Disappearance of Malaysian jet appears 'deliberate': PM

[wooloomooloo]

looks like all available facts are known so the story will peter out until the wreckage is found ,not much more speculation one can add .that could take years or never

Can't argue. One of two events have occurred - the aircraft depressurised and took its own course until crashing or sinister intent.

The end question of sinister intent would be why a hijacker would take the flight on a four to seven hour mystery tour before ditching. It would've been far easier to nosedive at the earliest opportunity.

One thing is for certain - the passengers aren't sunbathing on some tropical island sipping Pina Coladas.

[khaosai]

Land at anyone of the estimated 600 airfields or a prepared surface in the range of arc of the aircraft endurance.

The 777-200 is a large commercial airliner which would require a very strong and pretty <deleted> long runway to land and take off from. You might be able to get it on the ground at Samui airport for example which handles well over a million passengers a year but the undercarriage (due to the weight) would trash the runway as well as itself.

Hi,

At a weight of 200 tons you could stop in approx 1600 metres.

[3NUMBAS]

the only other thing i can think of is that they took to smoking some large joints on the flight that proved stronger than they thought and chilled out too much and became so complacent they didnt know what they were doing.

the sheilas said they were smoking in the cockpit so did they take on board some strong joints with something added that they didn't know about?

that would explain their crazy behavior because nothing else adds up , so you have to factor in something to explain the bizarre events .

both crew wouldnt have been on a suicide mission ,and the casual last words indicate they were very chilled .

(co pilots last words didn't follow strict protocol giving a call sign )

a hijacker would have crashed the plane into the towers as it was near enough but that didnt occur

Edited March 17, 2014 by 3NUMBAS

[notmyself]

Land at anyone of the estimated 600 airfields or a prepared surface in the range of arc of the aircraft endurance.

The 777-200 is a large commercial airliner which would require a very strong and pretty <deleted> long runway to land and take off from. You might be able to get it on the ground at Samui airport for example which handles well over a million passengers a year but the undercarriage (due to the weight) would trash the runway as well as itself.

Hi,

At a weight of 200 tons you could stop in approx 1600 metres.

Sounds reasonable but you would increase the downward pressure in doing so resulting in uneven weight distribution in the same opposite way that a motorbike front wheel will lift off if you accelerate to hard. The wheels at the front of the plane would sink into the asphalt and I'm sure you can guess what happens then. There was talk many years back about extending the runway but some monks basically said no because they would have had to move. They would have also needed to replace the existing runway or rather strengthen it because bigger planes are also heavier.

[folium]

Land at anyone of the estimated 600 airfields or a prepared surface in the range of arc of the aircraft endurance.

The 777-200 is a large commercial airliner which would require a very strong and pretty <deleted> long runway to land and take off from. You might be able to get it on the ground at Samui airport for example which handles well over a million passengers a year but the undercarriage (due to the weight) would trash the runway as well as itself.

Hi,

At a weight of 200 tons you could stop in approx 1600 metres.

Know diddly squat about planes...but 200 tons for a B777, even with empty tanks seems pretty light. That's less than 3 MIA2 main battle tanks...clue me in folks.

[notmyself]

the only other thing i can think of is that they took to smoking some large joints on the flight that proved stronger than they thought and chilled out too much and became so complacent they didnt know what they were doing.

the sheilas said they were smoking in the cockpit so did they take on board some strong joints with something added that they didn't know about?

that would explain their crazy behavior because nothing else adds up , so you have to factor in something to explain the bizarre events .

both crew wouldnt have been on a suicide mission ,and the casual last words indicate they were very chilled .

a hijacker would have crashed the plane into the towers as it was near enough but that didnt occur

Very funny but there could be something in what you say. Someone could have simply lost the plot such as pilot, co-pilot or passenger who knew what they were doing to some extent with regard to an aircraft. None if it seems to make any sense at all and perhaps that is the key.

[Judo Chop]

Ahmad Jauhari Yahya, the Malaysia Airlines CEO, said the plane had no unusual cargo, though he said it was carrying several tons of mangosteens, a purple tropical fruit.

Who's doing a background check on the mangosteens?

http://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-updates/malaysia-says-mh370s-copilot-spoke-the-final-words-as-search-mission-to-be-launched-from-perth/story-fnizu68q-1226857475351

[bendejo]

cooked up stories to sell newspapers ,they can get the story to run for months with all sorts of crazy stories

Shelves upon shelves of books of the phenomenon, still a great mystery after XXXX years! Twenty years after the incident so-and-so releases his memoir and breaks his silence on the subject!

Mystery, in the same way what I had for lunch yesterday is a mystery, simply because I didn't tell anyone.

I've wondered for years when and how this new jihad stuff would finally reach Malaysia.

I would have thought that if jihadis were to hijack a MAS plane it would be a 747, they have an onboard prayer room.

[captainsteve]

Most B777's and other aircraft have a toilet just outside the flight deck door. Although there is a strong door between the passenger cabin and the flight deck , the pilots need to come out to use the toilet , and cabin crew need to take food and drink into the pilots . On a long flight this means there are a number of chances for someone to storm into the flight deck.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[ABCer]

At long last, after enormous amount of inconsistencies we get a halfhearted admission of the obvious.

Now the Bermuda Triangle goes back where it should be, the Alien Forces stood down and the Passed Out Pilot reawakened.

It took more than a week for Malaysian Gov't to half admit half of the truth. The obvious half.

It looks that 'face saving' is all important not only to Thais.

And for the fourth time I am posting in relation to the obvious:

This Unusual Mysterious Disappearance Was Only Possible With Help From The Ground.

Everybody is looking for the plane. Everybody is looking at what happened at the plane. Everybody refuses to look at the ground!

Want to find it? Want to know what happened?

Look at the Ground Control at Radars at Communication System.

This is also obvious. And this is the other obvious half of the truth Malaysians are trying to avoid saying anything about.

Hope Chinese will make them...

Edited March 18, 2014 by ABCer

[captainsteve]

BTW I am not saying this is what I think happened . Until they find the aircraft and hopefully the black box , we will not know the truth. I hope for everyone's sake, and especially the family of the victims , this does not take too long.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[Asiantravel]

A day after authorities all but confirmed that one of the two pilots flying Flight 370 were involved in its disappearance, a new report on March 16 claimed that one of them, Zaharie Ahmad Shah, was a fanatically ‘obsessed’ political activist opposed to the Malaysian government, who watched his leader get sentenced to five years in prison just hours before takeoff.

The worrisome thing is that Zaharie was reportedly in attendance at this unjust trial, and just seven hours later he flew Flight 370, which was carrying 238 other passengers, out of Kuala Lumpur

http://hollywoodlife.com/2014/03/16/malaysia-airlines-flight-370-pilot-missing-political-revenge-plot-motive/

[webfact]

China finds no terror link to nationals on Malaysia plane
Agence France-Presse
KUALA LUMPUR


Students stand next to a giant mural featuring missing Malaysia Airlines flight MH370 displayed on the grounds of their school in Manilas financial district of Makati on Tuesday.//AFP PHOTO / TED ALJIBE

KUALA LUMPUR: -- Intelligence checks on the 153 Chinese passengers aboard a missing Malaysian airliner produced no red flags, China said Tuesday, as investigators struggled to clarify events that led to the plane's dramatic disappearance.

Eleven days after contact was lost with Flight 370 and its 239 passengers and crew, there has been minimal progress in determining what transpired when the Boeing 777 was deliberately diverted off its flight path and where it might have gone.

Two thirds of those on board were Chinese, and Malaysia had asked the authorities in Beijing to run an exhaustive background check on all their nationals.

Particular attention had been paid to one passenger from China’s Muslim ethnic Uighur minority, separatist elements of which have become increasingly militant in their struggle against Chinese rule.

On Tuesday, China’s ambassador to Malaysia Huang Huikang said no evidence had been found that would link anyone to a possible hijacking or terrorist attack on the jet, the official Xinhua news agency reported.

Huang also said China had begun searching for the aircraft in its own territory but gave no further details.

The potential search area, which was only properly identified after a week of fruitlessly scouring the South China Sea, is enormous -- stretching from the depths of the southern Indian Ocean, up and over the Himalaya and into central Asia.

China’s state media has been vocally critical of Malaysia’s handling of the missing plane investigation, saying valuable time and resources were wasted in the hours and days immediately after the aircraft disappeared on March 8.

On Monday, Premier Li Keqiang asked his Malaysian counterpart Najib Razak to provide more detailed information about the missing flight "in a timely, accurate and comprehensive manner".

Malaysian officials insist they are investigating all the passengers and crew, but for the moment the focus is clearly on the two pilots -- Captain Zaharie Ahmad Shah and First Officer Fariq Abdul Hamid.

- A confusing timeline -

========================

On Monday the head of Malaysia Airlines, Ahmad Jauhari Yahya, revealed that initial investigations indicated the last recorded words from the cockpit -- "All right, good night" -- were spoken by the co-pilot, Fariq.

Identifying the voice had been deemed crucial because officials initially said the words were spoken after one of the Boeing’s two automated signalling systems -- Aircraft Communications Addressing and Reporting System (ACARS) -- had been manually disabled.

But Ahmad Jauhari contradicted that chronology, saying that the ACARS could have been switched off before or after Fariq spoke.

It could even have been disabled at the same time as the plane’s transponder, which might possibly point back towards a general mechanical malfunction rather than human intervention.

The confusion is likely to fuel frustration with Malaysia’s investigation, which has repeatedly stumbled in presenting contradictory information.

According to unidentified US officials cited by the New York Times on Tuesday, investigators believe the first turn the plane made away from its intended flight path was not effected manually but by a computer system that was most likely programmed by a person in the cockpit.

Use of the Flight Management System, which directs the plane from point to point according to the pre-submitted flight plan, would reinforce the theory that the plane was deliberately diverted by one of the pilots.

Twenty-six countries are now involved in searching for the jet after satellite and military radar data projected two dauntingly large corridors the plane might have flown through.

The northern corridor stretches in an arc over south and central Asia, while the other swoops deep into the southern Indian Ocean towards Australia.

At the far northern end of the arc, the central Asian states of Kyrgyzstan and Kazakhstan said there had been no sightings of the jet in their airspace.

Malaysia has deployed its navy and air force to the southern corridor, where Australia is taking the lead in scouring a vast section of ocean off its west coast.

-- An impossible search --

==========================

In a reflection of the enormity of the task, the US Pacific Fleet said it was withdrawing a guided missile destroyer from the search, because the area was simply too big for such a vessel to make an effective contribution.

Two long-range patrol aircraft -- a P-8A Poseidon and P-3C Orion -- would shoulder the main operational burden from now on, said Fleet spokesman Commander William Marks.

"The Indian Ocean goes so far, there probably aren’t enough ships and aircraft in the world to search every inch of it," Marks told CNN.

"If you take a map of the United States ... it’s kind of like saying, all right, I want to find a person somewhere between New York and California. I just don’t know where they are," he said.

Malaysian police have searched both pilots’ homes and are examining a flight simulator that Captain Zaharie, 53, had assembled at his home.

Associates say Zaharie was an active supporter of Malaysia’s political opposition headed by veteran politician Anwar Ibrahim.

In a highly controversial case, Anwar was convicted of sodomy -- illegal in Muslim Malaysia -- just hours before MH370 took off.

Friends say Zaharie exhibited no extreme views, and Anwar said Tuesday he was "disgusted" by the suggestion that the captain may have sabotaged the plane as an act of political revenge.


-- The Nation 2014-03-18

[15Peter20]

This may seem like a silly question, but is it possible for a member of a flight crew to go nearly the whole distance of a journey without actively checking where exactly they are? I mean, if one of the co-pilots or captain is left alone in the cockpit for a while and changes direction without the others noticing, is it possible that those others will not check their location for hours more?

Thanks for any insight.

[GentlemanJim]

This may seem like a silly question, but is it possible for a member of a flight crew to go nearly the whole distance of a journey without actively checking where exactly they are? I mean, if one of the co-pilots or captain is left alone in the cockpit for a while and changes direction without the others noticing, is it possible that those others will not check their location for hours more?

Thanks for any insight.

No Peter, not a silly question, but it is not possible.

Edit, let me rephrase that. I am constantly reminded by interactions with certain people on here that anything is possible, so I will say yes 'anything is possible', but the scenario you describe is truly difficult to comprehend a crew or member of crew doing. Pilots are constantly aware of and updating their position.

Edited March 18, 2014 by GentlemanJim

[Rob8891]

There seems to be a deafening silence around the issue of 20-odd staff of a US high-tech firm who were on board. I hate speculation and rumour, but can't help wondering if they are relevant in some way. They were mentioned in the earlier reports, since then nothing.....?

[khaosai]

Land at anyone of the estimated 600 airfields or a prepared surface in the range of arc of the aircraft endurance.

The 777-200 is a large commercial airliner which would require a very strong and pretty <deleted> long runway to land and take off from. You might be able to get it on the ground at Samui airport for example which handles well over a million passengers a year but the undercarriage (due to the weight) would trash the runway as well as itself.

Hi,

At a weight of 200 tons you could stop in approx 1600 metres.

Know diddly squat about planes...but 200 tons for a B777, even with empty tanks seems pretty light. That's less than 3 MIA2 main battle tanks...clue me in folks.

Hi,

Lots of different variants of the B777. This one is a 200ER. The figures I have for this model are either 208.6 tons or 213.1 tons maximum landing weight.

From the first 200 series to the newer 300ER models the actual take off weights have increased from 247.2 tons to 351.5.

[transam]

[15Peter20]

This may seem like a silly question, but is it possible for a member of a flight crew to go nearly the whole distance of a journey without actively checking where exactly they are? I mean, if one of the co-pilots or captain is left alone in the cockpit for a while and changes direction without the others noticing, is it possible that those others will not check their location for hours more?

Thanks for any insight.

No Peter, not a silly question, but it is not possible.

Edit, let me rephrase that. I am constantly reminded by interactions with certain people on here that anything is possible, so I will say yes 'anything is possible', but the scenario you describe is truly difficult to comprehend a crew or member of crew doing. Pilots are constantly aware of and updating their position.

I thought on these commercial flights the crew can let the plane pretty much fly itself apart from takeoff and landing. Oh well, so the idea that one person alone could have produced the behaviour we know about seems unlikely.

[GentlemanJim]

This may seem like a silly question, but is it possible for a member of a flight crew to go nearly the whole distance of a journey without actively checking where exactly they are? I mean, if one of the co-pilots or captain is left alone in the cockpit for a while and changes direction without the others noticing, is it possible that those others will not check their location for hours more?

Thanks for any insight.

No Peter, not a silly question, but it is not possible.

Edit, let me rephrase that. I am constantly reminded by interactions with certain people on here that anything is possible, so I will say yes 'anything is possible', but the scenario you describe is truly difficult to comprehend a crew or member of crew doing. Pilots are constantly aware of and updating their position.

I thought on these commercial flights the crew can let the plane pretty much fly itself apart from takeoff and landing. Oh well, so the idea that one person alone could have produced the behaviour we know about seems unlikely.

Peter, that is not what you said. You said

is it possible for a member of a flight crew to go nearly the whole distance of a journey without actively checking where exactly they are? I mean, if one of the co-pilots or captain is left alone in the cockpit for a while and changes direction without the others noticing, is it possible that those others will not check their location for hours more?

Yes an aircraft can fly itself but the crew is constantly monitoring where it is, what height it is at, what the next reporting point is, how much fuel is left and all of that in between routine timed checks of aircraft position and health. One person can indeed change the aircraft height and heading, but again that is not what you asked. You asked if all that could be done over a period of hours without the other one noticing. The answer is, unless the other pilot is brain dead...no.

[fasteddie]

Mr Razak told a news conference that new satellite evidence shows "with a high degree of certainty" that the aircraft's communications systems were disabled

That's some satellite they've got there.

An earlier news report out of the US said the US authorities broke this news, based on some type of Boeing "ping" to the satellite that even though this airline was not subscribed to the Boeing service it still was communicating with the satellite and that's how they determined when each part of the system was disabled. Evidently, it took highly trained aviators, and the pilot is under scrutiny now. If you read the blogs on that original USA report, there are all sorts of scary scenarios being posited, such as the plane being used as a sort of super attack vehicle in the future. There was evidence to suggest they took the plane up to 45,000 feet which resulted in the deaths of all passengers from lack of oxygen.

There was no evidence, just supposition.

Sent from my LG-P880 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[fasteddie]

"Neither that team (the Malaysian air force base at Butterworth) nor the crews at two other radar installations at Kota Bharu, closer to where the airliner last had contact with the ground, designated the blip as an unknown intruder warranting attention, the person said. The aircraft proceeded to fly across the country and out to sea without anyone on watch telling a superior and alerting the national defense command near Kuala Lumpur, even though the radar contacts flight path did not correspond to any filed flight plan. As a result, combat aircraft never scrambled to investigate."

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/16/world/asia/series-of-errors-by-malaysia-mounts-complicating-the-task-of-finding-flight-370.html?partner=rss&emc=rss

Difficult to imagine incompetence to such a degree. How could a hijacker have planned on such multiple oversight?

Sounds like the Malaysian Air Force / National Defence Command were "got at" in the same way as NORAD were "prevented" from doing their job on 9/11. Hauntingly similar circumstances! The can of worms is being opened

Not all countries HAVE to be worried to the "nth" degree about plane crossing their territory. With Malaysia's central Asia location it doesnt matter as with countries at the center of Axis of Evil!! Nobody hates Malaysia like almost everyone hates America. I see no connection except some sleepy 2am traffic monitoring staff!

America hates Malaysia. The present Malaysian government is anti American and the courts have found George W guilty of war crimes and have warrants out for his arrest. The engines operated for four hours after the last contact, that's approx 2000miles, Diego Garcia is about 2100 miles from the last point of contact.

Just a thought.

Sent from my LG-P880 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[davehowden]

"Thai officials said they did not report the radar data earlier because they "did not pay attention to it"."

That's my boy!!

BBC News

[thailampang2012]

"Neither that team (the Malaysian air force base at Butterworth) nor the crews at two other radar installations at Kota Bharu, closer to where the airliner last had contact with the ground, designated the blip as an unknown intruder warranting attention, the person said. The aircraft proceeded to fly across the country and out to sea without anyone on watch telling a superior and alerting the national defense command near Kuala Lumpur, even though the radar contacts flight path did not correspond to any filed flight plan. As a result, combat aircraft never scrambled to investigate."

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/16/world/asia/series-of-errors-by-malaysia-mounts-complicating-the-task-of-finding-flight-370.html?partner=rss&emc=rss

Difficult to imagine incompetence to such a degree. How could a hijacker have planned on such multiple oversight?

Sounds like the Malaysian Air Force / National Defence Command were "got at" in the same way as NORAD were "prevented" from doing their job on 9/11. Hauntingly similar circumstances! The can of worms is being opened

Not all countries HAVE to be worried to the "nth" degree about plane crossing their territory. With Malaysia's central Asia location it doesnt matter as with countries at the center of Axis of Evil!! Nobody hates Malaysia like almost everyone hates America. I see no connection except some sleepy 2am traffic monitoring staff!

America hates Malaysia. The present Malaysian government is anti American and the courts have found George W guilty of war crimes and have warrants out for his arrest. The engines operated for four hours after the last contact, that's approx 2000miles, Diego Garcia is about 2100 miles from the last point of contact.

Just a thought.

Sent from my LG-P880 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

And...the Diego Garcia base is not sharing it radar records.......better...any words or any aerial help offered.....Sure..the plane is already there!

[transam]

"Thai officials said they did not report the radar data earlier because they "did not pay attention to it"."

That's my boy!!

BBC News

Think it is normal procedure in LOS.........

[Credo]

Diego Garcia will have shared any information that might be relevant to the plane's disappearance, but they will not make it public. If they have no information, then there is nothing to say.

I doubt they hijacked the airplane. They have a lot easier access to a lot of planes. Hijacking would be nonsensical.

[GentlemanJim]

Diego Garcia will have shared any information that might be relevant to the plane's disappearance, but they will not make it public. If they have no information, then there is nothing to say.

I doubt they hijacked the airplane. They have a lot easier access to a lot of planes. Hijacking would be nonsensical.

True. They have a desert full of hundreds of aircraft in storage.

[Scott]

Troll post removed.

[umbanda]

There seems to be a deafening silence around the issue of 20-odd staff of a US high-tech firm who were on board. I hate speculation and rumour, but can't help wondering if they are relevant in some way. They were mentioned in the earlier reports, since then nothing.....?

You are right..It is a very big connection of some of the Chinese high tech people on the plane and an American high teach company working in a military project....and only few people posted online info about that...But..you will find it searching online if you are curious enough...

[3NUMBAS]

^ the various intelligence agencies around the world would have checked them out apart from the US agencies ,the pax list is checkable by anybody who cares too inc their company