAT cheap anymore.

“Even in places like Thailand where good health care is really cheap, cancer is going to be expensive,” he said. “I can’t think of any country where cancer or a serious car accident wouldn’t be financially disastrous.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/22/your-money/the-dream-of-retiring-abroad-with-good-health-care.html?_r=0

The article is about general issues of retired expats getting (or not being able to get) health insurance abroad. I am posting it because I think retired expats and those considering doing so will find it informative.

Cheers.

[HooHaa]

what do you find inexpensive?

[MB1]

I'd still say it's cheap when you consider the cost of health care in places like America, maybe you have been here too long Jing and take the cheap for granted..

Oh and don't forget, the cost normally rises as you get older...

Edited February 25, 2014 by MB1

[Jingthing]

what do you find inexpensive?

The best part for me is being to buy so many kinds of meds directly at pharmacies, without a scrip, and mostly for competitive retail prices compared to the USA anyway.

[Jingthing]

I'd still say it's cheap when you consider the cost of health care in places like America, maybe you have been here too long Jing and take the cheap for granted..

Of course but the article is correct, if you get something medically devastating, most people are going to be ruined financially in Thailand as well if they don't have good cover. Also, good cover isn't actually for sale to all here, based on age and preexisting conditions.

Edited February 25, 2014 by Jingthing

[MB1]

I'd still say it's cheap when you consider the cost of health care in places like America, maybe you have been here too long Jing and take the cheap for granted..

Of course but the article is correct, if you get something medically devastating, most people are going to be ruined financially in Thailand as well if they don't have good cover. Also, good cover isn't actually for sale to all here, based on age and preexisting conditions.

Which is why when considering moving abroad is making sure you get the right insurance for you to cover all eventualities, and if you can't afford the insurance then moving abroad is IMO a bad move...

As for those who have been here for years and are now finding that they can't afford or won't pay for it, or as you say can't get cover for certain things, then maybe it's time to pack up and go, or take the risk if things go wrong....

[Jingthing]

It's probably more useful for those thinking about moving abroad than those already here. Most of us here already know the score and know the risks we are taking if not well covered by insurance.

[NeverSure]

I'd still say it's cheap when you consider the cost of health care in places like America, maybe you have been here too long Jing and take the cheap for granted..

Oh and don't forget, the cost normally rises as you get older...

America? If you are 65 or older, you can buy Medicare Advantage for between $125 and $150 a month with no exceptions for pre-existing conditions. It will stay with you for life and the premiums don't increase.

Also, there is no "rationing." My mother had a heart valve transplant (pig valve used) when she was about 85. My father, who is now 97, has had all of the care he needs at all times, and his medicare advantage costs $95 a month because he's had it for so long.

He also qualifies for and can get anything he needs from the VA as a WWII wounded vet, but he buys Advantage because he prefers private doctors and hospitals, so he's double covered. The VA even pays for his eye glasses and hearing aids.

This is a BIG consideration for senior Americans moving to Thailand where their US insurance is no good. (It should be because it would save the government a lot of money to pay Thai prices.)

[10Yen]

Another useless thread, if you can't afford private medical, stay in your own country, it ain't freekin rocket science, I was in Tokyo and had to go to a dentist, what it cost would give you a heart attack, but I was there by choice, so I paid up and didn't bitch and whine!

And JT, do you ever leave your room, you have some crazy ammount of posts, that tells me you never go out, so what the freek do you know about anything in Thailand, you never see anything in Thailand cos your stuck in front of a PC 24/7.

You're really living the dream, right ?

[Jingthing]

Another useless thread, if you can't afford private medical, stay in your own country, it ain't freekin rocket science, I was in Tokyo and had to go to a dentist, what it cost would give you a heart attack, but I was there by choice, so I paid up and didn't bitch and whine!

...

If you find a thread useless, the civil thing is just to ignore it.

[janpharma]

Are you joking? 4 to 10 x more expensive than Belgium...

(4 x for treatment of kidney-stones; 10 x for confinement...)

[elgenon]

NeverSure

Medicare Advantage costs DO go up! What cha talkin' 'bout? Mine went up. You really expect to live 30 more years and NOT have the cost go up? Jing jing?

[rotary]

I'd still say it's cheap when you consider the cost of health care in places like America, maybe you have been here too long Jing and take the cheap for granted..

Oh and don't forget, the cost normally rises as you get older...

And look at the quality of healthcare in American. My mother dislocated her shoulder in the USA, spent 8 hrs in the emergency room waiting on service. My father broke his leg, spent 6 hrs in emergency room waiting on service. They have insurance also so not a welfare thing at all. This was due to the amount of people in the Emergency room. Also getting a doctors appointment takes weeks to obtain in many cases. After seeing this I realized retirement in the USA is not an option.

[Thaiready]

Another useless thread, if you can't afford private medical, stay in your own country, it ain't freekin rocket science, I was in Tokyo and had to go to a dentist, what it cost would give you a heart attack, but I was there by choice, so I paid up and didn't bitch and whine!

And JT, do you ever leave your room, you have some crazy ammount of posts, that tells me you never go out, so what the freek do you know about anything in Thailand, you never see anything in Thailand cos your stuck in front of a PC 24/7.

You're really living the dream, right ?

You need to go back to bed....get up on the right side next time....Troll

[wym]

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I'd still say it's cheap when you consider the cost of health care in places like America, maybe you have been here too long Jing and take the cheap for granted..

Of course but the article is correct, if you get something medically devastating, most people are going to be ruined financially in Thailand as well if they don't have good cover. Also, good cover isn't actually for sale to all here, based on age and preexisting conditions.

Which is why when considering moving abroad is making sure you get the right insurance for you to cover all eventualities, and if you can't afford the insurance then moving abroad is IMO a bad move...

As for those who have been here for years and are now finding that they can't afford or won't pay for it, or as you say can't get cover for certain things, then maybe it's time to pack up and go, or take the risk if things go wrong....

Yes to that last bit.

No need to try to make sure you're covered if you're willing to wear the risk.

When it's time for each of us to die, we should IMO just let go of life. Far too many use advanced medical technology to live long past the point where they're living useful lives, better to free up the resources for the young.

[ghworker2010]

My advice for any farang with money issues is go to a government hospital. The treatment there is very cheap and the Dr's are mostly very good.

[dotpoom]

I'd still say it's cheap when you consider the cost of health care in places like America, maybe you have been here too long Jing and take the cheap for granted..

Of course but the article is correct, if you get something medically devastating, most people are going to be ruined financially in Thailand as well if they don't have good cover. Also, good cover isn't actually for sale to all here, based on age and preexisting conditions.

Which is why when considering moving abroad is making sure you get the right insurance for you to cover all eventualities, and if you can't afford the insurance then moving abroad is IMO a bad move...

As for those who have been here for years and are now finding that they can't afford or won't pay for it, or as you say can't get cover for certain things, then maybe it's time to pack up and go, or take the risk if things go wrong....

I sincerely hope my post is not offensive to some people but I sometimes wonder at this obsession most people seem to have about dragging out the process of life to the very last possible second. In a few months I will be 65 and I have never had health insurance. Life for me was not so good up until the time I moved to Thailand 12 years ago. These 12 years have more than made up for the previous years. I have a Thai wife, a house and some rent from a condo, a car and a motorbike. There is nothing more I need. Most of all, thank God, I am in good health (but starting to creek a little bit) I will get health insurance before my 65th birthday (seen it advertised at the ex-pats club for up to 65s). I don't place much confidence in any sort of insurance cover as they seem to spend all their time niggling out of their commitments. I am getting the cover because I am in GOOD health and hopefully it might cover some not too serious illness that may occur. But.....God forbid....if something really serious happens that would wipe me out financially then I would choose my own time to exit rather than spend all monies dragging out a penniless existence and thus leaving my wife behind with absolutely nothing after I'm gone. Better she have what money there is to live a life for herself and her children. Would going home be an option....not lightly....sitting at home (if I had a home) by a fire waiting to die, I'd rather make my exit before it came to that. I am more than happy with what life has given me up to this present time and upon my death I will have received far more than I ever imagined.

[Sheryl]

My advice for any farang with money issues is go to a government hospital. The treatment there is very cheap and the Dr's are mostly very good.

Much less expensive than private but hardly "very cheap" if major surgery, prolonged hospitalization in ICU etc is required, ditto dialysis, cancer treatment.

I've seen plenty of foreigners bankrupted by expenses in govt hospitals and/or unable to pay their bills.

[Sheryl]

.....No need to try to make sure you're covered if you're willing to wear the risk.

When it's time for each of us to die, we should IMO just let go of life. Far too many use advanced medical technology to live long past the point where they're living useful lives, better to free up the resources for the young.

The problem is that people do not have an accurate, realistic understanding of what the risk is.

There is a vast field of experience and issues in between perfect health and "time to die". Most people do not simply go from completely fit and well to terminal/end of life. They spend decades with basic faculties intact but gradually increasing problems. Or they may even get serious problems will still young and with potentially decades of life left to live.

There is the pain of joints that have given out/need replacement in people who are 100% alert, with it, and likely to live another 30+ active years.

The effects of major accidents, at any age...multiple fractures, need for surgery...

etc etc etc.

Can't begin to count the number of horror situations I have seen emerge here because people blithely assumed they'd be OK until they were "ready to die", never anticipating all the in-between scenarios.

Most foreigners who retire here either come from countries with some type of universal health care coverage, or from the US where there is universal cover for those over 65. So the majority are in fact moving from a situation of good access to health care to one where they will potentially face financial barriers. That the "cost" of health care in Thailand is less than in many of these countries is misleading given that people rarely pay out of pocket for it there, whereas they may well have to in Thailand.

[pennine]

I was quoted a reasonable premium for a policy at my age (74, living in Samui, with a Bt 40 000 excess), but then discovered that if I go into Bangkok International, there is a 25% co-payment (the only hospital in Thailand where this applies), plus another 25-30% co-payment if over 70, plus no cover for dental or vision over 65 or pre-existing conditions. On top of that, there are maximum payments for certain procedures/complaints, but no reduction in premium for these factors. I was left wondering if they would ever have to pay for anything.

[Jingthing]

That's another reason a lot of people who can buy insurance self insure. They're skeptical the companies will actually come through for what they need when they need it.

[Rupert2]

Maybe ( if lucky ) you can just fly home to get health care. Keep your place in America and your place in Thailand.

I wouldn't burn the bridge - so to speak.

[Doc46]

Wow I there anybody here who's got an health insurance here in Thailand that would pay for something and don't cost the earth for old codgers over 66 .

[HeijoshinCool]

The thread began as the cost of "health care" and quickly became about insurance.

Anyway, unless you're talking about a place like Bumrungrad, the cost of health care here is much cheaper.

Example:

A few months ago, a westerner was in an accident. It cost less for his care here because the doctors just cut off that old leg and tossed it.

In the west, a team of surgeons would have reattached it, and he would have gone through rehabilitation.

[Stan7444]

Been living in Thailand 6 years now originally from the States. Approaching 70 years old, but feel like 45. Bought UK health insurance when first arrived here and paid close to $400 per month or $5,000 per year with almost $1,000 per incident deductible. Had to go into Phuket International Hospital with a fever, which the Dr. thought might be bird flu, but turned out luckily not to be, but kept me overnight with several IV bottles, medicine, private room with my gf staying overnight with me, several visits by the Dr. and nurses, and medicine to take home with me. All costs were about $300 total. Had a couple of other injuries and the usual stuff and never even approached the $1,000 deductable for my UK insurance, so I finally dropped it. Have gone once into Thai gov't hospital and they gave me a card to use for the next time, and the charge for X-rays, Dr. Checkup, and other treatment was $1.00 plus $10 for medicine to take home. Most the time I go to a private hospital since closer to my condo in BKK. For check up cost me about $300 and seeing Dr. for pain in foot and other injuries never cost over $100 and usually quite a bit less.

Last time I had a tread mill heart test in the US prior to moving to Thailand, the 20 mins. testing, with one Dr. and nurse, and they presented me with a bill for $1,200. So I guess when we are talking about Thailand being "cheap" medical treatment, this would be my barometer at least.

I have been trying to find out if we permanent resident farangs are "entitled" to the $1.00 gov't hospital treatment and so far found nothing on any website, except it depends upon the individual hospital. At least one hospital in BKK accepted me without question. On problem I found was the long lines for waiting and almost not one soul spoke any English to tell them what my problem was.

I am considering moving to Ubon very soon and there is a gov't hospital there, but not sure if they would accept me in case of need. I also have Medicare in the US so if something serious (heart, cancer, etc.) does come up in the future, can always hop onto a plane to fly for treatment. I have Plan B which includes all medicine and visits to the Dr. which standard Medicare does not include and costs me all of $100 per month extra. Unfortunately, can only use Medicare in the 50 states or US territories, such as Guam, which is closest to Thailand, but could not find a good quality medical facility there on the internet. Some rumor that Philippine hospitals will also accept Medicare, but not sure if this is true or not. So I am presently self-insured especially since never have had any serious illness or disease or major operations in my life. Been living right I guess. Anyway, hope this info helps some other chap.

[umbanda]

Now even cheaper with a Government Health Insurance for Foreigners....2200THB/year..Can you find better? Sorry..I forgot....Needs to pay 30THB for every hospital visit including the medication...

[anon11]

Sorry do not agree at all with your comment Thailand is still an economical place to be ILL if you are going to be ill, I recently attended the local hospital for a very bad chest infection I only waited about 15 minutes was treated by a Thai Dr spoke very good english and quized me on my general health, I advised him I had had chemo and radio therapy for some cancer just a few months ago so he even went through what medications I was taking.

The consult plus medication cost me 430 baht ! ! ! back home I would be looking at maybe 2000 baht just for the consult excluding the medications, I also now by my normal medications that I MUST take and they are approximately 45% cheaper than I would normally pay.

To me that is really good value......But if you are really concerned about the costs,,,use your insurance .....a mandatory thing to have when not living in your own country....You DO have insurance don't you

Hoping you are not ill

[kalasiner]

Sorry Umbanda, but this Government Health Scheme for farang has definitely been CANCELLED!

It's only for workers from Cambodia, Laos and Burma. Already signed-up farang will get a refund.

I'm sure Sheryl can confirm this.

I really am sorry, because I wanted to join this scheme. Due to a pre-condition I can't get private cover.

Stark choices: 1. Accept the incalculable risk.

2. Set money aside for hospital treatment. How much? In my case, enough to prevent me buying a nice house.

3. Have a return ticket to UK etc. and hope you can make it there when sick.

4. Return home to your government health system.

Personally, I have chosen a combination of 2+3 and hoping for the best, aka whistling in the wind.

[Sheryl]

Now even cheaper with a Government Health Insurance for Foreigners....2200THB/year..Can you find better? Sorry..I forgot....Needs to pay 30THB for every hospital visit including the medication...

Only being offered in some locations, and some places that initially offered it have no rescinded it (i.e. Chiang Mai)

[Sheryl]

I was quoted a reasonable premium for a policy at my age (74, living in Samui, with a Bt 40 000 excess), but then discovered that if I go into Bangkok International, there is a 25% co-payment (the only hospital in Thailand where this applies), plus another 25-30% co-payment if over 70, plus no cover for dental or vision over 65 or pre-existing conditions. On top of that, there are maximum payments for certain procedures/complaints, but no reduction in premium for these factors. I was left wondering if they would ever have to pay for anything.

Can I ask which insurance company this was? As this is the first I have heard of a policy being offered to someone your age at all.

For all its limitations, still better than nothing.